What is it with couples who require condoms for penetration but not for oral?

[Spoomonkey 418]

lcjtsd said:

However, it seems that the people here would rather stick their heads in the sand and completely ignore the issue, (Which I feel the lack of voting in the poll illustrates). In other words, if a question or opinion comes up that goes against the majority here (which it seems that this one does) the issue is ignored by the majority, no matter how important the subject.

 

You have four pages of discussion on the issue... Not to mention that it is an issue that has been discussed in many other similar threads.

 

I am completely lost as to how that proves folks are sticking their head in the sand.

 

Just because they won't jump on another thread and discuss the same thing over again?

 

Let me ask you - what would the acceptable response look like to you?

[intuition897 2,177]

No Spoomonkey, I think the Naughties were right. We feel this forum has become cliquish, opinionated and closed minded to certain issues.

Cliquish? No, I don't see it as that at all. We just all happen to agree. What we have a problem with is being preached at, and our choices - our preferences - being discounted.

 

This issue we brought up, we feel, is an important one for all swingers. If anyone does unprotected oral, how effective is condom use in preventing STD's? We were hoping to raise awareness that there are many activities that swingers do with others that, basically, make condoms completely ineffective. Our own experience has shown that. Hence, why even bother with them?

Yes, it is a very important issue. But as Spoomonkey said, we've beaten this dead horse for four pages now, on this one thread alone. I'm sorry that you haven't been able to convince us that we should either be fanatical about safe sex to the point where swinging just stops being fun, or stop using condoms entirely. I'm also sorry that you two got burned , but I sincerely think it was a fluke. I, for one, would really love to see the numbers on this. What's the percentage of risk for oral vs. genital? Anyone?

 

Using condoms cuts down on risk. Doesn't eliminate risk, but it DOES cut the risk down. It seems to me that you're looking for some kind of guarantee that you won't catch a dose of something. There is no guarantee. Life is random. If this is unacceptable to you, don't swing. Or if you are happy swinging with extremely stringent safer sex standards, have at it! But don't tell us that the way we are doing it is wrong. You can't just say that because it happened once to you, that suddenly this risk is much greater. You just happened to win the lottery. Meanwhile - yeah! - lots of other experienced swingers (+20 years) are happily disease free. How do you explain 20 years of health in the face of such a grave risk? Luck?? Yeah, maybe partially, but sensible safer sex practices as well as careful partner selection probably played a greater part.

 

Condoms are not "completely ineffective". Let's extrapolate on Spoomonkey's biker analogy. Let's say the two guys get off their bikes at a roadside store and buy themselves an ice cream. So they sit outside eating their ice cream, one guy still wearing his helmet, and the other guy, as usual, not. Two seagulls fly overhead and at the same time, with military precision, shit in perfect synchronization on their heads. Now...who's happy he wore his helmet? And who's not happy? I'm just trying to say that shit can fly at you out of nowhere (ex. that guy/girl/couple seemed like such a nice, clean, couple...) and it doesn't hurt to be prepared. Now does the guy want to dress head to toe in rain gear on the off chance that a seagull could shit on him? I doubt it.

 

However, it seems that the people here would rather stick their heads in the sand and completely ignore the issue, (Which I feel the lack of voting in the poll illustrates). In other words, if a question or opinion comes up that goes against the majority here (which it seems that this one does) the issue is ignored by the majority, no matter how important the subject.

This is not the only thread on this subject. And THIS thread alone is quite long. If anything, I think swingers are pretty responsible and knowledgeable about STDs. I think the lack of voting just indicates that people are done discussing it. We've all made our decisions about it.

 

Swinging involves a measure of risk. The level of risk vs. reward is worth it to my husband and I. I am okay with this. Why is it not okay with you that I am okay with this?

[BradAndJanet 69]

lcjtsd, since I start with the first new post when I read a thread, I didn't even notice there was a new poll. I suspect that a lot of people do the same thing, which may be why the poll has few answers.

 

Also, this subject has been beaten to death, here and in older threads, and some people just don't have the time or the inclination to get into it again.

[good times 990]

However, it seems that the people here would rather stick their heads in the sand and completely ignore the issue, (Which I feel the lack of voting in the poll illustrates). In other words, if a question or opinion comes up that goes against the majority here (which it seems that this one does) the issue is ignored by the majority, no matter how important the subject.

