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  1. #1

    Default Where to go from here?

    This is going to be a really long first time post because there is a lot of history going on so, please bear with me.

    First off, my husband and I have been married for going on thirty years. Before you begin to think that we must be ancient, we got married when we were 19. Before that, we had known each other since we were three. Not like next door neighbors or anything, we lived in a small town and our parents ran in the same social circles so we interacted together sporadically and started dating at age 16. He was my first serious boyfriend and I was his first girlfriend. We lost our virginities with each other.

    Long story short, even back then, we knew we were going to get married but, parents being what they are had a panic attack that we were so serious at such an early age and colluded to make sure we went not only to different colleges but, to colleges in different States. My father died suddenly at the end of my Senior year in High School and a couple of months later I found myself alone, surrounded by strangers with a mother who had become distant dealing with her own unresolved emotional issues regarding my father’s death.

    My “best friend”, the person who had been my rock for so many years, was now hundreds of miles away and phone calls just didn’t cut it when I needed some hugs, which was daily.

    We had agreed, per our parents request to “see other people” and I slid into the party girl lifestyle (and how) while he did not. He tried dating one other girl but, ended up talking to her about me and his concerns for where I was headed and that pretty much put the freeze on that as it was obvious he was still in love with me.

    Me? I was able to easily separate the feelings of love I still had for him from “just sex”, pleasure and feeling a physical intimacy with another person.

    Fast forward three decades, raising five children (two are still teens) and a myriad of roadblocks that life throws at you from moving to job losses and I am happy to say, our marriage is still solid, maybe even more solid than it ever has been. We are still very much in love with one another, enough so, that perfect strangers feel the need to approach and comment on it.

    About two years ago, DH started having problems with ED and libido. He went for a more indepth physical to rule out heart disease, low testosterone etc. and was proclaimed healthy as a horse…except for a slightly enlarged prostate for which he takes a small daily dose of a well-known ED medication and while it has helped a bit, not enough.

    At first, we went through the idea that maybe it was just stress at work and I made sure to take steps to ensure that he was getting a good diet, regular exercise, getting enough sleep and of course, plenty of opportunities for stress release.

    When that all met without success, the ugly monster of self-doubt started to creep in. Maybe I just didn’t physically turn him on anymore. I took a good look at myself, lost five pounds (I was a loose size 6 to begin with), contemplated breast enhancement surgery, threw out my old flannel night gowns in lieu of some silky jammies and did my best to make sure that at all times I remained pleasing to the eye. We did a lot of talking and made some changes to our sex lives including getting out of the vanilla rut we had fallen into over the years.

    Weekends away from the kids, toys, shared porn watching, even a bit of mild S&M and learning Tantric sex. All of it has helped to a miniscule degree but, again, not to the point where our sex drives are anywhere near matched like it used to be. Fact is, he just doesn’t want it as much as I do and it isn't something you can fake with someone who knows you inside and out. The lack of passion, more than the ED, was starting to make me depressed and unhappy with other aspects of our lives.

    About six months ago, we discussed many possibilities; everything from hotwifing, to traditional swinging, to cuckhold, to opening our marriage and seeing how that went. He wants me above all else to be happy, he was starting to miss my usual happy do-lucky free spirited self. For six months, it has been a topic of discussion every weekend on “date nights”.

    Back and forth, forth and back we talked…we even set up “rules of engagement” should we ever decide to pull the trigger. We didn’t until last weekend.

    DH had gone to the car to get his cell phone and I stood watching the live band playing. A tall very attractive stranger sidled up to me and struck up a conversation. We talked for a while and DH stood a distance away watching. Then a moment later, I looked back in DH's direction and he had disappeared into the crowd. Stranger asked me to dance (we do country western), so I said yes. After the fact, he started talking again and asked the big one. “Are you here alone?”

    I had to be honest. “No. I’m here with my husband and he is floating around here somewhere.” The stranger visibly stiffened. “But, he’s not going to care that you and I are flirting and dancing. We have an open marriage.” To my surprise, Stranger started to relax.

    “So, like he won’t mind if I borrow you for the night?” Stranger finally said. “I don’t know. We’d have to ask him. Do you want me to go do that?” I said.

    Again, cutting to the chase, the three of us talked for a while: together and then separately giving each party a chance to have their say alone with Stranger and then Stranger left DH and I alone a bit to talk. Stranger was divorced about a year ago, has no desire to be in another long term emotional relationship, is seven years my junior, gainfully employed, intelligent, discrete and shared a lot of my interests (we can carry on a conversation) and he had never done anything like this before. He was willing to follow all of the rules DH and I had previously discussed; surprisingly, including that DH got to watch and participate with me if he so chose.

    DH booked a nearby hotel room and all went well though the only penetration happened between me and DH. Stranger invited DH to hold my hand while Stranger made me cum for the third time. DH even left us alone for a couple of hours and told me to meet him in the parking lot when we were done.

