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Dannyboy50

We need your help saving our marriage

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I have a serious situation. My wife and I are middle-aged, and have been married to each other for about 6 years. We have always had problems with her extreme jealousy...paranoia..whatever...although I have always been faithful. A cashier can smile at me, and I can be in deep shit. We are now separated, she has filed for divorce, because she is convinced that I have been unfaithful to her...I was not. We do love each other, and the only problem we have is her jealousy...we are talking...we both want to be together with each other...but she says I will break her heart again..and I say that my actions have been entirely innocent...I'm just friendly with everyone...I don't need an extramarital affair to be happy.

 

And I am at my wits end...this marriage is over, and that is really sad. Now, my wife is sexual...she loves sex. My thought is if we entered into a swinging relationship...or swinging lifestyle....maybe that would cure her jealousy...her worse fears would be realized, but there would be no dishonesty...we would be doing it with each others knowledge and approval...and since she is doing it ...how could she be jealousy...She can enjoy her sexuality...the jealousy problem hopefully would disappear...we could live together happy as a married couple...and while I don't need the swinging lifestyle....I would enjoy it.

 

Please give me your thoughts, suggestions, etc, and if you live in north Atlanta area, possibly we can conspire to work towards making something happen. I have not discussed this with her...I think she would dismiss it, and possibly get angry, but if handled right....I see this as a solution to all the problems...win..win..win.. At least I would try it before I kiss my love goodbye.

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Swinging will not fix a bad relationship, it will break it up really quick though.

 

You are looking the wrong direction for help.

 

I would completely forget about this idea. Get with a professional that you and your wife can talk about.

 

When two people can't work on their problems adding more people just makes the problems bigger.

 

Take what I say with a grain for salt since I am not a "Professional" but I have been in this lifestyle close to 40 years and seen hundreds of relationships crash and burn because of people thinking they can use it to fix things.

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As a new poster......you unfortunately need to know that swinging will NOT SAVE your marriage. That is the wrong way to think. In fact, it will only make things worse. You need to work out your marriage on your own. Believe me, I know this better than anyone as I've been down that road.

 

Best of Luck

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"Gee honey, I know you hate the idea of me having sex with another woman but how about swinging?". That's how that sounds. There is no right way to bring this up to a woman who does not want you to have sex with other people and has left you over it.

 

Having more sex will not fix jealousy. It just creates more opportunities for obsessing over things.

 

Have you tried communicating with her over why she thinks you have cheated? You say here that you think swinging would make you happy, are you possibly conveying to her that you want to have sex with others and she has picked up on it?

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Swinging will not mess up a good relationship, but it will sure as hell will not save a bad relationship.

 

Jealousy and swinging does not go hand in hand.

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Your relationship is already ending. Swinging would only speed up that process. I would never recommend anyone with jealousy issues attempt swinging. That just invites drama.

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Swinging is not what y'all need. You desperately need communication without fear. As long as you fear your wife's reaction to ANYTHING you might say, I see little hope. As long as y'all don't trust each other, this can't happen.

 

On our second date, my late wife and I agreed to never become angry because a question was asked and that we'd always talk it out completely and honestly. For the next thirty years, or so, neither of us feared to talk about anything.

 

I hope she is willing to make an effort with you. Good Luck!

 

Edit: [by the way, once you accomplish communication y'all will be able to do anything together, including swinging, should both of you decide to.]

 

Alura

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Have either of you tried counseling? Separate and then maybe couple counseling?

 

I'm so sorry to see that your marriage is ending, but your train of thought won't work in the swinging arena. I can almost see your way of thinking, however, it would surely doom your marriage.

 

I think if you two want to save your marriage, you need a lot of communication between you two. Alura is correct. I've found that communication is the base for any relationship, whether it be professional or personal. Once you have that down, swinging could be an option.

 

Good Luck.

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Your wife, even though you have told her that you have never been unfaithful, is convinced you have been and is divorcing you for it. My own bias is that I think people who are crazy jealous are really just plain crazy and need a lot of therapy and maybe even then shouldn't be out in the world inflicting their drama on the rest of us, but no matter.

 

Like everyone has said, swinging won't fix your marriage. It will only make it end faster, because the two of you don't have a foundation of trust. However, if your marriage is already over, I don't see any reason not to say, with all the exasperation that must come with years of defending yourself, "Honey, the only way I'd ever have sex with another woman is if you were right next to me fucking her husband."

