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Hi all. This is my first post. My husband and I are new to swinging. With his job we are unable to really pursue swinging locally so our options are kind of limited. We do have a second home in another state so we typically try to look there or wait for our trips to Desire. With this, our playing doesn't get to happen like we would like. We have some friends who asked us about Desire and we took them there. Since they are friends we haven't really approached them about the possibility of playing. They have never played with anyone but I do know they are looking to spice up their marriage. They are close friends, but becoming closer.

 

Anyone ever approached this? TIA

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I am going to make a prediction--virtually all the replies from the experienced and the wise members of this board will tell you "DON'T DO IT!" They will tell you the potential risks are just too high and too predictably unfortunate. They are the voices of experience and reason, they will be right.

 

Maybe there is a contrary view? What if your "close friends" have as much to lose from disclosure of these activities as you do? "Close friends" don't always stay close and can become estranged, so don't ignore that potential--guard against blackmail by knowing that you are not the only ones at risk.

 

Affairs involving sex are risky, even with just two people, but life would be boring and not rewarding if everyone was unwilling to take the risk. Whatever you do, keep us posted.

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Good point.

 

I'm thinking our lifestyle fun may be limited until my husband retires. LOL Then we won't worry so much.

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It worked for us with a former colleague of Mrs Doc. She came to visit us in Fla, they talked about all kinds of things while floating in the pool while I was working, including our hobby, and Trapeze. On the 3rd day, I got a call from my wife reporting that they were naked in the pool and I should get home asap. We had a great afternoon and evening which included the friend sending pictures of the 3 of us together to her boyfriend with the invitation to, as she put it, "get your ass down here". He did, we all played, we took them to Trapeze and introduced them to the club. We got together several times after that week here or in Pa. Eventually, their relationship failed (not related to swinging) but she continues to visit and is likely coming again after Memorial Day.

 

We were very fortunate with this friend but by and large, we'd urge caution in trying to "turn" friends. On the other hand, you said you took this couple to Desire. The genie is out of the bottle, I see no harm in asking if they're interested in exploring further.

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There is some risk to a friendship when swinging is introduced. You must weigh that risk for every couple with whom you consider swinging, friends or strangers.

 

My late wife and I didn't swing with strangers. The less you know someone, the more likely a problem will surface. One problem we didn't want to surface was a Sexually Transmitted Disease. While swapping with friends does not totally remove that possibility, it does give a couple the opportunity to access the risk. We chose our play couples based on their exposure. If their marriage was strong and their communication developed, we communicated with them and assessed the likelihood of their being offended by learning that we played. If there was a possible problem, we didn't ask.

 

It's not likely y'all will find a couple who have never slept with anyone else. We did, once in our twenty-seven year marriage. (30 years together.)

 

My advice is to get to know the other couple well. Learn how they think. Consider the possible pitfalls before asking. When you ask, don't invite. Learn about how they think. Laura's favorite way to open the conversation was to ask, "How do y'all feel about swinging?" That question does not ask for a decision, but an opinion. Learn, learn, learn.

 

I wish y'all the best of luck!

 

Alura

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Her and I have talked about her wanting to bring some desire to her and her husband's bedroom. She said she wouldn't mind seeing him with someone else and he has flat out said he would swing so I know they are open to it. I'm just not sure if they are with us. Heck, they may be thinking the same thing. We did play a game that got kinda wild one time. She blew her husband in front of us and her and I kissed but that is as far as it went and we were all drinking pretty heavily. I guess I worry about it being so close to home. My husband is a DR and we need to be very careful. Then again this couple is in the same boat with needing to keep things private. I guess we just need to play some more games and see where things go maybe.

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I'm one of the people who usually strongly recommend against trying to make swingers out of friends. I stick by that by still saying proceed with extreme caution if you decide to go forward. But, there are several things going on here that are different than the usual scenario. One, the topic has at least come up some and no big red flags here. Two, you went with them to Desire and that went ok. Three, by many people's definition, you have already had a swinging experience with them - alcohol induced or not, it happened, and no apparent repercussions so it's reasonable to wonder what else may be possible there.