    Stranger, gave me his number and told me to call if that was what we wanted.

    Afterwards, DH and I went home with big smiles on our faces and had the best sex we had had in a while; he actually seemed like he wanted it rather than giving me what I wanted out of obligation.

    The next morning, we concluded that this just might work for us though, he admitted that watching didn’t do much for him.

    Three days passed and I did finally call Stranger. It was his first time doing anything like that and I figured, he might have some regrets and wanted to feel out his thoughts. Nope. Stranger is fine with it, though he also admitted that being watched was uncomfortable for him. We have met for coffee once since just to see where, if anywhere, this might go. Our little discussion only reinforced that I made a good choice with this man being our first. He is a good person and can, like me, separate sex from “having an emotional relationship”.

    It has now been almost a week hence and DH and I have done a lot of talking (and passionate lovemaking) since. He has changed his stance on several of the rules as he makes an emotional shift between talking about things and having actually experienced them.

    He no longer has any problem with me going it alone with Stranger as long as he knows where I am at all times (with Stranger) and how long I will be gone. He has given the go-ahead to have penetrative sex if it evolves that way.

    This whole experience, though more of a bar pick-up than “swinging” has sparked a passion for me, in him that I have not seen in a very long time. He is actually flirting with me throughout the day. I feel a sense of relief in so many ways it is hard to count. His ED is still a bit of an issue but, nothing like it was before. It matters more to me that he wants sex again than how long or how hard he gets. For the last week, he has been able to satisfy my desire and meet my own passion with some of his own. For the first time in years, he is the one initiating sex.

    My question for all of you is what is the best direction to take things from here? Me getting emotionally involved with Stranger beyond a respectful interaction for mutually satisfying sex is not going to become an issue for any of us. Stranger and I are using each other, we all know it and have discussed it in very honest terms. We aren’t hanging out with each other’s friends or discussing our extracurricular arrangement with others. It is really just a “fuck buddy” kind of thing and will remain so.

    The question we have is if we should expand our horizons a bit. DH is open to doing something similar on his side (thinks, but actually pulling the trigger on it might be a different thing) but, having never been with another woman is a bit daunting for him, especially with his ED. He is a good looking man, looks a bit like present day George Clooney. Women constantly make passes at him. He doesn’t even realize when a woman is flirting with him. Hell, when we were 16, I practically had to do a lap dance at a football game before he thought I was interested in going out with him. He doesn’t realize how attractive he is and is a bit shy, which makes him absolutely irresistible to a lot of females.

    We have thought about visiting a swinger’s club in a nearby town but, with all of the hacking that goes on in technology these days, having our names on a “list” somewhere as members makes us really nervous. Even posting here is bringing trepidation.

    Any suggestions would be appreciated.


  2. #2

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Fascinating story, well-told. Thanks for sharing.

    Many of the facts are similar for my lovely wife and for me, but with the help of testosterone therapy and the blue pill, I am doing well. I would welcome DW embracing the hotwife (or whatever you call it) lifestyle, but she is not interested at this time. We are older, she is 63, so that explains some of it.

    Just want to let you know that there are husbands like me and like your DH who, sincerely, want nothing more than to see you extract the greatest pleasures that life has to offer. You are definitely intelligent, articulate and from my standpoint, you have identified the critical stumbles. Please continue to report as things move along. Some of us are voyeurs, too!!
    I never run with scissors. The last two words are not necessary.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Thank-you so much for your kind words of understanding. I want HIM to be happy too and all of the issues he began experiencing was taking its toll on him. This isn’t about me being a hoochie and having an affair. It really is about us and making our remaining years together the best they can be for BOTH of us.

    I’m lucky, that at 49 I still get mistaken for an early 30’s gal but, at my age, who knows how long that will last. Your wife might feel a bit embarrassed at 63 embarking down this road, I know I was but, it has made a difference for us as a couple. There are plenty of men out there who will find her intriguing and attractive.

    Our culture tends to make more mature women de-sexualized. It is a crying shame really, because so many of us buy into it and it changes the way we feel about ourselves even though we know we are very loved by our spouses.

    We carry ourselves differently, change the way we dress (even if it is still flattering on us) and stop seeing ourselves as sexual beings. No matter how often our spouse tries to tell us otherwise, deep down we just can’t really believe it.

    Maybe it took another man, a younger man (who was subsequently shocked at my age), to give me the permission to let all of the societal BS go and just act how I feel on the inside; with all the passion, zest for life and sexual satisfaction I craved. It reminded me “I ain’t dead yet” (excuse the Monty Python reference). In turn, I brought that attitude home to my husband where he taking it in himself and living vicariously through it.

    Tell your wife about our story and let her think on it for a while.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We really enjoyed reading your story. You were very frank and open in explaining the circumstances that have led you meeting Stranger. Very well written.

    We've been open for a few years now. She gets more... "attention" than he does, but we're not keeping score. We've had a variety of experiences that have had him involved or not involved. It has been a wonderful ride except that it isn't easy to find her kind of guy who wants to stick around. It has happened though.

