a selfish husband contemplating divorce

[ShellyM 1]

Our marriage is more important to us than swinging will ever be. The idea of getting a divorce because one can't swing is ludicrous.

 

Absolutely agreed. Jay and I both agree that if either of us ever decides for certain that that is it for swinging that is IT. Our union and family is what its about! Swinging is only an ASPECT within a marriage, not a marriage. Yeah, to walk from a marriage and family only because she or he won't swing is simply a very unwise decision. Weigh the costs before you do this.

[Alura 2,766]

What are some of the reasons for the "seven (twenty-five?) year itch?"

 

Both men and women try their best to be the person they think the other wants during courtship only to become their true selves again after being enveloped by the security-blanket of marriage.

 

The Great Spirit has designed us to ensure that the young, who have the energy, bear the children who keep us a viable species on Mother Earth. As women age, their bodies produce less and less testosterone. The result is that she has less need for sex. There are exceptions, of course, with some gals staying horney after they're grandmas. Men, on the other hand, tend to stay horney. Hell, they don't have to carry the young!

 

This situation can cause serious problems in the later years of marriage. Hormone therapy can help but it's not readily available and few women seek it. It's crazy that Big Pharma has developed several pills to give a man a four-hour erection but no such effort has been made to help women be eager to receive it. Have you ever heard a commercial ask, "Ask your doctor if testosterone treatment is right for you!"?

 

Many of our motivations stem directly from our sex drives, or lack of them. When the divergences are so great, it's hard to deal with the resulting problems.

 

Exercise can be very helpful. To quote Bill Maher, "Ask your doctor if getting off your ass is right for you!"

 

Mr. Alura

[texmo 16]

Sorry to resurrect this thread after it was already dead, but I just wanted to reply to l_amante1 and Tybee.

 

Tybee, I don't think anyone would disagree with your views about the proper place of swinging in a marriage relationship, and that is that it should be secondary to the relationship. That isn't controversial. I think it was tremendously judgmental to suggest that l_amante1 thought otherwise.

 

I agree with you, Tybee, and l_amante1 does too. He didn't choose swinging over his wife, and neither did I. What's really happened/happening here is that there were/are other incompatibilities in the relationship, and swinging served to highlight them. My wife and I both agree.. swinging didn't cause our problems. It only served to make us more aware of the problems that were already there. I hope you understand why l_amante1 got so defensive in his post. You clearly don't get it. And to go off lecturing about how couples need to *talk* about it swinging beforehand and be in agreement about how it should be secondary in the relationship is condescending, given how self-evident that fact is.

 

My wife and I aren't swinging anymore. And since I started this thread, we have settled on getting a divorce. It could be as soon as this summer, but we might wait longer for practical reasons that I won't address here. It is definitely the right thing to do, but I am still extremely saddened by it. I love her. I really love her. But we both know that we're incompatible, and it's time for us to move on.

[awu25 15]

In my opinion in a relationship there is never right or wrong. There is action, and there is consequence(good or bad). Morality often does not make much sense.

 

The OP sounds very mature and calm. He seems to know what will be waiting for him on the other side if he dose divorce his wife. I for one support his decision, whatever it will be, because I believe he had thought it through and ready to accept the consequences of his decision.

 

Yes, the OP is selfish, and so is every single one of us. Everything we do, if we dig deep enough it's always for our own desires and our own desires only.

[DBL D 120]

I have had a lot of the feelings that l'amante1 has stated, as well as texmo, with the difference being that I DO love my wife. There are also thoughts from others here that I would have to agree with as well.

 

It all gets wound up into the same type of thing. The relationship between your wife and you should be tops, and if you do love each other there should be a way to live without tearing each other apart when things go differently than you expect.

 

You either have to be patient with her or let her go. You may get the sex you are looking for but you will end up really missing the things that came with being together both large and small. I feel for you guys but you are going to have to keep your wits about you or your life will really get ugly.

 

When I got to thinking about bringing up the idea of doing the sex with other people together with her, it was only natural for me to feel that she would see things like I did. Well, guess what? She didn't. Then where does that leave you. Compromise? That usually sucks. Give up your feelings? That sucks too. There seems to be no solution, for once that box is opened, you can't quite wrap it back up that way it was. You HAVE to move at the slowest persons pace. Hopefully that person will still understand that you have some different needs than hers and let you be satisfied...but when she EVER feels that she isn't number one, don't be surprised when the plug is pulled.

 

If the shoe were on the other foot, I'm sure you would feel the same.

 

Male D

[safireblues 106]

I can't imagine that someone would go from 0-swingers parties and be comfortable. I'm in an open relationship and I can't say that I would be ok at a swinger's party. Never been to one, I prefer very small pre-selected groups.

 

Could it be that you men are trying to go so fast into all this more because you want to bang other woman than as a fun activity as a couple? And the wives sense that it's more about expanding your sexual horizons than fun as a couple??

