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  1. #1

    Default Where to go from here?

    This is going to be a really long first time post because there is a lot of history going on so, please bear with me.

    First off, my husband and I have been married for going on thirty years. Before you begin to think that we must be ancient, we got married when we were 19. Before that, we had known each other since we were three. Not like next door neighbors or anything, we lived in a small town and our parents ran in the same social circles so we interacted together sporadically and started dating at age 16. He was my first serious boyfriend and I was his first girlfriend. We lost our virginities with each other.

    Long story short, even back then, we knew we were going to get married but, parents being what they are had a panic attack that we were so serious at such an early age and colluded to make sure we went not only to different colleges but, to colleges in different States. My father died suddenly at the end of my Senior year in High School and a couple of months later I found myself alone, surrounded by strangers with a mother who had become distant dealing with her own unresolved emotional issues regarding my father’s death.

    My “best friend”, the person who had been my rock for so many years, was now hundreds of miles away and phone calls just didn’t cut it when I needed some hugs, which was daily.

    We had agreed, per our parents request to “see other people” and I slid into the party girl lifestyle (and how) while he did not. He tried dating one other girl but, ended up talking to her about me and his concerns for where I was headed and that pretty much put the freeze on that as it was obvious he was still in love with me.

    Me? I was able to easily separate the feelings of love I still had for him from “just sex”, pleasure and feeling a physical intimacy with another person.

    Fast forward three decades, raising five children (two are still teens) and a myriad of roadblocks that life throws at you from moving to job losses and I am happy to say, our marriage is still solid, maybe even more solid than it ever has been. We are still very much in love with one another, enough so, that perfect strangers feel the need to approach and comment on it.

    About two years ago, DH started having problems with ED and libido. He went for a more indepth physical to rule out heart disease, low testosterone etc. and was proclaimed healthy as a horse…except for a slightly enlarged prostate for which he takes a small daily dose of a well-known ED medication and while it has helped a bit, not enough.

    At first, we went through the idea that maybe it was just stress at work and I made sure to take steps to ensure that he was getting a good diet, regular exercise, getting enough sleep and of course, plenty of opportunities for stress release.

    When that all met without success, the ugly monster of self-doubt started to creep in. Maybe I just didn’t physically turn him on anymore. I took a good look at myself, lost five pounds (I was a loose size 6 to begin with), contemplated breast enhancement surgery, threw out my old flannel night gowns in lieu of some silky jammies and did my best to make sure that at all times I remained pleasing to the eye. We did a lot of talking and made some changes to our sex lives including getting out of the vanilla rut we had fallen into over the years.

    Weekends away from the kids, toys, shared porn watching, even a bit of mild S&M and learning Tantric sex. All of it has helped to a miniscule degree but, again, not to the point where our sex drives are anywhere near matched like it used to be. Fact is, he just doesn’t want it as much as I do and it isn't something you can fake with someone who knows you inside and out. The lack of passion, more than the ED, was starting to make me depressed and unhappy with other aspects of our lives.

    About six months ago, we discussed many possibilities; everything from hotwifing, to traditional swinging, to cuckhold, to opening our marriage and seeing how that went. He wants me above all else to be happy, he was starting to miss my usual happy do-lucky free spirited self. For six months, it has been a topic of discussion every weekend on “date nights”.

    Back and forth, forth and back we talked…we even set up “rules of engagement” should we ever decide to pull the trigger. We didn’t until last weekend.

    DH had gone to the car to get his cell phone and I stood watching the live band playing. A tall very attractive stranger sidled up to me and struck up a conversation. We talked for a while and DH stood a distance away watching. Then a moment later, I looked back in DH's direction and he had disappeared into the crowd. Stranger asked me to dance (we do country western), so I said yes. After the fact, he started talking again and asked the big one. “Are you here alone?”

    I had to be honest. “No. I’m here with my husband and he is floating around here somewhere.” The stranger visibly stiffened. “But, he’s not going to care that you and I are flirting and dancing. We have an open marriage.” To my surprise, Stranger started to relax.

    “So, like he won’t mind if I borrow you for the night?” Stranger finally said. “I don’t know. We’d have to ask him. Do you want me to go do that?” I said.

    Again, cutting to the chase, the three of us talked for a while: together and then separately giving each party a chance to have their say alone with Stranger and then Stranger left DH and I alone a bit to talk. Stranger was divorced about a year ago, has no desire to be in another long term emotional relationship, is seven years my junior, gainfully employed, intelligent, discrete and shared a lot of my interests (we can carry on a conversation) and he had never done anything like this before. He was willing to follow all of the rules DH and I had previously discussed; surprisingly, including that DH got to watch and participate with me if he so chose.

    DH booked a nearby hotel room and all went well though the only penetration happened between me and DH. Stranger invited DH to hold my hand while Stranger made me cum for the third time. DH even left us alone for a couple of hours and told me to meet him in the parking lot when we were done.

    Stranger, gave me his number and told me to call if that was what we wanted.