    From a couple who's "been there", you'll get nothing but encouragement from us. Life is short. Be picky and go have fun. Just be sure to always communicate and share feelings with each other often. Best luck!

  5. #5

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We agree, your story is very well written. Sometimes the best thing to spark some excitement back into a relationship is to know that others still think of your SO as hot and exciting. It's easy to loose some of that spark after as many years as the two of you have been together. Add to that the problem of getting older and ED (once it starts, it can quickly just become a vicious circle where it gets worse as a self fulfilling prophecy). Since you don't have a problem with where things are going, and apparently your husband doesn't either, then we see nothing wrong with what you are doing. On word of caution however: keep making sure that the lines of communication are completely open. Don't let him fall into thinking he isn't needed anymore now that someone else is 'taking care' of you. Just a word of caution, not a prediction. Good luck and keep us updated on how things are going.
    If you don’t have to lie about sex, you don’t have to lie about anything. - John Williamson

  6. #6

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We are finding that there is a delicate balance between having rules and a plan and then executing those plans in reality. It seems to me, that is where constant communication between DH and I is an absolute imperative.

    One of our rules is limitation on who we can approach for an encounter; no work/professional (doctors, dentists, veterinarians, etc) no one from a child’s sports team or school functions and, as we recently found ourselves discussing, anyone from one of our shared hobbies.

    There is a young man (in his early 30’s) that attends the same dance studio that DH and I take lessons at who has repeatedly shown interest in me. We have danced together a few times and conversed on several occasions during outings with the studio. The attraction is mutual and he would be a very good prospect if it were not for the fact that if I was to engage further with this man, DH has voiced that he would probably get less enjoyment out of our dance instruction together. We are often sharing a dance floor with this man during both party’s private instruction.

    As DH feels at this point, that it would interfere with our shared time doing something we both enjoy, I will honor his feelings and not pursue things further. In turn, even though one of the instructors has shown interest in him, he will not pursue that for the same reasons, even though, I would not experience a problem with it.

    I am very much finding that this lifestyle, once a decision is made to indulge, is a complex, fluid evolution of emotions and self-discovery, rather than a stagnant, hard and fast, logical process. Things quite often progress on a case by case, situational basis and must be discussed before pressing forward.

    And, at least in our situation, during this very beginning experience, he and I are not yet, and may never be, exactly on the same page on things from an emotional standpoint. We may be a couple but, we do not share a brain, nor are we empathic or psychic. We do share many thoughts, feelings and perspectives in common but, have very different perceptions (the way we take in and process information is different). We can only know where we part ways by honestly communicating with one another. When there is a hurtful or uncomfortable difference in the emotional impacts on one party, not shared by the other, then I think it behooves the partnership, for one to acquiesce to the wishes of the more sensitive partner. This must be done freely and without resentment.

    My educational background is in psychology. Before sincerely considering entering this lifestyle, we did a lot of research, not only into the benefits of it but, also into the failures. It seems to us, that where so many “open” marriages fail, is when one partner or the other begins to make assumptions about the feelings of the other based on their own personal perceptions of the situation or past experiences. Memories carry emotions; it is why hearing a song that played during a special time in your life can put you into a better mood.

    IMO the reason that "open" marriages fail is really not all that different than what is responsible for the failure of most monogamous relationships. The difference being, that in non-monogamous relationships, the emotional stakes are much bigger and one seemingly mundane wrong step (mundane, being something that you have done routinely before)based on assumption, can have huge lasting consequences because of the depth of emotions involved. This isn’t like the hurt one might feel when your spouse forgets to bring flowers on your anniversary!

    Emotions are neither singular (as in, only anger or betrayal as standalone), nor are they equal. Some are very primal, almost instinctual and some are those created by social norms. The primal emotions are those that can be the most powerful and difficult to deal with. Socially normalized emotions are those that cause superficial drama but, can be more easily soothed. Unresolved socially normalized emotions can and often do, eventually morph into primal feelings and that is when they become destructive.

    Going back to my example earlier: I would not feel the least bit uncomfortable if DH would be intimate with the dance instructor. I could be in the same dance studio, watch them dance together and take instruction from her without a second thought. DH on the other hand, at this point, cannot say the same. Because the root is not so much jealousy as it is his concern about becoming the topic of gossip, his feelings may change but, it will take time and if this foray into an alternative type marriage is to be a success, then I must validate his feelings by respecting his preferences.

    At all times, I must be willing to forgo my own physical/self-esteem enhancement for his emotional well being.

    We have always done things in our marriage this way, whether it was me quitting my career to stay at home and raise our children or him not pursuing that big promotion so that he could come home and have dinner with the family at a decent hour. The needs of all has always superseded the need of the individual in our relationship and as of now, there is no reason to believe this will not continue to be the case. Should at any point, it becomes untenable for any of us, this exploration will stop and the situation will be completely re-evaluated.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    So let me get this right - your husband has ED which you guys fix by have a younger man screw you, then try and talk yourself into it by giving half a page about how open marriage can fail?