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Thanks. Her insecurities are tied to bad relationships she had before I came along, and started right after we met. I mistakenly thought that marriage and time would show her that I was worthy of trust, and the insecurity would fade away and trust would grow, but that has not happened at all. Talking and communication and trying has kept us together for 6 yrs, but now we have been separated for several weeks, divorce filed, issues settled, and down to point of walking away...My thoughts are that if we would try this...it can't hurt...we are done for anyway...but if we did it...and make love later...then it might be a wake her up and know that our love can easily handle us fucking somebody else in the same room...Chemo almost kills a cancer patient...to use an analogy...but talking even thru a counselor is not going to kill the cancer....Have I changed anyone's advice?? If its my last chance why not give it a shot?

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My thoughts are that if we would try this...it can't hurt...we are done for anyway...but if we did it...and make love later...then it might be a wake her up and know that our love can easily handle us fucking somebody else in the same room...

 

Or it could show her that you've secretly been wanting to have sex with other women all this time and just didn't tell her. She could see how much fun you are able to have with someone else as proof that you are an unfaithful person, even if she suddenly believes that you haven't acted on it before.

 

The fact that she sees it wouldn't make it true, but it most definitely could hurt her emotionally.

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First, sorry to hear of your difficult situation. It takes two to make a relationship work, and adding a 3rd and 4th does not get to the basic issue of trust between the two of you. What everyone else has said is correct: swinging ONLY works in an atmosphere of trust and love. It cannot create that trust, nor can it restore love. Doing the hard job of introspection will require will, grit and the support of a mental health professional. She might not be willing to go down that road. But you should, if only to help you sort out your feelings and confidence. Where marriages dissolve, both parties inevitably hurt.

 

Good luck.

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Sorry for your loss. But you can not change some one like that. Your getting the blame for whatever some other guy supposedly did to her. Be glad you only lost 6 years and hopefully no kids. If another woman can't even smile at you with out her going ape shit WTF you think is going to happen if you mention sex with some one else? That just plays into her delusions. PLEASE don't bring that shit down on us if she actually went along with it, not that that is even going to happen. Get your self some counseling so your in a better place when you meet some one else.

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Use this terrible situation to learn to communicate, then apply the knowledge with another woman.

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I'm listening to each and every one. OK....She has told me that she likes porn movies...I don't so much, so we have never watched one together...what if we were to meet with another couple with the plan being for her to get turned on and all the action was between her and the other couple...I abstain or either I do very little compared to her involvement. My goal is not to figure some "legitimate" way to screw other women....at my age keeping a love-love relationship, and having peace is more important than an occasional piece of strange ass....I am just desperate to kill the thing that is killing our marriage. I keep putting counseling on the back burner because I don't think she would participate, we have both lost patience with this old worn out 6 yr old topic, and then costs, time, etc....It just may be easier to turn lose and start over. Again thanks for the comments and advice.

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Sorry to hear that, U both need to go to counseling together and express each others inner thoughts, and fears GOOD LUCK TO BOTH OF U!

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You may be listening but you don't appear to be hearing what is being said.

 

You do this and you might as well pack your stuff. It will be the end.

 

Besides, swingers don't want to deal with your drama so most will have nothing to do with your "trying" to fix things.

 

This will not fix it. It will show her all the things you say you don't want though and she is not going to take it well.

 

You want to say your relationship. Get a professional. You want to end it, bring up swinging to her tonight.

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To put it bluntly, sex will NEVER fix a bad relationship. Communication is the key to a good relationship. If she is unwilling to communicate or, worse yet, take your existing communication and twist it up in her mind to make you look bad, your done! If she is going to get pissed over some woman at a store or restaurant doing her job and being friendly there is NOTHING you can say that will not be twisted to hurt you. Get your self a good lawyer so she does not take you to the cleaners when she divorces you. You bring up swinging and she will just use it to tell the judge what a cheating bastard you are and how you emotionally abused her.

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To put it bluntly, sex will NEVER fix a bad relationship. Communication is the key to a good relationship. If she is unwilling to communicate or, worse yet, take your existing communication and twist it up in her mind to make you look bad, your done! If she is going to get pissed over some woman at a store or restaurant doing her job and being friendly there is NOTHING you can say that will not be twisted to hurt you. Get your self a good lawyer so she does not take you to the cleaners when she divorces you. You bring up swinging and she will just use it to tell the judge what a cheating bastard you are and how you emotionally abused her.

 

That. Dannyboy50, I admire your ability to think out of the box and I truly feel for you in this dreadful situation, but you clearly don't understand the triggers and motivators for jealousy. Plus, you're not being honest with yourself. If your wife wouldn't be interested in counseling to save your marriage, she's already out of there and sex won't change a thing.

 

You didn't do anything wrong, or at least nothing that would have changed the outcome, and you cannot fix this. If your wife actually wanted to stay married to you, she would have gotten the help she needed to work on whatever is so badly broken in her.

