Boyfriend wants me to swing to continue the relationship

Hi, I just met a guy and he has told me that no matter how much we connect, are in love, etc. that if I do not swing it’s a deal breaker for the relationship . He says he wants to have lots of sex but wants me there to enjoy it with him.

I’m not sure what to think of this situation.

At least he is honest.

Swinging is rarely the foundation of a relationship. A solid relationship is foundational for happy swinging. There is no ambiguity on chicken and egg here.

Hi, I just met a guy and he has told me that no matter how much we connect, are in love, etc. that if I do not swing it’s a deal breaker for the relationship . He says he wants to have lots of sex but wants me there to enjoy it with him.

 

I’m not sure what to think of this situation.

Is there a question you'd like to ask?

Sorry, but it sounds like the relationship is over. It doesn't seem possible for it to survive such an ultimatum.

It sounds like this guy has set his priorities for a relationship and swinging is one of the prerequisites. I see nothing wrong with that. Isn't it better to be honest up front than to have regrets after the honeymoon?

I'm thinking that Canada needs to put her feelings about this new man aside for awhile and simply consider this lifestyle. If she decides it's just not something she'd be comfortable with, she should probably find another partner. But it she finds that it has an appeal, then she should explore this more and talk to him about why this is one of his deal breakers.

Without knowing his age, I'd guess 30s. He may have been in restrictive relationships that ended due to his promiscuity. He may be making an attempt at honesty to see if this route works.

Swinging isn't a great hobby to dive into. You've found this site, use the resources. Here, you can find a ton of information on any style of swinging. Educate yourself to the point that it is no longer this uncomfortable, taboo, sex thing and just another way of expressing yourself and experiencing life.

It's a totally fucked up ultimatum to put on someone but if this is important to him, and he is an otherwise good guy, and you like him, fuck it, why not. You won't be on the rocking chair on the porch in 30 years thinking about how awful your swinging experience was. You might be rocking and smiling and making people wonder...

We are a highly sexual creature. Religion, school, the government, parents all try to control and contain our desire to constantly fuck. Swinging is an outlet that, if you can wrap your head around it, can make your overall outlook a little more pleasant, polite, sexy. Having multiple sex partners is not outside our basic instincts. Something to think about even if this guy doesn't work out.

..

 

I’m not sure what to think of this situation.

I’m not sure what to think of this situation.

Very simply, find a new boyfriend. Ok, I swing, I do lots of things now but to have a man demand that I do swing as we just begin our relationship, no way. Any such activity should evolve after your get to know one another fully and establish some type of committed realationship, as in committed on one another, not just sex.

Sorry to say, but I suspect the reason this came up is to test how susceptible you're going to be to a controlling relationship, or at least that he has nobody to swing with and is in a hurry to rope somebody into being his +1.

Exclusivity and even the idea that there is going to be a lasting relationship at all is usually something that takes some time to build up to these days. We're all adults, we meet people and know they probably have other prospects and likely have an active sex life until we agree that we don't anymore. There's usually a point where one or the other says "What are we?" and that'd be the usual time to discuss those expectations and boundaries, once you've already tested the waters with each other and know you're wanting to try.

At most, with someone you just met, I'd think they'd communicate something like "I'm not in a hurry to rush into anything" to manage expectations if you seemed overly eager to commit, not a discussion about getting you into the lifestyle.

The concept itself, that non-monogamy is non-negotiable, doesn't seem like a problem in and of itself. It's just weird that you "just met" him and he's laying it out.

He mentioned it a few months ago .

I think that :

I don’t know enough about it

We should be in a longer term relationship

Isn’t it a case of experimenting

I also do not believe in monogamous relationships

I want some time

Thank you so much for all your advice .

It’s not simple as I suspected but I feel I cannot he held to ransom so to speak . He’s 57 by the way . If he doesn’t want to take a risk dating me then it tells me something of his real feelings .

I would have thought you should be in a loving partnership before exploring .

Canada, you absolutely should be in a loving relationship before. But, at 57, he probably knows that he just wouldn't be happy in a long term monogamous relationship.

When I was 22, a year or so before I met my wife, I was in the middle of a jungle with time on my hands. I wasn't seriously dating anyone but decided to make a scoring test to grade before allowing myself to become serious with any gal I was to meet.