    What i am so glad about is this line "At all times, I must be willing to forgo my own physical/self-esteem enhancement for his emotional well being." lucky man lol

    oh man,

  8. #8

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Well, so how's the sex with new men going for you ? -- Sandra

  9. #9

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Quote Originally Posted by luvin eye full View Post
    So let me get this right - your husband has ED which you guys fix by have a younger man screw you, then try and talk yourself into it by giving half a page about how open marriage can fail?

    What i am so glad about is this line "At all times, I must be willing to forgo my own physical/self-esteem enhancement for his emotional well being." lucky man lol

    oh man,

    I take it you don't approve of the choices we have made together. That is fine. I expected nothing less from most people. Of course you are free to make your own choices regarding what works for you and your significant other as we are.

    Open marriages can and do fail. So do monogamous ones. So do marriages that follow a more traditional "swingers" format. Relationships of all kinds fail.

    Knowing what part of a chosen lifestyle can contribute to that failure can help to recognize the potential pitfalls so that they can be addressed as a couple before they become a problem.


  10. #10

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Yes, how about an update?
    If you don’t have to lie about sex, you don’t have to lie about anything. - John Williamson

  11. #11

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    The sex is good but ancillary to the benefits to our marriage which we are already beginning to realize.

    Just to clarify. It isn't new men. It is a man. We are finding ourselves in our ongoing discussions, most comfortable with one guy, for a long term friends with benefits rather than a series of one time hook-ups. Someone who is comfortable with both DH and myself but, can keep any type of romantic "love" out of it.

    I found myself last weekend, fending off a very good looking and insistent 29 year old who said he didn't care how old I was, I was beautiful. Good for the ego but, he was a bit too hot to trot and not the type who would be respectful of our rules or existing relationship. Physically tempting but, he wasn't a good fit for us as a couple.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldCoCouple View Post
    Yes, how about an update?
    Stanger is no longer in the picture. He couldn't live within the rules we set out and asked me to sneak around behind my husband's back. He's history. So it goes.

    On the other hand, I think we have found someone who will and has so far worked in nicely with our comfort level. He is five years my senior, an attorney and mechanical engineer, intelligent, open minded and very comfortable in his own skin. A good communicator.

    I'll call him R. He and DH have really hit it off in the socialization category. There is just an ease between the three of us when we are in the same room together that wasn't there with Stranger.

    Last Friday, we went out on a second "Date". When I say "we", I mean all three of us. DH brought me to the deli where we met up. We ate together and R and DH had a nice conversation about the space-x program and then DH went to the dance hall and left R and I to ourselves. It was the opportunity for R to go over the rules that DH and I have, discuss them and make sure R thought he could live with them. We had a very nice conversation and as R said, I was doing a good job of managing expectations (which he did not take issue with), I believe we got our points across. R and I then proceeded to go dancing at the same place where DH was.

    DH was busy talking to his cute harem of women, which made me happy to see. There are about four regulars he hangs out with. Three of them are single and one is married but, is divorcing; I have met all of them and like them, though each and every one of them has something in their lives that makes DH hesitant to act beyond flirting. One is divorcing so he steers clear of doing anything that will make her life more difficult. Another is just a mixed up emotional mess. The third is personality wise very fun and outgoing (squeezed his butt two weeks ago) but, he just doesn't find her physically appealing at all. The fourth, is gay.

    He has selected a bunch of "safe" women to hang around with and have fun. Flirtatious fun, may be all he is ready to do. If and when he is ready to do more, that will be up to him to decide. Not me.

    We were talking about our experiences so far and he revealed to me that until we ventured into this, he hadn't realized how much of himself he had lost. He always felt guilty talking with other women even though I had reassured him, even encouraged him to do so.

    To see him openly flirting with a bunch of women, being a man, not just a husband and father but, acting like a man warmed my heart. It has put him back in touch with a part of him that exists separately from his role as responsible father and husband. I saw my high school sweetheart coming out again, this time he wasn't a shy boy but a confident man. SO SEXY! I knew it was in there but, couldn't figure out how to get him to give himself permission to show it. This seems to have done the trick.

    Anyway, R and I went and sat out on the patio and talked for a while about intellectual pursuits and DH came out to visit. The banter between the three of us was wonderful and comfortable. It was quite stimulating.

    A while later we let DH know that R and I were headed out. He handed me a hotel key and told me to text him when I was ready for him to join me, gave me a quick smooch and we left.

    I won't bore you all with the details but, there are some advantages to sex with older men who know the lay of the land so to speak...R needed to get home as his mid-teens daughter was alone at home. I called DH who came over and we made love without all of the toys, warm up and other rigmarole that we usually end up going through. The advantage to that was that I was ready to go and he didn't have to last all that long to get the job done. It was good. Timing was impeccable. We spent the rest of the night wrapped in each other's arms. Very satisfying for both of us.

