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ownerspet

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ownerspet last won the day on April 28 2013

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About ownerspet

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  • Birthday 09/19/1973

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  1. I totally agree that kissing is necessary for me at least for a barometer to determine interest prior to inquiring about more involved sexual activity. I too like some of the responders thus far, was hoping for clarification from those with the "no kissing" restriction.
  2. Ok seeing as some are ok with having sex with playmates outside their marriage partner, but somehow kissing is more intimate. I struggle to grasp the logic of this perspective. So I wanted to put 2 situations out there that some (including me because I don't understand the perspective of "I will have sex but don't kiss because kissing is more intimate) will consider ridiculous. Situation 1# If kissing is more intimate: In conversations about dating, my parents should have said to me as a teenager," I prefer you not kiss, make out, have intercourse, or engage in oral sex, but son it is most important to save kissing for someone you want intimacy with. If put in a situation son, where you have to do one or the other, just have sex and whatever you do don't kiss the girl." Son says, "But dad!" Dad says, "No buts just stick to intercourse and oral sex, but no kissing! And that's final" Situation 2# When dating, most people work up to kissing and then work up to sex, with kissing coming before sex (because I think most people view sex as more involved or intimate part of the self than kissing). If kissing is more intimate with someone, do they hang out until sex is comfortable between he or she and the other, while sustaining from kissing? Then after they know that they are sexually compatible, and only then do they share the perceived higher level intimacy of kissing? My question is ridiculous, but would these two situations be realistic in the lives of those that have sex with playmates but kissing is not allowed? I just never have understood this perspective?
  3. Ok, as for confidence, I think everyone else has covered that topic, and so you already know both of you have to work on his confidence. And I know that will take time. One thing I have seen in a few different places, is the acceptable dress, and you keep saying jeans are just what people wear in your area. There's nothing wrong with blending, if it's working for you. Dressing to gain interest is not always dressing like everyone else. It's about standing out from the rest to enhance the projection of yourself image so that others are more interested. Sometimes when people dress like everyone else, they don't get noticed. It happens to me at work, as well as parties. If I don't dress a step above the people I supervise as a business professional, some people view me as a college kid even though I'm knocking on the door of 40 yrs old with 15 years quality experience and credentials that can stand against anyone (but if I don't step it up, I know I'm just perceived as a college kid). Sometimes when a person is struggling with some aspects of a negative self image, he/she may find himself/herself not obtaining positive interest of others. Then it's time for change so that you project a more appealing self image, you can't stand behind "that's what everyone wears." I find often that some of the people that stand out to us at theme parties, are often the ones that don't go with theme. With alot of those people not following the theme, I can't help but think, yeah they are sexy as hell, but also ask myself, If they were dressed like everyone else, would I notice them? or would they blend in? If it was me struggling with obtaining interest I wouldn't wear a suit, but I might try some dark colored casual dockers or kakis with a flashy bright colored shirt (or something different). I checked out the profile on SLS, and I hope he smiles more than I saw in the profile. If he starts getting noticed this will also help his confidence. If normal in your area doesn't make him draw interest when he approaches women at the parties or people at any setting. Why would you be normal? I don't know about you as a woman, but as a guy, I don't want people thinking "he's ok", "he's a guy", or worse, "I'll put up with him, to get to his wife." Normal works for some people, but when it doesn't work for you or him or both of you as a couple, don't be normal. Get him to be different and get him noticed. Cause right now, normal sounds like it sucks for him. The other things will help as well (i.e. confidence, weight control, basically other things covered by other people). You actually mentioned somewhere that other guys his size didn't get much attention either. So if he's being like or dressing like them this just adds to my point. There is no one answer for anyone, for him it might not be dockers and a different shirt, but don't cling to jeans, just because that's what people wear. I could get away with wearing an SEC College Football Golf Shirt at socials here, but I'm probably just going to be another guy in Alabama. I can't stand out trying to dress like everyone else. So, Step it Up! and Don't stand behind being Normal, when Normal doesn't work for you! Stand out or be weird in a positive way, that works! Cause it sounds like normal sucks right now. It's time for a few changes. That's my 2 cents for what it's worth.
