Seems like a touchy situation to me, any ideas?

[LFM2 1,481]

No telling what will happen to them, but my advice to you is to extract yourself from this situation. You suggested counseling, they rejected it. Unless these two are your BFFs, there's no reason to be involved in the situation. Even if they are very close friends, I'd step away.

 

I think I'd be runnin'.

[Valha 18]

An excellent thread for Mrs V. and I to read. We have found one couple we hit it off with and were making preliminary plans to do a little road trip with and/or a Vegas trip with in the Spring, sharing a 2BR condo that would have common living areas. We're discussing all of the potential issues that this type of trip can bring up. We don't want to do anything that would hurt our relationship and just as important do anything that would hurt the other couple's relationship.

It can't be stressed enough: good communication is key. We don't want to be a poly couple but would find it great fun to enjoy "friends in the LS" for vacations, etc.... Even though we're not talking about taking seperate trips like the one in this thread, there would still be plenty of opportunity for extended flirting/bonding with the other couple, or say if one spouse needed a nap or early evening rest. I believe it can work fine and be fantastic fun as long as certain rules are paramount. Reading this thread, we see a whole lot of examples of what not to do.

[UserName123 15]

Any more to this thread? An update maybe? I haven't been around for awhile and just caught up.

 

I feel horrible for the kids....

 

And I'm angry at the 'adults' in this situation.

[MN Tom 251]

She got back last night. She's been texting quite a bit, she spent far too long in airports it seems.

 

I would say she's cooled a bit to the boyfriend. Doesn't sound like anything bad happened on the trip, moreso that it wasn't a mind blowingly amazing time either. Maybe some of the reality finally set in, and she wasn't as enthralled with it. Dont know for sure. Im sure she will tell me when we see her in person this week.

 

Hubby hasnt talked with either of us in a few days. He was keeping himself very busy, probably nervous.

[UserName123 15]

That's so sad. I really hope something not so bad comes out of this. Can't really say 'good' as this isn't a good situation at all and I can't see it having any good outcome.

[Dont.Stop 339]

She got back last night. She's been texting quite a bit, she spent far too long in airports it seems.

 

I would say she's cooled a bit to the boyfriend. Doesn't sound like anything bad happened on the trip, moreso that it wasn't a mind blowingly amazing time either. Maybe some of the reality finally set in, and she wasn't as enthralled with it. Dont know for sure. Im sure she will tell me when we see her in person this week.

 

As I often say... sometimes the only reason why the grass looks greener is because it's full of manure.

[MN Tom 251]

As I often say... sometimes the only reason why the grass looks greener is because it's full of manure.

 

Yeah, we are hoping that is the case.

 

We did talk with both of them yesterday for a short while. It's still a big mess, but it seems they are finally going to go to counseling. . We mentioned it again, and this time the wife said "yes, I need to talk with someone else to help straighten out my feelings".

 

Hubby has been bottling up his feelings, and he needs to get them out. And the wife has issues to deal with, she is in love with 2 men, and while in reality she knows that the boyfriend isnt marriage material, she is still heavily drawn to him emotionally and we would guess she's way more passionately connected to him than hubby.

 

No idea what boyfriend thinks on this all, maybe part of the cooling is reality finally hit for him and he realized he doesnt want to marry her. Not sure. It's all conjecture on him since we dont speak with him.

 

 

We did talk about the trip, she went into some detail. She said it was good, not great, but good. Said that they played a lot with each other early on, started to actually discuss playing with other couples, and struggled with the idea. They ended up not doing couples swapping at all since they weren't coming to an agreement on the idea, and it became a sore spot. That bummed her out, and she said it put a strain on the last few days.

 

Maybe the wife and boyfriend hit the limit of their relationship? Who knows. We talked with about this for a while on the drive home, we are happy they are finally going to counseling, but still arent sure where it will lead. The wife really appears torn between her 2 guys, and we arent sure if the hubby will fully recover for that matter.

[Chicup 38]

If I'm reading that right the boyfriend didn't want to 'share' her with a couple? Well actually that might be a bad sign for their marriage if I let my imagination work slightly.

[MN Tom 251]

If I'm reading that right the boyfriend didn't want to 'share' her with a couple? Well actually that might be a bad sign for their marriage if I let my imagination work slightly.