    I have since spoken with R twice and we are meeting for coffee later this week to exchange manuscripts we have both written and are in need of a fresh eye for editing and, of course to make plans for another "date". DH is actually feeling really good about how all of this is forming, so that is the best thing of all.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasTwosome View Post
    I take it you don't approve of the choices we have made together. That is fine. I expected nothing less from most people. Of course you are free to make your own choices regarding what works for you and your significant other as we are.

    Open marriages can and do fail. So do monogamous ones. So do marriages that follow a more traditional "swingers" format. Relationships of all kinds fail.

    Knowing what part of a chosen lifestyle can contribute to that failure can help to recognize the potential pitfalls so that they can be addressed as a couple before they become a problem.

    My whole problem with this is not the sex - it's that you get self worth from others instead of your self and then when your SO of decades has ED problems you go and get some one else,

    So your SO has two choices even if he does not say it - put up with it and like it or - don't

    What if he siad no to it all what would you do?

    Once again i don't have a problem with the sex - it's your attitude to your husband ( from the posts ) that i have problem with because i do not believe he has a choice from what you have posted.

    Now if he really does and is fine then i have no problem.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    I can understand your critique and it is one of the pitfalls of written communications and not actually knowing the people in question, that often things go unsaid which probably should not.

    Both of us read your post. A short summary of the commentary from him: DH said to tell you that as far as the issue of him not having a choice here, don't worry about him. He said neither of us has a doubt that if either he or I wanted to call it quits, wanted to go back to a monogamous lifestyle, that either of us would do anything for the other. It sure would be a lot easier from a logistics standpoint. No questions asked.

    DH says he is not the free spirit that I am and knows that loosening up a bit would be good for him. He has actually always coveted the ability that I have to speak my mind and be myself without constantly worrying about being judged by others. It is part of why he loves me so much and without it, I wouldn't be me. That even though he is moving much more slowly than I, he is finding it to be a worthy pursuit. He says he will get there in in his own time or not---in which case we can always decide to make another change. We balance each other out in the best way possible.

    Whatever partners we encounter know that any one of us can put the brakes on this at any moment. It is part of the discussion we have with them.

    To clarify, this was something that both of us have brought up to one another during the last few years. Sometimes he was hesitant to take that step and sometimes I was. Eventually through discussions, we BOTH decided to give this a try and see how it works for us. Neither one is going to leave this marriage for any reason. Period.

    If you would like to get into some of the trials and tribulations of what we have been through in our lives that I did not detail here, start with $26,000 a year, 20 years old with a baby and no government assistance or parental charity taken. We dug ourselves out of that quagmire to make quite a nice life for our family and we did it as a team.

    If you don't think that was tough enough, try putting yourselves through college at the same time. You need not worry about my feelings of self worth or the adoration and admiration I feel for my husband. He is the most wonderful caring father and husband. I am quite proud of what we accomplished together.

    What were you doing in your relationships at age 20? I know what all of our friends were doing and it wasn't working full time, changing diapers, making meals and being so dog tired that you found yourself waking up the next morning with your face firmly planted on a text book, while trying to make a traditional marriage work long term as you both ran in different directions one off to your 7:30 am micro economics class and the other getting ready for work. Rinse. Repeat.

    Ask me to show you a person that has absolutely no self doubts, never evaluates what they could have done differently or thinks they could have done something in their lives better and I will show you either an arrogant ass or a psychopath. I am far from perfect and made my share of mistakes but, I love my husband and put his feelings before my own.

    I am not easily insulted but, in this case I am actually insulted that you would even entertain the idea that I would walk out on my husband because he has a little issue sometimes in the bedroom. Talk about blows to my self-worth? Thanks a lot.

    We will depart this earth married and very much in love with the other. If the last 30+ years working through issues of far greater importance to a marriage than sex haven't already evidenced that, I don't know what would.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    What a very interesting thread, I have been reading it since the beginning.

    I can only speak for myself, but I wouldn't be surprised if others feel the same. As you said, it is one of the problems with the written word, not everything can be communicated, but you have done an excellent job of eloquently sharing with us who you are and the relationship you have with your husband.

    After reading the OP I shared many of the same concerns as others who responded. Now unless you are a very good pathological liar, and I don't believe you are, I don't believe you have anything to worry about.

    The subject of your OP was "Where do we go from here?" I believe you already know where you want to go. Just enjoy the ride now.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    TexasTwosome

    I except that you had it hard - should i go on about a 10aud per hour job while looking after 4 kids ( 3 from my wife's 1st marriage and one of my own ) when i was 20 or......... i no what it's like to have nothing to eat for days as a kid watching your mother give the last bit of food to her kids bla bla. and i am not full of shit that's how it was.