    Afterwards, DH and I went home with big smiles on our faces and had the best sex we had had in a while; he actually seemed like he wanted it rather than giving me what I wanted out of obligation.

    The next morning, we concluded that this just might work for us though, he admitted that watching didn’t do much for him.

    Three days passed and I did finally call Stranger. It was his first time doing anything like that and I figured, he might have some regrets and wanted to feel out his thoughts. Nope. Stranger is fine with it, though he also admitted that being watched was uncomfortable for him. We have met for coffee once since just to see where, if anywhere, this might go. Our little discussion only reinforced that I made a good choice with this man being our first. He is a good person and can, like me, separate sex from “having an emotional relationship”.

    It has now been almost a week hence and DH and I have done a lot of talking (and passionate lovemaking) since. He has changed his stance on several of the rules as he makes an emotional shift between talking about things and having actually experienced them.

    He no longer has any problem with me going it alone with Stranger as long as he knows where I am at all times (with Stranger) and how long I will be gone. He has given the go-ahead to have penetrative sex if it evolves that way.

    This whole experience, though more of a bar pick-up than “swinging” has sparked a passion for me, in him that I have not seen in a very long time. He is actually flirting with me throughout the day. I feel a sense of relief in so many ways it is hard to count. His ED is still a bit of an issue but, nothing like it was before. It matters more to me that he wants sex again than how long or how hard he gets. For the last week, he has been able to satisfy my desire and meet my own passion with some of his own. For the first time in years, he is the one initiating sex.

    My question for all of you is what is the best direction to take things from here? Me getting emotionally involved with Stranger beyond a respectful interaction for mutually satisfying sex is not going to become an issue for any of us. Stranger and I are using each other, we all know it and have discussed it in very honest terms. We aren’t hanging out with each other’s friends or discussing our extracurricular arrangement with others. It is really just a “fuck buddy” kind of thing and will remain so.

    The question we have is if we should expand our horizons a bit. DH is open to doing something similar on his side (thinks, but actually pulling the trigger on it might be a different thing) but, having never been with another woman is a bit daunting for him, especially with his ED. He is a good looking man, looks a bit like present day George Clooney. Women constantly make passes at him. He doesn’t even realize when a woman is flirting with him. Hell, when we were 16, I practically had to do a lap dance at a football game before he thought I was interested in going out with him. He doesn’t realize how attractive he is and is a bit shy, which makes him absolutely irresistible to a lot of females.

    We have thought about visiting a swinger’s club in a nearby town but, with all of the hacking that goes on in technology these days, having our names on a “list” somewhere as members makes us really nervous. Even posting here is bringing trepidation.

    Any suggestions would be appreciated.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Fascinating story, well-told. Thanks for sharing.

    Many of the facts are similar for my lovely wife and for me, but with the help of testosterone therapy and the blue pill, I am doing well. I would welcome DW embracing the hotwife (or whatever you call it) lifestyle, but she is not interested at this time. We are older, she is 63, so that explains some of it.

    Just want to let you know that there are husbands like me and like your DH who, sincerely, want nothing more than to see you extract the greatest pleasures that life has to offer. You are definitely intelligent, articulate and from my standpoint, you have identified the critical stumbles. Please continue to report as things move along. Some of us are voyeurs, too!!
    This ain't no dress rehearsal.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    Thank-you so much for your kind words of understanding. I want HIM to be happy too and all of the issues he began experiencing was taking its toll on him. This isn’t about me being a hoochie and having an affair. It really is about us and making our remaining years together the best they can be for BOTH of us.

    I’m lucky, that at 49 I still get mistaken for an early 30’s gal but, at my age, who knows how long that will last. Your wife might feel a bit embarrassed at 63 embarking down this road, I know I was but, it has made a difference for us as a couple. There are plenty of men out there who will find her intriguing and attractive.

    Our culture tends to make more mature women de-sexualized. It is a crying shame really, because so many of us buy into it and it changes the way we feel about ourselves even though we know we are very loved by our spouses.

    We carry ourselves differently, change the way we dress (even if it is still flattering on us) and stop seeing ourselves as sexual beings. No matter how often our spouse tries to tell us otherwise, deep down we just can’t really believe it.

    Maybe it took another man, a younger man (who was subsequently shocked at my age), to give me the permission to let all of the societal BS go and just act how I feel on the inside; with all the passion, zest for life and sexual satisfaction I craved. It reminded me “I ain’t dead yet” (excuse the Monty Python reference). In turn, I brought that attitude home to my husband where he taking it in himself and living vicariously through it.

    Tell your wife about our story and let her think on it for a while.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We really enjoyed reading your story. You were very frank and open in explaining the circumstances that have led you meeting Stranger. Very well written.

    We've been open for a few years now. She gets more... "attention" than he does, but we're not keeping score. We've had a variety of experiences that have had him involved or not involved. It has been a wonderful ride except that it isn't easy to find her kind of guy who wants to stick around. It has happened though.

