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ricndi032903

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About ricndi032903

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  1. Well it seems that "Elusive BiFem" doesn't like what I had to say, OH WELL, she has nothing to lose, no SO to leave or have leave HER. But then again, maybe she'll "fall in love with someones SO" like Sadie did. Or maybe a few more marriages will end due to someones over eagerness at trying to "get the wife/husband" into this, when the word NO is not taken seriously. And it's true, if each person in the committed relationship are truly happy and content in that relationship and NOTHING is lacking, then there is NO reason to go outside of the relationship on the PHYSICAL level, for sexual satisfaction. The wife or husband has EVERY right to refuse to consider this lifestyle if they feel it's intruding on his or her right to a loving, yet faithful relationship. While communicating is great, but if there is any objection to a certain topic, then that topic should be off limits in the act of pursuing. You may have have a passion for swinging, but the real passion should be about your wife or husband. Not your fantasies. And even though I know I'll be slammed again for daring to say this, but somebody does, "almost" every woman in this lifestyle began by wanting to do this for their men, to make them happy, rather that then have them cheat... they surely didn't get into this by their own choices. It's goes this way, realistically, how many choices do we have, cheat? swing? cheat? swing? Cheat. face the unknown, swing, know what you really don't wanna know. But make the best of it. Or just be a happy couple who is satisfied and content with the one you chose to spend the rest of your life with. Ya know people, that's not such a bad thing...
  2. Hello, first and foremost, I know I'm going to get slammed real good for even posting this, but oh well, here it goes. Do you love her??? Want only her??? Is she YOUR #1 priorty? Your wife may not want to openly talk, or consider swinging, is because she doesn't want to fuck anybody else and quite possibly wants you to be 'happy' with good old her. Nothing personal, but I really can't stand it when the 'men' keep asking the same old question 'how do I get my wife to swing' geesh guys, if she says no, then DROP it, cause even though you may like playing with fire, do you really want to get burnt???? And if you keep pushing, you may be pushing her RIGHT OUT OF YOUR LIFE. So why don't you just be a real man and be satisfied with what you have and be happy.
  3. Sorry for misunderstanding, but in my search for knowledge and pure understanding or my journey in; why the man I love would want this for our relationship, and for simply asking a very honest question on "what would you do and how would it be handled if your (meaning everyone's) children discovered what their parents are and or were doing, how they would choose to handle the situation, should it ever arrise.... " I really and truly do feel that yes I have been attacked from one end of the scope to the other at times. To answer your question, Allow me to explain myself and how I got here, I lived in a marriage for 20 years, my husband was a dead beat, and the worst possible husband and lover. Hence we divorced. Ric, my new husband, lived in the most hellish of lives for 22 years with a woman that wanted absolutely no part of keeping house, or sex, he starved for love, attention and yes, sex, if he begged long enough, then he'd get a little, and then be left unsatisfied. We met, hit it off from the beginning, emotionally, and physically, and sex for either of us has never been better. He's truly been the man I have dreamed of and fantasized of. And he feels this same way about me in return. We talk about everything from A-Z. Open and honest, all the way. But, when swinging was mentioned, and how he'd always wanted to explore this, he scared me. He wanted the whole sha-bang at once, no baby steps, no taking our time, everything was rushed, then forced, then ugly threats were made, why? because I like sex and he thought I'd want this and he's have his fantacies and me all at the same time, But to me, his wanting this after all we both had had in our previous lives, to want this was unnatural to me, considering how great we have it together... And I'll admit I have my share of hang-ups, having always been on cheated on in every relationship, my first impression was he wanted to cheat, but with my permission. I want you to understand my words, ok, through all the talks, whether it be calmy talking, or arguing, in posting my fears and thoughts of my dreams ending, at his forcing this on me, in everyone's responses that this should never be forced on anyone that it has to be what both people want, it made him see what his forcing and threatening was doing, and that it was not right. And once he saw what he was doing to "us", and slowly backed off and allowed me to come to grips with what he was proposing, thus allowing to be see what I was ok with, if anything, and agree to let me set the speed, that alone gave me the courage to look beyond the sex part and see swinging and swingers from every angle. You gotta believe me when I say I was repulsed at first thought, cause I was, I seriously thought that this was for those that didn't want a committed relationship and out to score as much meaningless sex as they could. In posting and reading, (my husband reads them too), a lot of my fears were put to rest, that there are quote, normal people out there that have normal jobs, kids, families and etc... and that what they choose to do is not harming them, and this I firmly respect. As for me, myself, I do not want us, (meaning me and my husband) to have sexual relations outside of our marital unit. I do like and embrace the voyeuristic and expo side of this, and my husband understand these are my comfort levels and my limits. But I am not nor do I think I will ever be comfortable enough to permit touching, or anything physical with other people in our marriage, understand ok. that for US as a marital unit, anything physical with someone else is going against what I believe my marriage stands for. So PLEASE PLEASE understand, that is MY view for MY relationship and MY marriage. with no judgement on what you choose to do or not do. It was a long hard road to make this trip, and he loves me enough to respect me and my limits, and it's my thanks to you all for saying and telling that forcing is wrong, it allowed him to see what he was doing, and allowed him to tone down his wants and needs for me and for us. Plus allowed me to make up my own mind as to what I was capable of doing.