    Now from your 1st post i actually thought it may of been a man writing a cuckold story - my apologizes - really,

    But from your last post i see that many things were left out - i am not against any one having fun if it all ok with all people involved, but your 1st post did not say that it was more " even though DH has ED problems I'll make it all about how i feel unwanted and go and screw some one else" that's how it came across.

    If that is not what your saying then ok and if every one is happy then great. Please don't think i have singled you out some how or anything.

    Had a man wrote that 1st post i would of said the same thing what bothers myself is when it comes across as one sided whether male or female because all i see is a marriage headed for undoing and with so many year together that would be a shame if i just sat here and did not say anything at all - even if you found it offensive - better you get pissed at me but think about what your doing then not.

    So form now on i will take any thing you say with the knowledge that it has already been agreed upon in stead of or when it sounds like your doing it and the old boy just has to tag along.

    What i would like to say is has your DH been tested for depression at all - why i ask is that many fellows don't know they are suffering and this will cause ED problem on and off some times for years then bang good for a while then no , no passion at all.

    Lastly "Where to go from here " keep looking for the ED problem - imagine if you guys got that "fixed" and still do what your doing there could only be more fun.

    regards
    and good luck

  17. #17

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Quote Originally Posted by luvin eye full View Post
    TexasTwosome

    I except that you had it hard - should i go on about a 10aud per hour job while looking after 4 kids ( 3 from my wife's 1st marriage and one of my own ) when i was 20 or......... i no what it's like to have nothing to eat for days as a kid watching your mother give the last bit of food to her kids bla bla. and i am not full of shit that's how it was.


    Now from your 1st post i actually thought it may of been a man writing a cuckold story - my apologizes - really,

    But from your last post i see that many things were left out - i am not against any one having fun if it all ok with all people involved, but your 1st post did not say that it was more " even though DH has ED problems I'll make it all about how i feel unwanted and go and screw some one else" that's how it came across.

    If that is not what your saying then ok and if every one is happy then great. Please don't think i have singled you out some how or anything.

    Had a man wrote that 1st post i would of said the same thing what bothers myself is when it comes across as one sided whether male or female because all i see is a marriage headed for undoing and with so many year together that would be a shame if i just sat here and did not say anything at all - even if you found it offensive - better you get pissed at me but think about what your doing then not.

    So form now on i will take any thing you say with the knowledge that it has already been agreed upon in stead of or when it sounds like your doing it and the old boy just has to tag along.

    What i would like to say is has your DH been tested for depression at all - why i ask is that many fellows don't know they are suffering and this will cause ED problem on and off some times for years then bang good for a while then no , no passion at all.

    Lastly "Where to go from here " keep looking for the ED problem - imagine if you guys got that "fixed" and still do what your doing there could only be more fun.

    regards
    and good luck
    Sorry for getting pissed, your post caught me at a bad time...dang dog peed on the pile of laundry I had waiting to wash. Anyway, you wouldn't be the first to think I was a male by my writing style, I get that a lot, so no offense there. Too many years reading and writing unemotional just the facts dossiers.

    My apologies also for not having added some of the details but, there are so many in a lifetime and unless you are writing a book, some stuff has to get left out.

    It doesn't help that we were both raised to believe that sex, intimacy, is something that stays in the bedroom and never in public so talking openly with strangers about this is a new experience for both of us. I'm much more willing to break with our upbringing than DH, so I am posting and he is not. I have never been one to speak for him, we share a lot of common thoughts in common but our perspective is different, so writing/speaking for both of us seems...presumptive?

    There are a lot of complex issues involved here including sexual repression brought on by a lifetime of a rather strict religious upbringing. Before anyone says I am bashing on him again, sex with him has always been the most loving experience of my life. He is a kind and gentle-man. Always thoughtful and respectful of me but, very vanilla to my cinnamon (he'll readily admit to that). I am the wild-child and he is the voice of temperance.

    This foray into open marriage, seems to be having some good effects for both of us. DH would tell you that he is and always has been a bit of a stick in the mud (he says he has a sick up his ass), a person who is risk adverse. It is how life turned out for us. I have always been the risk taker, the "I'll try anything once", adrenaline junkie type and tempered it out of necessity, for many years. We couldn't ever afford to take risks because always, always, the children's well being came first. It has been that way nearly our entire marriage; financially, vacation wise and right down to our sex life.

    Now we are at a point in our lives where risks are not as consequential as they once would have been and we can focus more on us, what makes us happy. For the first time in a long time, I can be me, all of the cinnamon me; less mother and more woman. DH says seeing that side again after all of these years is making him explore a side of himself that he never knew existed. He never allowed himself to go there. First, because he was taught that it was morally bad to even think these things (or feel lust at all) and then after, we were married because even entertaining such thoughts was irresponsible, disrespectful towards the woman and "cheating" if he so much as acknowledged that another woman was attractive in his own mind and would lead to nothing good. For the first time in his life he feels free to be both "bad" and at least mildly irresponsible. For him, it is a slow process and I am letting him have his space in reconciling the old way he believed he had to be, with the possibilities ahead. He is getting to explore his full sexuality for the first time. I hope I explained that well.

