Dr Jekyll

Yep, Dito on Intuition897's last posting... Based on my results: 71% Poly 86% tolerant of the poly lifestyle 14% just in it for the sex I'd say the test is a little off on the Poly rating... I'm very tolerant of the idea of a poly relationship and find it hugely interesting, but I know for a fact that I'd go green with envy if my wife were to be emotionally involved with any other person. But it was fun and that's mostly the idea behind these tests, nice one...

I'd just like to add... If you're really concerned about getting HPV and want to avoid it, you should really not be swinging. In fact you should not be having vanilla sex with anyone for approximately 10 years to make sure you are in the smallest risk group... And then when you get the chance to finally jump him/her, you still have a significant risk of getting HPV. With a virus so common you really must stay celibate not to be exposed to it at some stage...

I almost feel it is a non-issue in your case. If there were one of you who had a need for discretion, then the group must respect that, but since all 4 of you have already said it's fine, what's the problem? The only issue that there may be is with how much is shareable... Some things happen that is best not shared by anyone other than the person it happened to. Or there may something in the details that is sensitive to one person, but may not appear that way to another. So there might still be a need for some level of discretion, even though the overall experience does not require it. Then again, going by what I know of the 4 of you, I'm fairly certain you'd go out of your way not to post something personal in any case...

We know a couple (that we love playing with) where the girl will ask you outright before the first date if you are at least of average size. Her point is simple, she enjoys looking at and feeling a big cock inside her. And for some reason, seeing a guy drop his shorts when he is small is a sure way to quench her fire... We all have some preset likes and dislikes in our partners that are turn-ons and turn-offs. For her it's a turn-off to see a small dick, and it in itself will lead to sex not being as much fun. Not because she can't orgasm wildly by oral play, but simply because the person has a trait that is a turn off for her. I tend to compare this to men with a beard or a moustache. If you have one, the chances of getting my wife into a room is extremely small, it's just too much of a turn-off for her. Why should penis size be any different?

Dito You seem to do the talking thing really well... Try listening, it's normally the hard part.

This I think might be the biggest root of your problem. Women, pressure and sex don't do well together. It might have been a word choice thing, but somehow I doubt it. You'll need to choose, it's the one or the other... If she doesn't want to swing if you've been talking to her, nothing you say after months of "pestering" is going to change that. Why in the world would she want to bust your nuts if your relationship was 100% ok? I get a lot of bad vibes from you saying that things are NOT ok, yet you insist it is... Maybe you should really stand back and take an excruciatingly honest look at your relationship, you may not like what you see, but acknowledging a problem is always the first step in fixing it. You may be the one standing between you and that exciting sexlife...

It's one of those damned if you do, damned if you don't scenarios. You have this fantasy that she once went along with, now she won't. If you remain silent it'll never happen, if you speak up, you sleep on the couch. I'd try to speak to her. Approach the topic very carefully and try to keep things calm. The point being that if you never speak to her about it, you'll never know why or how she feels. Sex is a very touchy subject when your sexlife isn't 100%. But just ignoring it won't fix a thing, and you're even contemplating cheating on your wife... Which is very bad indeed. Sleeping on the couch isn't fun, but sometimes it's the only way.

If she was single and fell pregnant with him it would still have been her choice to keep the baby. But in that scenario it is commonly accepted for the father to pay child support. Yes, she has a husband, but (and this is sad to consider) if they get divorced he will have legal footing to deny her child support by proving that he is not the father. It will be much more difficult to go through the court and force the biological father to pay child support then. That said, it's not a nice scenario to be put in. I'd not be inpressed if you asked me for child support...

It's a tough one, but I'd say you're not exactly comfortable with the situation, although you're not exactly sure as to why it is that you're not comfortable. The fact that you are uncomfortable in itself is a good enough reason for her to stop. This is a two way thing. You're obviously not quite happy and if it's bugging you to the extent where you don't want them to ever meet... My opinion, ask her to stop. Either you are not ready, or she is overstepping the boundaries of what is ok. Won't work.

If ever there was a thread that got completely off topic this is it!!!! Good luck Mr&Mrs Naughty, I think no matter what you do there will always be some clingy singles out there. Each segment of swinging has it's own problems, cpl-cpl is difficult to find 4 people who really match, single bi-fems are virtually non-existant and single guys/girls are more likely to be clingy... Still wondering if LM is telling the whole story. Oh yes, and good luck ES, hope everything works out well...

BTW, how many of those posting on this thread has ever been tested for any of the non-life threatening STD's? As Julie rightfully said, you can't test effectively for Herpes (for example), how do you know YOU'RE clean to start with? Simply being asymptomatic means nothing in the world of STDs...

The problem with a closed group is that it takes one person to infect the whole group. With incubation periods of 3 months and longer it is impossible to test for HIV and be safe when playing. Lots more trust required there than I'd give anyone...

every sport has it's injuries eh Vespertine? STD's will be with us forever. Once an innoculation (I'm sure there is a better word) for AIDS has been found there will be some other STD scaring people. And you can be sure that a new deadly STD will replace AIDS in the not too distant future... Should we all run and hide and stop having sex? I don't think so. Risk management is the name of the game, use protection to suit your fears and enjoy the ride. If you are to be the unlucky 0.1% (sucked out of my thumb, don't quote me) that contracts HIV from oral sex then so be it.

More often than not cheating goes on for a long time before the spouse realise it. During this time they often have no clue... But as to why people cheat, I think this sums it up perfectly... There is one simple rule that makes or breaks relationships... You have to satisfy your partner's basic needs or they will become infatuated with someone who does. Nothing works SO well against a relationship than witholding from fulfilling your partner's needs. Whether or not it is on purpose is irrelevant, the end effect is the same... Am I saying it's ok to cheat? Not a chance, like jcbcouple said, YOU are the only one who can change your life. And if you're unhappy you can do something about it AND go about it in the right way. But sadly people don't realise they're unhappy because it's the way it's always been, or it slowly became that way. Then one day someone steps into their lives and fills that one little shortcoming in their significant other (SO) and they become god's gift. Not because they WANT to cheat, but because they don't realise that without their SO this person's appeal will fall flat. But meeting that one basic need overshadows ALL the other basic needs being met by their SO. And so it starts, and there is always 3 sides to a story: his, hers and the truth... I firmly believe many of the serial cheaters out there started out as one time affairs. Many of those saying: "I still love them", really think they do. In general people do not like hurting others, my wife still has emotional scars from her affair. Not because it didn't work out, but because she didn't expect herself to stoop to that level where she'd have an affair. This has become an essay, not a post, but I think you get my message... As for if swingers should play with cheaters? Do whatever you feel comfortable with, I wouldn't, but I'm not judging.

Yep, a very big Dito to everything said above... If they're basically happy with swinging but need to relax a little. 2/3 drinks won't kill anyone or make them do something they would'nt have when sober...