I had a grading system on things like politics, religion, desire for children, enjoyed activities, and of course sexual enjoyments. Looking back, I would have also included beliefs about monogamy.

I've been married now for 46 years. And, honestly, with the division in this country now over religion and politics, if my wife hadn't been compatible with me on those two alone, we'd be divorced by now.

Thank you so much for all your advice .

It’s not simple as I suspected but I feel I cannot he held to ransom so to speak . He’s 57 by the way . If he doesn’t want to take a risk dating me then it tells me something of his real feelings .

I would have thought you should be in a loving partnership before exploring .

His real feelings are probably that he knows what he wants and he wants a partner that has a like mind in regards to non-monogamy. At least that it's something that is OK to experiment with.

I'm a little younger than him but after a long boring marriage that I should have gotten out of long before I did and then a couple of failed relationships(failed in part because I had an interest). I decided to lead with my interest in Non-monogamy. I put it out there. Either I'm going to find a woman that can accept that this is something I want to explore and we can be happy with that after establishing a committed relationship and communication(the important part)or I will be happy as a single man for the rest of my life. What I wasn't willing to accept was being attached and unhappily monogamous. There is a lot more to the story with how we got there but it happened for me. In the beginning a big problem for us was her stating the desire to explore what I wanted and me actually believing that. She was willing to take steps though to show me that she was sincere(we visited a nudist park) and I took steps in solidifying communication and trust. We built our relationship on a solid foundation of commitment, trust and communication but a desire to explore non-monogamy has always been a part of where we knew we were headed once we built that relationship. It took us a few years.

I suspect your man has much the same feelings. He's not getting any younger and he feels like his time is limited. He doesn't want to waste time on someone who isn't interested and willing to go on that adventure with him. That means he doesn't want to waste your time either. You'd be just as unhappy as he would be if you didn't have the same interests.

ou say you don't believe in monogamous relationships but you want some time. Just tell him that. He should be willing to give the time to develop a relationship that will be strong enough to allow for swinging. Yes, you should be in a committed relationship but how long do you think that needs to be. 20 years, 10, 1? It's really not about the length of time its about the strength of the relationship. He needs to know that you're sincerely interested and willing though. You don't have to be all in any more than he is all in. It will take time. If he's pushing you to prove something or check something off of a list within a set period of time then his priorities and possibly motives are worth questioning.

You cannot build a house and then later realize that you probably should have built a good foundation under it. You cannot start swinging and then realize that the relationship needed a better foundation and try to add it after the fact. Successful swinging REQUIRES a rock solid foundation that few couples ever achieve. Starting without this foundation is only going to cause the relationship to eventually fail (IMHO).

We should be in a longer term relationship

Yes you should. It takes some time to develop the trust and communication it takes to be successful. Forcing someone to do something that they may or may not be ready to do rarely leads to anything good and usually breeds resentment since they weren't really given a choice in the matter.

I also do not believe in monogamous relationships

But this should be something you decide to do TOGETHER. Instead it sounds like he is saying that he is going to be sleeping with whoever he wants no matter how your relationship turns out. As already pointed out, the sex is more important to him than any relationship. You are better than this, you deserve more than this...you need more time and while you may someday become a swinger, that time is not today and this is something you should both decide as a team. It's time to walk away from him, at least for now.

At least the boyfriend is being honest. Otherwise, we will be reading a post about, " I love my husband, but he wants me to swing. I'm not interested, he's not happy. " Better to bring it up too soon than too late.

My partner has and always will come FIRST. Swinging is something that we do together after we both discussed it and decided together that we wanted to try it. If either of us were to ever stop, we would in a second and never look back. Swinging is like a hobby while she is my world.

Hi, I just met a guy and he has told me that no matter how much we connect, are in love, etc. that if I do not swing it’s a deal breaker for the relationship . He says he wants to have lots of sex but wants me there to enjoy it with him.

 

I’m not sure what to think of this situation.

To me, this is a ridiculous stance. Insert any other hobby into the OP's sentence. Shooting, baking, motorcycling, running, golfing, needlepoint, etc. No matter how much I love you, if you don't take up golf - we are done. Any ultimatum like that before a relationship has even gotten off the ground - ditch him. Now, if he had said I have been golfing for the past 25 years. It's a costly hobby that takes a lot of time and requires an ugly wardrobe but I enjoy it. I hope you know it's an important part of my life that I intend to continue. Maybe one day you'll even join me... Very different conversation.

