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Earthsand347

We messed up while at a house party

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We have been dabbling in the lifestyle ever since we started dating 2 years ago. Only full swapped 3 weeks ago. I must admit I've been very stop and go from the beginning. He was a swinger with his ez-wife.

Decided to date a couple. House party after. My guy ended up having sex with the girl from the date. I didn't do anything.

 

Problem : all week he told me over and over I was in the driver's seat and if there was anything I didn't want him or me to do we would stop. At the house party I kept telling him I didn't see anyone I wanted to have sex with. We had clearly discussed before that if I didn't find anyone he would not do anything either. Promised.

However, he was sexed up, said that he asked me if he could have sex with that girl. I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did.

 

I am feeling that he broke the rules. I can't get the images of them out of my head. I think I'm really more of a vanilla mind-set and he definitely is swinger mind-set.

We talked (argued) about this. Yes, I did throw boots at his computer and poured a bottle of champagne down the sink. He hopes I will change my mind. He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women. He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet and he's one of the few who is smart enough to act out on it so it's actually beneficial.

 

Try as I might I cannot separate recreational from emotional sex with my guy. I like the idea of swinging, but when reality hits I just feel bad knowing he's with other women.

 

Do I keep trying? Do I stay in this relationship ? What if I say no to swinging and he does stuff behind my back?

Help. Don't know what to do......

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I see that you are new to the board so I'll say I'm glad that you have joined us.

 

I believe you already know the answer. To suggest that sex with other women is a need like eating or drinking is a manipulation. If you both value your relationship, you will both forget the idea of swinging. It's not for him; it's not for you. Wait, at least, another twenty years before bringing it up again.

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Guest smithvillecoupl
We have been dabbling in the lifestyle ever since we started dating 2 years ago. Only full swapped 3 weeks ago. I must admit I've been very stop and go from the beginning. He was a swinger with his ez-wife.

Decided to date a couple. House party after. My guy ended up having sex with the girl from the date. I didn't do anything.

 

Problem : all week he told me over and over I was in the driver's seat and if there was anything I didn't want him or me to do we would stop. At the house party I kept telling him I didn't see anyone I wanted to have sex with. We had clearly discussed before that if I didn't find anyone he would not do anything either. Promised.

However, he was sexed up, said that he asked me if he could have sex with that girl. I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did.

 

I am feeling that he broke the rules. I can't get the images of them out of my head. I think I'm really more of a vanilla mind-set and he definitely is swinger mind-set.

We talked (argued) about this. Yes, I did throw boots at his computer and poured a bottle of champagne down the sink. He hopes I will change my mind. He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women. He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet and he's one of the few who is smart enough to act out on it so it's actually beneficial.

 

Try as I might I cannot separate recreational from emotional sex with my guy. I like the idea of swinging, but when reality hits I just feel bad knowing he's with other women.

 

Do I keep trying? Do I stay in this relationship ? What if I say no to swinging and he does stuff behind my back?

Help. Don't know what to do......

 

Sounds like pretty poor communication. The bold parts really stand out to me.

 

A one person swap like this sounds like all sorts of trouble. Were you really that drunk that you don't recall him asking? Even though you two were so crystal clear beforehand this somehow was missed? Sounds fishy to me.

 

From reading this, I might suggest a do-over. If you can't remember because you were so wasted, I wouldn't completely blame him, you both went into this so need to share the blame.

 

You both need to communicate, read this together, come to an understanding or agreement. Don't let things fester.

 

This is all my opinion, we're new but trying to do things right so it breaks my heart when I read things like this.

 

Best of luck.

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I echo the sentiment...Welcome and I am sorry. It's not supposed to be like that - SW is right, it's manipulation and not swinging. He took advantage of you while you were less than sober, that's unfair. No gentleman would act that way. The two of you need to continue the open communication that got you here. It sounds like you had a great foundation and this incident has derailed the train. Stop, talk, communicate and don't let yourself be manipulated.

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I would also like to welcome you to the forum, Earthsand347.

 

Before I delve into your post...may I say that I giggled a bit when I read this:

 

He was a swinger with his ez-wife.

 

Hee, easy-wife. ;) I know you meant ex-wife though. Who decided to place the "z" and "x" next to each other?

 

 

With my silliness out of the way, (please forgive me if it bothered you), I'll list the items that upset me about your post.

 

I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did.

 

In my opinion, drinking heavily and swinging don't go well together. You don't have to be a teetotaler but I can't tell you how many times I've seen couples post here about what troubles ensue after they drink heavily while swinging. Rules and boundaries are bent or broken. Safety can be compromised. I don't know if your boyfriend was also drinking heavily (which might be another issue), but if he wasn't, he should have been able to see that you were drunk and not able to make a decision with all of your faculties firing. Not only was he willing to leave you alone drunk (to possibly be taken advantage of by other people) but he was thinking selfishly and not considering the mutual boundary that was created when both of you were clear headed. And I hope this isn't the case, but I certainly hope he wasn't waiting for you to be drunk to ask you if he could have sex with another woman, knowing that you would be more willing to agree while under the influence. My advice to avoid these alcoholic issues is to limit the intake for both of you.

 

He hopes I will change my mind. He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women. He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet...

 

Excuse my language but bullshit. As a boyfriend, as someone who is supposed to love you for who you are, as someone who wants to be in a relationship with you...he shouldn't want you to change, much less change your mind. If he really thinks that having sex with any woman he wants is a given right, he needs to get his head checked. Whether you two are compatible or not, I don't see this type of attitude as being beneficial to a long-term relationship, period, much less a swinging relationship. I'm sure there will be others who disagree with me but I think this is a man who can't keep his dick in his pants and he is trying to justify this actions. Do I believe that everyone is either monogamous or non-monogamous? No. But there's a healthy, loving conducive way of being in a relationship and being non-monogamous at the same time.

 

Other items that bothered me:

 

1. If I understand correctly, the first swap wasn't really a couple swap? He swapped but you didn't? This is often a reason why I am a big supporter of equal swap as the first experience. Both halves of a couple can see their partner engaged with someone else but also have their own fun. Then they can discuss the experience together on a more equal footing.

 

2. You both are in a relatively young relationship and swinging from the very start. Many on the forum advise that two people in a new relationship take some time away from the LS to focus on the relationship and each other before adding anyone else into the mix. There are rare exceptions to this but it sounds like you're in the majority and there should have been time to build the foundation of the relationship before testing it. Swinging brings out the cracks in any relationship--young or old. If that foundation isn't solid, it is much more likely to crumble.

 

3. Swinging isn't for everyone. It could be for you but not now. Maybe not with this guy. Maybe not ever. If you feel that you aren't ready or you don't like it, don't try to force yourself to like it because your boyfriend is pressuring you to do so. Swinging is supposed to be fun for both. If it's not fun for one of you, then it shouldn't be done. If he can't "help himself" then his priority list is pretty obvious.

