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Swingers As Escorts? We stumbled on a few!!!

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We brows the local escort sites from time to time for fun.

 

The other day we saw a post with pics of someone we've met in the lifestyle. We thought "Oh, maybe the pics are stolen!" but then we did some digging and everything came back to the reality that the girl in this couple is an escort ($450 an hour with great reviews). Then we noticed a link in her ad pointed to another girl with whom she does "doubles". We click it and....

 

BAM! The girl in the second ad... she's a girl in a couple that we've been with before!!!! This just validates that they are both really into this because they are both friends in real life!!! This second girl has PAGES AND PAGES of 5 star reviews and is $550 an hour!!!

 

So, what do you think about all this? We're having a hard time wrapping our heads around it!

 

I guess our big questions are:

 

1) Has this ever happened to you?

2) Do you know anybody in the lifestyle that also escorts?

3) Do you have any thoughts about people in the lifestyle that escort? Would you play with them?

4) Why do you think lifestyle girls might be more inclined to escort? Do you think they enjoy it?

5) Would you bring it up to them?

6) Would you (girls) ever consider it, or would you (guys) let your women do it?

 

Again, this is some crazy stuff!!! Small world, huh?

 

Can't wait to hear your thoughts!!!

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So, what do you think about all this?

 

Sounds like you got a great discount.

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HAHAHA...

 

That's pretty much what my wife said! "Wow, you got $550 sex twice for FREEEEEE!!!" :D

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Sounds like you got a great discount.

 

I know it's early on the east coast, but since you made me snort coffee up my nose, I'm calling this "Best Answer of the Day".

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$400 an HR? That's pretty high.. Down here in Texas, a first class "date" runs about $220 - $300 pr hr.. But the great looking ones, with lots of good feedback/reviews, can bring $400+.. But considering that Parties are normally several hours long, the "couples" we know that have one being paid, are usually paid for by the evening.. WE know several couples / swingers / escorts.. and at least one Male..

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That happens out here as well. There is this guy that use to show up at some of the hotel parties with a escort or two. He was so freaking creepy we steered away from him. The escorts were hot.

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Nope. A couple of porn actors and two directors are the extent of my experience with swinging sex workers. Oh, and several professional dommes and a dom. Since they were all acceptable playmates, I doubt I'd kvell at escorts. I don't think the l/s increases one's inclination to escort, though, because the activities are quite different. I also don't know that I'd bring it up, not unless I routinely talked professions with people, because not everyone likes their outside life linked to their swinging life.

 

I did consider working as an escort, when I was young and very poor and arithmetic was making me pick two of food, shelter and tuition. I decided not to, not because I thought it was wrong but because I didn't want to start seeing people as transactions.

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My wife and I are acquainted with one woman who occasionally works with an escort service. She very carefully separates the different parts of her life. She takes very special care to separate swing partners and swing activity from escort clients and escort activity.

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Great points!

 

Another thing we're wondering is if escorting or lifestyle came first. Also, we're wondering if the girls did escorting before their current guys or if their guy supported or even encouraged them to get into it?

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We have a few "girls" that come to the club on a regular basis both as a couple and single women.

They know if they get caught "working" at the club they are banned for life and that we also have many "officers" that party at the club.

Many of them just like to party without being at "work" so they come out and have fun.

 

You never know at times who might be working girls though. Two weeks ago we got a report that a couple that has been coming to the club for over 15 years was "charging" to party. We took the couple aside and talked to them about it. She said they needed money so she was "working". They have now been banned for life. This is not a young couple I am talking about either. We really thought it was a joke at first thinking who would pay for this...... We were wrong.

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I'd like to point out - not in an attacking way, but in one of examination - that at the root of your question is the notion that more sex = a much larger risk for disease. That's not actually true, even if it seems intuitively correct. The real equation is that riskier sex = a much larger risk for disease, which is an entirely different thing.

 

Not feeling attacked, and just curious by asking for others here for their read. We have a pretty clear research base on "sex volume versus sex riskiness" and statistical probabilities.

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Don't think on it much at all. Call girls, in general, pay better attention to safe sex practices than swingers.

 

Gotta say "paint me curious" as to how you come up with this?