Thank you so much for taking the time to post - it’s been invaluable in my decision making process .

I suppose so .

When you put it that way it makes total sense .

I assumed it was a lifestyle choice and not just a hobby , but maybe they are the same thing !?

No, swinging is a hobby, making you choose is a choice (and not a good one at that). Most hobbies are something that you do that is a bonus...that enriches your life, but isn't something that you MUST or HAVE to do. I have never really run across anyone who felt that they HAD to be a swinger (before this). Swinging is a hobby that we have chosen to do together...partially because she isn't very good at golf. BTW, golfing is not really a hobby, but more of a lifestyle.

Swinging IS a hobby for most of us. We've met some really hard core swingers who insist that it's their lifestyle but we've found them to be way too intense, too focused on the hunt and too eager to hit and run for us to be interested. An ultimatum such as the OP discussed is the anthesis of swinging at least in our world. Swinging is something we share, yet we both understand if one of us says "I'm done" then WE are done. We do this for fun but recognize that our relationship is primary and if swinging ceases to be fun for one of us, the primary relationship will/must survive. Our advice to the OP is to tell the guy to take a hike!

Swinging is something you really have to enjoy doing. It’s not like golfing or whatever that you can just walk away from. Swinging is like giving up the religion you grew up with. Even if its just a hobby, its a lifestyle, a new set of moral values that you accept. Every once in a while, I look at what I’m doing or what I did last night or last week and think, OMG, what a slut I have become. But, the fact is that I am totally enjoying what we’re doing, I feel better about myself then I ever have but I am definitely doing things that most people wouldn’t approve of. To somehow not really be really into it and instead just try to do it “for him”, that would be disasterous for me and my psyche. In starting down this path, part of it may have been for him but if he disappeared, I am sure I would keep walking down this same path and find a guy that was into it, not force a guy to become a part of it.

That’s helpful . Do you mind me asking how you got into swinging ?

It’s not like golfing or whatever that you can just walk away from. Swinging is like giving up the religion you grew up with.

I don't even know who you are. Golf IS a religion and I grew up with it.

Lol

Good for you! Smart girl.

I just wanted yo tell you how incredibly helpful your comments were . They made sense to me the way you expressed them.

Thank you

Sorry it had to end this way but better to end now than after investing a bunch of time only to have the same outcome. Good luck and we wish you the absolute best.

I'm guessing my comment won't be very popular but personally I don't see anything wrong with this situation.

Speaking from a male point of view I have been in this exact same position various times with women I have dated, and perhaps the story isn't as straight forward as one thinks.

To give a little background information I would say that....

I'm a bisexual man and from the age of only 15 years old have been extremely interested in the idea of group sex, that mainly been threesomes with my girlfriend and other men / women. I highly enjoy the idea of group sex, get extremely aroused by the idea of group sex, feel excited and happy at the idea of exploring group sex. However beyond that I'm also a very hard working business owner / home owner / car owner / that works very hard for his family, and I'm also NOT a cheating man, in fact I have never cheated in my life.

I am not interested in group sex because I want to leave my partner, am not interested in group sex because my partner is not good enough, am not interested in group sex because I want to find someone better, in fact truth be told I just really like the idea of group sex and getting to explore my sexual life in a safe and friendly fashion, without any need for cheating or lying.

However in my younger years (aged 16 to 20) I began to date a young women and sure for the space of about 3 or 4 years we basically just dated like a normal couple, we did all of the usual things that a young couple would do such as watch movies / eat junk food / attend nightclubs / hang out with friends and there wasn't any mention at all of group sex or threesomes. Sometime later, after we had been dating 3 or 4 years I decided to speak with my girlfriend about my desires to swing, in fact we had been together a fair while, we had grown a little older, had grown a little more confident and the time seemed right.

Sitting my girlfriend down for an open minded chat I very carefully but honestly explained my desire to swing, in fact at that specific time I was far more interested in MFM / MMF threesomes, in fact I loved my girlfriend so much I wanted her to have the very best, I wanted her to feel lucky, to feel special and get the attention of two men. With that in mind I explained my feelings and reasons for wanting to swing and been honest I was 100% sure she would excited and open minded towards the idea, I was sure she would jump at the chance, I mean after all it would be a totally private situation for all our enjoyment, and also made is perfectly clear that I have 0% interest in running away with another guy, that basically I just found the entire idea cool and exciting, that I found it thrilling and arousing.