 

4. Trust is pretty important in a relationship. Once it's doubted or broken, it takes a lot of time and effort to rebuild it...and even then, things will never be the same as it was before. If you can't trust your boyfriend, it's not good for you or the relationship. Considering how things seem to be in the 2 years of your relationship, do you think there was much trust to begin with before and after you two started to swing?

 

Whether you decide to stay with him, leave him, continue to swing, discontinue, etc....all of that is up to you. You know the situation much more than we'll ever know. Keep in mind that we are only getting your side and if he were to come here and post, it would probably appear quite differently. Maybe you can invite him to come here, read your thread, and maybe even read other threads. Research together and talk about your feelings, thoughts, fears, etc. openly and honestly. All of my advice and thoughts on the matter could be 100% wrong because we'll never get all of the facts and details so please take my words with a grain of salt. I wish you the best. Please let keep us apprised on your situation.

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I'm going to be, I think, harsher than others who are or will be responding. You were drunk (why? Did you think that would help you find partners? Were you just bored?), you feel like he broke the rules because you didn't see anyone who interested you (would your evening have ended in conflict if you had?) and then dealt with the ensuing conflict by throwing things (and possibly a tantrum). Your picture of yourself isn't very attractive.

 

Your partner, at least as you portray him, sounds manipulative and opportunistic, also not very attractive. Is that a realistic picture? If it is, why are you with him?

 

You say you like the idea of swinging, but also say you cannot separate recreational from emotional sex. I do wonder, though, if that would be true if a) you had your own playmate, or, b) were the center of an MFM. It's not unusual for swinging to not work for a couple because one or the other can't handle their partner with someone else, although they'd be fine with it if they were the only one participating. Do you think that's true for you?

 

In any case, my answer to the question you posed in the title to this thread is both of you.

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"He was a swinger with his ez-wife." = he's already in high gear and impatient with your learning curve.

 

"My guy ended up having sex with the girl from the date. I didn't do anything." - That's not right, especially because you had both agreed to not do this beforehand.

 

"We had clearly discussed before that if I didn't find anyone he would not do anything either. Promised." - promises don't protect you. That's your partner's job. And making a promise you can't (or won't) keep is counter-productive for the health of a relationship...so why did he bother?

 

"However, he was sexed up, said that he asked me if he could have sex with that girl. I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did. " He took advantage of your inebriated state (blaming it on the alcohol...in reverse) and acted selfishly. You drank too much in an attempt to anaesthetize yourself, which basically sets you up for this kind of disaster. He said, she said... I can't see anything good coming out of arguing this one out, so let it go. Everybody screwed up. The best thing you can do here is to own your own mistakes, admit them to one another, recognize that your actions hurt one another, and learn from them.

 

"I am feeling that he broke the rules." - Without question.

 

"I can't get the images of them out of my head." - and sadly, you never will. It happened. It really, really happened. The good news is, you have more control over your reaction to this reality than you think you do. You get to decide whether or not you are going to allow this to hurt you.

 

"I think I'm really more of a vanilla mind-set and he definitely is swinger mind-set. " - That's what it sounds like to me. If you're happy with the vanilla mindset...why change? It's not like you have to.

 

"We talked (argued) about this. Yes, I did throw boots at his computer and poured a bottle of champagne down the sink." - No judgment here. When you get hurt, it's understandable that you would react. It doesn't solve things, I know, but sometimes breaking shit just makes you feel better. I dunno.

 

"He hopes I will change my mind." - Of course he does.

 

"He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women." - Honesty.

 

"He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet and he's one of the few who is smart enough to act out on it so it's actually beneficial." - Okay this is total bullshit. He doesn't seem to get that he can't use logic and reason and good arguments to change your mind, no matter how hard he tries. And even if he could, what he said right here? It's not helping his case AT ALL. Swinging is only beneficial if the couple can make it work together. And this "all guys need an outlet" stuff?? Please! They don't need an outlet any more than women do!

 

"Try as I might I cannot separate recreational from emotional sex with my guy. I like the idea of swinging, but when reality hits I just feel bad knowing he's with other women.' - There's your answer.

 

"Do I keep trying? Do I stay in this relationship ? What if I say no to swinging and he does stuff behind my back?" - Then you need to decide whether you want to stay with him while he works on becoming a better, more honest person, or if you want to cut your losses and move on. That is something only you can decide. I've never met the man, so I have no idea how much work and patience would be involved.

 

Sorry that you're going through this!

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I thank everyone so much for your replies :kissface: I didn't know where else to go - can't really ask my mom about this!

I do want to respond to some comments ...

1. Yes, I was drunk. I drank alcohol because I thought I needed something to help me be more comfortable. First date with a couple. First house party. I was trying to psych myself into having some fun because I've been so sloooow this whole time. I take responsibility for drinking too much.

2. Temper tantrum was next morning. I would not conduct myself that way at the party. The tossing of objects was I think because I really must be more vanilla and am not easy with the idea of him having sex with somebody else.

And he had sex without my being in the room even though we had set out beforehand that we would be full swap, same room.

(The images I talked about before are from his descriptions and I did see them making out prior to.)

3. Interestingly, I am not totally ready to throw it all away though. Wondering how/if I can get to a comfortable place.

Maybe he's not the right person who can give me enough space given his urges and me possibly possibly saying no to the whole thing.

Will he be satisfied enough?

I'm worried.

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P.S. Don't want to throw the swinging away maybe mainly because I don't want to lose him. Sad, eh?

P.P.S. EZ wife :lol: - a slip. Or was it? I didn't even realize it!

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Welcome! You have received loads of great advice so far, so I won't add to it in detail other than a few things I see as key.

 

"guys need an outlet" - bullfuckingshit. If that is his reason for swinging, then swinging will never work long-term for him. When I say work, I mean as something that a couple does together to enrich THEIR relationship. I'm guessing he has a different definition of "working for him", but over time, I think I will be proven right. In fact, I think I have already been proven right twice. Whether he can turn that attitude around at this point is up to him. Personally, I doubt it that will come for a good long time, if ever.

 

The other thing is in reading your posts, I think you maybe do have some swinger in you. Whether you do or you don't is totally ok, and I bring that up just to say there is no time limit on how long it takes to truly answer that question for yourself. It may come with him soon, or may come years from now with him or in a different relationship. Don't try to force it, if the seed is indeed there and the conditions are right, you will feel it growing on its own. Even if it is there, a stable, loving, trusting relationship is what it takes for it to grow though, so I will leave it up to you to decide if those conditions are present.

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If you are '...not totally ready to throw it all away', then first, TALK and come to an agreement, then give him another chance. But REMEMBER, once is an accident, twice is an ON PURPOSE. I HATE where you said '...given his urges', BULLSHIT! He wants to therefore he should be allowed? He can't control his urges? Red flag! If my SO said she wanted to walk away from this, I wouldn't hesitate a SECOND before turning my back and leaving this behind. She is SO MUCH MORE important than any 'fun and games'. This is an enhancement, a magnifier if you will, of our relationship but this is most certainly not a key part. It's sprinkles on our ice cream and that's all. It already sounds like he is willing to give up on you before he gives up on having sex with other women, 'given his urges' (ugg!).

