Needing advice about MFM

[KYCpl]

Ok, guys and gals, we’re needing your expertise here. First some background. I’m 32, she’s 39 and have been married for almost 5 years. Our marriage is rock solid, and our communication skills have been magnified many times over due to discussing swinging. Neither of us has any complaints and both feel our marriage is strong enough to handle anything that gets thrown at it. We brought a mutual male friend into our relationship a few months back. Mostly it was kissing, rubbing under the table and one hot make-out session ending with him performing oral sex on her while I was standing behind her kissing and rubbing. Some unknown feelings popped up from me a few days later, and due to the stress it was causing on me, we called it quits. We discussed what caused these feelings, and found out they were my insecurities and how to work through them. So, after many, many discussions and reassurances, we decided to give it another shot with him.

We had another hot make out session with the three of us kissing, and then I excused myself while she gave him a blowjob and he performed oral sex on her again. Everything’s fine. We’re planning and hoping to have a motel room this weekend for a full sex threesome, as this is my wife’s fantasy as it is mine. Here’s where the problems are rising.

During the first makeout session, in the beginning, I couldn’t see anything due to the darkness. She thought I could, so she didn’t change anything. That’s when I asked to join them, and then I was fine with everything. I didn't blame her for this because I knew it wasn't her fault because she could see me. So, for the second session, I kept drilling into her head, “I must see everything”. So, needless to say, even though I could see everything the second time and enjoyed it, she was paranoid the entire time that I couldn’t see and really couldn’t get into it. That makes me feel bad.

Also, I’m afraid that if I just sit and watch them having sex, and the guy goes for hours, I’ll feel left out just watching and jacking. We’ve tried searching and reading here for scenarios, etc for MFM, but the only things we can find is doggie-style with one on each end. Not too comfy for a position for long periods. Plus, if we swap, he’ll be wearing a condom, so oral on him won’t taste very good. My wife has no problems whatsoever of me being involved and wants me involved, but we just don’t know how. I want to give them some “alone” time while I watch to just enjoy each other, but I want to be included too. If I’m watching, the only thing I can think of doing is to ask “Can I join in”, but to me, that feels like I’m asking permission to sleep with my wife. Apparently, I’ve started drilling things again with this weekend of me being involved because she’s stressing and not wanting to go through with it because she says she’ll be worrying the whole time if I’m feeling left out.

We’re honestly trying to make this to where nobody has regrets afterwards and enjoys themselves fully during. What can we do? We’re not looking necessarily for just positions, but of how everyone can be involved and how to “get” involved if someone’s watching without just jumping onto the bed or pushing the other person off. To us, this could be a wonderful, sexy experience if everything goes well. We're not wanting to have this choreographed down to the positions, times, etc, but just have some ideas of what works. We want to just let it flow naturally. Also, she has always looked at sex and between two people, and now with it involving three, she doesn’t want to come out of it feeling like a slut.

KYCpl

[taomaster]

Originally Posted by KYCpl

So, needless to say, even though I could see everything the second time and enjoyed it, she was paranoid the entire time that I couldn’t see and really couldn’t get into it. That makes me feel bad.

I totally sympathise. It's hard to relax and enjoy yourself if either of you are worrying.

Originally Posted by KYCpl

Also, I’m afraid that if I just sit and watch them having sex, and the guy goes for hours, I’ll feel left out just watching and jacking..

Yep. That can indeed happen. Been there, done that. (Well actually just watched. Until I got bored and went down to the bar in the club.)

Here's what we found out after some trial and error: 90% of single men are just interested in having fun with a woman (in this case your partner). They're not really interested in a true MFM which, in my book, is two men working together to please a woman.

So if an MFM is really what you want then pick and choose carefully. If you can find the right guy she'll be a very happy camper (if the grin on Mrs. T's face has been anything to go by).