I was sure my girlfriend would jump at the chance to explore with me, HOW WRONG I WAS!!!! In fact on hearing my desires to swing she actually burst out crying, she actually tuck a deep offence to the entire idea and was shocked at me even mentioning such a thing. What followed over the next 5 or 6 years was basically a farce, it was basically a very difficult and long winded process of talking / arguing / building up her courage / and I'm NOT proud to admit this but basically "Talking her into trying" and giving lots of positive answers until she finally did agree to try group sex with me.

In truth the entire process was a complete waste of time, that actually she was against the entire idea from the start and remained so right until the end. In fact we had a variety of really good MFM threesomes, and even a few FMF threesomes all of which was really good. The vast majority of people we met didn't cause us a single problem, they were clean, fun, healthy people who added a great deal of company and sexual friendship to our lives. In fact as a result of these threesomes we didn't break up, didn't cheat, and it didn't even effect our relationship.

Sadly however no matter how good the person was, no matter how well the meeting went, no matter how fun or relaxed the situation was my girlfriend simply could not settle with the idea which let into her kicking off / causing scenes / becoming moody and cold / snappy / jealous / insecure and various other things. I will point out however that my girlfriend had 0% issues with cheating, in fact she really enjoyed the attention of other men, within a 10 year period she cheated on me at least 3 or 4 times and in the end she admit her big sexual fantasy was cheating, she got horny and sexual aroused by cheating not swinging and in the end she ran away with some other guy and basically ruined her life by getting pregnant to an unemployed drug using alcoholic who tricked her just long enough to get her pregnant before walking away.

I guess the moral of the story is.....

I wanted to swing and she didn't.

Instead of taking that answer I basically wasted 10 years of my life trying to make swinging work with a person who didn't share the same loyalty, values, or open mindedness as me. I basically wasted 10 years of my life running around in circles chasing a girl who wasn't really worth chasing, a girl who had deep and fundamental differences to me.

Looking back now if I had been open with her about my desires to swing from the first few months that we dated and actually tuck her gut reaction answer to heart then I'd have saved myself a lot of years and stress at the hands of a lying women who could cheat all day long but not be open minded / honest and simply share. I mean in reality if she had agreed to the idea of swinging then sure she could have had whatever she wanted, she could have experienced other men in a safer way, she could have explored other men without it causing or our relaitonship so much turmoil and hurt.

Really she could have "Had her cake, and ate it as well" but instead she chose the more normal route of lying and cheating which invited all sorts of havoc and heartbreak into our lives. The base of the story is simply that I WANTED TO SWING and she didn't / couldn't, and sure I wasted many years chasing my tail around in circles, I wasted thousands of pounds and caused my life massive amount of grief trying to be with this women who simply wasn't right for me, who at the core had a very different way of thinking.

In the end I found that OUR RELATIONSHIP in her eyes wasn't about "US" it was about her. That she openly admitted that if she wants sexual fun then she simply cheats, but she does NOT want me to have sexual fun, she wanted to kill off my sex life / change my sexuality / destroy my open mind and basically leave me sat at home whilst she went on pub and nightclub crawls with her friends and ended up fucking other guys anyway. She didn't want to SHARE she wanted all the fun herself and dam everyone else, but sure I was young and stupid and didn't see that until I became older and a little wiser.

WHAT IS THE POINT?

Well the point is.....

Would you rather someone be honest with you about their desires from the start, or would you prefer to date someone for 5 years and then get a massive big shock as the truth comes spilling out?

Would you rather someone be honest with you from the start, or actually waste 10 years of your life dating someone who at the core isn't right for you?

Would you rather walk into a relaitonship with lies and sweet smiles, or would you rather walk into a relaitonship where the other person knows what to expect?

One thing I do find rather amazing is the REASONS SOME WOMEN HAVE DUMPED ME!!!!

Over the years I have had women break off relationships with me because of things such as:

1: I didn't have a car at the time and couldn't drive them round like a personal driver.

2: I have had several women break off relationships with me because I don't have WatsApp and they can't message me for free.

3: I had one girl break off a year long relationship with me because I didn't want her 11 cats and 1 dog moving into my house.