 

I think your last sentence is the key - I can't think of much or anything really in swinging that is better when you rush into it, so just keep going along and see where it leads. Also, I'd try to leave room for a graceful retreat on both sides should you take a step too far, that way a "no thanks" doesn't have to mean feelings of awkwardness and potentially the end of the friendship.

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NORMALLY, the recommendation is to stay away from trying to make friends into swingers. There's too much of a chance that they aren't ready, can't handle, or will just be shocked at the suggestion and let the neighborhood know what you two do with your spare time. Usually it is much better, easier, and safer to make friends of swingers instead of swingers from friends...but in your case it sounds like they might already be on that path to becoming swingers.

 

Don't make this so hard. Next time you all get together (or maybe just the women), talk to her/them about what has happened. How did they feel about the trip to Desire and/or giving her husband oral in front of them? Ask them if they have done more (or anything) with anyone else? They might just be afraid of bringing it up, especially since they know that you two have 'more experience' than they do (you've started and they really haven't done anything other than express interest) and are hoping you will say something. Ask them and see what their feelings are...

 

At the same time, remember that there will always the risk that word may get out among your friends and neighbors, especially if their relationship has problems in the future. It doesn't sound like that much of a risk here, but be aware that there's still a risk. Let us know how things go for all of you.

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I'm not even going to read all the replies.

 

In years past when I first started I tried approching this subject with a few friends.

 

I learnt very quickly NEVER to ask normal friends about this.

 

Sadly playing with someone you know well / someone who knows your jobs / someone who knows where you work / someone who knows your family / someone who knows your routine / is all very bad and has a habit of blowing up in your face.

 

My general approach towards swing is to meet someone new who knows nothing about your family / work / other friends / hang outs / hobbies and so on. The less they know the safer things feel.

 

I know at the time it seems like a great idea, at the time you think this certain friend is perfect, sadly when it goes wrong they end up telling people you know, they end up spreading gossip about you, they can cause you a lot of damage by letting out such secrets.

 

Just my personal opinion really but I'd never ask a friend or anyone I work with, to risky.

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I'm happy to swing with friends, but I have a rule about it, I will not be their first and I want to see that they are still happily married 6 months or so after they start to swing. IMO swinging has the potential to blow up relationships and when it comes to friends, I'm not going to be the stick of dynamite that does it.

 

So, what I have done is talk to such friends about our experiences, and if they are interested in moving forward I will help them find the right sites to be on, help them get set up, talk to them about what to expect and then let them find their own way.

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We read the many, many articles and opinions saying not to do it but, we have. I rationale was that we were doing it with total strangers, why wouldn’t be better with friends. So, it started as a birthday blow job for a guy had been a long time friend of mine but who bonded nicely with hubby and I as a couple when we started dating, grew into MFM with him and then regular time play, and willingness to play with others we know.

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I have this crazy hangup. Swinging with someone I have a long history with as strictly vanilla is a tough mental hurdle to get over. If we were introduced as lifestyle, even if we'd never played, it's different.

 

Mrs. Stop has a friend she's known for decades, and we've been hanging out with him and his wife. They know we are LS, and apparently that knowledge has kicked their own fantasies into gear. I suspect they've talked about having a woman for her, and now they won't have to potentially embarrass themselves looking for one.

 

He often sends us nudie pics of her. We haven't tried to talk them into doing anything, but they are increasingly curious. In the beginning they were on the fence. I told Mrs. Stop that perhaps one day we could play, but they weren't really ready yet. And she agreed.

 

It seems in the couple years since the talk started that we might actually do this sometime. It's one thing to be approached, it's another thing to hit up friends and try to work it into conversation. I guess you'd have to be somewhat flirty towards each already before trying to cross that bridge.

 

In the end it's probably easier to make friends out of swingers than the other way around.

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I've had one 3some with friends of mine and I found it more comfortable than the thought of strangers. Mind you they were open to it as it had been a flirty topic before. I think it depends on the friends. I wouldn't ask friends who haven't expressed any interest before. That might end badly. But with strangers you don't know who they really are.

