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Fire_and_Air

Broken Rules and Bad Feelings

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Hi everyone, my fiance and I entered the swinging lifestyle about a year ago, out of the curiosity and desire to explore what playing with other couples and women would be like (I was bi-curious at that time). We had been together for many years, since high school, and therefore had VERY limited experience with other partners. So, we thought it would be fun and sexy to explore this option together.

 

Last spring we met a nice couple at a party, who was also new to swinging, and as there was definitely a mutual attraction between the female half of the couple and myself - she and I played a little at the party - and we all seemed to hit it off pretty well, we decided to get together and play after meeting for dinner one night.

 

We began by switching partners (in the same room), and lo and behold, as my bf and the other girl began kissing, and I did the same with the other man, I discovered that I was not enjoying the kiss, and there didn't seem to be any chemistry between myself and the man; at least on my end. I thought it was a case of nerves and the newness of it all, so I just threw myself into it and tried to make the best that I could out of it, because when I looked over to our partners, I saw that they were really into each other and enjoying their own session. Well, to make a long story short, the night ended without any satisfaction on my part or the other man.

 

However, despite the "bad" night, the couple got in touch with us again, and we ended up developing a very close (non sexual) friendship over the next few months. And as the friendship grew, I wanted to give swinging with them another try.

 

The problems began when I left town for a weekend. The weekend I was away, a good friend of my bf's invited him along with other friends to go to Vegas. I encouraged him to go and have a good time. Around that time, the other couple had been fighting, and the other girl seemed depressed and lonely because her bf had been extremely busy with work and couldn't spend much time with her. I thought she might enjoy joining this group on their trip to Vegas, as she was acquainted with some of the others in that group, and her bf agreed that she should go, since it would make her feel better (and also provide some friendly companionship for my bf.) I wasn't bothered by the idea of the two of them going together, as I was more and more certain that we would probably all swing again soon. In fact, I even told my bf that if he wanted to play a little with her, they could get a head start before us...

 

When I returned from my trip, I asked my bf to tell me what they did, did they have fun, etc... I wasn't surprised when he said that they did have some intimate fun, but when he admitted that they went all the way and had sex.... without a condom, I felt like I was crushed.

 

We talked about it at lenghth and I told him how betrayed I felt because they broke two of our most important rules... 1) no full swapping without all partners in the same room and 2) no sex without condoms. He apologized for what he called an honest mistake because he'd thought I had given him the ok to have fun with her, and said I was partly at fault for not specifying that that didn't include having sex.

 

The four of us tried to talk things out and resume our friendship to the level it had been before that weekend, but emotionally, I felt like I was on a rollercoaster... one moment I felt that what happened wasn't that big of a deal because it was a true miscommunication mistake.... but the next moment I felt hurt, very angry, jealous and distrustful.... because I also learned that the other girl had wanted my bf to keep it a secret, for the reason that "I would be upset if I found out" and it would be kinder not telling me (or her bf) what happened.

 

Since we had been so close and such good friends before that point, I really wanted to make this work and move forward and just chalk it up to human mistake made from inexperience and not communicating right. We actually even tried having a shared swinging experience one more time, to try to create a new experience that would sort of "wipe out" the bad memory, but unfortunately, again I found that in the middle of the session with the other man, I couldn't really click with him sexually, whereas my bf and the other girl were having a great time. So after that, I was feeling even worse.... for trying to fool myself, and because on top of that I now also felt jealous of the great chemistry that my bf obviously shared with the other girl, and worse, that they had enjoyed each other in private before that.

 

Now it has been six months since our last swinging encounter with that couple. We have an understanding now that we're just better off as friends, but there are moments when I still feel very upset over how things turned out. The worst is the feeling that if I had gone with my instincts, or just had the foresight or experience, I should've realized that I was a big cause of my own problems by miscommunicating from the beginning. Yet part of me also believes that it should be common sense, or understood, that there are some things you just don't do (such as sex w/o condom), but I guess they got lost in the heat of the moment.