 

I wish you the best and I'm not trying to be hard or difficult on you, but sometimes I am just disgusted with the things other men say to manipulate and force others to let them have 'their' way. Realize that more than likely you will have to deal with this the rest of the time you are with him. Will you ever be able to really TRUST him (given his urges)? Reminds me of elementary school and I think he still has some growing up to do.

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Let me just say I might be a little too frank and if so I’m just trying to express my thoughts on what you said. I didn’t understand exactly what you meant when you said you went on a date to a swinger’s party. Did you go with another couple or were you talking about you and your boyfriend going to the party?

 

Anyway you went to a swinger’s party knowing what went on at these things. You just agreed to go and play it by ear as to actually playing or not. That’s understandable and really I think that’s what a majority of folks do. Now you say that you got so drunk that you don’t remember if he asked you if it was alright if he had sex with this gal or not. But you weren’t so drunk that the sight of him having sex with this gal really pissed you off.

 

Now I don’t mean to blow my choirboy image but there have been a few times in my past life that I’ve been floor crawling, moon howling – commode hugging drunk. While there are some things I might not remember verbatim while in that condition I’ve never been drunk enough not to remember important things that happened. Like if my wife would have come up to me and said something to the effect of, hon you look like you’re having so much fun crawling around down there on the floor I’ll be right back I’m going to go fuck this swinging dick I just met if you don’t mind.

 

I think you remember him asking you if it was alright and I think you probably told him that thing that women have been telling men forever, something to the effect of “do what you what to do I don’t care”. Now I’ve learned through years of marriage that is female code for if you do there will be hell to pay for it tomorrow and most likely for the next few weeks minimum.

 

There are two things that you must have in any relationship to make it work. First you have to be open and honest with each other. Say what you mean and mean what you say. You don’t agree to something just to put off an argument because the other party wants to do it. Second you have to come to grips with the fact that you’re not going to change the other person from who they really are. You either deal with who they are and change to conform to them or go you separate ways. We have no control over what turns us on sexually. We might control those urges but the fact is those urges are still there even if they aren’t acted on.

 

As you have been told in this thread swinging isn’t for everybody. Honesty in a relationship starts with you. You have to be honest with yourself as to whether or not you really want to explore this lifestyle or not. There is no right or wrong answer there is only your answer. From what it sounds like to me from what you’ve said this wasn’t something that you came up with. The question at hand is it something that you can compromise on and learn to enjoy or not. If it’s something that you find the thought of sexually exciting that’s fine, if it’s something you find as exciting as a root canal that’s fine too.

 

I guess my question for you would be is this something that you would really like to explore because you find the idea of it sexually exciting or is it something that you are not into and trying to figure out how to deal with a boyfriend that is into it? We’re not going to try to talk you into or out of anything. If you tell us how you honestly feel we will answer any question you might have. Don’t ask what you think we want to hear ask what you really want to know.

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He a was swinger before he met you and you want to be with him. I would reconsider being a swinger if I were you. He is what he is and you can not change him. It is unfair to ask him to change to be with you if you knew that going in that he was a swinger. You thought you could handle it but you can't. Its OK not wanting to swing you are just different. I doubt from your post that he will make you happy and I bet you wont be happy swinging. This is just my take on it. I could be way wrong. Good luck and I hope the best for you.

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We have been dabbling in the lifestyle ever since we started dating 2 years ago.

 

This to me is the biggest issue here. He's already of a lifestyle mindset, you are not. Two years of dating isn't that long a time. You might well be "swinger material" but what you are not is comfortable and confident in your own relationship yet.

 

I see really two types of honest, successful swingers.

 

Type 1, are those who are 100% comfortable in their relationships. They don't worry about him/her leaving for someone else. They know each other inside and out.

 

Type 2, they just don't give a shit. They just want to have their fun and are not worried about losing their other half because they don't really care if they do.

 

Since you are not 100% comfortable in your relationship and you DO give a shit, this leads to the drama. As a former swinger its a lot easier to feel ok with "swing mode" with a new partner. I think a lot of people who were swingers with past partners are so worried that their new one won't be ok with it, that they push it too early for some.

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1. Yes, I was drunk. I drank alcohol because I thought I needed something to help me be more comfortable. First date with a couple. First house party. I was trying to psych myself into having some fun because I've been so sloooow this whole time. I take responsibility for drinking too much.

 

I find this concerning for a lot of reasons. First, I suppose I have a real issue with disinhibiting with alcohol, but when you combine it with trying to overcome something you've been edging into for two years, I worry. A lot. If swinging isn't something you could or would do sober, it really isn't for you. Which I think you must know on some level, or you wouldn't have said this:

 

The tossing of objects was I think because I really must be more vanilla and am not easy with the idea of him having sex with somebody else.

 

They don't hand out merit badges for open-mindedness. If it's not okay with you, then extra-curricular sex doesn't belong in your relationship. There's no need to try to overcome that.

 

Finally, this one?:

 

Interestingly, I am not totally ready to throw it all away though. Wondering how/if I can get to a comfortable place.

Maybe he's not the right person who can give me enough space given his urges and me possibly possibly saying no to the whole thing.

Will he be satisfied enough?

I'm worried.

 

I'd worry too. The urge thing is just bullshit. Furthermore, it's bullshit slung around to excuse poor behavior and a not at all attractive greediness. Toddlers aren't satisfied with compromise and he and his urges sound a lot like toddlers' logic, so he probably won't be satisfied enough. That's not really something you can fix, nor does it have anything to do with you. Nor - and I think this is key - will his theoretical dissatisfaction be eased by swinging, even if you eventually decided it was something you wanted to do. Again, it wouldn't have anything to do with you nor would appeasement be a useful strategy.

 

If you've been trying to swing in some fashion for the entire time you've been together and it hasn't worked for you, I'm guessing it's because some part of you knows your relationship isn't stable or supportive enough for the high risk activity that swinging can be. If it was, you'd be in a comfortable place, either sure you would eventually like to try swinging or equally certain that, however attractive it was in thought, it wasn't for you.

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P.S. Don't want to throw the swinging away maybe mainly because I don't want to lose him. Sad, eh?

P.P.S. EZ wife :lol: - a slip. Or was it? I didn't even realize it!

 

Really? You want to push yourself to be someone you are not?

 

Okay, then get with some guy, your choice, on your own, just like he did. Go find the guy in a bar, at a party you go to as a single, online craigslist, where ever. Bang one out with some random guy you just met and tell your bf you are trying to swing and see if you can really do this or if maybe it ain't gonna work.

 

Can you even imagine yourself doing that? What did you just learn thinking about it?

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1. I know I can't change him. Accepted.:whitefl2:

2. He and his EZ (Ex LOL) wife had a LOT of swinging experience for, say, 3 years or so. I say to him, "Can you be grateful and satisfied for what you got in the past? You got a lot more sex with other people than the majority of the population."

He admits "I want to have sex with other women" as in the future.

3. I find myself looking out of the corner of my eye to see if he's not just looking at other women, but is he seriously thinking he could have sex with other women. In casual conversation if he sees a pretty lady in a couple, he'll sometimes ask, "Do you think they're swingers?"