  4. Guess I'm off to defend myself and my views once again, starting at the bottom of the list and going up. 1. DE & CI. Listen loud and clear, I am not a trainwreck, just a mom to a total of 8 children, 5 mine, 3 his, your so fortunate to have a hot wife that you can share anything with. Oh goodie, well babe, I'm as hot as the next and probably hotter, does that mean I want to have sex with any man or every man, hell no, can my husband come to me with his thoughts and ideas, well yes he can, for if he couldn't I would not be hear. get it? Good and while I'm at it, TH & I are probably the only ones to have the nerve to at least ask the questions we seek to try to give our husbands what they want. Even though we may have had our arms twisted, I think our being questional about what our mates want and why they want it is what bothers us, and by trying to see all angles of this lifestyle more then proves our love anf want for their happiness. 2 Amy & Mike, I refer to a husband and wife as "making love" why? Isn't that what you all call it, and when it's having sexual relations with some one else , is't that called "fucking", I mean really you want to say there is a difference between the 2, so since it's very apparent that when you all say your having sex with someone else, you all refer to it or most have, called it FUCKING and reserving the LOVE MAKING for your spouse. So which is it? you tell me so I can be clear on what you deem as making love and fucking. Do I feel that swinging is wrong, well yes to some point and no to some point, as I've said, what ever floats your boat, doesn't have to float mine, there are aspects to swinging that does not involve touching or having sex with other and that has been my choice. I choose to maintain a sexually faithful relationship with the man I chose to marry and live the rest of my days with. running out of time, I really don't have much to spare to debate my personal choice, but for goodness sake, why don't some of you understand that I'm almost sure you didn't get where you are by NOT asking some questions and I have the same right to ask even if they have been asked 100 times. And wrnakednu, I have never once asked for the swingers on this site to agree with me one way or another, quite possibly I have when I referred to my own situation as to having this shoved down my throat night and day and constantly feeling that it was being forced on me, without allowing me to make my own choice. On that point perhaps I was looking for alittle aggreance that in my case what was happening was wrong. Oh well , so be it.
  5. Sorry Lady Cleo, but I have to disagree with you and your view, and say that I view your comments as persoanlly slamming me for even to dare pose a question like this, but ya know what? Reality sucks babe. Most parents do not raise their child in the manner of which you refer, I mean really, how you could say that a child finding out that their parents are doing other people , that that wouldn't make them feel insecure or their whole life threatened , geesh get real. I know we live in 2003, but honestly, I have 5 son's, 12 through 21, and have always had the most open honest relationship I ever could with my son's (of course depending on their ages at the time) and even though I am remarried, but still have a child residing with me and my new husband, it would shake everything my son believes as true and honest if he was to ever discover that me and his step father have done anything outside of our marriage and anyone who believes other wise is fooling them selves. Don't mean to come across so harsh, but my parents didn't raise me to sleep around, nor did my parents teach me that having sex outside their marriage was ok, I was taught that sexual relations was and should be with the one you love, and as a matter of fact, I really don't think anyone I know was raised as you would refer to. Honestly Cleo, the way you talk, that scares me, who on earth raises their children to become swingers??? And sounds to me that is what you plan to do. You said; "If we teach our kids that sex is not shameful, why should we worry about "damaging their sense of safety and security"? well I do agree that there is nothing "shameful" in sex, but there is something not right in what you said, the fact that children see or know their parents are not in a faithful relationship just teaches them that there is no reason to get married or settle down with just one person. So who's choice are you giving them, your's or their own??? Hmmm. while your teaching your children that as long as it's not harming anyone or not illegal, that it makes it right or ok, boy are you misleading yourself. And it's me that feels bad for you.