 

Why is this the case? How do you know? And call girls, versus our approach to swinger "vetting" and that of the swingers we swing with, have to take a shitload on faith from mostly strangers paying them for sex.

 

My hunch is different than yours. Just a hunch.

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Having done a paper in law school about why prostitution should be legalized and regulated...

 

street level hookers tend to pay as much attention to protection as the average chick in a bar. High end, several hundred dollar types...excellent attention to that stuff.

 

Fucking for money doesnt make you any less likely to want to NOT catch something.

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I know a couple of women who are swingers but worked as escorts for a time. One of them is actually a rather sad story. She was hit hard a few years financially and she confided in me that she was working occasionally as an escort to bring in some income. I wouldn't think twice about playing with her, just because on a personal level I know she always plays safe. I don't know if she's still doing it and it's not something I'd bring up. We actually haven't talked about it except that one time. She definitely didn't do just for kicks. I think the risk of STD depends on the person and is difficult to generalize. I have seen swingers who are much less careful.

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The STD part of the equation was definitely something we thought about with the couple that we played with.

 

My wife is so funny. She's SUPER insatiable when it comes to sex... loves loves loves it. She's also every guy's gift to the lifestyle because she's pretty easy and will do most guys if they are friendly and have decent hygiene.

 

She started to do the math with our friend's $500/hour and said, "Wow, just 4 guys a week would be pretty good pocket change!" I had to stop her from going too far down that path reminding her that from what I hear it's still illegal in most areas.

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Fucking for money doesnt make you any less likely to want to NOT catch something.

 

But are those PAYING to fuck incentivised at all with regard to the safety of the body they are "buying for their use", and are all the other john's of our conscientious, regularly tested, glass slipper wearing "Pretty Woman" doing the same thing?

 

Do prostitutes, and their johns, have more sex with more people? And does that open Pandora's pink box and sprinkle in STD's? There are supposedly many escorts, even high end, who don't always play safe. Exhibit A: NY's ex-governor who paid extra for barebacking "privileges" with his $5,000.00 a night "high end escort from a high end service". The very next day, she was sleeping with the next guy. And I'd venture to guess those "special privileges" were available to anyone who felt like a cherry on top. So, volume meets riskier and....?

 

Final thoughts from us on this thread are we would personally prefer that our lifestyle play partners are not in the sex trade. Period. YMMV, not judging anyone, just expressing our real and/or imagined concerns and preferences. Guess we'll have to add "Are either of you an escort or gigolo?" to our questions during a chemistry check with a prospective couple over tea or drinks.

 

Final question: If it took the thread starter stumbling upon this "escorting lifestyler" involvement in the sex trade, I wonder if the escort informs her potential and actual lifestyle play partners of her involvement in the sex trade so they may factor that into their "play decisions". It would seem that would be appropriate, but it hasn't been mentioned.

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We know a lot of people that know the first girl (couple) very well, and nobody has ever mentioned that they've heard that she escorts. Here's the kicker, we HAVE heard from multiple people that know this couple that they are pretty adamant about NOT wearing protection when swinging! That automatically strikes them from our list.

 

The second girl (couple) that we do know and have played with twice: Based on her reviews, she's been escorting for at least a year and has had a lot of success with it. She, or her husband, didn't once bring it up to us and we don't think they've brought it up to others.

 

So, this opens a can of worms: Let's say you're a VERY promiscuous swinger... you swing with a TON of couples, go to bars and you both hook up with singles all the time (together or individually)... at what level should you "inform" potential lifestyle partners about the sheer quantity of other playmates? I mean, does it matter if someone is an escort and seeing 4 guys a week vs. a couple that is banging 4 couples a week? Should both of them be even more careful and upfront?

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Could you say more about that? Because no reputable study I've read equates volume to riskiness. Also, in terms of statistics, the risk percentage stays the same for each encounter, it doesn't increase by numbers of encounters (this is usually the place where it becomes counterintuitive).

 

I can't see that as logical. More partners would equal more chance of exposure. My chance of getting heads is 50-50 each time but if I flip that coin enough it will be a tails sooner or later. While catching an std isn't 50-50, even if its 1-1000, you have a greater chance of getting it with 1000 partners rather then 10. Neither are a guarantee though.