 

I disagree with you on your conclusion of what the lack of participation in your poll means. I think, As I stated in that thread, that the format of the poll is flawed because it assumes that people know how much less risk they are subject to by not using condoms for oral but requiring them for vaginal sex. I think the people who believe this just feel that it is generally less risky but have no idea by how much and so they can't honestly answer the poll structured the way it is.

[viking21 15]

Good morning. I agree with your position on condoms 100%! It always amazes me that a lady will suck my bare cock until I cum in her mouth and then ask me to use a condom when I fuck her. Sort of like taking a shower while wearing a raincoat. Makes no sense at all.

 

I am new to this site, and perhaps do not yet understand the correct protocol. Any comment I make which you find offensive is totally unintended.

 

I live in south Alabama and am seeking folks nearby who enjoy good sex. I am married but play solo. Have had many threesomes (mmf) and many one-on-ones. Any interested couples or ladies may contact me and we'll trade pics. If there is mutual interest in going forward, we'll arrange to meet.

[Chicup 38]

No Spoomonkey, I think the Naughties were right. We feel this forum has become cliquish, opinionated and closed minded to certain issues.

 

Unless oral without a condom and sex with one is cliquish this statement has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

 

You have a bone to pick, and most of us don't share your point of view.

[lovn2share 15]

I am very sorry that you had a bad experience I think all of us would agree that bad times and STD's are NOT what we are looking for. I for one don't make the men wear condoms ONLY because we only play with 2 couples we have known for a long time and are comfortable not using them with. Mr.lovn and I would not feel comfortable going to a club and not using one at all times but that again is why we don't go.

 

I feel you have to make the decision that is right for you and your SO. If it is using them then do and if it isn't then don't. I think everyone one here making their own choices and you can't fault them on it.

 

I too have a lot of false securities like if I lock my doors at night no one will break in... but the truth is if it is going to happen then it is going to happen... but guess what? I still lock em up every night because it is what makes ME feel comfortable. So let them have their "false securities" as you put it and you have yours... I would hope you would never want to make a couple feel uncomfortable because swinging is supposed to be fun for all involved so if their rules don't match yours then keep on enjoying your wife and hopefully you will find some couples that match your requirements. Good luck on your search.

 

Mrs. lovn

[LICouple4u 15]

I'm coming in obviously VERY last to this discussion, so I apologize if I'm bringing up old wounds. I see the OP is no longer posting here (due to their location).

 

I didn't see our reasoning mentioned, so I thought I would respond...

 

1. We grew up in the 80s and condoms with sex were basically forced down our throats

2. I am only 30 and even though I have an IUD, there's still that chance and I'm not quite into having another man's baby and testing all the daddies on Maury

3. I really don't like that 'drip factor' afterwards. It's one thing at home, I can go to the bathroom and take care of that. When you are in a club, at a party, in a hotel or at a playmate's house - not always easy.

 

Yes, we perform oral with no protection. Yes, I have known people who have gotten herpes due to oral sex. We use our eyes and if something looks funny, we do something different.

[StewartP 171]

This may seem provocative, but I don't mean to flame...

 

I really don't want to get together with a couple if all I'm going to taste is latex. If I'm approached by people in latex gloves and I have to have a rubber wall in front of my mouth, then let's just not bother.

 

I presume to avoid this "double standard" kissing is also out?

[Agile_Galaxo 117]

However, it seems that the people here would rather stick their heads in the sand and completely ignore the issue, (Which I feel the lack of voting in the poll illustrates). In other words, if a question or opinion comes up that goes against the majority here (which it seems that this one does) the issue is ignored by the majority, no matter how important the subject.

 

Your opinion is valid, but you seem very aggressive in promoting it. Swinging does not have to be about oral if you don't want it to be. Many people get off nicely with soft swapping and vanilla play that does not involve unprotected oral sex. Might be slightly more challenging to find these folks, but they certainly exist in number.

 

You emotionalism seems to indicate a deeper issue unrelated to the topic.

[Just Passing By 140]

Ok will own up to seeming double standard.

 

Always used condoms with others for intercourse. Once met with a couple that wished to use condoms for oral also. Maybe there is some secret methods that aren't highly unpleasant to give or receive thusly, but it wasn't intuitive, and eluded us. Afterwards we both concluded that should the issue arise again about avoiding unprotected oral, that hand job/soup stirring would be preferable.

[cs305b2 15]

What if the woman is sucking off two guys at once? Is there risk that one guy can pass something on to the guy next to him via her mouth?