So, I'm a little paranoid.

Trying to deal.

Thanks soooooo much for your comments!

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The key to successful swinging, as I see it, is honest communication and the understanding that your relationship with each other is the prime objective.

 

In other words, "Honey, I'm just not ready for swinging, and the thought of you with another woman makes my stomach roil and not in a good way."

His response should be "I understand, I value our relationship above all else and I am willing to set aside this part of my life in order to make our relationship strong and successful."

 

I don't see that happening from everything you've written so far.

 

So let me ask you: How long can you live with this paranoia? How will you feel in 6 months, 2 years, 10 years, constantly wondering and worrying? That's a seriously good recipe to drive yourself insane.

I'm a big fan of lists. So make yourself a list, at the very top of the con side is "He's not willing to give up casual sex with other women" List all the pro's, put them on your mental scale, and see if the pro's outweigh the con's.

 

Life is way too short to be with someone who is not only on a different page, but living their life by an entirely different book.

 

That honest communication isn't just with your partner, it's with yourself. Why are you so keen to keep him? Fear of being alone, being a failure at relationships, whatever, but ask yourself that question and be honest with your answer.

 

Also if you go to any more swinging events, I strongly encourage you to go sober. :)

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1. I know I can't change him. Accepted.:whitefl2:

2. He and his EZ (Ex LOL) wife had a LOT of swinging experience for, say, 3 years or so. I say to him, "Can you be grateful and satisfied for what you got in the past? You got a lot more sex with other people than the majority of the population."

He admits "I want to have sex with other women" as in the future.

3. I find myself looking out of the corner of my eye to see if he's not just looking at other women, but is he seriously thinking he could have sex with other women. In casual conversation if he sees a pretty lady in a couple, he'll sometimes ask, "Do you think they're swingers?"

So, I'm a little paranoid.

Trying to deal.

Thanks soooooo much for your comments!

 

With all of the items you listed, these all felt like normal swinger responses. I, the female half of Sunbuckus, often ask Mr. Sun if he thinks a certain couple is (are? I can't figure it out right now for some reason) swingers. I can tell you for a fact that if I heard Mr. Sun say any of these things when we were young in our relationship, I would have felt that we were incompatible because I was intensely jealous and thought that being in a serious relationship meant being monogamous.

 

I don't have a very high opinion of your boyfriend in regards to your side of the situation, but I believe someone above me wrote about how he also has a "head start" on the swinger "mindset". That doesn't excuse his behavior but sometimes people get into selfish-mode and it can be hard to stop and think about how their actions are affecting those around them. Maybe this is the case for him or maybe he is just in this mode all the time, which might explain why he has an ex-wife.

 

My humble opinion is that right now, in this situation, in this relationship, the conditions aren't optimal to help foster a trust and ease into the LS. There seems to be a lack of trust, a lack of respect, a lack of communication, and a lot of insecurity floating around. If your boyfriend isn't able to stop and solidify the relationship before engaging in any future swinging activities (and this "break" might take years or forever) then I can't see you two being compatible. Clearly, you are the person who moves at the slowest pace and if your boyfriend can't move at that pace...then something has to give and that might be the relationship.

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He hopes I will change my mind. He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women. He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet and he's one of the few who is smart enough to act out on it so it's actually beneficial.

 

Regardless of anything else he's told you this is his true motivation and if it doesn't fit in with your worldview it's time to move on.

 

Otherwise the pressure to swing will never stop.

 

Swinging is like having your cake and eating it too. If you really love someone it's relatively easy to stop but if you don't really love them it's all about your own wants/needs/mindset! Exactly what he is expressing!

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With all of the items you listed, these all felt like normal swinger responses. I, the female half of Sunbuckus, often ask Mr. Sun if he thinks a certain couple is (are? I can't figure it out right now for some reason) swingers. I can tell you for a fact that if I heard Mr. Sun say any of these things when we were young in our relationship, I would have felt that we were incompatible because I was intensely jealous and thought that being in a serious relationship meant being monogamous.

 

I don't have a very high opinion of your boyfriend in regards to your side of the situation, but I believe someone above me wrote about how he also has a "head start" on the swinger "mindset". That doesn't excuse his behavior but sometimes people get into selfish-mode and it can be hard to stop and think about how their actions are affecting those around them. Maybe this is the case for him or maybe he is just in this mode all the time, which might explain why he has an ex-wife.

 

My humble opinion is that right now, in this situation, in this relationship, the conditions aren't optimal to help foster a trust and ease into the LS. There seems to be a lack of trust, a lack of respect, a lack of communication, and a lot of insecurity floating around. If your boyfriend isn't able to stop and solidify the relationship before engaging in any future swinging activities (and this "break" might take years or forever) then I can't see you two being compatible. Clearly, you are the person who moves at the slowest pace and if your boyfriend can't move at that pace...then something has to give and that might be the relationship.

 

Excellent post by Sunbuckus, particularly the last paragraph. I can only second what she said.

 

...the pressure to swing will never stop.

 

Swinging is like having your cake and eating it too. If you really love someone it's relatively easy to stop but if you don't really love them it's all about your own wants/needs/mindset! Exactly what he is expressing!

 

And I also like what Gordo wrote here. There are a few different kinds of swingers. First are the bad-news type we all know about, the ones who are doing it dysfunctionally in an attempt to "fix" a broken relationship, relieve sexual boredom, etc. Then there are the type who just love one another so much, have such an abundance of sexual energy, have a deep desire for one another's fulfillment and happiness - regardless where it comes from - and (for lack of a better term) worship one another to the point where they see it as almost criminal to lock each other up and throw away the key. I like to think Mr. intuition and I fall into this category. He's so awesome. I have no desire to turn a wolf into a housepet; I want him to be the untamed thing he was designed to be, the one I was attracted to when we first started dating. The third type, as I see it, is something of a hybrid. It's not that they're evil or anything like that, they just make their terms known and do not apologize for them: "I will have sex with other people. Nothing personal, but you won't be my one and only. Take it or leave it." When they find another person who is of like mind, they're a fully functioning couple. They might even love one another, but there's a certain tenderness that seems to be missing. The reason for this is simple: they choose their own wants and happiness over the needs and happiness of their spouse/partner. If you're okay with living with someone like this, we don't judge you for it. Logically, we just can't see it working out. Your energies are unequal and are going in opposite directions.

 

Now...that said, I don't agree that you'll "never" be a swinger. Anything is possible given enough patience, support and love to allow you to explore the idea safely and confidently. It's quite a lot of fun to redefine sex and marriage and what constitutes a "successful" relationship, while telling society to stuff it because it's none of their business. You get to make the rules, no holds barred. And the spectrum ranges from mild to wild. Pretty cool, actually.

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Thanks again for so many replies which I've read over and over again trying to learn.

 

Because of them I got the strength to talk to him again last night about what it all meant. He said that he would probably have a hard time if I said no because he would be missing out on "having it all," missing out on having the maximum amount of fun he could have.