 

Here's what my husband and I did...we went to a legal brothel and got a courtesean. There was no sex, just a naughty shower, touching, and she and I did a blow job with a condom on him. It was exciting!

 

What about trying something like that, or a strip club, or a way to make it seem like a fun activity for your wife, rather than the "fuck other people" angle. You want it to spice up what you already have, not be a substitute for unmet needs.

[DBL D 120]

...There was no sex, just a naughty shower, touching, and she and I did a blow job with a condom on him. It was exciting!...

 

Clinton Lives!!!

[Tybee Swing 286]

You clearly don't get it. And to go off lecturing about how couples need to *talk* about it swinging beforehand and be in agreement about how it should be secondary in the relationship is condescending, given how self-evident that fact is.

 

I shouldn't even respond, because it's likely that you'll choose not to understand what I'm saying. I wasn't lecturing. The paragraph about the way my husband and I communicated and came to our decision to try swinging was just sharing our personal experiences and how it worked out for us. It wasn't a lecture. This board is to share thoughts and ideas.

 

You say it's condescending to advise that couples really talk beforehand, and should place swinging secondary. This advice has been given thousands of times on this board, and not only by me. Why? Because so many people come here with big problems, and in what they write it appears that they didn't really talk things through and get really honest with each other, and/or that one party was pushing an agenda on the other one.

 

l_amante said that he gave his wife two choices: Swing and embrace it, or swing anyway (as a trial). He was pissed because she said she'd try, and after she got to a swinger's party she became uncomfortable and backed out. From a woman's perspective (at least mine), she did try. She got the slutty outfit, got up the courage,and went with him to a swinger's party. While there, she realized that she didn't want to do it. To not leave would have been the worst thing she could do. To fuck people she didn't want to fuck just to make her husband happy would be the biggest sell-out of herself. She'd hate him later for it, if she'd done it. If she's not there for herself because she really wants to be, she doesn't need to be there. It's too bad that l_amante couldn't give her choice #3: "if either of us are uncomfortable at any point, we can back out and that's okay". That wasn't on his agenda.

[lovinher 505]

Sometimes things just don't work out. Your marriage is one of them. I agree with you that your problems have nothing to do with swinging but it became a catalyst in the road to divorce. If you and your wife are that incompatible then everybody is better off in the long run if you go your separate ways. It's obvious to me you should never had married in the first place but you already know that. If you and your wife are this unhappy, considering the info you gave us, I think everyone is better off in the long run if you divorce. This is not something I say lightly because in the short term it will hurt you, your wife and your kids. You know that too. You are a smart guy who already knows what has to be done. You came here for validation, not advice and there is nothing wrong with that. Who would actually leave his wife based on advice given on a swinger's board from people you don't know? I do think you should get counseling before you make this huge jump in life. If anything you both might understand better where the other is coming from. It may help your split to be a bit more amicable. That would be good for your kids. IMO, it is their needs that are the most important at this point.

 

 

That said....

It has been mentioned a few times that a person's needs and wants should not be compromised. A person should not sacrifice their own needs, desires, whatever label you want to give it. That implication is that it will lead to a miserable life. Bullshit. Life is full of sacrifices and compromises. How many of us actually live the life we thought or hoped we would. Life gets in the way of goals and ambitions. It's the people that dwell on their own sacrifices and missed goals that are unhappy. I didn't achieve my original goals in life and I'm glad I didn't because I would not have the family and life I have now. To say your own wants must be paramount to everyone else in your life is extremely selfish. With that kind of attitude you are destined to a life of disappointments. If something happened to my wife and she could not have sex (or go bowling), I would sacrifice my need for it because I love her and she IS my life. That is what love is all about, sacrifices and compromises. It really is that simple.

I'd love to be male porn star who sails the world. But it isn't going to happen because I have more important things in my life...and I'm not miserable because of it.

[DBL D 120]

That said....

It has been mentioned a few times that a person's needs and wants should not be compromised. A person should not sacrifice their own needs, desires, whatever label you want to give it. That implication is that it will lead to a miserable life. Bullshit. Life is full of sacrifices and compromises. How many of us actually live the life we thought or hoped we would. Life gets in the way of goals and ambitions. It's the people that dwell on their own sacrifices and missed goals that are unhappy. I didn't achieve my original goals in life and I'm glad I didn't because I would not have the family and life I have now. To say your own wants must be paramount to everyone else in your life is extremely selfish. With that kind of attitude you are destined to a life of disappointments. If something happened to my wife and she could not have sex (or go bowling), I would sacrifice my need for it because I love her and she IS my life. That is what love is all about, sacrifices and compromises. It really is that simple.

I'd love to be male porn star who sails the world. But it isn't going to happen because I have more important things in my life...and I'm not miserable because of it.

 

Very well said...

 

I agree that if you have other issues that have made you unhappy in your marraige and you both agree, maybe it would be best to split. Good communication will help things fall in palce without anger. The key word here is GOOD communication. I have found that communication is what works best, but you have to be kind and speak with love in your heart. You may not like your spouse at times but you still love them and want them to understand you. When people are approched by someone with anger it can cloud what you are trying to say and the other may not understand.