4: I have dated several girls who broke off relationships with me because I wasn't a university student, because they were addicted to the university student buzz that I wasn't part of then.

5. I have had various relationships end because the women in question has been too busy fucking her male friends or ex boyfriends to dedicate any real loyalty or time to me.

6. I had one relaitonship end because I didn't vote and by all accounts the girl I was dating was a political person and couldn't be with someone who hand't voted.

I have actually had various short lived relationships where the women has given me ultimatums about continuing a relaitonship with her.....

Get WatsApp on your phone or we are over?

Let my 11 cats and 1 dog move into your house and do thousands of pounds worth of damage, or we are over?

Either magically appear a nice car from thin air or we are over?

Basically..... Do as I want, or we are over? Do as I want, or we are not going to work?

I think the BEST ONE which ever happened to me was a young women I met in a nightclub and began dating, when she invited me around to her house I was amazed, she was a 26 year old women with her own mortgage and a beautiful house, her house was spotless, it was basically a show home, she even had a great little car parked on her driveway and a good job to boot. For about 8 months we dated, she said it was true love, she said all the romantic things and I'd spend 3 or 4 evenings a week at her house, in fact things were going well.

However my natural detectives brain picked up a pattern, I soon began to realise that I could NEVER VISIT HER on a Thursday night, and I began to wonder why? On questioning her about why I could never visit her on a Thursday night she gave a unsure answer and tried to avoid the question, she became nervous and on edge so I backed down.

Several weeks later I re-visited the same question, why can I never visit you on a Thursday night? The truth that was about to spill out was rather upsetting, in fact she explained that 3 or 4 years before meeting me she went out with her friends and got a little drunk, she said goodnight to her friends and jumped in a taxi home and during this taxi ride home the Muslim / Asian taxi driver offered her £40 if he could have sex with her, so £40 is probably about $55 to have sex with her, and basically she said yes.

From that point (and for the last 3 or 4 years) that Muslim taxi driver would visit her once or twice per week and give her £40 for full unprotected sex behind his wife and children's backs. This Asian man was paying my girlfriend to have an affair with him. In reality he was popping around her house every Thursday evening and was having 2 or 3 hour full on sex sessions totally unprotected and was leaving £40 on the bedside table every time. I mean in reality he was "Cumming inside of her" and then the next day I was laid snuggled up in bed with her licking particles of this Muslim mans cum out of her pussy and I didn't even know a thing about it, I was sleeping in the same bed sheets that this taxi driver had been fucking her in for the last 3 or 4 years.

She explained that the taxi driver visited every Thursday night, and sometimes one other night per week and would give her £40 each time for sex. She then went on to explain that his money was basically paying 50% of her household bills per month, that on average she was been paid £200 a month, basically $250 per month just to open her legs for this taxi driver and she then gave me the ultimatum.

LET THIS HAPPEN, or we are over? Let me continue been a prostitute for this Asian taxi driver or walk away?

The door slammed behind me about 10 seconds later and I walked away and never once looked back, I remember it like it was yesterday, I didn't even say a word, I just stud up, grabbed my jacket and headed to the door and never contacted her again.

In reality if she had been honest with me from the start then I could have actually decided if I wanted to date a prostitute, if I wanted to share my girlfriend with some cheating affair based Muslim taxi driver, if I wanted to spend my night laying in the same bedding and wet patches that he had just fucked her in. Instead she waited 8 months before telling me and boom in ended that relaitonship in seconds.

So yes would you rather someone be honest about their desires and sexual position, or would you rather date someone for a year / two years / ten years only to find out they have been lying all along?

There is also another aspect to this situation, that been.....

How difficult and incredibly hard it is for a MAN to actually find a female partner who is willing to swing, who is open minded enough, honest enough, sexually exploring enough to swing with.

In my experience where swinging is concerned most women fall into a few categories:

1%: The massive 1% of women worldwide who will actually swing, who want to swing, who actually like the idea of threesomes and group sex. The massive 1% of women who are honest enough, brave enough, sexually open minded enough to swing with their boyfriend or husband. The women who can communicate, the women who actually properly understand a mans desires and reasons, and their own as well.

60% The women who basically say "HELL NO" to the entire idea of swinging, who are disgusted by the idea of swinging, who would never try a threesome, who have strong opinions and hang ups about sex, who view sex as something that is only done with a person that you love, that confuse the idea of sex as been love, or meaning love, the women who are totally 100% against the idea of sexual exploration as a couple.