On the other hand if all you want is to create space for the woman in the couple to have extra fun then you might want to consider the following options:

A) Sticking to couples where there is a swap so you're not left out

B) Finding a man you can 'trust' and give her some private space to get on with it

C) Get clear ahead of time that you're there to watch and don't expect to participate. Find out if it's OK for you to head out the kitchen or whatever if you get bored. Talk about things ahead of time.

Just my 2p. Good luck!

[a_couple_in_pa]

Kudos to you for your communication. But remember to not over analyze and put undue pressure among yourselves.

Originally Posted by KYCpl

So, for the second session, I kept drilling into her head, “I must see everything”.

Don't drill. That's not going to make things comfortable. But you probably already know that.

Also, I’m afraid that if I just sit and watch them having sex, and the guy goes for hours, I’ll feel left out just watching and jacking.

Not likely. Most guys aren't superman. She should be in tune to you as well. If she sees you sitting there becomming lonely, she should call you in.

We’ve tried searching and reading here for scenarios, etc for MFM, but the only things we can find is doggie-style with one on each end. Not too comfy for a position for long periods.

Gosh no. Ever rent porn movies? There are all sorts of positions (assuming the men aren't homophobic and afraid of comming in close proximity to each other)

Plus, if we swap, he’ll be wearing a condom, so oral on him won’t taste very good.

The price to pay for being responsible. Maybe try flavored condoms. Or non lubed ones. Definately not ones with spermicide. Also, you'll want plenty of condoms on hand. If you're doing lots of switching or a marathon session, you'll need them.

I want to give them some “alone” time while I watch to just enjoy each other, but I want to be included too. If I’m watching, the only thing I can think of doing is to ask “Can I join in”, but to me, that feels like I’m asking permission to sleep with my wife.

Communicate this to her. She should know not to leave you there un involved. You shouldn't have to ask to join in. And if you're lonely, just go join. Everyone knows this is the ultimate goal anyway... right?

We’re honestly trying to make this to where nobody has regrets afterwards and enjoys themselves fully during. What can we do?

Just go with the flow. Let things happen naturally.

We’re not looking necessarily for just positions, but of how everyone can be involved and how to “get” involved if someone’s watching without just jumping onto the bed or pushing the other person off.

Pushing someone off is a little drastic. Just go jump on the bed and lend a helping hand. Kiss, caress, rub, fondle, etc. See where it takes things.

[KYCpl]

Originally Posted by taomaster

Here's what we found out after some trial and error: 90% of single men are just interested in having fun with a woman (in this case your partner). They're not really interested in a true MFM which, in my book, is two men working together to please a woman.

So if an MFM is really what you want then pick and choose carefully. If you can find the right guy she'll be a very happy camper (if the grin on Mrs. T's face has been anything to go by).

On the other hand if all you want is to create space for the woman in the couple to have extra fun then you might want to consider the following options:

A) Sticking to couples where there is a swap so you're not left out

B) Finding a man you can 'trust' and give her some private space to get on with it

C) Get clear ahead of time that you're there to watch and don't expect to participate. Find out if it's OK for you to head out the kitchen or whatever if you get bored. Talk about things ahead of time.

Just my 2p. Good luck!

A. Right now, a couple isn't what we're looking for. Not to say in the future it won't happen, but for now, we think concentrating on one person at a time is what's best for us.

B and C. Leaving the room is not what either of us is looking for. We're wanting this to be "our" experience, just not one-sided. I definitely want to watch her getting pleased by him, but I'm definitely not into just sitting and watching for the entire time. Some, yes, but not for the entire duration. Even though the other man is self-conscious about him and me touching, he knows that it's going to happen when we're close. I've reassured him if I touch him, it's purely by accident. He's ok with all of this.

For couples that has had a person who leaves to watch and then join back in, how do you do it? Do you say something? Do you just squeeze back into bed? Like I said, she wants me there, to be watching, rubbing, her pleasuring both of us, etc. Maybe I'm just putting too much thought into it, but I'm a planner. My personality makes me think of possible scenarios and how I/we would react in everything we do, not just this. Thanks for your advice though. It's appreciated!