 

Yes, that is what we gather too. And it's not shocking to be honest, we've seen that time and time again. A guy will be in the lifestyle, say it's all great, but when he meets a certain person, he no longer wants to share. Happens with gals probably too Id guess, we just have seen it more with single guys.

 

And for us, that is a huge sign. And we think it might be a sign for her too. She was really frustrated over that topic. It's probably the first big "chink" in his armor that she has noticed. He has many more I would imagine, but she's been blinded to them up until this point.

[Alura 2,766]

Yes, that is what we gather too. And it's not shocking to be honest, we've seen that time and time again. A guy will be in the lifestyle, say it's all great, but when he meets a certain person, he no longer wants to share. Happens with gals probably too Id guess, we just have seen it more with single guys.

 

Now, that's just plain scary! One thing that more frightening is the sentence, "If I can't have you, nobody can!"

 

It happened recently here in Tulsa. The wife and boyfriend are dead and the husband is in jail facing two charges of pre-meditated murder.

 

Single people aren't always a problem; but when they are, it can get very serious quite quickly.

 

Alura

[MN Tom 251]

Now, that's just plain scary! One thing that more frightening is the sentence, "If I can't have you, nobody can!"

 

It happened recently here in Tulsa. The wife and boyfriend are dead and the husband is in jail facing two charges of pre-meditated murder.

 

Single people aren't always a problem; but when they are, it can get very serious quite quickly.

 

Alura

 

Yeah, that is obviously a worse case scenario. IMO singles that don't share are called vanillas, and they dont belong at swinger events.

[two4youinswva 3,067]

And it's not shocking to be honest, we've seen that time and time again. A guy will be in the lifestyle, say it's all great, but when he meets a certain person, he no longer wants to share.

 

If you've witnessed this time and time again, then you might want to find another different group of people to hang out with. This isn't exactly the kind of scene that we care to be around.

[MN Tom 251]

If you've witnessed this time and time again, then you might want to find another different group of people to hang out with. This isn't exactly the kind of scene that we care to be around.

 

If you go to a large party with 250+ people, and you look around at all the people, you will see it every time I dare say. It's not common, but with the sheer numbers, you will find it.

 

I would say it's a cause of what vegaslee or other longer term swingers refer to as the modern swingers. They aren't necessarily swingers per se, more like partygoers who like to dance and flirt but arent really ready to swap.

 

Reason I tend to notice it is because we play separate so much, and have had a number of mails/questions from SM's on if my wife would play. So, at times Ive asked those guys if they would be willing to swap when they have a date, and very often they say no, even if their date says yes.

 

Guess it's just a pet peeve of mine. The old it's good for you but not for me deal. And not every SM is like that either, I know quite a few who are willing to swap when they are out with a gal. That's normally how I play if Im out with a gal. One playmate in particular loves the idea of couples play, and she's really happy that Im willing to play that way with her, since some guys wont it seems.

[Chicup 38]

And its why we will NEVER play with a single guy.

[MN Tom 251]

Ok, final update for a while.

 

We spoke on speakerphone with the couple last night. They both went to a counseling appointment this week, and as most would imagine, it's not all good.

 

They are struggling to say the least. Wife is still firmly attracted to the boyfriend, and hubby is tired of it. Hubby offered to quit all lifestyle activity, wife doesnt want to leave boyfriend. Wife doesn't want to leave hubby either for that matter.

 

To make matters worse, wife told us that boyfriend is actually still married. She thought he filed the divorce papers, but he told her recently that he hadnt. And that was part of what bothered her during the trip, I guess that little nugget came to light. Along with the aspect of him not being willing to share, which he also said includes sharing her with her hubby..

 

Yeah. So basically we told them that boyfriend is a total arse. A lying selfish arse at that. Dump him. And they need to get their crap together, and drop all lifestyle stuff and just work on each other.

 

So, who knows. The train has crashed, now it's a matter of if they want to stay to clean it all up or just light it on fire and run.

 

This conversation was truly a downer for us. Makes us wish we would have avoided it, but again, these people are friends to us aside from lifestyle activities, so we didnt want to just turn our backs.

[Alura 2,766]

Y'all are right to stick by your friends and try to help them with this matter, Tom. I wouldn't bet a lot of money on your chances of success, but it's quite honorable to try, in my opinion. My guess is it will end more like this:

 

We played with a couple for several years until the wife "fell in love" with a younger fellow at work, divorced her husband of 30 years, and moved into an apartment with her new "love." He lived there with her for a short time but decided to go back to his wife and three children.