  4. First there are similarities to my experiences in this original post as JustAskJulie indicated, but at the same we don't play alone and that playing alone is not both of us present but one just watching. Unless it's strictly girl - girl with the guys just watching. This is because as you've described your feelings, we don't want either of us or either of the couple that we are playing with to feel left out. Because it sucks to be the odd one out. It sounds like below you are referring to them having sex as "getting their engines going." So this would not happen with us as a couple. But if you're referring to making out in a corner separately that is gonna happen. But I think I'm going to assume you mean oral sex or intercourse, things you aren't just going to do on a dance floor at a vanilla club. I think rule 2 below sounds like it may be bent a little hear but I don't know all the details, but I'm going on the quote directly above this sentence ending in you "sitting on your hands." You need to ask why are you sitting doing nothing? Did they tell you that you weren't allowed? I hope not because you have bigger issues if that is the case. Or the other possibility is that you are too passive as displayed in your sentence that I quoted below. I understand the non-aggressive approach, more than others and it is true that you have to watch women because they can be more subtle in their "I'm in to you" indicators. Sometimes you just have to dance with random people to figure it out. If their having fun dancing with you and not trying get off the dance floor quickly, they might be into you. So you might just have to kiss them on the dance floor. If she's leaning her face in to yours face to face, and you're not sure just peck kiss her lips to test the waters. If you think you got a positive result, try it again with more passion, but read the face and the body language. But if they look like they are smiling and going through the motions, you will know it (so if this is the case be polite, and make up an excuse (need to use the restroom, refresh your drink) just don't advance on someone that appears like they are trying to appease you.) I have issues with being more aggressive at times, but you really need to try more aggressively. Its great if a woman that is attractive is totally out of her shell and aggressively pursuing me, but more often than not, you do have make the first move. To overcome the fear of rejection it has to be agreed by both you and your wife if they as a couple aren't in to both of you, it sounds like you aren't comfortable being the odd one out (which as I inferred earlier, is perfectly natural) and I'm pretty sure that if you're wife was the odd one out, she'd feel the same way (most people don't want to be the odd one out). So if you both agree that neither of you are going to be the odd one out, then it should give you confidence the all play involving you and your wife stops if either one of you are left out. Sitting there doing nothing when your wife and another guy are "getting their engines started", and there is a woman sitting there also with you waiting to see what your first move is, could definitely come across as creepy. Keep the friendly open conversation, but when everything gets started take the engines being started as your cue to "do something already." Take a line from the Nike advertisement, and "Just do It!" After all she's trying to wait patiently. We've had guys and girls text us before. If they are just being friendly that's fine. If its constant from either one but none from the other half, I think it may make me worry considering we don't play alone (as it sounds that you 2 don't) and it should be NSA sex. But in your case, she may be waiting on you to text her (I'm assuming you are not texting her and possibly expecting her to reach out to you). No, you are not a selfish jerk because you want equal attention, those are the rules you have set. Not directly but when you make a rule that says both of you will move at the same speed, it is implied. I think most wives in your position would feel left out also, if they felt like the other guy was not into her, but her husband was going at it with the other woman. However, it appears that you are probably less aggressive than I am, so you need to at least get more aggressive. To your question section finally. I've experienced guys coming up and hitting on my wife, making out with my wife, and trying to pull the alpha male B. S. I've experienced guys making out with my wife and not really finding common reciprocal interest from the female half when I'm interested. But my wife knows that it's going nowhere towards playing with them and we don't play separately. You need to make that well known to your wife, and your definition of playing separately sounds like it may be close to my definition. Which does not mean being in the same room while your wife is going at it with one or two other people while you just watch. So if you are uncomfortable, you speak up and everything involving you and your wife ends or something changes right then at that moment. Unfortunately you will almost always have more interest or offers aggressively directed towards the female half of a couple from other men than towards a man from another woman, because of simple programming by society. Most men are brought up from day one as a boy to be aggressive go getters. Then, while women are just as capable of being aggressive and anything else they want, society (not me) influences a large majority to not be the aggressive one's when it comes to making the first move in sex. So, yes you should probably be more assertive with women. Most people, if they have a problem with something and just accept it, then they are just going along with it but feelings don't just change. You will most likely still feel left out. If you don't fix this, I fear that resentment will build. You have to communicate with your wife, and let her know you can't deal with this. Unless you have a cuckold fetish, I don't think you are happy with the situation, and I'm starting to think you avoid confrontation more than me. This is important, if you let it go on for too long, it's going to be harder to confront the issue. It's not about stopping her fun, it's about both of you being comfortable with the situation. Allow me to pull out my southern accent "Hell Yeah!" Don't let this issue go, you will regret it. You have to confront your issues (being uncomfortable with her playing while you're on the sideline), and your wife sounds like she will understand. So dude, I think you and your wife can work through this, make no playing separately mean "no playing separately." Topic of Aggression: Make like a tennis shoe and "Just Do It!" I think your nature from what I see expressed here will keep you from being overly aggressive, you have more risk of doing nothing and appearing creepy. Topic of either of you being a 3rd Wheel: Don't make like a tennis shoe. Talk to your wife, define playing separately and don't play separately. You can't handle it, and don't allow anyone to give you the excuse of "well you're in the room, but you aren't doing anything." It does not matter if you are uncomfortable being aggressive (which you need to work one) or if it's the girl really isn't into you (which I don't think you try enough if you aren't making a move sexually). If you are uncomfortable with what's going on with her playing and you not, it should stop. But keep in mind that goes both ways, if you come to a situation when she's on the sideline while you play and she's uncomfortable everything still stops. That's more than my 2 cents.. I could probably be more aggressive myself...and I'm working on it... you need to start working on it....