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I can't see that as logical. More partners would equal more chance of exposure. My chance of getting heads is 50-50 each time but if I flip that coin enough it will be a tails sooner or later. While catching an std isn't 50-50, even if its 1-1000, you have a greater chance of getting it with 1000 partners rather then 10. Neither are a guarantee though.

 

When you flip a coin, you have a 1 in 2 chance of getting heads. The odds stay 1 in 2 for getting heads no matter how many times you flip the coin. The odds of it not coming up tails at least once every 10 times is low, but the largest factor in that is the 1 in 2 chance for it to come up tails, not the 10 flips.

 

If your chance of contracting an STI is 1 in 1000, it stays a 1 in 1000 chance with every encounter with every partner. That means with each encounter and with every partner, the odds against contracting an STI is 999 to 1, whether you have 10 partners or 1000. Since the actual odds of contracting a fluids transmissible STI when properly using barriers/safer sex practices is actually much lower than 1000-1, the coin flip analogy is even farther from being useful.

 

I get that it doesn't appear to be logical (I did say it was counterintuitive), but odds are not actually a cumulative thing. If they were, people would win at casinos a helluva lot more often than they actually do. But they don't, because the odds remain the same with each play on the slot machine, no matter how many times you play.

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Really though if someone doesn't have an std, the chances of getting one by playing with them is zero. If you play with a thousand people who are std free you will not get an std. If you don't play with people who know their std status, the likelihood they are infected depends on the disease, their sexual preferences, condom use, age, race and where they live.

 

Different stds have different rates of transmission, and individuals have different immune systems. If someone does have an std then you could get it the first time you play with them, the 10th or never.

 

If an escort uses condoms with all her customers and swing partners and is tested regularly, that would probably be an ok risk for me.

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When you flip a coin, you have a 1 in 2 chance of getting heads. The odds stay 1 in 2 for getting heads no matter how many times you flip the coin. The odds of it not coming up tails at least once every 10 times is low, but the largest factor in that is the 1 in 2 chance for it to come up tails, not the 10 flips.

 

If your chance of contracting an STI is 1 in 1000, it stays a 1 in 1000 chance with every encounter with every partner. That means with each encounter and with every partner, the odds against contracting an STI is 999 to 1, whether you have 10 partners or 1000. Since the actual odds of contracting a fluids transmissible STI when properly using barriers/safer sex practices is actually much lower than 1000-1, the coin flip analogy is even farther from being useful.

 

I get that it doesn't appear to be logical (I did say it was counterintuitive), but odds are not actually a cumulative thing. If they were, people would win at casinos a helluva lot more often than they actually do. But they don't, because the odds remain the same with each play on the slot machine, no matter how many times you play.

 

So you are saying that, given a random population sample, the person who has sex with 10 people has the exact same probability of getting an STD as someone who has sex with 100? We are talking in total. I want to be sure we are discussing the same point.

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The female half of one the couples I play a lot with at a monthly house party is an escort. I've read some of her online reviews and she is apparently very popular. I've talked to her about her escorting a few times. She has even asked me if I'd like to go into the business with her. So far I haven't but I've thought about it.

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When you flip a coin, you have a 1 in 2 chance of getting heads. The odds stay 1 in 2 for getting heads no matter how many times you flip the coin. The odds of it not coming up tails at least once every 10 times is low, but the largest factor in that is the 1 in 2 chance for it to come up tails, not the 10 flips.

 

If your chance of contracting an STI is 1 in 1000, it stays a 1 in 1000 chance with every encounter with every partner. That means with each encounter and with every partner, the odds against contracting an STI is 999 to 1, whether you have 10 partners or 1000. Since the actual odds of contracting a fluids transmissible STI when properly using barriers/safer sex practices is actually much lower than 1000-1, the coin flip analogy is even farther from being useful.

 

I get that it doesn't appear to be logical (I did say it was counterintuitive), but odds are not actually a cumulative thing. If they were, people would win at casinos a helluva lot more often than they actually do. But they don't, because the odds remain the same with each play on the slot machine, no matter how many times you play.