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When we began, four of the five couples we swapped with were prior vanilla friends. One of the husbands was even a coworker of mine and another of the husbands was the contractor we hired to build us a house. We never, ever, had any problems after.

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I have a suggestion for feeling out friends who might be interested in swinging with you. First, if they aren't already flirting with you, don't go there. If they are:

I'm a writer and I've just written a scene in a story that I'll summarize briefly. A private Christmas party. Both women goaded each other into wearing very sexy, revealing dresses. Kisses under the mistletoe. Dancing where the women's breasts and bare asses were flashed by the revealing dresses. If it gets too much for someone, they will likely stop it. In my story, they didn't stop there.

Another real experience was changing a bridge game that only four of the six people could play and we didn't know how to play the game, so we suggested poker. When someone asked what stakes, I said, strip poker. My wife dealt, and the game started. I had a shirt and cutoffs on with no skivvies. I quickly lost two hands and was naked. Eventually all three women were topless and the game stopped there. The next weekend we repeated it and got naked, and then got into the shower together with much fondling. Two of the couples, us and one other, swapped, separate rooms. It ended with them getting nude with us once more, but no more sex, her choice not ours. We all remained friends after that.

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We don't proposition friends but we were once propositioned by friends in our vanilla circle.


Years ago (before kids) my wife had a co-worker friend (let's call her Tina) and occasionally we would hang out with her and her hubby.  One night the four of us had dinner at their place and after dinner, to our surprise, the hubby put porn on the TV.  As if this bold gesture wasn't enough, he announced his wife Tina recently had her nipples pierced and encouraged her to show us - and she did (they looked beautiful).

 

Our 'vanilla' friends had set the mood with porn and now the wife had her tits out.

 

My wife and I had swinging experience. We were active nudists, we had been to sex clubs... yet this moment of being hit on by our vanilla friends caught us off guard and felt very awkward.    Even though we were swingers things could have easily gone south then and there.

 

I decided to help and try to save the situation so I said "I think it's unfair that Tina is the only one with her tits out". At that moment all eyes went to my wife. I had totally put my wife on the spot and for a moment i thought she was going to kill me, but after a couple seconds of hesitation she pulled he shirt off over her head and now both ladies were topless at the dinner table.

 

The ice broke, the tension lifted, we began to laugh and flirt and to make a long story short we swapped with them and after that they were lifestyle friends and no longer vanilla friends.

 

But I wondered how they knew.  Did they see our profile on a swingers site?  They insisted they just caught a vibe and acted on nothing more than that!

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We've asked a lot of our friends.  Unfortunately we have had a very low success rate with our couple friends however we have an extremely high success rate with our single (and some in relationships) friends (well mostly guy friends).  Approaching this with guy friends is very easy and usually very successful.  With a couple it's a little different because you have to get two people on board and the emotions of it are very different.  If you're very open about your lifestyle I don't see much of a reason not to approach friends but if you're trying to keep it a secret then friends can be difficult because they know people within your inner circle and might tell other people.

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For my wife and I, we've told two friends of ours (neither associated with the other; they'd never even met) that we are swingers.

 

In the first case, it was because he and his girlfriend were beginning to experiment with non-monogamy, and so we talked with him to help support him and answer questions he might have. He was absolutely floored, having never guessed we might be swingers. We didn't proposition him; just offered to answer questions he might have. We also gave him a book on the subject, which we had both already read.

 

In the second case, it was an old girlfriend of mine and it was a proposition (agreed to by my wife beforehand). That didn't go well, but we remain very close friends.

 

We don't see much of a benefit in telling friends (the two cases aside). You stand a fair chance of losing them as friends. There's also a chance of exposing your lifestyle choices to other friends and family and possibly coworkers. The potential reward is getting to play with your friend, but the chances of that are, as a general rule, pretty small. With so many couples available in the lifestyle with whom you could develop a friendship without such potential complications, it doesn't seem to be good math to proposition friends.

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On 6/29/2017 at 12:57 AM, ViSexual said:

another of the husbands was the contractor we hired to build us a house. We never, ever, had any problems after.

Amazing!  This is the first story I've ever heard where someone did not have a problem with a contractor. ?