  5. While it was nice to see her in my shoes, it was really odd. She really does have patience, because I tried to give them the benefit of the doubt that's why I went to the table to try to engage the couple in conversation. I realize first conversations can be odd. Julie was working the front desk or I would've made sure she went with me. However, trying to engage the couple in a conversation was a big mistake, as I felt like it was pulling teeth to get them to carry any part of the conversation. So when Julie walked up I just let her talk in hopes that they would talk to her, because at that point they weren't really holding up their end of the conversation very well. Yeah ... I like good looks ...(she was cute but not over the top), however I have to have someone that can make small talk, communicate, etc. At this point I realized after they failed to engage my wife in conversation and failed to hold very much of a conversation with me, there was no benefit of the doubt left. It was either a case of their inability to communicate or ignoring my wife. I think it was both. So yeah she blew her chances. It was really weird. I'm a quiet person outside the lifestyle, so getting outside my normal self in the lifestyle and having this sort of oddity often makes me take a step back into my shell for a while. I'm just glad my wife and I communicate openly about these odd moments in time.
  6. No I really didn't have an expectation on number of past partners because of a couple of reasons that sort of build on each other. First: I believe many single people (not just guys, because women do it to), including myself, go thru what politically correct people want to refer to as promiscuous times as we live life where we meet those hot people (guys or girls or both depending on preference) that we are attracted to. So I would be a Hypocrit to judge my wife by putting a number on acceptable partners, for something I've done myself as a single person. Depending on each individual's set of standards that each of us actually live by, many times individuals will just hop from bed to bed, because they are single and there is no one to which they are committed. It doesn't mean the individuals are necessarily sleeping with just everyone. It doesn't mean they didn't take safety precautions either. It just may be that individual was in sync with more partners in a given period of time than the number of partners some other people may find acceptable, based on the other peoples standards (which by the way last time I checked there are over 6 billion people on the planet, and I'm guessing here but there are probably also 6 billion sets of standards on this issue of "who to sleep with and how many to sleep with"). Second: Society on average as a whole put's an acceptable behavior out on everything, eventhough it's not written down somewhere. Society or people in society as a whole (on average), tend to treat people differently based on those acceptable (or what they conculde as "unacceptable") behaviors, but it's not written down anywhere. What's acceptable is different for everyone. I'm sure there are times when the majority voices that a behavior is unacceptable, and some people that don't necessarily agree with just agree to avoid being set as an outcast or judged by the majority. Then, when the majority is not around, they engage in the behavior anyway. So based on people knowing increased number of sexual partners is many times viewed as unacceptable by society as a whole on average, you won't hear about the majority of people that go through the promiscuous times in their lives. As a result of this situation, when one does actually tell the truth about the number of partners it oftens sounds above average or bad to some that may believe the individual has more sex partners in their life than is acceptable to the other individual's standards. Now, I can't help but ask myself, when faced with being judged by one that an individual wants to spend the rest of their life with are they going to ask him or herself? "What is society's impression of what is an acceptable number of sexual partners and are they going to adjust it to attain happiness?" and "If they do adjust it (or lie), who's gonna know, after all it's not on record somewhere unless they had a kid with someone or legal proceedings occurred?" My Conculsion: Some can say having a certain number of sexual partners is irresponsible or immoral (or whatever term you want to use), but I say compared to who's standards or who's morals? Because, I don't think people on average when in the presence of the majority (or if they think the majority may find out) are honest about the number of past sexual partners out of fear of being judged. So even if a potential partner is honest in saying for example 10, whats to say that I could find somewhat close to accurate information on what others do if the majority is not being being honest. The average could be 5, if it were possisble to get accurate information, then the majority or people that buy into the "accuracy" of the information or the majority of society on average may actually judge me. But the average could be 25 (I know it sounds high, but how do you know), then you may be think well is this experienced enough? Do they do things I like? Are they going to be a prude in comparison to me? Do they not like sex? To the point: To judge a potential mate on number of sexual partners, may not be something I could do with a clear concience. I don't know what I could compare it to other than my own experiences and what society says is acceptable (which I think what is acceptale in society is not what actually goes on behind closed doors in individuals real lives). I know this is a long answer to a short question, but simply put, unless they were cheating on their spouse (which swinging is absolutley not), the answer to putting a number of sexual partners limit from the past on your potential spouse/wife for me is "no I can't do that."