 

We have not seen this couple much recently, but occasionally they will contact us, and if we do spend time with them, it's a hit or miss on how I will feel emotionally afterward, even though we are no longer doing anything sexually.

 

I wish I could really put the negative thoughts to rest, and would like for us to move on and meet new couples where there would be equal compatiblity and attraction between all parties. But now I worry about whether I would have old feelings of jealousy coming up at inappropriate times, and am afraid that I would have another bad encounter which would sour another swinging experience.

 

Sorry for such a long post... :-( but am I making too much of this? Has anyone else been through something like this before, and how do you handle it? Am I making too big a deal of a simple mistake... Please help with any advice or thoughts...

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Fire_and_Air, I can tell that you're feeling a lot of conflict. Your feelings of betrayal, anger and jealousy are understandable and entirely appropriate. As gently as I can, I'll say, "He cheated on you." You've stayed with him, and I hope that you have worked it out between the two of you.

 

I think you need to find a way to break it off with this couple. It doesn't sound as if you are having much fun with them. I question your boyfriend's motivation somewhat, but that is something you will have to determine yourself.

 

If you do swing again, avoiding a bad encounter like this one will be helped by one thing: don't, if the sexual attraction isn't there for you. If I were in your shoes, I'm not sure if I would trust my partner not to break the rules again. Before the next time, I would suggest an honest, heart-to-heart with him. Spell out what your boundaries and expectations are and tell him that you expect him to honor them.

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Guest xerogirl

I think some lines WERE crossed.. In a way I can understand your husband thinking he had the okay to have sex but, THERE IS NO EXCUSE AT ALL FOR THE NO CONDOM!!What was his reason in that? I'm sorry your swinging experience went so badly. I do think it would be best for you to CLEARLY tell your hubby/b/f exactly how you feel. Swinging is not for everyone and personally I would NEVER trust him to swing with again. He showed a disregard for you and your health and he cheated. If you don't have a rock solid relationship swinging will hurt the both of you and the couples you play with. The other women cheated also how horrible of her to ask him not to tell you:mad: I'm glad he did tell you.... maybe you will be able to work thru this and learn from it. I would say to CUT ALL ties with them before anything else could happen. "Best of luck."

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whoa.......he broke the rules. I think saying he cheated may be a tad too strong. There was an understanding that some sort of play was going to happen....the play just went further than it should have. This was a situation that probably should have just been avoided. 90% of avoiding sin is avoiding temptation :)

 

Rules take a little getting used to. My wife "broke" our rules a couple of times before we got it all ironed out. Part of my wife's problem was that she very seriously got caught up in the moment, and let libido override judgment. She wasn't trying to hurt me, or avoid the rules- she just allowed her id to take over. She's in better control now :D

 

I don't see this as case closed "cheating”. I see it as poor judgment and rule breaking. He did tell you about it after all.

 

Unprotected sex is just stupid. Guess what- people have a remarkable capacity for stupidity, especially in the heat of the moment. Smack him around (not literally) and tell him not to do that again- ever.

 

I think that you need to reaffirm your rules, and continue talking about what they mean.

 

Someone on this board said that swinging was an "art form that takes practice." I'm finding this to be true. Our first experiences were not so good. But as we have worked out our emotions, and our rules, it has gotten progressively better. You may want to take a break from this whole thing till you feel secure, and perhaps less betrayed.

 

How does your BF feel about this? Is he sorry? Contrition has to have some value.

 

As far as the other couple goes....well are they causing you more pleasure or more pain? Figure it out and make your decision.

 

Good luck, hang in there, and talk it through. Don't throw your BF away because of a moment of poor judgment.

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I have to agree that saying he cheated is a bit too much. From reading your recounting of what happened, I got the idea initially that you had given him permission to have sex with her. First, by sending her on a trip with him when you weren't there, and second by saying that he could play with her, and not providing specific limits on what that meant.