 

This is not correct.... Odds calculation is cummulative in many cases! odds calculation for flipping a coin are diffferent for odds calculation within a finite group where the total population decreases with each throw or draw. Each time you flip a coin the odds are 50/50 because the total possible outcomes do not change with succsessive throws. This is also the same with playing the one armed bandit in Vegas. But it is not how you figure the odds when you play cards. That is why card counting works. Chances of drawing a ace of spades out of a 52 card deck are 1 in 52. But with each card I draw out of the deck odds get better. 1 in 51 then one in 50 etc etc. Poker/Texas hold-um is similar; as the odds of drawing the right card change each time a player or the dealer draws a card. Good players calculate their odds based on what is in their hand, what is showing on the table and the remaining size of the deck. 21 is played the same way--Its why Vegas now plays 21 from multiple decks. It makes the reduction in odds harder to calculate because the beginning population is bigger, but the odds still decrease as successive cards are drawn and removed from the deck. This is what make 21/poker/texas hold-em fun but five card stud not so much. Although even with five card stud as your hand is dealt the the odds of winning a given hand change because the population being drawn from is decreasing.

 

Population statistics are the same. The more partners you have the higher your odds are of contractin an STD simply because the population you are drawing from is dimishinishing with each successive partner. For someone who has never had sex the odds are 1/1000. Each time they choose a new partner the odds change because the available population has decreased. For simplicity consider a small town where there are a thousand potential partners- each time you have sex with a different partner you are increasing the odds. 1/1000, 1/999, 1/998, etc. Granted in general the population is very large and the odds do not diminish greatly with any particular partner but it is not like flipping a coin where the odds remain the same with each succcessive throw. If you have 10 partners your chances are greater than if you have only one and if you have a hundred your chances are greater than if you have 10. The odds given by the CDC are not the equivelant of odds for flipping coins or throwing dice. They are more similar to odds given for particular hands dealt in a card game where the total cards available is finite and each card drawn changes the odds. Simply put the odds of you geting an std are not 1/1000 each time you choose to have a new partner. Those odds change as the population you are drawing from changes. The more partners you have the greater chance you have of getting an STD because you have decreased the population (albeit the odds change is small with each successive partner)

 

This why smaller populations often have higher rates of STD infection than large populations. STDs amoung the young, single, or gay communities are higher because they have more partners within a relatively small population versus the general population. Simply put you do not have a 1/1000 chance each time you have sex with a new partner!

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Interesting take but I don't think you need to go that far deep. Even if your sex pool was the general population of billions, where population size did not matter, if EACH encounter was a 1% chance of getting an STD, or .01, or .00001, it really doesn't matter, MORE partners means a greater chance of hitting the "jackpot".

 

Just because the odds are the same each encounter, more encounters gives you more chances to get (un)lucky. Lets take a horrible game like roulette. Horrible because he odds/pay out sucks. Anyways if you play #10 all night the odds of hitting it on every spin is exactly the same as the last, and those odds are 2.61% chance of winning. The odds of hitting the same number 3 times in a row is 1-50000(ish) depending on the table. If you play once your chance of a tripple 10 is 1-50000, I think we would all assume those are bad odds. The more you play though, the greater the chance you will see it.

 

I used to play a lot of poker, my grandmother taught me when I was 7. Eventually I was dealt a royal flush in a 5 card draw game, straight cards, odds of that happening, 1-649733. Odds of it happening in a game where I'm teaching someone how to play, 1-1 :(

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I probably went to deep of course, but the point is that it isnt like flipping a coin where the possible number of outcomes doesnt change with each successive flip. Also the swinger population is a relatively small population vs the general. Active swingers who have many partners will change there odds significantly. We can also add that just as in poker the status of the other players affects your odds. If you have sex with someone who has only had a few partners the odds are different than if you have sex with someone who has had many. Their movement through the population affects your odds. Who I have sex with affects my wife's odds of catching an STD even if I am her only partner. if I am at a high risk then so is she, as long as she continues to have sex with me

 

I agree that even in extremely high odds situations the more you play the more likely it is that you will get lucky. This was one of the fun points in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy... that no matter how high the odds were stacked against an event occuring given an infinite number of oppurtunities eventually it will happen. silly improbability drive...