    This said, I don't think his ED is caused by depression. More likely, the ED caused some depression; the doctors thoroughly checked him out. He has a history of prostate cancer in his family, both his grandfather (died of it) and his father (caught it in time) had it. Doc thought DH's enlarged prostate might be part of the issue and so, is treating him for that (our insurance does not cover the little blue pill or any substitute for ED and at $80 a pop is out of our price range for the frequency we are used to).

    The meds are helping gradually and actually, since we started this venture, sex has been really good between us namely because it seems to give him a little extra oomph; Somehow, seeing me enjoying a non loving sexual relationship with someone else, is bringing home the idea that I wasn't just talking smack when I said that it is okay to treat me like a sex object at times. He is realizing that it is okay to act on his lust without reserve and fuck me like I am a woman, rather than just treating me like a fragile flower, a revered mother. Making love is good too but, as one woman he was talking to said, sometimes a woman just needs you to take her home throw her one the bed and fuck her.

    Last night was the first time ever that he actually talked dirty to me during sex and dang if it didn't just send me over the edge! He is seeing that acting on his desires and expressing his urges in bed doesn't mean he is disrespecting me or not loving me or any of those bad things he was told it was. Letting loose is both good and can be mind blowing.

    God I love him! This just keeps getting better and better.


  18. #18

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    TexasTwosome

    Oh good to hear - really - see that is a great story of how you guys got to where you are and i agree some times there's just to much to write as back ground to your question.
    I'm also glad to here your husband is still working on the ED ( doc's or pills or both ) Your life story is some what like mine and my wife's only i was the wild one - but all though the kids growing up and all the other stuff is nearly the same for us as well. ( 33 years married )

    I'm glad to hear you guys are finding ways to explore and that you are in-tune with the slowest partner as well - so many posts here are just dreadful with the way partners treat each other, thankfully most are not like that, ( so i get a bit pissed as well with them lol )

    One thing that is really great out of our or rather my misunderstanding is that now any one looking for help, may come across this thread and if they have the same thoughts - well it just may help.

    So good luck to you both in this new venture, I would advise that one must be careful of emotions when bringing in a new person - there are many post where a attachment formed to the 3rd, that said i think you guys are on top of that already.

    Regards

  19. #19

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Have enjoyed the revelation of your story from the beginning. Your writing style makes it so much more enjoyable, thanks.

    Your comment about the cost of the blue pill spurs me to tell you that I ordered and have been using a generic, non-prescription blue pill manufactured in India. My doc says it is probably 70% as effective as the branded version (I use the 50mg), but the cost was a bit over $100 for over 100 pills (there was a "bonus" pack).

    Whether a placebo or not, the effects have been tremendous.

    Know the contraindications, be safe.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasTwosome View Post

    God I love him! This just keeps getting better and better.
    I think it's great that things are right now working out for both of you.
    But I'm sure you know that as human beings keep on evolving and changing, so do relationships. They have a life of their own and what seems without risks today will change and maybe become very dangerous.
    You mentioned non-loving sex, but no one can predict what happens when 2 people get together repeatedly and how their feelings for each other will evolve, particularly if the sex becomes very intense and passionate. It can be intoxicating to the point that all the good intentions disappear.

    Also how your husband feels right now about you and more particularly how you feel about him letting you enjoy other men will undoubtedly change you and the way you perceive him, because nothing remains static, especially where sex is concerned because of the powerful emotions it can create. Thinking things will stay as they are would be naive.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    machiavel55

    Yes i agree 100% how many poly stories start out the same way - i think that it's best if the two of them can get there normal sex life up and going then explore but - at lest they are thinking and talking about it openly and lets hope for the best.

  22. #22

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We agree that things can get quickly out of hand.

    All three of us are aware of that pitfall and have openly discussed it with all parties present not once but on multiple occasions. Per our (the three of us) conversation last night: it is walking that razor's edge between a physical connection and an emotional one where the secondary relationship cannot interfere with the well-being of the primary one. We cannot predict the future. This whole thing might work on the long term. It could end tomorrow.

    Just so everyone knows, DH is very much included in the relationship between R and myself. Nothing is hidden between any of the parties involved. In addition to what I relay to him, DH gets an "eyes on" chance to see for himself what is going on between R and me each time we meet up. Often the three of us will eat together and conversations of all types are had with input from all. All three of us are surprised at the ease with which we can all talk to one another openly and honestly about anything in such a short time. For whatever reason, this has all seemed so natural, without awkwardness.

    I am not very good at hiding my thoughts, should never play poker and DH can read me like a book. He might not always know exactly what I am thinking but, he knows to ask. That is where communication, honesty (both with each other and with ourselves) comes in. If at any point DH sees anything that hints at inappropriate feelings developing, he will voice it without reserve and knows that I will not dismiss his observations. Sometimes he knows me better than I know myself.