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My first wife had affairs with several guys who were half of a couple we were friends with and the wives didn't know about it. She also had a long affair with one of my thesis advisors, which is the same guy I mentioned above (the couple we were friends with), and I knew socially or from work or school all of the guys she had affairs with (or just fucked a few times). One wife knew her husband cheated on her with my wife and that caused them to start an open marriage, but he refused to let her play with me and she let him bully her. 

In short, playing separately can get awfully messy. 

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16 hours ago, videoeditor44 said:

My first wife had affairs with several guys who were half of a couple we were friends with and the wives didn't know about it. She also had a long affair with one of my thesis advisors, which is the same guy I mentioned above (the couple we were friends with), and I knew socially or from work or school all of the guys she had affairs with (or just fucked a few times). One wife knew her husband cheated on her with my wife and that caused them to start an open marriage, but he refused to let her play with me and she let him bully her. 

In short, playing separately can get awfully messy. 

In these cases you are taking a huge risk.  One day a few of us were out drinking and partying and we all came back to her friends house.  It was really late maybe 3am or so.  I was downstairs with a couple of people and my GF was upstairs (I had a feeling I knew what she was doing up there).  Her friend goes upstairs into her bedroom and finds my GF and her BF in her bed together and freaks out.  They had a falling out after that but they actually became friends again not too long ago.

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16 hours ago, videoeditor44 said:

My first wife had affairs with several guys who were half of a couple we were friends with and the wives didn't know about it. She also had a long affair with one of my thesis advisors...

One Lifestyle couple we know got into swinging bc the wife was a serial cheater.  She admitted to having six separate affairs in their first year of marriage.  It wasn't bc she didn't love her husband she just had a supercharged sex drive and probably a sex addiction. To her husbands credit he realized the Lifestyle may provide her what she needs and save their marriage and it did.  Now they have been married 20 years.

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My relationship with my first wife didn't fail because of swinging problems. They helped us stay together to raise an accidental child even though what she was able to do with others was far more than what I could do. Twenty-three years plus a mandatory year of separation and I was able to get on with my life. If I had it to do over again, I wouldn't marry her. It wasn't worth it and I don't think my kid was better off for it. He's in his fifties and never found a wife or had kids. He thinks it's poor mothering and a bad relationship with her that is to blame.

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I can see this ending in about 5 ways.....4 of which are disastrous. We had drinks with a couple at a bar in our small town. They are swingers as well. It was supposed to be vanilla but after a few drinks......we also know the bartender, who called our adult kids and said your folks are down here. So that ended that. The only other local swingers we know are also friends. We have drinks quite often but never played with them.....in highschool my wife babysat for the female. We go to a larger town to play. We have no clubs in our state so when we go to a club it's a long way from home.

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We talked about asking friends to join us and even talked about how we should approach them. 

Should I talk to the husband or she talk to her friend. Do we go to dinner and bring up the subject and watch for reactions. 

Its a hard call to make. 

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3 hours ago, ToeDippers said:

We talked about asking friends to join us and even talked about how we should approach them. 

Should I talk to the husband or she talk to her friend. Do we go to dinner and bring up the subject and watch for reactions. 

Its a hard call to make. 

Unless people have had “exposure “ to the concept of swinging, this is a tough ask of friends. The first people that told us about swinging blew our circuits out. If we were to try to recruit friends (doubtful), I think we would break the ice by asking what they thought of swinging to get a read on their receptivity. 

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22 minutes ago, njbm said:

Unless people have had “exposure “ to the concept of swinging, this is a tough ask of friends. The first people that told us about swinging blew our circuits out. If we were to try to recruit friends (doubtful), I think we would break the ice by asking what they thought of swinging to get a read on their receptivity. 

We're a younger couple and have no kids so maybe it's just easier for us to ask.  Our feeling is if they are really our friends they won't be judgemental about it and most people haven't been.

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We would have them over for dinner or drinks. Mention our trips to HEDO II. If there seems to be some interest, my wife would take the other women to the bedroom and try on some of her sexy dresses for her, if there is still more interest wife and maybe the other woman would come out and model for us guys. We take it from there.