39% The 39% of women who actually say YES to the idea of group sex because they want to sound cool and open minded when they first begin dating a man. That basically they meet a new man who happens to mention the words "Group Sex" or even "Threesome" and sure this women doesn't want to sound like a uptight boring sexually shut down prude, she wants to sound brave and cool, she wants to sound care free and open minded, she wants this new man to think she is not the crazy controlling jealous type so she says YES to the idea of swinging, when actually she really means NO!! She really means HELL NO!! Then obviously the man who does desire group sex begins to date her and then months or years down the line when he does mention the threesome or group sex idea again he gets a very sharp and hostile shock.

I have actually dated several women who said YES to the idea of group sex when we first met, then months later when asked about it again they have been 100% hostile towards the idea and have freely admitted they only said yes when we first met because they wanted to sound cool / fun / open minded, and so on.

Its actually really hard for a man to find a women who will not only love him / be loyal to him / work with him / build a home future and family with him / but will also swing with him as well. In the swinging world there is a term called "Unicorn" and why do you think that term is used? Because they don't fucking exist!!!! Finding one is like finding a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. That actually finding a women who is fully open minded and confident enough to swing is not an easy task at all, so sure if a man does want to swing then I can fully understand him saying that to a new partner from word go.

Really there are loads of examples of this situation.....

A women who works in a strippers club meets a new boyfriend and she explains that 3 or 4 nights a week she takes her clothes off for money in front of 50 horny guys all wanking off under the table, she asks her new boyfriend if he is okay with that or is it a deal breaker?

A party like guy who does drugs with his friends meets and new women, that women turns out to be a police officer, that man explains to this women that on the weekends he goes out clubbing with his friends, he drinks large amount of alcohol, he smokes weed, he takes cocaine, and he asks this police women if she is okay with that, or if its a deal breaker for her?

In fact one I have heard of several times is a man meets a women, they begin dating, this women has 2 or 3 cats at home, as it turns out the man is highly allergic to cats, what then? Does she get rid of the cats, or does he have to walk away?

Basically life is full of ultimatums and personally I'd rather know them from word go then waste 10 years of my life trying to date someone who is never going to accept my desires.

I also think CHEATING plays a big part in things.....

That actually the on line world is FULL OF MEN looking to cheat, swinging sites are overrun with so called single men who are all looking to cheat on their wives, and sure in most cases about 80% of those men have asked their wives to consider threesomes, they have asked their wives to share, they have asked their wives to explore with them and have been told to FUCK OFF!!!! They have been told NO!!!!

Some guys try for many many years to get their wives to agree to swinging and are hit by solid brick walls every time, its many of those guys who do end up cheating, who do end up sneaking around.

Its funny really because I have walked into various houses that are painted some God awful pink colour or is decorated like a little girls princess home, when I ask the guy "Why the fuck is your entire house pink?" he replies, because that is what his wife wanted. Shit my brother is about 6.5ft tall and he is driving around in a Mini Cooper car with his knees nearly touching the roof because that is what is wife wanted a posh little Mini Cooper.

I see some guys bedrooms that are painted some pastel peach colour and has flowery wall paper and flowery bedding fit for a princess, and really that is because that is what his wife wanted. It seems in many Western relationships women are use to getting what they want. BUT if your a man and you ask for swinging then 9 times out of 10 you are NOT getting what you want, and then you wonder why swinging sites are littered with men looking to cheat on their wives.

Its actually really really depressing been a man who wants to swing, a man who wants to swing for fun honest reasons, only to end up with a women who is totally 100% against the idea. It is debilitating, it is soul destroying, relationship destroying. In many cases the women stands more chance of losing her relationship by saying no to swinging than she does saying yes.

What I have observed about younger women today is that most young women (aged 18 to 30) all have smart phones, and on those smart phones are 10/20/100/ or even 200 "Male Friends" most of which are only there because at some point they have wanted sex with this young women. This smart phone not only carries hundreds of male friends (that are not really friends at all) but it also connects that young women with basically every man they have ever slept with, I have dated women who have smart phones packed full of men they have fucked, men who constantly text asking for more sex and asking for booty calls and hook ups, and that seemingly is 100% fine in women's eyes.