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. . . . I am just desperate to kill the thing that is killing our marriage.
You are not the first person to post a message at this Web site hoping to learn there is a easier way out of a situation or hoping for validation of an irrational plan. Your reception has been a cool one but not, believe me, as cold as what some new members have received.

 

Stop, look and listen. You have heard some cogent arguments. I do hope you will consider them carefully.

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I'm listening to each and every one. OK....She has told me that she likes porn movies...I don't so much, so we have never watched one together...what if we were to meet with another couple with the plan being for her to get turned on and all the action was between her and the other couple...I abstain or either I do very little compared to her involvement. My goal is not to figure some "legitimate" way to screw other women....at my age keeping a love-love relationship, and having peace is more important than an occasional piece of strange ass....I am just desperate to kill the thing that is killing our marriage. I keep putting counseling on the back burner because I don't think she would participate, we have both lost patience with this old worn out 6 yr old topic, and then costs, time, etc....It just may be easier to turn lose and start over. Again thanks for the comments and advice.

 

Why don't you tell her that??????

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You keep saying you" think she would" or you "think she would dismiss it" with regards to several scenarios including counseling. What you need to do is stop trying to read her mind and directly communicate with her. My advice would be to ask her to go to counseling if you really want to try to save your marriage. She already distrusts you, if you bring up swinging, that will validate her beliefs that you want to have other women and destroy any chance you two may have. You have to have trust, honesty and solid communication before you could ever swing.

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Swinging is an accelerant, but it cares not which direction it burns. Applied to a good solid relationship, it can really heat things up. Applied to a bad one, it will blow it up. It's as simple as that.

 

Professional counseling is the only way to go here. If she won't agree to that, then you have done all you can do and it's time to just start picking up the pieces and moving forward with your life.

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Sounds to me like your adamant about trying swing. But I think you have a choice to make first. Do you want to stay with your wife or split from her. If you want to stay with her you can expect to throw swing out the window (especially with those jealously thoughts.. Been there) I think even with therapy, those thoughts would reappear later if you did start swing. If you do decide to split then a option would be finding a person that had same view of swing as you before you enter a serious relationship. But all in all I side with the people that say you all are in need of serious counseling NOT swing.

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My own bias is that I think people who are crazy jealous are really just plain crazy and need a lot of therapy and maybe even then shouldn't be out in the world inflicting their drama on the rest of us, but no matter.

I tend to have the same bias, because I believe this...

Thanks. Her insecurities are tied to bad relationships she had before I came along, and started right after we met.

...is generally a bullshit excuse for bad behavior in a relationship. If I ran a poll here, I'm betting the majority of us on this site have been cheated on at some point in our lives, whether in marriage, in a committed relationship, or as kids in high school. You don't get to hold that against the next relationship, or the next one, or the next one.

 

My wife and I both came out of shitty relationships with cheaters before we met. We have never held the transgressions of our former lovers/spouses against each other. That's wrong, it's corrosive, and it isn't fair. You deserve better than that, and you can't fix it. She has to fix it, and if she can't, well, you'll have a choice to make.

 

Let me tell you why you shouldn't swing from a different perspective: It will blow up, like others have said, but that isn't my concern honestly. My concern is you are going to put another couple, or couples, in the middle of her eventual meltdown (and she will melt down), and no one else in the world deserves the drama that will ensue.

 

Do you want to be known in the swinger community as "that couple that had a total freakout when they were with Bob and Mary because they had no business even thinking about swinging due to her jealousy issues"?

 

Good luck to you.

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You are being completely inconsiderate toward the potential couple/couples who might be so naive as to get involved with you. I can't imagine the drama and discomfort you and your wife could cause at a swing club or event.

 

Your magical thinking that she would even go out with you to a club or to meet a couple is interesting. The divorce papers are filed. I don't see anyway she'd even be interested in lying down to watch porn with you. Besides, if you get a hard on she will say that proves you are a cheater. From your description you are in a no win situation.

 

Get into counseling and work on yourself so you can find a more suitable partner next time. Work on good communication from the start and perhaps you will eventually have a relationship where you can enjoy swinging.

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Have I changed anyone's advice?? If its my last chance why not give it a shot?

 

No. I feel more adamant that you simply want the result you desire. You are making a desperate leap. Getting our support will not change your wife's mind about how she feels on sex with other people.

 

If you were hoping there might be some special secret thing that other husbands have used to get their wives on board with this that they can share with you to make it happen; you might be disappointed. I don't think there is. The couples I see making this work as something they enjoy aren't really working at it. It's part of who they are, what they both want and what makes them happy.