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A safe way to approach is to ask a non-committal question like "have you guys heard about swinging" or "what do you guys think about people who swing?" The reply might be anything in the range of "people who do that are destined to burn in Hell" to "we have sometimes wondered about that." Your line of questioning can go from there.  If you perceive a positive view you can work around to "we are swingers, your know."  You'll need to feel around for what happens next. 

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If done properly, sex among friends and acquaintances can bring them closer together.

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We have been pondering for some time and if this pandemic ever abates, our first time may be with close friends. We've been friends for almost 2 decades and live long-distance, but in the last few years have flirted a lot and at the beginning of the year we tested out the waters with some playful teasing and wandering hands at their house, just couldn't take it much farther since our kids and their kid were there. The plan was to take it further next time (without the kids around), but then the world caught on fire.. oy... but we still hope and tease.

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33 minutes ago, couplers said:

If done properly, sex among friends and acquaintances can bring them closer together.

I agree, Couplers, but if done improperly that kind of sex can destroy friendships and marriages.

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7 hours ago, couplers said:

If done properly, sex among friends and acquaintances can bring them closer together.

We have been very active with friends and acquaintances - friends, coworkers, my GF's boss, etc. and we have had some bumps in the road but at the end of the day we both agree that the benefits have outweighed the drawbacks for us.

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The problem with having sex with friends (or making friends into swingers) is that if things go bad (and because the other couple probably doesn't have the foundation and the time to talk about swinging, swinging limits, etc and they haven't really considered swinging before this, the odds are pretty good that things can go bad) then EVERYONE is most likely going to know about it...neighbors, friends, family, co-workers. Is it worth taking the chance. Even just ASKING your friends, no matter how much you THINK they are interested, may shock and disgust them. You really don't know until it happens.

 

Ms. Gold with her former husband tried this. They started going with friends nude in the hot tub...then fooling around, then changing partners and fooling around. In the end, Ms. Gold and her former husband shouldn't have been swinging at all (they were thinking that swinging would save a bad marriage) and the other couple...well the husband fell in 'love' with Ms. Gold and was willing to leave his wife for her (she wasn't interested, but everyone knew that he wanted her over his wife). Friendship was destroyed, private lives became public knowledge, marriages ended, and everyone knew why.

 

While it may SOUND easier to do, it really just isn't worth the risk. You are just better off finding another couple(s) that have already decided to try swinging and make them friends.

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6 hours ago, GoldCoCouple said:

... Even just ASKING your friends, no matter how much you THINK they are interested, may shock and disgust them. You really don't know until it happens.

Everything GoldCoCouple said. Spot on.

 

I wanted to emphasize what GoldCoCouple said here quoted above. I mentioned previously in this thread that I approached an old girlfriend (with my wife's permission), and that it did not go well. She and I are very close, and remain very close. We broke up 10 years before I met my wife, but it was a very amicable break up. I never really thought about propositioning her with idea of us having sex again, but as my wife and I became more comfortable with emotions developing it seemed like a potentially natural evolution for my wife and I. After quite some time and a fair bit of thought, we decided to try it. I spent two years on and off flirting with my ex girlfriend. As I said, we're very close. All three of us referred to her as a sister wife, and all of us were comfortable with that. That is, until I propositioned her that it could be something of a reality. I thought there was a very high chance she was going to be accepting of it, and found out she was exactly the opposite.

 

No matter how well you think you know your friends, you never really know just how they will react.

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On 10/8/2020 at 6:49 PM, videoeditor44 said:

My first wife had affairs with several guys who were half of a couple we were friends with and the wives didn't know about it. She also had a long affair with one of my thesis advisors, which is the same guy I mentioned above (the couple we were friends with), and I knew socially or from work or school all of the guys she had affairs with (or just fucked a few times). One wife knew her husband cheated on her with my wife and that caused them to start an open marriage, but he refused to let her play with me and she let him bully her. 

In short, playing separately can get awfully messy. 

 

Yeah, that ain't swinging, that's cheating.

 

And BTW, ew.

 

?