 

Granted, I assume your rules had been discussed previously, but I think it is understandable that he might have taken the permission you gave him to be more than what you intended. That said, the one area he was totally wrong on was the no condom issue. Although, we all know how easy it can be to get caught up in a moment and lose track of things.

 

At this point, if you want to continue with him, you need to forgive him and move on. It might be best to completely seperate yourself from these friends simply because of what happened and because as long as they are around you, you will be reminded of what happened and those jealous feelings will crop up again.

 

While we can't undue the past, I can see several red flags in what happened to you that I hope you have noticed as well and learned from.

 

1. When you found yourself in an uncomfortable position, you allowed it to continue rather than stopping things.

We began by switching partners (in the same room), and lo and behold, as my bf and the other girl began kissing, and I did the same with the other man, I discovered that I was not enjoying the kiss, and there didn't seem to be any chemistry between myself and the man; at least on my end. I thought it was a case of nerves and the newness of it all, so I just threw myself into it and tried to make the best that I could out of it,

 

2. Despite knowing that there was no sexual chemistry you decided to attempt swinging with this couple again. Chemistry can't be created or changed. It wasn't there to begin with, it wasn't going to show up later.

 

3. Swinging or even thinking about swinging while you are having problems with your current partner is not a good idea.

The weekend I was away, a good friend of my bf's invited him along with other friends to go to Vegas. I encouraged him to go and have a good time. Around that time, the other couple had been fighting, and the other girl seemed depressed and lonely because her bf had been extremely busy with work and couldn't spend much time with her.

She was upset at her bf, and you sent her off with yours. It's entirely likely that the fact that she was upset with him was part of what led to the encounter with your boyfriend (along with him thinking he had the ok anyway). Not to mention that I can't see that the idea of sending them off together without you or her bf was a good idea to begin with.

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This is an interesting situation. I know that your husband took your comments as a green flag to play. I'm sure I would have too in that situation if it's not spelled out before hand. (There is a reason why I dont have nor want female friends respectivley)

 

This does not mean to point the finger at you in any way as this being your fault. Just a situation gone bad and ill communication. (imo) Do you see the animosity between the other couple's relationship as beieg a potential problem?

 

Bottom line is rules are rules. I trust that your relationship with your boyfriend is important to you both. He was truthful as far as you know which should be commended to some degree. Like Julie, I also say forgive and forget. Move on to a couple that you both are attracted to. One that shares and respects your rules.

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I have to agree with both Julie and Ciscosv.

 

In my opinion, you both made some mistakes and rules were broken. It does seem as though you gave him the go ahead to have a little fun if he wanted to. The fact that your boyfriend told you about it is commendable, that fact that he didn't use a condom is not. But it is done, it is over, you can't change it and you need to forgive and forget.

 

I don't like the fact that the woman of the other couple was encouraging your boyfriend to keep it a secret. That is most definitely a bigger issue in my eyes and not someone that I would want to be associated with. It sounds as though they have enough problems of their own, without drawing you into it. Major red flag couple.

 

Dump the couple, keep the boyfriend and move forward with your lives whether or not you decide to continue to swing. It sounds as if the two of you have been able to communicate well enough without pointing fingers.... a key to a good relationship.

 

Best of luck to you both. Oh yeah, if you do decide to continue to swing, if "you" aren't having fun, then it probably isn't fun for your boyfriend either. If you don't have an attraction to someone for whatever reason, don't do it for the sake of going with the flow.

 

Lori

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Originally posted by OhioCouple

. . . Oh yeah, if you do decide to continue to swing, if "you" aren't having fun, then it probably isn't fun for your boyfriend either. If you don't have an attraction to someone for whatever reason, don't do it for the sake of going with the flow.

 

Lori

101% correct. If he's like most of the men with partners here (well, this one at least), a great deal - maybe the majority - of his pleasure will come from seeing your pleasure. If it's genuinely not pleasing you, then you're doing both of you a disservice.