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I gotta side with Chicup on this. Using two extremes:

 

I can guarantee that given two cases:

 

1) I never drive my car for 10 years

2) I drive 2 hours to / from work every day for 10 years

 

There is absolutely a higher chance that I'll get in an accident in situation 2 than in situation 1.

 

BTW, this conversation is making my wife getting a job as an escort WAY less sexy exciting!! ;)

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On the flip side though, we ALL know swinging increases your STD chance over monogamy. How much MORE risk an escort, and lets just call her prostitute, has over the swinging population I can't say. Depending on the type of clients it might even be lower than swingers.

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BTW, this conversation is making my wife getting a job as an escort WAY less sexy exciting!! ;)

 

Other than being illegal, the one thing that really makes it unappealing to me is when you have to have sex with someone that really turns you off but you have to because you're being paid to do it. It's one thing if the client is attractive...quite another if the other person might make you want to run the other way but you can't.

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Other than being illegal, the one thing that really makes it unappealing to me is when you have to have sex with someone that really turns you off but you have to because you're being paid to do it. It's one thing if the client is attractive...quite another if the other person might make you want to run the other way but you can't.

 

The way I look at it is that despite the stereotype of the guy who doesn't want a relationship but is otherwise normal and attractive, the average guy looking to pay for sex has a reason he needs to pay.

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Other than being illegal, the one thing that really makes it unappealing to me is when you have to have sex with someone that really turns you off but you have to because you're being paid to do it. It's one thing if the client is attractive...quite another if the other person might make you want to run the other way but you can't.

 

 

It's not illegal everywhere.. and overseas, even less of an issue..

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The way I look at it is that despite the stereotype of the guy who doesn't want a relationship but is otherwise normal and attractive, the average guy looking to pay for sex has a reason he needs to pay.

 

I call BS on this one, although we're normally on the same page.. Inferring, or stating, "the average guy looking to pay for sex has a reason he needs to pay".. That's the BS! My wife and I call a prostitute (gotta keep the narrow minded happy), escort, pro.. whatever you label it, for play occasionally and unlike meeting up with couples, or chasing the elusive Unicorns, it's easy, fun, non-complicated, and ALWAYS a good time for all. Unlike finding, dating, dining, dancing, drinking with some "prospect", everyone is on board, knows why they are there, and knows when to leave. If you're paying for it, then well. YOU'RE PAYING FOR IT. But without the hassles of playing the game.. and you can call it whatever you want.. I consider myself to be an above average guy, never had an issue with self esteem or being turned down, so what would you suggest the "reason I pay for it" to be?

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There are two things going on with trying to figure your risk when it comes to STDs. To keep the math simple, let's hypothetically say that if you have unprotected sex with someone who tests positive, studies have shown the transmission rate is 10%. So, you have a 1 in 10 chance of getting it. Next, let's say that out of 100 potential playmates, 1 in 100 individuals are infected, so 1% of the population.

 

Have sex with the right 99 of the potential 100 playmates, your odds are 0. They can't give you what they don't have, doesn't matter how high the transmission rate may be.

But, have sex with the one carrier, your odds are 10% since that is our hypothetical transmission rate.

 

First is the odds of EXPOSURE, second is the odds of TRANSMISSION. Your number of sexual partners has everything to do with the first, but nothing to do with the second. Have sex with one of them, 1 in 100. Have sex with five of them, 1 in 20. Have sex with 50 of them, 1 in 2. Those are the odds of being exposed, then if you are exposed, comes the 10% risk of transmittal.

 

Both exposure and transmission are factors in how a disease moves through the population.

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I call BS on this one, although we're normally on the same page.. Inferring, or stating, "the average guy looking to pay for sex has a reason he needs to pay".. That's the BS! My wife and I call a prostitute (gotta keep the narrow minded happy), escort, pro.. whatever you label it, for play occasionally and unlike meeting up with couples, or chasing the elusive Unicorns, it's easy, fun, non-complicated, and ALWAYS a good time for all. Unlike finding, dating, dining, dancing, drinking with some "prospect", everyone is on board, knows why they are there, and knows when to leave. If you're paying for it, then well. YOU'RE PAYING FOR IT. But without the hassles of playing the game.. and you can call it whatever you want.. I consider myself to be an above average guy, never had an issue with self esteem or being turned down, so what would you suggest the "reason I pay for it" to be?