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My swinging started with a friend, though not an everyday friend. She was a college friend in town for a football game. There was no talk, no asking, it just happened while sharing a hotel room after the game. 

We have two very close friends that we are very sexually involved with. My husband’s best friend who my husband approached to join us and a very good friend of mine who I didn’t want to include but eventually welcomed into our play. Neither of them have caused any problem for us. My husband’s friend has become the person who I have had more play with than anyone else other than my husband. An outsider might question our relationship even though there are no romantic attachment. 

I was hesitant at first and included him at my husbands urging and none of us have regrets. 

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19 hours ago, PSULioness said:

I was hesitant at first and included him at my husbands urging and none of us have regrets

Your husband and my wife were the ones who had the talk with the friends, did you ever wonder how the conversation went? How did your husband bring up the topic with his friend or was it Hey you want to fuck my wife? I know now my wife and her friend made up stories to get me to agree and I wondered if they had already played before what was our first time as couples. I don’t think they did and now I don’t care if they did. We are very open with our play with them. We play together and alone with them. My wife has played alone with her friend, so have I. As you said I have no regrets and am enjoying how close we have become especially during the Covid era. 

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On 10/17/2020 at 11:35 AM, findinganswers said:

How did your husband bring up the topic with his friend or was it Hey you want to fuck my wife?

That's how I bring it up.  That's what it is and nothing more.  It's been a very effective pitch in my experience.

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How to proposition friends and acquaintances?  Create the opportunities - I would leave my friend alone with my husband for short periods to show that I wasn't jealous; I would undress/dress in front of both of them.  (It was something I had done in front of her before, and obviously had done in front of my husband, but with both there it created an interesting dynamic.)  Go slowly - let the other person take the next incremental step, then welcome it.  Make your response mutual - when she said she found my husband attractive, I would say he finds you attractive too.  

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      I'm just trying to sort out my feelings and maybe writing them down, and having the good folks on the forums offer their $.02, will help.
       
      So, I've got a crush on my friend-with-benefits. I probably should have seen it coming. In fact, I think I did. She's exactly the type of lady I've always crushed on. Smart, strong but with a hint of softness, geeky, long dark hair, great eyes... Yeah, I was doomed from the start. When we first met, I joked about it: "If I was ten years younger, she would have been exactly my type." First she was just a casual acquaintance and sometime babysitter (yes, I'm banging the babysitter, get over it, she's in her 20's). Then we were friends. Now, we're friends with benefits. It's a casual thing... friends and occasional sex... really great sex.
       
      OK, I knew I had a bit of a crush on her right from the start. I'm an idiot but I'm not a total idiot. I said as much. I said it to myself, to my wife, to her wife, to her... we all know it.
       
      The other day I looked at her picture online. I went looking because I hadn't seen her in a week. (A damn week? Really, I should have known better.) It hit me... that feeling, that swooping, heart skipping a beat, light headed, what-the-hell-I-shouldn't-be-feeling-this feeling. Oh crap.
       
      So I said it to her. Those three damn words. She knows. She cares about me too. But she doesn't feel "the way I want her to." (Her words.)
       
      The thing is, fucked as I know just how I want her to feel. I don't even know what these feelings mean to me. What we have is good. Friendship and occasional really great sex. I don't really want more than that... except maybe more often (twice a month instead of once) and she and I both want that. I don't want to run away with her. We both have good relationships with our spouses and other partners. I don't want to mess any of that up. I like what we have. In fact, liking what we have is what got me into this emotional confusion in the first place.
       
      Maybe it's just a question of definitions. What is love beyond friendship and sex? What does it mean that I have this crazy-making neuro-chemical reaction just to seeing her? Aren't I too old for this shit?
       
      Nope, still haven't sorted it out. I'll just have to keep trying. (If you've made it this far, thanks for reading. Welcome to my crazy. )
    • By two42lovers
      Some couples have the "use 'em and lose 'em" approach to finding play partners, others want "friends with benefits". A few choose polyamory - having more than one loving, intimate relationship at a time with the full knowledge and consent of everyone involved. Interested to hear your thoughts.
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