KYCpl

[KYCpl]

Well, I have the tendency to over-analyze everything I do. For example, when we just bought a new digital camera, I had to research, research, and more research every option, user's opinions, etc until I made the decision. That's just my personality. Sometimes this is good, but in this case, it's not. We're dealing with that.

I don't consciously drill it into her. In my mind, I'm just telling her, but in reality, I've repeated it 10-15 times. Again, we're dealing with that.

As far as all the positions in porns, that's not really appealing to me and probably her. In porns, the woman is usually just a pawn to be used and abused. I think that's what she meant by not coming out of it feeling like a slut. (Please nobody take offense to that statement).

Basically, I never thought I could interrupt them if I felt uncomfortable, but I did on the first make-out session. I think I would do the same on this time, but I'm just scared that I won't and then have bad feelings afterwards. I know this would be MY fault and not her's, but I don't want either of us to have bad feelings.

Thanks for the tips on flavored condoms...never really thought about it.

I know this will probably go smoothly, with the normal awkwardness, but I just have a tendency to over-analyze and stress over the little things. Like I said earlier, we both think this could be a wonderful experience for all involved. She'll probably write some tonight with her thoughts after she gets home. All advice is appreciated and any other will be also.

KYCpl

[taomaster]

Originally Posted by KYCpl

Well, I have the tendency to over-analyze everything I do.

That's probably a good self-awareness to have. Of course orgasmic energy tends to defy analysis and might flow better if you just relax a bit

Best of luck to you both!

[TNT]

OKay...let's see what we can do to help you two out

First of all RELAX...I know, easier said than done, especially when exploring a new situation.

To get the evening started I would suggest a nice dinner and maybe a couple of drinks. Not to many as you want to be able to enjoy and remember the evening. Once you get to the room, have your wife change into something sexy, sit on the bed and chat for a while getting comfortable with each other and if necessary going over any rules that you two have and asking him if there is anything that is off limits to him. Communication is very important when it comes to making sure everyone has a good time.

For your lighting, I would leave at least one bedside lamp on. I personally am not much into bright lights, but I do want a little light so I can see and be seen. I also like a little back ground music...nothing to loud but just something to listen to, either a music channel on the t.v. or the radio going.

Getting the action going is a little tougher, so I will just tell you how we usually do it. The other man and I will usually lay on the bed and start touching and feeling, sometimes the man is still totally dressed and sometimes not. Ted will either sit on the side of the bed and/or lay down with me in the middle of both men. I usually start by unwrapping the other man, by slowing taking his clothes off and just enjoying myself as I go. Ted will either watch or will rub and touch me while I do this. There is nothing that says you have to totally watch , it's your wife, you should be able to touch her anytime you want. When Ted is just watching and he is ready to join in, he just joins...either by pulling me up for a kiss or by placing one of his body parts close enough for me to start kissing him. If your watching and can't see exactly what you want to be able to see, then get up and move to a spot where you have a better view.

Definitely have plenty of condoms on hand. As mentioned the flavored ones work really good for oral if you insist on condoms for oral. There are numerous positions that three people can get into, use your imagination. Porn movies are good for ideas as well as reading over some of the stories here on the board for ideas.

There should be no reason why your wife should feel like a slut...Goddess maybe , but never slut (ok, sometimes it's good to feel that way too, but only if she wants to )...as long as she is being treated right and enjoying what is going on she should feel great afterwards.

Don't over plan, just let things progress naturally.

Hope that helps and good luck ! Please come back after your playdate and let us know how it went.

Teresa

[Vespertine]

Originally Posted by taomaster

Here's what we found out after some trial and error: 90% of single men are just interested in having fun with a woman (in this case your partner). They're not really interested in a true MFM which, in my book, is two men working together to please a woman.