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Hi everyone,

 

Thank you so much for helping me put this into better perspective. We do realize that we have made many poor judgements and bad decisions, and now will be the wiser for it. I guess this experience has been part of our growing pains for being new swingers.

 

I also realize that part of our problem from the beginning was that I was very attracted to the other girl (the attraction was not only between my bf and her), and so I had ignored the initial red flags regarding the couple's fighting. Now we know better than to be blinded by partial lust, and to only play if all 4 are equally into each other.

 

And regarding how I felt with the other male, I had had such a great friendship with him that I had really hoped the attraction and sexual chemistry would develop over time. I learned the hard way that Julie is correct - you can't create sexual chemistry where there was none to begin with, no matter how strong your (platonic) relationship is.

 

My bf and I did have many, many discussions about everything that happened - sometimes resulting in nights of lost sleep - and I do feel reassured now that what happened regarding the no-condom use was really just a heat-of-the-moment stupidity, and nothing more, nothing deeper... he had also been drunk at the time. Thank you, Nymph & Satyr, for sharing your personal experiences on similar "heat of the moment" mistakes in your own swinging past.... I feel better knowing that it does happen to other couples, and that you've had better swinging experiences since.

 

I am glad that my bf has been honest with me throughout, though, and he has shown a lot of regret over what happened, so we are ready to move on to better times. We've also decided to end our friendhip with the other couple for now... I realize that it is the only way for me to get over the hurt feelings that pop up every now and then. Also, like Lori, I don't think I could ever be that comfortable being friends with someone who can be dishonest in such a sensitive situation, no matter how attracted I am to the person.

 

Thanks again for such great advice and for listening.... these great forums have helped me through some very tricky moments, and I hope our learning experiences can help others too.

 

- Fire_and_Air, the female half

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Fire_and_Air, I'm so glad that things are working out for you two. It sounds like you and your boyfriend have some good communication going.

 

And, I have to apologize. :o I read too quickly and missed the line:

 

In fact, I even told my bf that if he wanted to play a little with her, they could get a head start before us...

That makes a world of difference, and I take back what I said about him cheating. I myself would have taken that as a go-ahead to play. Thanks to everyone for pointing that out :eek:

 

We hope you'll stick around and contribute more. I think the story of your experience will help others in similar situations. Thanks!

 

-B

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Sounds like you are on the right track :).

 

We have a lot of grey hair, and some wisdom- both come from making mistakes. You mades some mistakes, learned from them, and received some wisdom, and no doubt a grey hair or two :) Best of luck!! N&S

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I think that your going to have to back up and accept some of the responsibility here. Agreed your bf should not have broken the rules, especially the "condom" rule, but you sent him on a fantasy adventure with a lady that he had sex with before, and obviously enjoyed it then.

 

If you don't want things like that to happen, don't set them up to happen. At least if you suspect it might happen, re-visit the rules with your bf before he goes. Explain your expectations.

 

In my mind your bf did not cheat on you. I'm sure you were aware of what would happen. These two people have had sex before, and they are now in Las Vegas. They are going to have sex again.

 

Now you have a few choices to make. One you definately need to make is to make sure your bf knows the rules, the rule he broke about condoms and that knows this is his last chance. You need to make a statement.

 

We have a couple of friends that I do not have much chemistry with the woman. My wife enjoys the man. I go with the flow because my wife is having a good time. You don't have to have chemistry with someone to have sex with them.

 

But I really think that your main focus should be on your jealousy. In all honesty I think this is the underlying issue in this whole situation, and situations to come. But it's OK to be jealous. It really is, but you need to understand what the emotion is and how to control or redirect it for yourself. Otherwise you may never have "chemistry" with another male when swinging.

 

I'm not saying this is your problem alone, there are many factors and variables involved, but only you can deal with it for you. Power comes in understanding yourself and taking control.

 

I think once you do this, that you'll probably decide later the "Condom" isn't as big an issue as you might think it is right now.

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