  6. well in hopes of reinterrating my orginal questions, and to make sure everyone completely understood, as far as us, we do not "play" at home, nor was I attempting to defend "playing" as to where the children could come in contact with the lifestyle, and nor was I trying to see how to play without getting caught. Mearly asking those of you that have been in the lifestyle how you WOULD handle such a matter IF it were discovered by your children. Ya know I would think this is alot more damanging then finding out your dad reads Penthouse and your Mom uses a dildo. But I do have one comment to make and it does pertain to a child walking in and finding their mother and father in the terms of "making love" and while yes some children would first be wondering if Daddy was hurting Mommy, once explained to that child (as I did when my oldest son walked in on me and his father, and no there was no question of pain or hurt, more of a what are you doing) that this is what 2 people do to show their love for eachother and that this was how he was made. Well that anserered his puzzled look and questioning face. Summing that up, to my child at the time, gave him a sence of safety in knowing that it was ok. Needless to say the bedroom door was locked after that...... But when you have a child finding out that Mommy & Daddy (or Mom & Dad) are out fucking other people, I'm very sorry, but IF and I'm saying IF a child finds this out, I hate to think what it could do to a childs sence of safety and security in his or her view of the parents marriage. I would tend to think that if a child discovered this, that it would shake the ground he or she walks on. I mean if you really sit back and think about how you would have felt as a child catching your mom and dad making love, there comes a certain degree of "everything is right in the world" no matter how yucky it looked in your mind, but what if you came home and saw Mom, Dad, and the neighbors tangled in what looked like naked twister in the bedroom, think what that sight would have done to you?? Would you have thought your parents were still deeply in love? Would you think they were headed for divorce, would you have viewed them as sick, besides the "eww gross" thought that comes to mind at when it is your parents. In a childs mind, having parents that are having sexual relations with others then the other parent, it could have very traumatic effects on that child. But please understand my words, I am not condeming anyone, just trying to figure out if what "we" are doing and if a child conceaved in love, what that child would be feeling if they learned of what their parents were doing. And just so I am once again clear, NO I am not implying that swingers are deviant. Just mearly questioning the effects on ALL OUR children should it ever be known, whether it be by walking in and seeing it, or stumbling across it on the internet.
  7. oh by the way, for just a little giggle in lighting the mood, my oldest son is 21 and my yuoungest is 12 and I'm still MOMMY, my husband's oldest is 22 and his youngest is 16 and he's still DADDY. and to make you laugh, my husband is 46 and still calls his mom MOMMY....... And until the day both of my parents died, they were still my MOMMY & DADDY. So just goes to show that no matter how old we get, when it comes to your parents, they will always be MOMMY & DADDY. And there is that little piece in all of us that regard them as royality, teachers, the people we look to to guide our footsteps and protect us from evil, we never totally grow up. ... LMAO....