So if an MFM is really what you want then pick and choose carefully. If you can find the right guy she'll be a very happy camper (if the grin on Mrs. T's face has been anything to go by).

I think taomaster brings up an important point.

During a MFM, the woman should be the center of attention. Both men need to know how to 'perform together' for the woman's pleasure, for it to be a truly wonderful experience. Both men's focus should be on the woman at all times.

If the guys are just taking turns and watching, it's not quite as fun as when they're both participating. This could leave your wife worried that she's spending too much time with one guy and distract her from really enjoying herself. It's difficult to concentrate on pleasing two men at once.

My first MFM was a horrible experience because the men were so nervous about touching eachother. Their only focus was their individual pleasure, rather then making it a team event. It made the experience awkward and too much work for me.

There's lots of pleasurable things one man can do to the woman while the other man is having sex with her. For instance, sit behind your wife and have her lay back on you while she's having sex (misionary position) with the other man. You can rub her breasts, run your fingers through her hair, talk to her: tell her how sexy she looks. She can orally please you if she turns around and changes position.

I'm sure you get the idea.

[TNT]

I'm going to shamelessly plug one of my stories...it actually happened and is the way most of our MFM threesomes play out.

Originally Posted by Vespertine

During a MFM, the woman should be the center of attention. Both men need to know how to 'perform together' for the woman's pleasure, for it to be a truly wonderful experience. Both men's focus should be on the woman at all times.

Totally agree with this 100%...once you relax and allow yourself to be the center of attention without worrying about pleasing both men at the same time it makes MFM threesomes GREAT!

Oh...here's the link to the story I wanted you to read.


Teresa

[Just_us49]

Well you've heard a ton of good advice already but I might add a few thoughts:

Our first MMF wasn't really that great either mainly because the guy, although sincerely wanting to please M, didn't listen real well when told what it would take. Not that we gave him instructions, but if a woman says things like "do that only softer" for instance I'm going to listen. So that was our first experience.

After that I was a bit like you in that I wanted to be certain everyone was on the same page and had a clear expectation of how we all saw it happening.

My first and foremost concern was that my wife would have a fantastic time. I did some "drilling", but mine was drilling into my wife I was OK with her and another man and the only way I would be dissapointed was if she spent too much time worrying about me instead of enjoying herself! I personally didn't have any insecurities to deal with. So I could tell her that and mean it. I realize that's not always the case for everyone. I also knew I wouldn't have any problem commuincating to either of them if I wanted in on the action or needed to take a break or whatever.

I made up my mind I was OK with with other guy naked and we might accidently touch. I made sure he was OK too. IMO if a guy is freaked out about that he might want to reconsider if he's really cut out for MMF.

You made a comment about what if they are going at it forever and you get left out. I would tell them both that was a concern you had and then if I wanted to "take a turn" at something when you were all together I'd let them know in a nice way.

Like others have said we feel it's all about the woman in a MMF. She should feel like a goddess or a slut whichever turns her on.

I like to do a little planning before hand but sometimes it can be fun not to plan at all. But our experience has been better with a bit of planning. Since you know this guy already, you can easily make sure you're all on the same page.

I emailed the guy with all the little tips that I knew would take her over the top from 10+ plus yrs of learning. M knew I was emailing this to him and ageed not to read it.

The end result was she had a hell of a time with two guys that had her pleasure in mind. facelick

-D

[Alura]

KYCpl wrote:

During the first makeout session, in the beginning, I couldn’t see anything due to the darkness.

Here's something I zeroed in on, KYCpl, that would cause me to enjoy the encounter less.

Mrs. Alura and I like the lights on when we play. Our bedroom is equipped with rheostats so we can dim the lights enough to feel relaxed but bright enough that we can see what's happening. I haven't bought a dimmer switch for awhile but it seems they cost around ten dollars at your Home Depot store.