 

I'm sure that most all of us at one time or another have had some negative things happen in the lifestyle that could push us away from our spouses.

Take some time to understand what's really happening before you make your next move. I think the above quote says it all.

 

Good luck to all of us.

Fem d

[texmo 16]

Great thoughts by all. Now that I consider my motivations for starting this thread, I can't say that I was seeking advice, but I really wasn't seeking validation either. What I really wanted was perspective, and I think I have gotten that. I appreciate the responses.

 

There are some practical matters that will prevent my wife and I from getting a divorce within the next year. So I have plenty of time to think about this. I understand both sides of this issue. Whether or not getting my needs fulfilled is worth sacrificing my marriage is still an open question for me. I agree very much with what DBL D said about people who dwell on their own sacrifices being unhappy... I am living proof. I personally am not convinced that divorce is not the best option for me, but you've all given me plenty to think about.

[fireman_andrew 15]

Sounds to me like you are trying to come up with excuses convince yourself it is alright to engage in whatever behavior you "feel" like doing. Step up and be a Real Man...

 

The grass is always greener on the other side BUT you still gotta Mow it.........

[ownerspet 506]

I don't know if you married for the wron reason or the right reason as prior posters have pointed out we don't have enough information. Keep in mind though swinging is something that becomes a focus in many peoples lives at times, it is not the priority of most peoples lives. They have families, freinds, and other areas of life that each of us value. Put some deep thought into the following question and do not make a knee jerk reaction: If you have to choose between your loved ones and swinging, what would you choose?

 

 

It helps to know that I'm not the only one.

 

However, If you did marry for the wrong reason, You are definitly not the only one that has married for the wrong reason, I married my first wife with red flags going off left and right. So dont feel bad.

 

 

As for myself, I am not interested in completely abandoning my children. I would probably share the child-rearing responsibility with her, as she does not ever wish to be a single mother. I am more concerned about my love life (and sex life) than the situation with my kids.

 

I realize you said you would probably help with the kids and you are contemplating divorce.

 

To which my response is, you need to be there for your kids regardless or you will regret it. However, more importantly you indicated you are more concerned with your love/sex life.

 

If this is what you are concerned with, figure out if you married for the right reason first. Then at that point figure out your priorities. If you married for the right reason, straighten out your marriage.

 

Yeah swinging looks exciting and you know its fun, But.

 

Above all else you need to put some deep thought in these decisions, as if you choose something over you're wife, you risk life as you know it. If you love your wife, talk to her and try to figure out why she wants to quit, before you react. After all you didn't marry her because she said "Honey, I'll let you have sex with other people.

[texmo 16]

Sounds to me like you are trying to come up with excuses convince yourself it is alright to engage in whatever behavior you "feel" like doing. Step up and be a Real Man...

 

The grass is always greener on the other side BUT you still gotta Mow it.........

 

I am not concerned with appeasing people who are only capable of finding fault, so I don't think this deserves a response.

 

I don't know if you married for the wron reason or the right reason as prior posters have pointed out we don't have enough information.

 

Just take my word for it. I know without a doubt that I married for the wrong reasons. That is not a question in my mind. The question in my mind is whether it matters. Let's be clear that I am not choosing between my wife and swinging. I am choosing between the life that I have, and the chance that I could have a better life. Since the future is unpredictable, leaving my wife is a big risk. I am debating whether that risk is worth the possible reward of a more fulfilled life.

[ShellyM 1]

Texmo, this is a decision only you can make. If you and your wife have children (I'm too tired to read back to all of the previous posts so please forgive me if you have said whether or not you have children) than definately THEY should be the top priority of both you and your wife. I cannot tell you either way because I do not know you and I'm not a counselor. I think you need marital counseling NOW. They are trained in taking you through everything to help you in deciding what you want to do. Just remember, and everyone has said this: I know that the grass looks green. And it very well may be; but there is always some crabgrass mixed in. I would seek counseling, allow them to help you get everything in perspective and go from there. Best of luck to you.

[MRnMSbhaven 45]

I am choosing between the life that I have, and the chance that I could have a better life. Since the future is unpredictable, leaving my wife is a big risk. I am debating whether that risk is worth the possible reward of a more fulfilled life.

 

So what you're saying is, you'd be willing to give up what is sure (the life you do have) on the off chance that there's something out there that will make you happier? And if there isn't? Do you have a backup plan? What if you all you discover is that you were happier where you were? I'm not sure there's a do-over option in something like this.

 

The only person that can make you happy and fulfilled is yourself. Not your wife, not your kids, and not some hypothetical better more fulfilled life. I'm not advocating either choice. What you do is up to you.

 

However, do you really think you have done everything you possibly can to create a more fulfilled and happy life with the one you already have or are you just considering the quick fix?

 

MS. B