  8. I do agree with you on that the kids don't need to know, but it does come down to what is still right and wrong in the children finding out, example, you lived a straight life all your life and your 20 year old daughter comes to you and says her husband wants other in their sex life, do you say go with what your hubby wants, do what you feel comfy with darling, kwim??? As parents we all have a # 1 priorty to our kids first and foremost and I do have to say that walking in and finding Mom & Dad in a "loving moment" ok fucking like animals, is alot more comforting and assuring that everything is ok in "their" lives(the kids) rather then finding Mom & Dad fucking the couple down the street, I guess what I'm trying to say is, when a child walks in on the "Parents" it's yes, very much embarrassing to both child and parent, but there is still the ora of it being their parents, and not someone that the child views as a home wrecker. exp; walking in on a parent that's cheating. See I had a neice that came to me cause she thought her mother (my brothers wife) was fucking the guy up the road, and I saw the out right devastation in her eyes, and to me, the kids finding out that both parents are not in a souly commited sexual relatiosnhip with each other and that would be very harmful to the child's existance in thier personal knowledge as to having a secure home life and enviorement. In saying what I have, all I'm trying to point out that in what we do in OUR lives, has a huge affect on our children should they ever discover the hidden truths about their parents and "friends". And exactly what example are we as "adults" really showing our children. Just a little food for thought. Diane
  9. you said your oldest knows, how old is your oldest and how did he or she find out and how did you explain your choice in this lifestyle and how does the child except your way of living??? By the way, I'm not casting any judgement, none at all, just very courious at how this delicate subject would be or is handled as loving parents when or if your children find or found out......
  10. Just a quick thought on Tarnishhalo's post "Angry about Swinging" and the comment by her about the children finding out, I noticed that only one person caught on and actually addressed that statement, so I figured what the hell, might as well find out ; What would you do if your children discovered you kinky side??? (by the way, I'm not talking about finding a toy, like what if your son or daughter saw your profile on their friends computer or came home unexpectedly and walked in on mommy getting it from 2 men??? or daddy muff diving on a woman that wasn't Mommy???? ) What would you say??? How would you say it??? How would you explain that even though Mommy and Daddy have sex with other people, that their lives (& the kids lives) are still in a secure place??? And if you were embarrassed for your children to find out, a feeling of guilt or shame, isn't that your subconscious really trying to tell you something???? I am so curious to know how some would sit their kids down and have this type of talk with your children.
  11. Just wanted to say Thanks for all the replies, and I do mean ALL. Bear & Bi I think were the most help, and of course everyone, While it's very difficult to be in my position, mother, 2nd wife, having always been on the shitty end of life and felt that I was about to have my fairy tale come true. In many ways it has, although I never dreamed that my new life would ever consist of my new husband asking for something like this. Always searching in my heart for the one man that would be faithful and want to be faithful to just me, ya know, to love me enough to want me and only me. Even though I know Ric loves me beyond words, none the less, it hurt me deeply to know that he and I are not on the same page in wanting a more traditional marriage, meaning when it comes to sex, that it just be him and I. That's been my fantasy all my life. To Bear I will say this, Yes dear you are correct, Over the "swing thing"; He is a ass hole and I am a idiot, He pushed and pushed and I crumbled due to my fear of loosing him to someone that would want this lifestyle, my heart and mouth said NO, but yet I gave in. And you would be very correct in assuming that it will never happen to me again. I am only comfortable with the very bear bones aspects of this lifestyle, I require a huge degree of safety, respect and security as a woman, wife and mother. And in him understanding this, it shows me respect and makes me feel secure, and safe in my relationship with him as his wife. And as of currently, I am happy to report that he is doing and showing me these things that I need and require to maintain a healthy marriage, while I still research the lifestyle and gain more understanding, as to better comprehend his wants and needs.