 

I don't think you can convince someone they want this when they don't. It works because we want to experience this. It's not a fix to something that isn't working, it's not a way to prove anything; it's simply what we want to share with our husbands.

 

 

The Rose @>-->--

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I came here to this community to get your advice and suggestions, and I have gotten both...thank you. Everyone is of the opinion that introducing swinging is a very bad idea, and that we should seek professional help. OK...case closed...I am going to forget "swinging" and I plan to discuss with her again the idea of us going to counseling.

If that doesn't fly, I am going to try to follow another suggestion...exit gracefully.

 

Now, I have a suggestion for a few of you...don't add facts to the scenario...don't assume...don't accuse based on things not involved.

First I wanted to give serious thought, and seek advice, before I floated this idea with my wife. I did just that. I have not ever discussed swinging with her, and now I certainly have no intention to do so. I knew it was a desperate act on my part...but I had run out of other ideas.

 

Second, the first step was serious consideration and advice; if everything was "go", then the second step would have been a serious conversation with wife, and if everything was "go" the third step would be a serious conversation with potential other couple, including the history of her jealousy.....You were right to point out that I should not put another couple in a bad situation...but you were wrong to think that I would have done that. I'm in step one, not step two, and certainly not step three.

 

Third, I am a man who loves his wife, who is trying to find a cure for jealousy which is destroying what could have been a wonderful marriage. After 6 years of me loving her, being faithful and patient with her...the problem is worse, not better. I hate to give up, but we have separated and divorce papers are on the table. I don't need swinging...don't want it...but I think I am healthy enough to do it, and to even enjoy it...if it saves our marriage. But, again, it appears to have been a stupid thought.

 

I say all of this because many people who come here for advice, need their situation addressed...as many of you did with me...but they do not need advice based on added facts or assumptions which are not involved in their situation. OK, I'll get off my box now...I have enough problems.. Thanks again for the responses. Keith

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Thanks. Her insecurities are tied to bad relationships she had before I came along, and started right after we met. I mistakenly thought that marriage and time would show her that I was worthy of trust, and the insecurity would fade away and trust would grow, but that has not happened at all. Talking and communication and trying has kept us together for 6 yrs, but now we have been separated for several weeks, divorce filed, issues settled, and down to point of walking away...My thoughts are that if we would try this...it can't hurt...we are done for anyway...but if we did it...and make love later...then it might be a wake her up and know that our love can easily handle us fucking somebody else in the same room...Chemo almost kills a cancer patient...to use an analogy...but talking even thru a counselor is not going to kill the cancer....Have I changed anyone's advice?? If it's my last chance why not give it a shot?

 

Sounds like you have nothing to lose really. It's already lost.

 

I'd suggest not doing others but if she could see you had the control to NOT do others, maybe not even do her in that situation, maybe she would get the hint that you have control over your sexual behavior?

I'm thinking more a club and not another couple. One last vacation?

 

Just don't drag others into your mess with swinging....no reason to hurt them.

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I came here to this community to get your advice and suggestions, and I have gotten both...thank you. Everyone is of the opinion that introducing swinging is a very bad idea, and that we should seek professional help. OK...case closed...I am going to forget "swinging" and I plan to discuss with her again the idea of us going to counseling.

If that doesn't fly, I am going to try to follow another suggestion...exit gracefully.

 

Now, I have a suggestion for a few of you...don't add facts to the scenario...don't assume...don't accuse based on things not involved.

First I wanted to give serious thought, and seek advice, before I floated this idea with my wife. I did just that. I have not ever discussed swinging with her, and now I certainly have no intention to do so. I knew it was a desperate act on my part...but I had run out of other ideas.

 

Second, the first step was serious consideration and advice; if everything was "go", then the second step would have been a serious conversation with wife, and if everything was "go" the third step would be a serious conversation with potential other couple, including the history of her jealousy.....You were right to point out that I should not put another couple in a bad situation...but you were wrong to think that I would have done that. I'm in step one, not step two, and certainly not step three.

 

Third, I am a man who loves his wife, who is trying to find a cure for jealousy which is destroying what could have been a wonderful marriage. After 6 years of me loving her, being faithful and patient with her...the problem is worse, not better. I hate to give up, but we have separated and divorce papers are on the table. I don't need swinging...don't want it...but I think I am healthy enough to do it, and to even enjoy it...if it saves our marriage. But, again, it appears to have been a stupid thought.