 

In the meantime, Mr. Playcouple, a college professor, met a much-younger (and more beautiful) graduate student, married her, and is still with her, living happily in the upscale home he used to share with his ex-wife, who is still living alone in the apartment.

 

"Be careful what you wish for." The bottom could fall out.

 

Alura

[Alura 2,766]

And its why we will NEVER play with a single guy.

 

Bingo!

 

Alura

[MN Tom 251]

Originally Posted by Chicup

And its why we will NEVER play with a single guy.

 

Bingo!

 

Alura

 

You know, after seeing all of this and some other stuff here locally, it definitely is shaking our thoughts on separate play. We've really enjoyed it, but I think to start we will limit it to only spouses where we all get along.

 

Which, to be honest, is sort of what we do now. Mrs Tom never got along very well with any true SM's, only hall pass hubbies, and the current ones she plays with all have spouses that Ive been with. I have played with quite a few SF's though, and still do. We might tighten that up though, and further limit it to cases where we are both actively involved with the other spouse, or at least social with on a similar basis so we can keep a good handle on any stray feelings.

[Alura 2,766]

I've posted somewhere else about a game we used to play with one of our Playcouples. We'd go as swapped couples to the same restaurant but sit at different tables as if we didn't know each other. After dinner, we'd go to one couple's house but to separate bedrooms. After sex the game was over. The four of us would congregate in the den where a foursome would usually happen.

 

We called it "Date Night."

 

Alura

[shrevecouple 252]

What an absolute bummer for the husband. To actually see your wife be so attached to someone else. The one who was to put you above all others not write this guy off for the sake of your marriage and mental health.

 

What is also funny to me is the fact that the playmate is still married bothers her. I mean really she is offended that he wouldn't share her on vacation but yet she reserves the right to be mad he is still married? As long as the guy is cheating on a spouse who gives a flying fuck whether he's still married or not. This woman has allowed herself to fall way down the rabbit hole and in my open she had to be open to establishing feelings for this guy in the first place for her to feel this way. Question is what "need" is this guy fulfilling that her husband doesn't fill for her?

 

This is where that saying you all say about things being amplified when you swing. This has brought something to light that she must not have been admitting to her husband or possibly herself.

[Alura 2,766]

Question is what "need" is this guy fulfilling that her husband doesn't fill for her?

 

My guess is that it's her need for drama.

 

Alura

[bbarnsworth 2,536]

My guess is that it's her need for drama.

 

Alura

 

Isn't that channels 1500-1599?

[MN Tom 251]

Well, the disgust she has with him still being married is because she feels that she is cheating now. Before, she thought he was officially divorced, so she felt it was ok. Even though her hubby doesnt necessarily like it, he's fully aware, so it's not cheating to her. And I think the fact that he lied to her about such an issue isnt helping her either. For their marriage sake, it's good that the boyfriend lied. Puts another strike against him.

 

From what I gather, the need that is being filled is raw passion without any reality. The kind of fantasy love you read about in a book or see in a movie, that has very little basis in reality. The sweep her off her feet, dont care about anything in the world, nothing else matters but this feeling. Because, in effect, that is what she gets from him. No financial discussions, no kids homework, no housecleaning, just pure love and fun. She goes home and gets reality (which she wants to a degree), and then she meets him and gets fantasy.

Call it lust, call it infatuation.. It's not long term love in my book, but it's a powerful feeling.

 

 

This is kinda hard for me too, Ive played with this woman in the past, Ive known her for some time, and now I see her like this. She isnt acting like she used to. Again I would liken it to a drug addiction.

[Alura 2,766]

Isn't that channels 1500-1599?

 

Huh???

 

Alura

[bbarnsworth 2,536]

Huh???

 

Alura

 

You said "My guess is that it's her need for drama."

 

I suggested she could find Dramas on channels 1500-1599 on HD digital television. Sorry. Lame joke

[Alura 2,766]

You said "My guess is that it's her need for drama."

 

I suggested she could find Dramas on channels 1500-1599 on HD digital television. Sorry. Lame joke

 

Nah, the problem is that the audience was a hick Okie with Cox cable.

 

Alura