  12. 1. I'm not anti swinging. if it works for you, then fine, if not, then fine, my hubby loves peas, do I? no. Do I prepare them for him. yes. Do I eat them with him, no way, there gross. Simply put, to each their own. 2. I'm as open minded as the next person, for if not I doubt I'd be here or with him, or even trying to gain any understanding what-so-ever on something he wants. But also trying to make him understand where I'm coming from and that if you play with fire, your bound to get burnt. He thinks that us having sex with other people will enhance our sex life, make us closer, and yet maybe I'm fooling myself by thinking that our sex life and life is already great and that we as a couple are as close as anybody can possibly be. When he brags/ tells me how he never cheated on his first wife of 22 years and never asked her about swinging (even though it's been in his mind forever) and then tells me how special I am that he's even asking about this, which makes me feel offended that he didn't ask his 1st wife, in some backwards way of thinking on my part; that him asking me, is making me dirty and keeping the mother of his kids clean. But then at the same time, I kinda feel honored that he asked me and not her, that he trusted me and not anyone else, his reason for not asking her was, that she was sexually dead from the neck down and therefore why even ask when she didn't want sex to begin with....and for that I can understand. So I research all aspects of swinging, in hopes that I might be able to find something, some part of his fantasy that I can share with him, so that I feel safe and it's not threatening to our relationship. I tell him that I'm only comfy with voyeurism and expo. he says ok, that he doesn't need or want another woman, and then in the same breath says but how much fun it could be and how strange and exciting it would be. So he's basically saying he doesn't want anyone else, but that he really does. I just want to yell at him; shit or get off the pot. He used double talk. And that is what confuses me and why I come here and ask the questions I've asked, and the one poster was right, this clearly isn't something I can go ask my pastor about.... it's embarrassing to say the least. And of course knowing how people gossip at church, my kids would know about it. A professional sex therapist, thought about that, but would hate for a session to turn into a gang up on Di event or hate it even more if it turned into a gang up on Ric event. Ya know, I buy and prepared peas for my husband, not because I want to eat them, but because he wants them, he loves them and I buy and prepare them for him because I love him. But ya know, years ago before we met, he hit himself in the balls with a sledge hammer, was I there to see it? No, is it something I want him to do for me? No, why? cause it hurt him, Do I sit there and tell him to do it so it can make me feel like the "better woman" , no, if it hurt him, then I want no part of it. How could I possibly view having sex with others as cheating? well maybe because in the past 2 major relationships I've had, I was cheated on and him wanting this is the same as cheating, but with a twist, get the wives permission and then it's not cheating. and at the same time, give her your permission to have sex with someone and then you don't feel so guilty. Why? cause your both having sex with someone else. So why get married, just have an open relationship. It's like I've said before, he thinks one way on this, and I think my way, but also I'm the one trying to see his side of it, trying to open my eyes even more, when he fails to see my side, but my common sense says and tells me after seeing his ex wife and hearing the horrible stories about his marriage to her and weighing what he had then and what he has now, and how much better we have it together, it's enough to make a crazy person sane in trying to figure him and this out. But I do thank you for trying to give me a better understanding and in many ways you have, you've all helped and not in just siding with him or me, but in showing me your human, caring side to even reply at all. thanks
  13. Well I can only guess I've offended a bunch of you and there's really nothing I can say or do, but say I'm sorry for bothering, But I'll say this much, NO, I've never had sex for the fun or thrill of it, I never had those thoughts, if it wasn't with someone that I loved or cared about, it just didn't happen, I never lived a sexually promisquisious lifestyle either. Also I'm not a natrual born cheater and if he wants another woman for his sexual satisfaction then he might as well move on, cause I am not about to give him my permission to have sex with someone, with or without my being there. (to me; it's still cheating) It's hard for you all to understand that other then the swinging issue, we get along fine, we don't argue or fight, but when he tells me how much he wants it and why, and I try to express my opinion and what I feel it would do to us and our marriage, he makes lite of my views. He can't express why he wants this lifestlye in a way I can understand, to me, he either wants me or he dosen't. but I wish someone would just tell me... why does anyone has the right to keep forcing the issue and their views (why it's ok and not damanging) when the other person has said no? why when a man knows the hurtful past of the woman he loves does he have the right to inflict that same pain (a 3sum) for the sheer fact that it proves he's the better man??? why does he or anyone else want this for the sheer fact (that he's told me) that having sex with someone other then your SO is fun, different, or strange??? If there is no emotional attachment, then what's the purpose of doing it??? What pleasure can anyone really possibly have watching the one you love having sex with someone else??? Isn't the sex you have susposed to be special, or be with someone that is special or at least feel something for them???
  14. well it's obvious that the last few replies didn't bother to read the other posts by me and why I was here, to gain a better understanding of this lifestyle and the why's that some people can't live without it, regardless of how I got here, it's pretty obvious that I am here, but what some of the last posters fail to understand is that I am not here by my own choice, for if it were by MY choice I've have nothing to do with this lifestyle, my husband is the one that brought it up and then wouldn't let it go when I begged, pleaded, cried, etc...... He is the one that wants to have sex with other people, NOT ME, and yes I may have failed at my worthless attempt to SHOW him what he was giving away, and yes again that failure is on me, and sorry to report but I have not used it as a weapon on him, it was a mistake to try and show an addict what he wants, cause it only made him want more without the cost of losing what he says he's waited all his life for. ME. So who are you and why do you thoughtlessly pass your poor judgement on me and try to blame me for HIS wants and HIS pushyness???? If the situation was reversed and it was me that was wanting something that he didn't and if I knew how he felt, it would have never been brought up or pushed down this throat..... But it's ok to blame me, why not, right, what he wants is ok, what I want isn't. I have no rights according to the last few posters, that much is obvious and then blame me for his addiction. I'm perfectly satisfied with the man I married, I have no need to look elsewhere for sex or anything else. But ya know what , I do, and his manipulative games on praying on my past and my pain is over.