He also said that he thought I might be giving up on it too early because I hadn't had a chance to have a great sexual experience yet.

 

I'm a little confused. :confused:

But, something great for me still means he gets to have sex with other women which I am not comfortable with .

 

Wondering if his responses are just him trying to talk me into something he wants

OR

if all swingers go through what I'm going through early on and you get over it ...

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Whether you get over it or not is not important. He is telling you that his needs are paramount. And you are not comfortable with that.

 

In swinging you only go as fast as the slowest partner and if that means you never get there oh well!

 

Honestly it's time to move on.

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. . . OR

if all swingers go through what I'm going through early on and you get over it ...

My wife and I know very many swing couples and none speak of this kind of beginning.

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Wondering if his responses are just him trying to talk me into something he wants

OR

if all swingers go through what I'm going through early on and you get over it ...

 

Swinging was something I wanted to try when we started BUT I made sure it was something my wife wanted to try before I did anything in that direction.

 

I truly believe that "once a swinger always a swinger" has some validity to it, but "once a swinger, always swinging" does not. He needs to go at your pace for YOU, and it seems based on your points hes trying to get you to his pace for him. You may come to find you end up really enjoying it, but its not fair to expect to start out at full speed.

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Is there a way for you to bring your boyfriend here to read your post and share his thoughts (and read what the forum has to offer)?

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I truly believe that "once a swinger always a swinger" has some validity to it, but "once a swinger, always swinging" does not. He needs to go at your pace for YOU, and it seems based on your points hes trying to get you to his pace for him. You may come to find you end up really enjoying it, but its not fair to expect to start out at full speed.

 

Exaaaactly. Swinging is just the thing that is bringing out the truth; it's not the problem itself. The real problem is the truth, which is that - as Gordo said - his needs are paramount. Your needs come second. On this point he is seemingly unwilling to negotiate. The only question you have to answer is: are you okay with that? If you're not, you have a decision to make. It's true, it's hard to go back to vanilla once you see what life is like beyond the self-made fences, but it should be understood that it's not something that should rule one's life. Your desire to fuck other people should be easy to put on a shelf if you know it's going to make your spouse miserable! Who does that!?

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Wondering if his responses are just him trying to talk me into something he wants

OR

if all swingers go through what I'm going through early on and you get over it ...

 

Yes to the first and certainly not to the second.

 

To expand a little, he's trying to sell you on something he wants. The best sell is when you're selling something the other person wants, because then it's just a matter of negotiating price. When you're trying to sell something the other person does not want, then it's time for the classic sleazy sales tactics. And, yes, I think your SO is employing classic sleazy sales tactics, as well as completely ignoring your needs. In a way, I feel for him a little bit, because you've been sorta-kinda-a little on board with the whole swinging thing for the duration of your relationship, which probably makes his manipulation seem like an appropriate response (although part of me suspects that he's been manipulating you all along, which is why you've never gotten to a yes or no to swinging, when you're clearly not comfortable with the idea).

 

It's not unheard of for couples to start with some fairly tight restrictions (oral only, no kissing), due to discomfort with certain forms of intimacy, nor is it unusual for there to be the occasional moment of unease or even jealousy, but all the things you describe aren't normal states of discomfort. Instead, you're not comfortable with having your partner have sex with other women. With most of us, that would have ended the conversation.

 

Finally, it's only okay for very small children think they can have it all. Fortunately, they're talking about toys or cookies and they're not all that difficult to train into some sense of understanding for the needs of others. If that persists into adulthood, it's not a good sign.

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Just wanted to respond to tahoecpl's entry.

I do not remember him asking me if it was OK.

I did see them kissing early on.

I actually did not ever see him have sex with her. He told me about it afterward. In fact, I was saying bye to her, "maybe we can get together," nicey-nice sort of stuff at the end of the house party not realizing what had happened.

 

Not seeing him have sex made it worse for me - it was not just each of us having sex with someone else, not just one of us having sex, but one of us having sex when the other wasn't there.

 

I just don't want to be blamed in the future for the reason that "we" stopped the swinging experience.

And I don't want to think that he would sneak around to get what he wants.

 

Thanks again for all your replies. Can't tell you how appreciative I am for every single reply :)

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Not seeing him have sex made it worse for me - it was not just each of us having sex with someone else, not just one of us having sex, but one of us having sex when the other wasn't there.

 

To my mind, that is what is wrong both with what he did and with what he is doing.

 

Swinging is a thing a couple does together. Maybe not physically together, as plenty of swingers do separate play, but emotionally together. It is a shared experience, where what you are doing is ultimately about both members of the couple. It is NOT about one member of the couple wanting to fuck around and the other putting up with it for their partner's sake.

 

I just don't want to be blamed in the future for the reason that "we" stopped the swinging experience.

And I don't want to think that he would sneak around to get what he wants.

 

The simple fact that you put we in quotes emphasizes my point above. This isn't something about the two of you. It's something about him which you are being coerced into going along with... and I do mean coerced, as your second sentence above carries with it the obvious implied threat... either you give him permission to do what he wants or he will do it regardless of your wishes. That is a coercive, potentially abusive, situation.

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Not seeing him have sex made it worse for me - it was not just each of us having sex with someone else, not just one of us having sex, but one of us having sex when the other wasn't there.

 

Lionheart72 brings up a something that is very, very important. Swinging is something that couples do together. In your example, whether or not you were physically together when it happened, to me is of lesser importance. You were not emotionally together when it happened, and that is of utmost importance. Those two things have to come in the correct order - first the emotional togetherness, then there may or may not be physical togetherness. Some like it together, some separate, some can go either way. To swing, you absolutely positively have to have that emotional togetherness. You guys aren't there yet, and if that doesn't deeply concern him as it should and he is still pushing forward on the swinging, then there is a serious issue there that needs worked on.

 

I just don't want to be blamed in the future for the reason that "we" stopped the swinging experience.

And I don't want to think that he would sneak around to get what he wants.

 

Try substituting some other words for swinging in that first statement, say gambling. If what started as a few fun trips to the casinos was turning into an obsession that was putting everything at risk, would you worry about being blamed for trying to get that train stopped before it got to the bottom of the hill and ran off the tracks? No, you wouldn't. If you value the relationship you are in, then you will take whatever hard steps are necessary to try to save it. Sadly, sometimes they can't be saved, but that doesn't mean you can't try or you should worry about being blamed for trying.

 

Sticking with the same theme on the second statement, some sneaking around is par for the course for gambling, sex, drugs, alcohol or anything that someone is trying to change their destructive ways on. The real question is how much will you tolerate and how many second chances before he eventually sees the light, or else it is time for you to go?

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Talked again to him tonight. Statements from him -

1. I'm scared about what will happen to our relationship if we stopped swinging.

2. I don't know why I need to have sex with other women even though I love sex with you

3. I think it's so good for a marriage because it satisfies the frustrations of a monogamous relationship.

4. I like to think I have this wonderful GF and we have all these wonderful sexual adventures, but if we stopped ...

 

Are these general swinger beliefs?