  7. Everyone has a preference, and I'm sure some guys like the hair grown out natural. I prefer it shaved or well groomed, and with me my wife prefers it well groomed or shaved. So, If the hair is just too wild, then yes it's a turn off to me. I don't want chewbaca in your pants. So if you have wild pubic hair, for me it's a turn off. However, It sounds like the problem is that you shave or use hair removal product and there is some reaction. If you want to try grooming: I suggest just trimming with electric hair trimmers, with a quarter inch or half inch guard (you'll have to figure out what size guard based on how much it pricks your partner at the length, thats trial and error. It's much easier than trying to break out scissors and you're more likely to get an even cut with the guard on the trimmers. A good location to do this is facing your toilet and sitting down on the front edge of the seat straddling the toilet with your legs spread wide. This way, you can flush when you're done. If not the toilet, maybe just spread a towel out on the bed and lay down and let your partner do it for you (It could be fun). That's my 2 cents...
  8. First, you appear to be having some but limited communicaton with your wife about this, but I'm not positive. However, I will say this on the comment above: If your wife said recently that she wants to visit a club to see other people have sex, I don't encourage people to go to a club to treat them like a zoo... where you go and stand around to see caged wild animals. If you are going to a club to watch other people have sex, then you do have the option to go to the on-premise clubs and "play with each other only" in front other couples while watching those other couples. You don't want to be perceived as a couple there just to watch a freak show (cause swingers aren't freaks, it's just most people aren't used to seeing others have sex in front of them), but it does sound like you both may have voyeuristic tendencies. So you may want to consider talking about planning a trip and going to an on-premise club near you to play with each other only while watching other couples play. Remember no one can force you to play with them, and remember the biggest rule in any on-premise club worth going to is "no means no." If you take the approach I explained in the last couple of paragraphs of this post, it sounds like you need to stick to playing only with each other until you both mutually decide you are both ready to go beyond that. Then the next day or on the way home, have an indepth discussion about how you felt when this couple was doing this, that couple was doing that, and you two were doing whatever. It sounds like you may want more than that, and I don't know if she wants more, this is something you have to talk about. You might get all your answers on the way home, but most likely you will have to put some time into the conversation and it may be several smaller conversations (this process requires lots of patience and understanding). You may find yourself sticking to "playing with each other while watching others" forever is enough for you after going several times, and that's ok, but deciding to play with others outside the relationship is a decision you both need to talk about and decide after trying the voyeur exhibitionist thing. I don't advise making this decision on impulse in the heat of the moment. Understand that venturing into swinging is best done by taking small steps, but even the scenario above is a huge step for some people. The reason being is that from an early age most individuals in American society are taught that sex is primarily a private event between two people, so you may want to take a slightly smaller step. A smaller step may be just going to an off-premise club, where you are just going to meet other swingers. You could do this just to see if you are comfortable with the idea of interacting with other swingers (who surprisingly enough, are usually just like the normal population, but often perceived as more open socially) on a non-sexual level. If you don't think your relationship is ready to try playing in the same room with another couple or you aren't comfortable with just going to off-premise social or meet-n-greet with other swingers, then you may want to just try going to the adult video store to get some movies and taking it home to watch while having sex (which may be very satisfying for both of you). Another thing you may want to do, because it is often easier to write one's fantasies down than by talking to them face to face if he or she has not had many discussions about one's desires, due to the fear of rejection. You both could write down your fantasies, and exchange them. However, on this note TNT is right: "Just enjoy it." In my opinion, you never know what could happen to make that experience with the one you love end, cease to happen, or whatever. Life was meant to seek enjoyment, and let others do the same. Life does not always present these great situations (you have ups and downs) the way we would like, so grab hold of the experience as long as it is there. To be honest, you may want to just enjoy the ride that life has provided to you at this moment in time. And that's another ten cents ........