 

Keep your pants on, unless the averge "John" is a swinger couple my point still stands.

 

You seem rather overly defensive on what should be an obvious difference between the situations.

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Keep your pants on, unless the averge "John" is a swinger couple my point still stands.

 

You seem rather overly defensive on what should be an obvious difference between the situations.

 

ME Defensive?!? You stated "the average john". Just curious how you know what the average "john is" and why, in your words...."has a reason he needs too pay". So you think the average john is, too ugly, inept, shy, handicapped, or for some reason can't find a "regular" date? It may be just a case (like in swinging) someone wanting a sexual evening that doesn't require wooing, drama, spending hours (or even days) trying to find someone for sex? Too much of a generalization. Notwithstanding your possible inside knowledge.. it just seems a bit too inclusive to state the average guy, for some reason, can't find six without paying for it. Whether he (or she) is a swinger isn't of any point at all.. you stated "average". I was only pointing out your "jump to conclusions." And

FYI, I ALWAYS keep my pants on, unless, or until there's a time to take them off. LOL

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ME Defensive?!? You stated "the average john". Just curious how you know what the average "john is" and why, in your words...."has a reason he needs too pay". So you think the average john is, too ugly, inept, shy, handicapped, or for some reason can't find a "regular" date? It may be just a case (like in swinging) someone wanting a sexual evening that doesn't require wooing, drama, spending hours (or even days) trying to find someone for sex? Too much of a generalization. Notwithstanding your possible inside knowledge.. it just seems a bit too inclusive to state the average guy, for some reason, can't find six without paying for it. Whether he (or she) is a swinger isn't of any point at all.. you stated "average". I was only pointing out your "jump to conclusions." And

FYI, I ALWAYS keep my pants on, unless, or until there's a time to take them off. LOL

 

Chicup might be taking what he has seen of the single men in the LS and applying it to "the average john". Often, I have seen him state that singles (who stay single for a long time) in the LS are "single for a reason".

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ME Defensive?!? You stated "the average john". Just curious how you know what the average "john is" and why, in your words...."has a reason he needs too pay". So you think the average john is, too ugly, inept, shy, handicapped, or for some reason can't find a "regular" date? It may be just a case (like in swinging) someone wanting a sexual evening that doesn't require wooing, drama, spending hours (or even days) trying to find someone for sex? Too much of a generalization. Notwithstanding your possible inside knowledge.. it just seems a bit too inclusive to state the average guy, for some reason, can't find six without paying for it. Whether he (or she) is a swinger isn't of any point at all.. you stated "average". I was only pointing out your "jump to conclusions." And

FYI, I ALWAYS keep my pants on, unless, or until there's a time to take them off. LOL

 

Shrug, I'm not going to argue my opion of the matter too deeply, but if I gotta pay someone to want me I don't want to be wanted. If I were single it wouldn't ever be an option. The only place I could see a "normal" man paying would be some guy cheating on his wife. Being I'm a swinger, my wife is usually around for my extramarital couplings, so I don't need to hide it.

 

I support prostituion, I think it should be legal, I think it can be thought of as a valuable service, for those who need it.

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Shrug, I'm not going to argue my opion of the matter too deeply, but if I gotta pay someone to want me I don't want to be wanted. If I were single it wouldn't ever be an option. The only place I could see a "normal" man paying would be some guy cheating on his wife. Being I'm a swinger, my wife is usually around for my extramarital couplings, so I don't need to hide it.

 

I support prostituion, I think it should be legal, I think it can be thought of as a valuable service, for those who need it.

 

That's fair, you have an opinion and I respect that... but not at the expense of making your opinion a "standard".. I also have an opinion.. in fact, several, but I usually count them as just that.. OPINIONS.. and don't judge others by my standards.. OH, one more thing.. you ended with another swipe... "Being I'm a swinger, my wife is usually around for my extramarital couplings, so I don't need to hide it. " Exactly who, when where did anyone say ANYTHING about "hiding it".. We were talking about mutual, joint play. Secrets are for losers.. and on that I DO agree with you..

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