    The following two paragraphs, may or may not be of relevance here but, probably should be mentioned. Throughout our lives together, most of my best friends have been male. Of the five people that I know would drop everything if we needed help, only one of them is female. None of those relationships have even semi-entered into a physical one even though we have known each other for decades. They are truly "just" friends. I simply find the emotional drama that most females tend to drag around with them, tiresome. I prefer the way a man's mind works; get pissed off, have your say and then move on. No back stabbing or gossiping, no dragging up unresolved issues. Speak your mind and be done.

    As I mentioned previously, there are several complex issues at hand. Both R and I are "sapiosexuals", meaning, we are very much attracted to and turned on by intellect, almost more than physical stimulation. Speaking for myself, a good intellectual conversation can often leave me as sexually satisfied as a decent roll in the hay. This aspect makes it so that both of us could, if it intellectually made sense, end the physical relationship and still find the other aspects of the relationship very satisfying for both of us. Mind sex. It is a curious dynamic and more often difficult compatibility-wise to find than a good physical one. As DH's married/divorcing friend from the bar noted in surprise upon meeting R, he's not as good looking as she expected (meaning DH is much better looking). To which DH relayed to her, yes, but R is very smart so my choice wasn't a surprise to him.

    I'm not naďve in this and neither is anyone else involved here (R is not some twenty year old and this isn't his first rodeo. It is part of the reason I turned down the 29 year old boy toy).

    If anything, because this is our first journey as a married couple into this genre, we are being hyper vigilant in that regard.

    Things will evolve and change...they already have and so far, so good. For now, we will take things day by day, watch for anything that even hints at a problem and discuss how best to move forward as a couple. There is always a choice to be had one of which is to call it quits cold-turkey if things are headed in a "too dangerous" direction.

    PS: DH would like all of you to know that he is no longer having issues with his ED and his sex drive is beyond normal (we are having hot sex daily) so if y'all can stop focusing on that please.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Hi TexasTwosome

    No doubt you have gone over every thing what your getting from some of us is concern for the both of you not a put down for sure, while we may of never meet you two most of us do try and watch out for you guys in a "we are in this together forum"

    So tell you DH that i was just concerned for his well beaning and that of your marriage nothing more, Many of us here have seen how ED leads to bringing in a 3rd which ( even thought they say it will never happen )
    leads to emotional feelings then ploy and while some say it's the best thing that ever happened i wonder given that now the husband is now sharing his wife - the time with her alone and all the other thing he now gets only half or less off,

    So while i hope the best for both of you and hope it works out the way you think it will - please be careful as you all ready do have a emotional attachment to Mr R - it started when you found in him the intellectual abilities that you like in people, can you see what your setting up here?

    It now is not just sex but a connection of the minds - is this what you saw in your husband ? is this why he for fills you? why do you look for that in a sex only 3rd.

    Because you do think about a lot and like to do that instead of finding sexual gratification in looks you find it in the mind ( and probably some looks ) so are you not doing what you say that your not doing ?

    I'm not having ago at you but more asking you to rethink what your looking for if it;s sex only then why not different guys that are acceptable to both of you? why is it important to only have one - we are all human and find comfort in things and or people we get on with - there is a connection.

    More over why does your husband like this guy as well? does he see in him something that he knows you like? when this all started from your post your husband did have ED problems and i can not shake the feeling he found some one he though could replace him for a while even if he does not realize it.

    This is why i keep talking back to you guys, i'm worried for you both. 28years is a long time and your heading into waters that go deep, i'm not saying not to have a swim just pick the waters that will not drown both of your marriage.

    So we always have different guys so that there is no attachment apart from the crazy sex for the reasons above, also while the girls get way more attention we do look for the same for myself just to make sure it's all for sex and nothing else,

    if my wife said lets stop today i could and would in a hart beat could you do the same?

    sorry for the long post - we really do hope the best for you both.

    Ps. i will not mention the ED any bro lol.

  24. #24

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    I think I have said several times that yes, if either of us said it needed to stop, we would. No questions asked. So, I won’t repeat myself again.

    I have an emotional attachment of some variety to everyone I consider friends. That is why we are friends and not just casual acquaintances. Some people are better at compartmentalizing feelings than others. If you have difficulty in that area then agreed, casual sex with many partners is the way to go.

    Your concern for us is admirable however, it is coming across on this end as judgmental; not at all unlike a Priest who has never been married, counseling a couple he has never met before, on how they should conduct their sex lives, based on what he has seen from the outside looking in. There are far too many missing pieces to make that leap.

    We were hesitant to even bring this to a website, any website but, sought an open minded discussion and sharing of experiences. We gave it a try. Now I believe that we should have followed our reservations and kept the details of this venture between DH and myself.

    TexasTwosome, over and out.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Lol really that's what you get out of it - ok then. So opened minded poeple can not say what they think ? and expect to have a opened mined response - who is the priest i wonder.
    best to you both.


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