 

I say all of this because many people who come here for advice, need their situation addressed...as many of you did with me...but they do not need advice based on added facts or assumptions which are not involved in their situation. OK, I'll get off my box now...I have enough problems.. Thanks again for the responses. Keith

 

I'm sorry if you took offense to people reading between the lines. We don't know you and all the info we have to go on is what you provide. Beyond that, all we can do is read between the lines and give advice based on our own experience. Our experience (including both actual experience for some and reading what has happened with others) is that most people don't think ahead. The fact that you were even considering swinging as a potential "fix" for anything was our only starting point. Based on other experiences, we can assume that if you are considering swinging as a "fix" for anything that you likely haven't given thought to a LOT of things, including the other people you may be involving.

 

I applaud you for wanting to save your marriage enough to be willing to try anything. I also applaud you for researching before you made that attempt. Unfortunately, swinging isn't the answer here. Jealousy can not be "fixed" by anyone but the jealous person. It's something she has to deal with and maybe losing you will be the thing that has to happen to make her realize that she needs to change her reactions. Perhaps, however, there is more to her jealousy than you even know. Again, that is for her to deal with.

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If the desire to ever sample swinging is anywhere on your radar , work on establishing trust and communication with your next Girlfriend.

If you wish to try to patch things with current Wife , run don't walk to counseling, both of you individually , and together. And heartily embrace monogamy.

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If she already has jealousy issues suggesting swinging will only confirm in her mind that you want other women besides her. Swinging is definitely not the answer to jealousy issues. You need to resolve any jealousy issues before you even think about bringing other people into the equation. Get some counseling to work through your issues together.

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      A few days after we were all together the second time I told my wife about my feelings for Becca. I told her I didn’t know if I was getting our sexual chemistry mixed up with emotion but I thought that could be the case. To my surprise Angie did not freak out. She told me she suspected something was up-given the amount of communication between Becca and I. I took a few weeks to sort out my feelings and spent many more hours talking to both Angie and Becca. I realized that I was probably in love with Becca. And I told them both so. Becca told me she feels the same way. This is not the “oh, I’ve just fucked someone new, I hope they like me best” kind of feeling. We’ve both been with other people since we met and it has not cooled our emotions. This is raw, real and deep.
       
      When I told Angie all of this she gave me license to pursue a relationship with Becca and follow it wherever it may lead. I did not ask for this, Angie offered it to me. Angie is secure about our commitment to each other-I am not leaving my wife and Becca and Angie both know that. Becca also has no intention of leaving her husband.
       
      Becca has talked with her husband Rob about us and the feelings we’ve developed for each other. What she has not told him is that she thinks loves me, she does not know how he would react to that (here is the mostly open part that I alluded to in the first paragraph). She has told him our feelings are deep but has not gone into how much we care for each other. Rob is completely comfortable with texts and calls throughout the day, but not with Becca and I meeting without him and Angie there-even for lunch or dinner. I completely understand and respect this. I don’t like it, but I respect it. I suspect if the shoe were on the other foot I would feel the same way. I really genuinely like Rob by the way, he treats both Becca and Angie really well-and he and Angie have really great sex together. Angie has told Rob that it’s just sex between the two of them and Rob feels the same way. They have no other feelings for each other past that.
       
      Becca and I text every day and talk several times a week; I know about her life and children, and she knows about mine. We have similar interests and lives outside of swinging, we are in similar businesses. We have become emotional rocks for each other. I get emotional needs met from her that I do not get from Angie. Again, I have been upfront with Angie about all this and she is fine with it.
       
      So here are my big questions: Do these things really ever work, or are we on the express train to Dramaville?
       
      Is it possible to keep something like this going long term?
       
      How do we navigate the fact that Rob is not comfortable with Becca and I meeting without him around (again, we will not be going against his wishes on this one) and knowing that he and Angie will want to have more variety in their swinging soon, which will leave less opportunity for Becca and I to be together?
       
      Any thoughts from the wise sages on here are welcome. I’m a big boy-if I’ve being naïve about anything please tell me. I can take it.
    • By Ebonylehigh
      We are in a relationship with another couple. The male of that couple had a single lady as a gf. That ended because he was taking love and affection from his wife and also ignoring me.
       
      He keeps being upset that his wife gets to still be with the one she loves (my husband) and his was taken away. Compares the two situations like they are the same even though when he was with his gf, his wife got nothing and was home with the kids. Whereas when they see us he always gets me that gets him off at least twice every time and there has been more times than that. Where I am affectionate and caring. Where we both clearly enjoy each other's company very much.
       
      Am I right to be offended that he keeps doing this comparison? It hurts my feelings every time because I'm obviously a non factor to him. He says he really cares about me and can see his feelings heading to love. I'm just not seeing that when he keeps doing this comparison.
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