I'm just trying so hard to understand what I can.

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Are these general swinger beliefs?

 

In a word, "No". At least they're not successful swinger beliefs. So, let's answer line by line.

 

1. A successful relationship isn't built on swinging. Also, a veiled threat. Not very attractive.

2. I like having sex with other women, but I don't "need" to have sex with other women. That sounds, well, childish.

3. It is interesting that he finds monogamy in your relationship frustrating. OK, maybe more worrisome than interesting.

4. More passive aggressive, veiled threats about what would happen if you didn't swing. Nice.

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. . . Are these general swinger beliefs?

I'm just trying so hard to understand what I can.

I believe I will be able, this time, to speak not only for myself but for other swingers. These concepts are foreign to swingers.

 

Now, speaking only my own impression, from the evidence laid out thus far, it seems your man simply wants to seize control. Once gained, he will not likely want to release it.

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I've refrained from commenting because you've been given great advice. But, it seems like you need more reassurance that what you feel is true. So I'll add mine.

 

Even if these statements were normal for swingers, which they are not, why would you, personally, want to put up with that? You're just not compatible right now. He has experience, but just wants more. He's not willing to take things at your pace. He doesn't care about making it a good experience for you. He wants you to be drunk and not in control so he can have sex with other women. You are not comfortable or happy and he doesn't care. He wants you to feel unsure and insecure and he doesn't care.

 

He doesn't care. He'll say he does, but actions speak louder than words. Probably right after he says he cares, he'll say, "But... I need, I want..."

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To me, this seems less and less about swinging and more and more about your boyfriend's unfavorable personality and attitude. Being a swinger/golfer/sky-diver/gardener/hobbyist doesn't give you a pass to be a jerk about it. While I understand that being non-monogamous is a hobby for some and essential to others, the manipulation you are going through is unacceptable no matter which situation it is. If swinging is something essential to his being then he should understand that there is incompatibility between you two and not pressure you to do something you aren't comfortable with. He would do the noble thing and break up to find some one else more in line with his beliefs. But from what you are sharing with us, which is unfortunately very bias and why I wish he could come here himself so we could get both sides, the world revolves around him and his wants. If he is even considerate of your feelings at all, he would back off from swinging or break up with you.

 

But he knows it can be hard to find a woman who is even open to the idea of swinging so he keeps pressuring you and making you feel guilty for feeling the way that you do. And you are being too complacent and scared to see how he is truly treating you to leave him. Instead, you keep wanting to see if this is normal of swingers. No. No, no, no. This isn't about swinging now but about finding a reason for his behavior. Unfortunately, he is being an asshole.

 

I want to be wrong but until he comes here to show his side of the story, this is my blunt opinion on the matter. I want you to be able to experience the best that swinging has to offer but you aren't going to achieve that with this conniving boyfriend.

 

I'm sorry for my harshness. But please stop trying to find excuses for his behavior.

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Lets not demonize the man for telling her what he wants to do. She might be sending him mixed signals.. heck what can be more confusing than saying I want to go to a swinger club, setting up the rules on how you want to swing and then saying you don't. Just by coming here and talking about indicates that she is slightly intrigued about swinging. The fact that she is still talking about says alot. He is definitely a swinger that is looking for a wife or partner he can swing with. She is seeing if she can be that woman. I am betting he is a pretty good guy in real life or she would not be considering this type of lifestyle. The mixed signal she gave is confusing to me and I think that might be a sign she could swing but is unsure about her footing and how to build a relationship around swinging.

 

 

I would ask myself can I let go of my control of him and let him swing with other women while I have sex with other men. This is where same room sex for both couples seems for me the way to go. That way my partner and I are both getting something and they are together. Letting go of the control and need to be every thing for my wife was paramount for me being able to swing. The first few times I saw my wife with another man scared and confused me. I thought to myself, Hey that's my wife and she only is suppose to look like that with me. It was so distracting that I found it hard to be with the woman I was with.. Then it clicked for me. It was ok for her to have pleasure from another.Feelings of anger and resentment did arise. I came to the conclusion that I did not have to be everything to my wife. Our relationship grew as I let go of the need to dominate her. The same might happen here if she can let go of the need to be everything for her man. Or , if she can not do that she may have to move on to another man that does not swing. Both options are good in my book. I tend to lean that swinging is good and has really helped with our sexual boredom in the bedroom.

 

Good luck and I hope this view written from a different point of view helps. I think it would be nice if one of the women here picked up on how they started swinging and over came some of the jealousy issues when their partner swings.

 

Swinging is easy. Learning to swing well takes effort.

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Talked again to him tonight. Statements from him -

1. I'm scared about what will happen to our relationship if we stopped swinging.

2. I don't know why I need to have sex with other women even though I love sex with you

3. I think it's so good for a marriage because it satisfies the frustrations of a monogamous relationship.

4. I like to think I have this wonderful GF and we have all these wonderful sexual adventures, but if we stopped ...

 

Are these general swinger beliefs?

I'm just trying so hard to understand what I can.

 

There are two words to cover this. The first is NO these are not general swinger beliefs

 

The second is ADDICTION.

 

He's addicted to swinging. You could substitute drugs or alcohol or any other abusive form of addictive behaviour but he is addicted.

The reason I say addiction is because if you are prepared to destroy a supposedly loving relationship for the sake of an activity that is an addiction.

 

You can't change him he has to change himself and if the sight of your (cute?;)) ass heading out the door with a suitcase doesn't motivate him to change nothing will. Just keep walking!

 

And you, by the way, are showing the same signs of addiction in that you're trying to redeem him so you can hold on to an obviously bad relationship for you.

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Lets not demonize the man for telling her what he wants to do. She might be sending him mixed signals.. heck what can be more confusing than saying I want to go to a swinger club, setting up the rules on how you want to swing and then saying you don't.

 

Whether she's confused or sending confusing signals, we're still going by the "Going at the pace of the slowest person" adage. He doesn't seem to want to slow down for her and it's not right to speed her along so he can get what he wants.

 

This is what I see:

 

...all week he told me over and over I was in the driver's seat and if there was anything I didn't want him or me to do we would stop. At the house party I kept telling him I didn't see anyone I wanted to have sex with. We had clearly discussed before that if I didn't find anyone he would not do anything either.

 

Did they stick with the boundary they both agreed upon prior to the party...

 

However, he was sexed up, said that he asked me if he could have sex with that girl. I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did.

 

Answer is no. I already addressed why this bothered me earlier. Do rules and boundaries get broken or bent sometimes? Yes. Does forgiveness and understanding factor in when dealing with this sort of situation? Yes. But honestly, the OP was drunk enough to not remember him asking (or maybe he didn't even ask). If she's drunk enough to not remember being asked, she's drunk enough to be raped. Would you leave your drunk wife/girlfriend alone for other men to possibly take advantage of? This is a point I can't get over because it blatantly shows where his priorities are and it's not his girlfriend or her safety.

 

He said that he would probably have a hard time if I said no because he would be missing out on "having it all," missing out on having the maximum amount of fun he could have.