    From a couple who's "been there", you'll get nothing but encouragement from us. Life is short. Be picky and go have fun. Just be sure to always communicate and share feelings with each other often. Best luck!

  5. #5

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We agree, your story is very well written. Sometimes the best thing to spark some excitement back into a relationship is to know that others still think of your SO as hot and exciting. It's easy to loose some of that spark after as many years as the two of you have been together. Add to that the problem of getting older and ED (once it starts, it can quickly just become a vicious circle where it gets worse as a self fulfilling prophecy). Since you don't have a problem with where things are going, and apparently your husband doesn't either, then we see nothing wrong with what you are doing. On word of caution however: keep making sure that the lines of communication are completely open. Don't let him fall into thinking he isn't needed anymore now that someone else is 'taking care' of you. Just a word of caution, not a prediction. Good luck and keep us updated on how things are going.
    If you don’t have to lie about sex, you don’t have to lie about anything. - John Williamson

  6. #6

    Default Re: Where to go from here?

    We are finding that there is a delicate balance between having rules and a plan and then executing those plans in reality. It seems to me, that is where constant communication between DH and I is an absolute imperative.

    One of our rules is limitation on who we can approach for an encounter; no work/professional (doctors, dentists, veterinarians, etc) no one from a child’s sports team or school functions and, as we recently found ourselves discussing, anyone from one of our shared hobbies.

    There is a young man (in his early 30’s) that attends the same dance studio that DH and I take lessons at who has repeatedly shown interest in me. We have danced together a few times and conversed on several occasions during outings with the studio. The attraction is mutual and he would be a very good prospect if it were not for the fact that if I was to engage further with this man, DH has voiced that he would probably get less enjoyment out of our dance instruction together. We are often sharing a dance floor with this man during both party’s private instruction.

    As DH feels at this point, that it would interfere with our shared time doing something we both enjoy, I will honor his feelings and not pursue things further. In turn, even though one of the instructors has shown interest in him, he will not pursue that for the same reasons, even though, I would not experience a problem with it.

    I am very much finding that this lifestyle, once a decision is made to indulge, is a complex, fluid evolution of emotions and self-discovery, rather than a stagnant, hard and fast, logical process. Things quite often progress on a case by case, situational basis and must be discussed before pressing forward.

    And, at least in our situation, during this very beginning experience, he and I are not yet, and may never be, exactly on the same page on things from an emotional standpoint. We may be a couple but, we do not share a brain, nor are we empathic or psychic. We do share many thoughts, feelings and perspectives in common but, have very different perceptions (the way we take in and process information is different). We can only know where we part ways by honestly communicating with one another. When there is a hurtful or uncomfortable difference in the emotional impacts on one party, not shared by the other, then I think it behooves the partnership, for one to acquiesce to the wishes of the more sensitive partner. This must be done freely and without resentment.

    My educational background is in psychology. Before sincerely considering entering this lifestyle, we did a lot of research, not only into the benefits of it but, also into the failures. It seems to us, that where so many “open” marriages fail, is when one partner or the other begins to make assumptions about the feelings of the other based on their own personal perceptions of the situation or past experiences. Memories carry emotions; it is why hearing a song that played during a special time in your life can put you into a better mood.

    IMO the reason that "open" marriages fail is really not all that different than what is responsible for the failure of most monogamous relationships. The difference being, that in non-monogamous relationships, the emotional stakes are much bigger and one seemingly mundane wrong step (mundane, being something that you have done routinely before)based on assumption, can have huge lasting consequences because of the depth of emotions involved. This isn’t like the hurt one might feel when your spouse forgets to bring flowers on your anniversary!

    Emotions are neither singular (as in, only anger or betrayal as standalone), nor are they equal. Some are very primal, almost instinctual and some are those created by social norms. The primal emotions are those that can be the most powerful and difficult to deal with. Socially normalized emotions are those that cause superficial drama but, can be more easily soothed. Unresolved socially normalized emotions can and often do, eventually morph into primal feelings and that is when they become destructive.

    Going back to my example earlier: I would not feel the least bit uncomfortable if DH would be intimate with the dance instructor. I could be in the same dance studio, watch them dance together and take instruction from her without a second thought. DH on the other hand, at this point, cannot say the same. Because the root is not so much jealousy as it is his concern about becoming the topic of gossip, his feelings may change but, it will take time and if this foray into an alternative type marriage is to be a success, then I must validate his feelings by respecting his preferences.

    At all times, I must be willing to forgo my own physical/self-esteem enhancement for his emotional well being.

    We have always done things in our marriage this way, whether it was me quitting my career to stay at home and raise our children or him not pursuing that big promotion so that he could come home and have dinner with the family at a decent hour. The needs of all has always superseded the need of the individual in our relationship and as of now, there is no reason to believe this will not continue to be the case. Should at any point, it becomes untenable for any of us, this exploration will stop and the situation will be completely re-evaluated.

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