  9. This will be a little lengthy: There may be different things going on here in her head... and I will attempt to try to explain why you may feel like you as you say "are always getting the answer" with the implication of it being the same answer. First their are certain things you are asking, that must be addressed to make my point: What she mentioned above "she probably would have been a swinger if not married" may be the honest truth, or it may just be her fishing for your opinion on the topic. 1. If she was fishing: Because of the next statement indicating that she may be affraid of potential jealousy if you both chose to swing, leads me to beleive that she may have also been hesitant to directly address the subject without fishing due to fear of your jealousy. Which in my opinion is definitly a sign that you are important to her. (Keep in mind: this fear is a legitimate fear from anyone in a relationship who is breaching the subject of swinging with their mate) 2. If the comment "she probably would have been a swinger if not married" was the honest truth in how she felt: It may be that she doesn't feel like either her, you, or both could get past the jealousy that she described in the following statements. So whether it is answer one or two or something else the readers here do not know. To answer this question: Whether bi, gay, or straight, people have abstained from sex for many years in one stretch, so there is nothing unbeleivable about a bi-sexual person not engaging in bisexual activity for 10 years. (especially if they are receiving satisfaction from their heterosexual relationship). I'm sure there are underlying experiences that are had in and out of bedroom that leave people wanting more in sex. After all it is the concept of hope. People find about activities, may even engage in activities, or just see someone they find attractive. So if any of the three or other things happen and someone get's excited, then yes this may leave people wanting more in sex. It may sound stupid for me to point this out that this where fantasies come from, but it takes me to the next part of your question. For many swingers, fantasies of threesomes, foursomes, orgies, or even more have brought them to the swinging lifestyle. The desires are built over time just thinking about engaging in activities that may not just involve their spouses. This has brought many current swingers past their past fears of breaching the subject with their spouses, but some never progress past fantasy. So to answer your question, for couples more sex is not always some sort of swinger, but for some it definitily is. 1. The anwser to your question is not straight forward as many of us would like. We often wish that the straight forward answer would magically appear in a pefect package. In high school girls would often act giddy, smile, or talk to me, so I never could figure out if they were freindly or they wanted to go out with me. Any mind reader around me at age 16 would have known I wanted a straight forward answer on whether the girls in my high school wanted to go out with me. But I have to admit: It would have been so much easier to just show up at their house knowing they were going to go out with me, than me having to build up the courage to ask them. In a way this appears to be the same situation to the readers of your thread. You appear to want to know if your wife wants to swing. Your wife appears to be dropping hints, but you don't have the courage or you haven't figured out how to directly ask her. That is why people are indicating that you need to talk to her, because they do not know what she wants. Every person is different, and you would be more equipped to find that out. 2. The other thing that you stated is that you are getting another answer indicating that your relationship may be having problems. Well anytime someone mentions possible jealousy, for most that indicates it exists at some, if even minimal level. With the possibility of any minimal jealousy and the lack of discussion between you and your spouse or her input we don't know if your relationship is ready for swinging, no matter how strong your relationship is. This is something that each couple has to discuss. That's a little more than my 2 cents.....
  10. Here is something I found in a profile recently as what the couple was searching for: "......... The couple would need to have a bi-female with a little experience as this is my first time with another woman. I would prefer her to be clean shaven and along the same body size as myself....... " So I glance at the stats of the woman considering her preferences for someone along the same size as herself. I find that the woman is 5 foot 3 inches and weighs absolutely nothing. Yes zero pounds was listed. That is correct they are apparently looking for a woman who is around 5'3" tall and who weighs around, I don't know 5 to 10 pounds (or less) I guess. I'm not sure how to define "along the same size."
  11. You found a spa that will wax him.... wow.. I'm in AL I don't know that I could find a spa that would wax me ... but I do prefer to keep it shaved, but it leaves the razor bumps.....
  12. I think you are definitely on the right track with the going out, meeting face to face, and becoming comfortable for all parties involved first. Then if things are ok go from there. It seems that at this point, If I were you, I think I might take the whole attitude of "not playing on the first date." Maybe even going dancing or out to dinner with him with intentions of just getting to know him or being comfortable with him. I may even take the hubby so you get his view point on the character issues (after all you probably want your husband to be comfortable with this guy also).
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