 

This sounds like being non-monogamous is crucial to how he wants to live his life. That's okay but don't push it onto someone who isn't sure if they want that sort of life. The best way to see if someone wants that lifestyle is to let them come to it on their terms, not someone else's.

 

Statements from him -

1. I'm scared about what will happen to our relationship if we stopped swinging.

2. I don't know why I need to have sex with other women even though I love sex with you

3. I think it's so good for a marriage because it satisfies the frustrations of a monogamous relationship.

4. I like to think I have this wonderful GF and we have all these wonderful sexual adventures, but if we stopped ...

 

Others have already posted how these statements come across, which I think are pretty good analyses. The longer this keeps going, the more I'm convinced there's a co-dependency issue.

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There's a lot of talk about 'mixed signals' and such. We all do this. Who here hasn't sent mixed signals at some point? The desire to please others is a natural tendency for some personalities; it often takes more conscious effort for some people than for others to overcome this tendency and to simply say what you mean and mean what you say. I'm one of those people, so I understand how this can happen. The one and only cure I have found for it is to diligently practice fearlessness in conversation. If you're afraid to say it, chances are, it's the very thing that needs to be said. You have to work at it. If one partner is getting mixed signals, it doesn't mean it's okay to assume that the signal that is more in line with what the other wants is the one he or she really meant; if anything, one should assume the opposite.

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The second is ADDICTION.

 

He's addicted to swinging. You could substitute drugs or alcohol or any other abusive form of addictive behaviour but he is addicted.

The reason I say addiction is because if you are prepared to destroy a supposedly loving relationship for the sake of an activity that is an addiction.

 

I think thats a pretty over reaching use of the word. There are activities of mine, that if my wife said "its that or me" I'd be looking for an apartment because it would be unreasonable of her to expect me to give them up. Addictions are a disease, they cause changes in your brain, a dependency of sorts. This to me sounds like hes just being a dillweed.

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We have been dabbling in the lifestyle ever since we started dating 2 years ago. Only full swapped 3 weeks ago. I must admit I've been very stop and go from the beginning.

However, he was sexed up, said that he asked me if he could have sex with that girl. I was pretty drunk and don't remember his asking me. He said I said yes. So, he did.

 

.

We talked (argued) about this. Yes, I did throw boots at his computer and poured a bottle of champagne down the sink. He hopes I will change my mind. He says he will continue to want to have sex with other women. He says that he thinks swinging will really help our relationship because all guys need an outlet and he's one of the few who is smart enough to act out on it so it's actually beneficial.

 

Try as I might I cannot separate recreational from emotional sex with my guy. I like the idea of swinging, but when reality hits I just feel bad knowing he's with other women.

 

Do I keep trying? Do I stay in this relationship ? What if I say no to swinging and he does stuff behind my back?

Help. Don't know what to do......

 

This sounds to me like he has been upfront from the beginning about swinging and that she was on board from early on in the relationship. Now she has cold feet and is reconsidering what she has been teasing him with for the last two year, he is upset and confused. Sure some means things have been said. We only hear what she said from a second party. I think the only honest thing said was that he was going to keep swinging.

 

I stand my post and say that she sent him mixed signals when she said that they have been toying with this for two years. He thought he was with a swinger girl when she expressed interest but, then withdrew her decision to swing. Which it is her right to change her mind. I understand the mindset she was thinking and it is manipulative at best. Lets see I bet her thinking went something like this. If I indulge him in his sexual fantasy of swinging I can get this man to like me and once we get together and he learns what a cool girl I am he will forget swinging and just want to be with. All the drama that came after is, well drama and manipulation.

 

I say again lets not demonize her boyfriend and look at the whole picture..well half a picture that we have here. We only have her side of the story and it sounds pretty one sided to me.

 

Once again I am writing this from his point of view and is only designed to make us think about what has not been said. This is just a different way to look at it.

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That is a good point, the relationship started with swinging as part of it. It may simply be they want different things at this point and breakups happen.

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Once again I am writing this from his point of view and is only designed to make us think about what has not been said. This is just a different way to look at it.

 

Funny how you writing from his point of view still makes him sound like a selfish asshole to me. :)

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I have been following this post from the start, but have not replied because all I can think to do is offer you my personal experiences at starting swinging. The problem with that is I am worried it will sway you in a direction that might not be ideal for you... but here goes.... (This will be long, I apologize)

 

 

 

When DH and I first got together, he made it very clear that he wanted a sexually open relationship. I was 19, he was 28. I didn't know it at the time, but the age difference made things very hard for us in the beginning. I had yet explored my sexuality at full ( and still haven't) and the idea of swinging never crossed my mind. He pushed very hard, it was the topic of a lot of our conversations. I was scared and not sure it was what I wanted for a very long time. We fought and fought and fought about it. His main focus at the beginning was to have a threesome with another female. Full swap hadn't even been discussed. To me, it seemed like the only thing that mattered to him was him sleeping with other women, and I wasn't willing to give that to him. This went on for years, and honestly to this day I don't know how our relationship survived it. About 3-4 years into the relationship, I became more open to the idea of at least trying it and seeing how it went. We had a couple of experiences. The experiences were fine but I couldn't truly enjoy them. It was awkward talking to my husband about them. And much like you I always worried in the back of my mind if he would leave me if we were not exploring swinging. I even told him that I thought he would leave me if I stopped. He said that would never happen, but I just couldn't believe him. I had MAJOR trust issues and swinging was the majority of any and all problems we had together in the relationship, at least as far as I could see it. We did eventually stop. I got pregnant and had our first child. We stopped during the pregnancy and never made it back (5 years). During that time, he would bring it up and I would try to say just enough to keep him off my back until it was brought up again. It is all very sad.

 

From his perspective, I just wasn't into it. He felt I was doing it JUST to please him. In a way, that was true. But not totally. I did enjoy it, and I did want to do it. But because of the trust and lack of communication, it made things hard. He felt that I was leading him on. Telling him I wanted it but only to keep him. Again, in a way this was true, but not totally.

 

Well we did end up breaking up. We were apart over a year, both seeing different people. The odd thing about it all though- during that time he stopped swinging; I didn't. I didn't actually hook up with anyone, but I knew it was something that I wanted, whether single or in another relationship. When DH found out, at first he was furious. I can completely understand it. He spent all those years thinking I just didn't want to do it, and here I was doing it without him. WTF right?

 

The problems with what was going on in our relationship I think relate strongly to your situation, but not perfectly of course.

1. I think it was brought up too early. He knew it was something he wanted, but I had no idea it was even a possibility. Instead of him bringing it up after we were together for a while and comfortable in our relationship together, he brought it up right away. And I more or less agreed right away, without giving it any real thought and without understanding the toll it could have on our relationship. If we were more secure in our relationship before it was "forced" to be an issue, I feel like the road would of been a lot smoother. I don't blame him for this, as I don't think your BF should be blamed. He knew what he wanted in the relationship, and he wanted to see if it would at least be a possibility with me before he became too involved.