  15. Hello and I do say thank you for the replies, very sincerely, but calmly speaking, I'd like to explain just a bit as to why I am so very defensive (but not with you all), the way you choose to live and who you have sex with is your own personal choice, with no judgement from me....if it's good and works for you, then wonderful. When Ric and I first met, we discussed our past, we confided in each other, our fears, our dreams, our wants out of life, I told him of things in my past, things that hurt me, almost drove me to the brink of killing myself, he too told me of his past, how he hurt for many years, his thoughts of ending it all....then as time went by and we began building a future together, he told me about these "fantasies" (wanting to take me to a strip club, because guys are so impressed when a man has his woman there, his curiousness over what goes on at a Swing Club, voyeurism, and of course having a 3sum,) at first thought I laughed and thought to myself, he's just saying this to appear open minded, this isn't really something he wants for us or for our relationship, especially after the lives he and I both had. So basically I disregarded what he was saying (big mistake on my part) Soon after we moved in together, he began hinting for that 3sum, knowing that was a painful part of my past, that I had done it for an old b/f years ago with catastrophic results, I was humiliated, embarrassed, my self esteem was lower then shit. He pushed and pushed, he yelled at me cause I didn't want to do that again in my life and that it wasn't something I wanted to do years ago, that I only did it to make my b/f happy, and how he hurt me with it, all Ric could say was how he must be the better man cause I gave him something that I wont do for him, how he felt cheated out of something that was "rightfully" his, how he's paying for some other ass holes mistake, and that if I wasn't made to be humiliated and etc, if it was handled better then I might be more ok with it now, needless to say, he yelled his views as I cried and attempted to explain that I didn't want it back then and don't want it now , that the thought of loosing his respect would kill me, kill us. Nothing I could say or do would make him understand that I ONLY wanted HIM, and that if he truly loved me, that in my mind & heart that he should only want me, that did nothing, after an argument that carried over to the outside and he yelled at me that he was going to have his fantasies even if it meant leaving me and going back where he's from to find someone else that "thought like him" and that would want "what he wanted", I knew I had NO CHOICE but to give him what he wanted, even though he knew it was hurting me, so eventually I gave in after 10 months of on and off again yelling and fighting over him wanting a 3sum so he could be the better man, I finally gave in and did it, I came away with the same feelings of years ago, he however had not one thought as to what it was doing to me, he enjoyed what he got, I enjoyed knowing that he finally got what he wanted so badly, so in my "crazy" state of mind, I set up another 3sum but this time on my terms, I wanted him to sit and watch as I gave the man what I only give him, (less the kissing) let me tell you he didn't like it at all, he saw for the first time what he had done to me, what he was giving away, well his change of heart at not wanting to share me and have a normal marriage only lasted 2 or 3 days, and then he was back on the swinging kick, he learned no lasting heart lessons. I wanted him to get a real good look at what he has now and that after his 22 years of begging his x wife for meaningless unsatisfying sex was not what he really wanted for us. But like I said, his change of heart didn't last for long, he still see's no harm in fucking other people for fun as harmful to us, that touching someone else is not wrong to him, well he can't see or comprehend that for US as a unit when I want nothing to do with touching or having sex with someone other then the man I promised myself to, that for us it is wrong and harmful. You can take and make any opinion from what I've tried to explain and come to your own conclusion, but remember the posting "Sad Sight" in this forum and think how many women out there are doing this for their husbands or SO's, when talking and communicating does no good to open their eyes that this may not be the lifestyle for them, that this fantasy may not be what they really want, that it's not healthy to live this way when one person can't. thanks.
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