[lilfordy 15]

magnum said:

Good point...I have been playing with a couple "friends" for 4 plus years or so and we started out with condoms but stopped after about a year. "I have been tested and all is good-clean-negative." I/we pull out and like to cum on hear face so no pregnancy worries.

 

I have recently meet another couple and we always use condoms for sex and yes she sucks my dick and others w/o condoms. I have only played with this couple twice and have no problem with using condoms.

 

It will be interesting to hear the other replies.

 

Pulling out before cumming? Oh dear please don't tell me you think this will stop women getting preggers!!!

[two4youinswva 3,067]

lilfordy said:

Pulling out before cumming? Oh dear please don't tell me you think this will stop women getting preggers!!!

 

I am not saying that the withdrawal method is a smart or wise strategy, but according to Planned Parenthood, when done correctly, the withdrawal method is 96% effective, compared to the 98% effectiveness rate for a condom.

 

Of course, doing it incorrectly reduces the effectiveness rate to 73%.

 

Once again, not suggesting it as a primary birth control strategy. Just sharing statistics.

[Lascivious L&L 865]

I think the difficulty of using a birth control method effectively is part of the effectiveness statistic. Because withdrawal is not easy to do perfectly, because it's easy to make a mistake using withdrawal, it's effectiveness is limited by that. To say it's 95% effective when used properly seems to me inaccurate. The real effectiveness of the withdrawal method is closer to 73%.

 

The same with a condom's effectiveness. I've never seen it given a better than 90% effectiveness and even then with caveats. Can an individual improve on those numbers? Of course. Do individuals actually improve on it? There is a huge difference between is it possible and do people actually attain those limits of possibility.

[Sophy 551]

Before my marriage, previous to start swinging, I used to think that performing oral sex was some how more "personal" than being penetrated, in fact I had several sexual experiences that included penetration but not oral sex at all. Now, in swinging the things are the other way round: we started as a softswap couple doing a lot of kissing, touching, foreplay and oral sex.

 

As swingers, we use condoms for penetration but we do not use condoms for oral, We discussed this long time before start swinging and we both agree: it is a risk, yes, but we are willing to take it. Most of the people we have met think the same way regarding condoms for oral sex. I don't have problems handling male orgasms during oral sex, sometimes I swallow other times I point it to my breast or my chin, so far we haven't had any STD problems.

 

We only bareback with our most closest friends, people we know and trust.

[SpinOX 24]

In my opinion, I believe this thread is not about what is the greater or lesser risk of catching anything. The point that's trying to be made here is, is be safe all the way or risk it all the way. I don't see where everyone is misunderstanding this.

[Ozzie+Harriet 84]

In my opinion, I believe this thread is not about what is the greater or lesser risk of catching anything. The point that's trying to be made here is, is be safe all the way or risk it all the way. I don't see where everyone is misunderstanding this.

 

Well, I see the point, but people make judgments based on the risk they perceive from their own experience and the point at which doing something would not be worth the effort if one had to wear a hazmat suit to have sex. People base jump in wing suits, even though the chance of dying is remarkably high. Their judgment differs from most folks, but do you see the point? Having sex can result in pregnancy, so there is that additional factor lurking in the back of people's brains. I have to say that in any sexual encounter I've ever had, fear of pregnancy was way higher on the list if things to not do than get an std and so far, neither has happened.

 

Also, if you really thought the odds were even 50-50 that the person you were about to have sex with had an std, would you do it? I wouldn't, so if I'm going to have sex with someone, I already have decided it's pretty safe based on whatever impression she made before boinking her, so if the inconsistency about using a condom for this and not for that makes everyone feel better, despite being a bit illogical, so be it, However, if you are going to have oral sex and intercourse, using a condom for intercourse still improves your odds of being safe by around 50%.

[Napoleon 232]

Men and women DO get treatable and untreatable STD's through comdomless oral sex. Its even possible to get an STD just from skin contact of any part of the body. This is one of many reasons why I personally don't like female strangers(any gender) thinking they can touch, hug, or kiss me without my verbal consent. This also one of many reasons why I will never do one night stands, many women nowadays are carrying STD's. I don't even shake hands with most people, they don't wash their filthy hands after using the restroom.

[seb345 17]

I personally don't mind the unprotected oral sex. I think it's easier and a lot more pleasurable for both parties (I mean who likes to suck on rubber even if it's flavored)

[ToeDippers 79]

I am learning this is the normal thing.