I have also observed that a lot of women do cheat these days, that for many young women having "Friends with benefits" situations with their male mates is now classed as normal behaviour, that sure a lot of young women will meet you / begin to date you / when actually they are still sexually involved with their last few boyfriends and several of their male friends, that actually cheating a lying seems to be okay to a lot of young women now. I have dated some young women and I have been sat their eating dinner at a nice restaurant whilst their male friends fire off penis pictures to her smart phone, and that is seemingly okay.

However.....

You ask a women to SHARE, ask her to explore WITH YOU, ask her to follow a more honest and open minded path and suddenly its a big fucking problem!!!! Its funny really because I have dated women who could basically fuck two guys every week if they wanted, if she agreed then sure she could spend entire evenings sandwiched between me and another hot guy, she could have 1 on 1 sessions, threesomes, even gang bangs if she wanted, sure we could explore other men, could explore Cuckold like situations, she could have herself a Bull, she could fuck young guys, older guys, or we could just meet 1 special swinging partner and stick with him and build an ongoing friendship, really she could have her cake and eat it as well.

Really she could have it all, but seems a lot of young women today are more focused on collecting male friends / male lovers on their smart phones and cheating with ex boyfriends after boozy nights out. That in my experience a lot of women would prefer to put their entire relationship at risk by lying, cheating, collecting male hook up friends that simply sharing, so sure as a man its dam hard to meet a women to actually swing with and I can fully understand a mans reasons for asking his new girlfriend about the subject good an early.

Don't get me wrong I'm not against women, I just find it odd how a LOT of women can cheat, that a lot of women can have entire smart phones full of sex buddies and pretend male friends shooting them off dick pics in messages, that sure a lot of women do meet nice honest guys whilst all along they are still fucking their ex boyfriends or even Muslim taxi drivers, BUT you ask them for a threesome and the world falls down.

Some years back I met a really nice guy, he was a great bloke to be honest, he was kind, passive, considerate, clean, almost an innocent and humble type of man. Guess he reminded me of some surfer dude, this totally passive nature loving person who wouldn't hurt a fly. That guy wanted to swing but his girlfriend had said no, yet several of us already knew that his girlfriend was a nasty bit of work, that his girlfriend would go out clubbing and take every opportunity she could to fuck black guys behind her boyfriends back.

Funny really because he was sitting at home working on some save the planet or rescue the little birds project and she was around the back of some scummy nightclub sucking off a black guy next to the bins, yet she couldn't do it with him, couldn't share, couldn't agree to threesomes together.

Sure if I meet a new girl to date I'd ask her about swinging within the first few weeks of meeting her, I'd explain my desires, I'd explain my reasons, and if she didn't agree then I'd cut my losses and meet a different girl, one who matched me better or was more open minded about things. Its not a ultimatum, its a simply a question.

Could you get on with me knowing that I'd like us to swing?

No? Oh well guess this relationship isn't going to really work out then.

Could you date me knowing I have 3 cats and your highly allergic to cats?

No? Oh well guess there wont be a real future here then.

I'd rather know from the start than waste months or even years dating someone only to get a rude sharp shock when I did mention the subject.

In my eyes at least telling someone about your desires to swing from the start is the noble and honest thing to do, its either that or spend the next 12 months lying to them before you bring it up.

Thank you so much for taking the time to post - it’s been invaluable in my decision making process .

You say he is 57. Just curious how old are you?

Well, my first thought on your situation is that if he is giving you that kind of ultimatum then him being a swinger is more important than any relationship you and he may become involved in. There is a huge difference between a couple who is in the lifestyle together and both enjoy having sex with others and enjoy watching each other playing with others versus a couple where one party is involved in sex with others just to make their partner happy and hope to stay with that person.

The lifestyle should not be what your life revolves around but more as an added spice every now and then. If your partner can't be happy with just having sex with you and not involving other people because he NEEDS that to be happy, then my advice to you is to RUN FAR AND AS FAST as you can and get yourself away from this situation. Nothing good will come of it. And do you really want to be in a relationship with a man who straight out tells you having sex with other women is more important than him having you in his life?

He isn't worth having you as a part of his world. Don't get involved in this just to please him; he certainly isn't worried about pleasing you.

Sorry for the brutal truth, but you will only get hurt from him.

Sun ..you are on point...I have been with 2 women that say they only did it for me.. supposed just going along with it