In hotels, consider taking several glass-jar candles and placing them around the room. You can choose from a hundred different aromas, too.

Alura

[curiousagain]

In a MFM, the female is the center of attention and the two guys should work together to give her the most pleasure. There is nothing wrong with anybody verbalizing their desires. It doesn't have to be an order, she can say "I want..." or "time to switch". But usually, just body language is enough. You've got lots of good advice here, especially the part about not over analyzing it and just going with the flow and enjoying the moment.

[WesternSwing]

Wow, that is a great question, and a great explanation of what is going on. It sounds like you have pondered over this quite a bit.

First, let me say that it is your own insecurities (read: jealousy) that are creating the problem. Rest assured that by how worried she seems about you having a good time and her willingness to walk away from it without a fight, shows she is absolutely, positively in love with you and you are her #1. Period.

But the point is that SHE can't have a good time without YOUR permission. And YOU obsessing so much about YOU having a good time at HER party is going to kill any chance of HER having a good time. It is your reaction that will make "her feel like a slut" because she did something "dirty" that upset you. Remember, in jealousy there is more of self-love than love.

MFM is about HER pleasure. Every guy I know that has done a MFM says that he gets his pleasure from watching his wife having a great time. That moment is not about him, it's about her (as one husband told me "just get me a bag of popcorn and a chair and I'll be fine" ). Think of it as a gift you give to your wife - and the best part is you get to reap the rewards afterward . It is about fulfilling her fantasy since she gets to be the center of attention being ravaged by two men. The other guy is the "stunt cock" and should get center stage because he is a major part of the fantasy. You are giving him to your wife. And from what you've said, I don't think she'll leave you out completely.

Look at it this way, a MFM is as much about her as a FMF would be about you. A MFM or a FMF is a completely selfless act on the behalf of the spouse. And as in any swinging situation, it's just a blip in time in your marriage. You'll get lots of her afterward, more than Mr. Stunt Cock could never imagine. Believe me, you shouldn't be jealous of him, he should (and will) be jealous of you for having such a great wife. He gets to go home alone, you get to go home and have even more sex with your wonderful wife.

MFM's are tricky in that you have to pull yourself out of the picture, be completely selfless, and be happy that she is having a great time. Even if he gets more action with your wife than you do at the time, she will give you 10-times more action afterward because you helped her with her fantasy.

Mrs. WS says to me all the time that it is because of me that she can swing. I have allowed her, and encouraged her to be herself and explore her sexuality without feeling guilty. Something her ex's never did, and she loves me even more because of it.

I have to agree with others, maybe swinging with couples is the best way to start. That way you are not left out. It's hard to feel really jealous when you got some too. You can still do MFM with a couple, we have. I've even watched my wife in a FMF with another couple. Of course I get some next , so no feelings of being left-out occur. Everybody has a great time. Then, when you are more comfortable look again at a MFM.

Mr. WS

[KYCpl]

Hi guys
This is the female in kycpl. First and foremost I want to thank everyone for their responses, everyone has made this alot easier for us.
I want to say an extra thank you to WesternSwing...when I read your post I truely thought some how you had gotten into my head and seen everything I was thinking. My hubby emailed me and told me to read it and I am so glad I did. I dont think I could have told him how I felt any better!!!
He is my #1 and the most important thing in my life without a doubt. And as suprised as I am the discussion of swinging has opened us up to a whole new level of communication.
After us reading this and him rereading this I think it has helped him open his eyes some and I feel more comfy about the whole situation in front of us.
Once again thank you all for your help and if you have any other comments we would love for you to share them with us!!!!!


Mrs. Kycpl

[adventureUS2]

Not sure if my perspective will help or not,

In my oppinion sex is not a spectater sport. When we have 3sums no one sets back and watches. The turn on for me and the Mrs. is her taking on two men at the same time. Not one at a time. Same goes for FMF. Not that I would have issues with just watching but, It wouldn't be as much of a turn on as participating.