2. Communication. This goes back to it being too early. We didn't have great communication skills. Because the relationship was so new, both of us tip-toed around the whole conversation, afraid to say the wrong thing or hurt the other one. Although we were together for a while before any play actually happened, we fell into a pattern of bad communication from the start and it was easier to stick with that than to try to change it. It also was because I was insecure, not only in the relationship, but with myself and my wants/needs/desires. To this day, I am still not fully comfortable talking about all things sex. I blush, even know, when DH says certain things about sex. I know I don't have to be this way because he knows me inside and out (literally), but it is part of my personality.

3. Because of the two above, I felt like it was all moving too fast. As many have said here "you have to move as slow as the slowest person". That was not happening in our relationship. Even though I was able to keep us from actually having intercourse with another couple for quite some time, I felt pushed to do things that I was not yet comfortable with.

 

 

So to answer some of your questions- Are these normal feelings all swingers have? I think certainly not. But they can be if certain factors come into play. I think starting swinging too early in the relationship is a mistake. And I think 2 years is too early into the relationship. Some will disagree. I'm sure there are plenty of people that start early and move on to have a great time, but I'm going to stick by that statement.

 

Will he leave you if you stop? From what I can tell from what you posted, he probably will. But that shouldn't be in your thought process when YOU are deciding if this is right for YOU. Just because you are scared, turned off, unsure, doesn't mean that you will never have an interest in swinging. I felt the same way in the beginning and now I love it. But the biggest thing that held me back for so long, and nearly destroyed my relationship, was because instead of sitting down and soul searching in the beginning about what I wanted for me, I always considered DH in my feelings about the lifestyle. You need to sit down with yourself and decide if this is something that you would have an interest in whether he leaves you or not. I don't know the situation with his ex wife and what went down there or who left who- but obviously swinging wasn't enough to keep them together. And I am here to tell you that even if you end up LOVING swinging, it DOES NOT mean you will be with this man happily ever after.

 

I am of the belief that swinging should be "recreational". Meaning- if it is main focus in your relationship, if it is going to "make it or break it" then it is not healthy. I no longer feel swinging will make or break my relationship and it makes things a whole lot more comfortable. On the other hand, if I did go to DH and say "I want to stop swinging" and he left me- let him go. That might sound harsh, but it is the truth. If that is enough to make him leave me after 10 years, 2 kids, and all the shit we have been through.... bye! Compromise is very important in a relationship, but swinging shouldn't be a compromise for either party.

 

 

 

Talked again to him tonight. Statements from him -

1. I'm scared about what will happen to our relationship if we stopped swinging.

2. I don't know why I need to have sex with other women even though I love sex with you

3. I think it's so good for a marriage because it satisfies the frustrations of a monogamous relationship.

4. I like to think I have this wonderful GF and we have all these wonderful sexual adventures, but if we stopped ...

 

Are these general swinger beliefs?

I'm just trying so hard to understand what I can.

 

NO! This is not true for all swingers. This is him trying to talk you into swinging!!!! Again, you need to decide for YOURSELF and STOP using ^these^ excuses as the basis for your consideration.

 

Swinging was something I wanted to try when we started BUT I made sure it was something my wife wanted to try before I did anything in that direction.

 

This is probably the best piece of advice you have received, and I wish there had been someone there to tell me this in the beginning.

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SwingSetWife made a wonderful point (and thank you for being so honest and posting your story)...I think a lot of us here might agree that when a couple just starts out in their relationship, they should focus on building the relationship first before bringing in anyone else into the equation. I know that there are special couples out there that can have open relationship or swing right from the start but sometimes the foundation for that relationship needs to be established before you start to put pressure and stress on it, which swinging does do. Swinging right away is almost like building and tearing it apart at the same time.

 

We don't really know the details about how they began swinging. Was it right away? Did the have that new relationship honeymoon before any swinging occurred? Did it happen more like SwingSetWife's situation?

 

Keep in mind that we are only getting your side and if he were to come here and post, it would probably appear quite differently. Maybe you can invite him to come here, read your thread, and maybe even read other threads. Research together and talk about your feelings, thoughts, fears, etc. openly and honestly. All of my advice and thoughts on the matter could be 100% wrong because we'll never get all of the facts and details so please take my words with a grain of salt.

 

Is there a way for you to bring your boyfriend here to read your post and share his thoughts (and read what the forum has to offer)?

 

I want to be wrong but until he comes here to show his side of the story, this is my blunt opinion on the matter.

 

As for the male's side of the story, I am always open to it. I am always open and asking for the other half of the story, in fact, in this thread alone I've asked three times but for some reason, he hasn't come. Maybe the OP is too afraid to ask. Maybe the boyfriend doesn't want to share. Maybe...a thousand reasons. I implore you, Earthsand347, please share this thread with your boyfriend and give him the chance to share his side and clear his name. Let him make it as sympathetic as he wants. I don't care but this forum is a great tool for any and every swinging couple to use in their swinging journey.

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Lizards post did make me look at this from a new perspective. The issue here is he STARTED the relationship to have swinging part of it. For most of us this is not how we got into this. I would have been completely against the idea for the first five or so years together, vaguely wondering for the next 4, and started to think if we could make it happen for a year before we actually tried.

 

For me after 9 years to tell my wife "I can't imagine what would happen to our relationship if we don't swing" would be a completely assholish and selfish thing. But lets replace that with "I can't imagine what would happen to our relationship if we don't have sex anymore". We started with sex, we were having it for 9 years, and if she said she didn't want it anymore odds are that would have been that.

 

In this case swinging is part of the normal sex life, and a high priority to the male. The more I think about this the more I'm thinking that they may just not be compatible on this. Its not how I would have approached it were I to be single again, but there was no deception here on his part.

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I have to respond to 81lizard69's post. That was actually not my way of thinking, meaning I did not pretend interest in swinging just to get the guy. I agree that would be manipulative. I was already a little interested, but no experience.

All the back and forth-ness of two years was because I was just plain not sure. I do wish swinging was not right from the start, that we had spent time building the strong relationship that all say is needed before healthier swinging.

 

Despite all that, when we got to the actual "full swap" episode there were many things that went wrong and have left me feeling bad about the whole situation.

 

As to why I have not brought him to the board partly it's because I feel I want to see what he will do on his own. To me that way I could get a truer picture of what he wants to do not under the influence.

I'm also honestly a little scared about how he will react to all the opinions of him. Our relationship is at the moment kinda if-fy anyway and i'm scared of throwing fuel on the fire if i show him this post. It's not because I think I'm the "right" and he's the "wrong." I understand why he would be frustrated these past two years.

 

My main issue is what happened at the party and how I now feel. Hope that makes sense.

I am still thanking all for each and every response!

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Just adding ... I don't feel I was leading him on for two years. I did my share of initiating going to clubs, etc.

 

Reality hit big time though, that party weekend when things went wrong. And that's how I ended up confused, hurt, upset.

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Sorry for me being disorganized with all these posts.

Last night he jokingly (?) said "monogamy is a four-letter word."

My stomach sorta sunk.

:(

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