Dr Phil's Rebuttal show on swingers

I caught a commercial today and Dr Phil was having a show on Rebuttals from viewers on certain subjects. Swinging was one of them.

He had a sex therapist on and She did a very good job, in my opinion, on defending the lifestyle.


Her main objection to his show was that he said swinging "Never, Never, Ever works for anyone who tries it."
She pointed out that there are hundreds of thousands of swingers who are successful and happy. He referred to the couple ha had on. She agreed, which she should have, that swinging was wrong for them.

Again she drove home the fact that he was wrong to say it Never will work for anyone, ever because it does.
She told him about lifestyle coventions and swinger sites (none by name) and reccommend he go to a convention and see for himself how happy swinger couples can be.

He responded in all his profound ignorance "I don't want to, I am afraid I would catch something".

He told her in ALL his 30 years of research he has never seen a successful swinging couple.

She responded by suggesting that he do some more research.

I don't know if anyone esle saw this show but I give her a two thumbs up for trying to shed the true positive light that so many find in swinging.

[TNT]

Cool...I like her

Teresa

I figured I would add that after I saw the commercial I decided to watch it.
I didn't get all thet from the commercial.

[Tom & Bonnie]

I went to Drphil.com and saw the guest sex therapist you mentioned... That's Dr. Robin deVal. She's well known around the swingers convention circuit. We first met here about 6 years ago at N'awlins in November. You can see her website at http://www.thedrrobynshow.com/

[Rombi's Girl]

I saw the show. I taped it and the original show for my partner to watch. So far he hasn't. I agree that Dr. Phil sounded old fashioned when he said that swinging never works, ever. But I also thought that there was something to be considered.

Most swingers are married. Most marriage vows include the phrase, "forsaking all others". I just wonder how all the religious and married swingers that desire "honesty" resolve this issue. I mean, did, or did most couples declare before a God of their understanding, in front of family and friends this sacred vow?

I've been a swinger for 9 years. I am divorced from my first and last husband. Since I don't plan to stop swinging, I don't think I will likely remarry because of that. I know that you can write any vows you'd like to take. But I have an old fashioned view of marriage. And it includes the view point that my husband should be the only possible father of my childern. Yes, I am a safe sex swinger. I also like the "forsaking all others" part of vows. I just wish I could live up to that. I'd very much want my future husband to "forsake all others". I'd want him to want me, not other women. I personally know some swinging couples that have a "no kissing" rule, and while I respect this limit, I think it is silly. IMO, if sex with another person that you're not married to is OK, then anal and kissing should be too.

I am very prepared to recieve lots of hate mail by stating these opinions. I am quite popular with the swinging smokers that I have told that I am thrilled that my city has a public smoking ban. The ban prohibits smoking in bars and restaurants. I can now go out for the evening w/o smelling like an ashtray.

Back to the topic, I enjoy sex. I enjoy my partner more than I like sleeping around at swing clubs. The day that he says this lifestyle makes him feel empty, and that he desires a porn free, exclusive union, I will have some tough thinking to do. I mean, I hate porn. But monogamy has always been tough for me, because I have usually settled for my needs not being met by my partners and have looked outside my primary relationship to try to satisify those needs.

Is it possible that I am the only swinger that wishes my primary relationship satisified all me emotional and sexual needs?

Does everyone wnat to line up to those tomatoes at me?

Will I be called a Dr. Phil groupie just beacuse I feel this way?

If you don't feel brave enough to support me here on this thread, then feel free to send me a PM (email).

Otherwise, if you feel the need to flame and shame me, please direct your negative comments here, as I will be folowing this thread like the news, several times a day. Don't mean to hijack the OP's thread. I just wanted to share my opinion.

Be kind,
RG
Surrender

[TNT]

Hi RG... and Welcome to the Board.

I don't think you will be flamed for your post as that is not the way things are done here. You will however probably get a lot of different opinions on it, but they won't be flaming you.

As to your comments on marriage vows...take a look at this thread here
and you should get a better understanding of what a lot of us feel about them.

Originally Posted by Rombi's Girl

Is it possible that I am the only swinger that wishes my primary relationship satisified all me emotional and sexual needs?

Sorry to disappoint you but my husband does satisfy all my emotional and sexual needs as I do his...we don't have to swing, we swing because it's fun and we want to but it's not because we aren't totally satisfied with each other.

Teresa

[TNT]

Originally Posted by Tom & Bonnie

I went to Drphil.com and saw the guest sex therapist you mentioned... That's Dr. Robin deVal. She's well known around the swingers convention circuit. We first met here about 6 years ago at N'awlins in November. You can see her website at http://www.thedrrobynshow.com/

Darn, I would have loved to have seen her giving it to Dr. Phil ...I think she's great.

Teresa

[funtoplay]

As having been raised in a traditional RC home, it was always understood that when we got married, that was it. Fortunately, while being a devout practising RC, my mother also taught me to be independant and to think for my self. I have no trouble with, nor do I feel that I have broken the "forsaking all others" vow. My husband is the one I love. It is that simple.

I would ask one question of RG....there is a link on this site to the Liberated Christians website. Have you checked it out? I would highly recommend it to anyone having the same faith vs. swinging crisis as you seem to be having. Believe me...I don't want you to think that I am "flaming" you. I can only hope that you will come to the same sense of peace with yourself that I feel inside me.

[Rombi's Girl]

Originally Posted by funtoplay

... I have no trouble with, nor do I feel that I have broken the "forsaking all others" vow. My husband is the one I love. It is that simple.

I would ask one question of RG....there is a link on this site to the Liberated Christians website. Have you checked it out? I would highly recommend it to anyone having the same faith vs. swinging crisis as you seem to be having. Believe me...I don't want you to think that I am "flaming" you. I can only hope that you will come to the same sense of peace with yourself that I feel inside me.

Thank you to TNT for the welcome. Thanks to funtoplay for the suggestion to the link. Not to flame you either, but the "forsaking all others" vows don't say anything about the difference between loving another person and sexual relations with other people. To forsake means: 1) To give up (something formerly held dear); renounce. 2) To leave altogether; abandon

I am not a Christian. And I really do not think that I am having a crisis of faith. I have a healthy outlook of the god of my understanding. I love my partner. More to the point, I love the way I feel when I am around him, and when I show him through "acts of service" that I love him.

(acts of service = making coffee, starting his car in the morning, scraping off his windows of snow and/or ice, buying his favorite food items, scratching his back, things that are for his benefit, things that affect his comfort, things that he really notices, etc...) Acts of service, refers to one of the 5 Love Languages. (a book by a Christian author, Mark Chapman) A book I highly recommend, whether you identify as a Christian or not.

I don't feel flamed. Yet. As for a sense of peace, I'll have to get back to you. I've been in the lifestyle for 9+yrs, with two different partners, at two different times in my life. I am NOT the jealous type. Do I feel peace? I am not weirded out by sex. Feel no guilt about my desires, either.

Is it possible to restate my eariler opinion? What I should have said is I wish my partner found that all of his needs were satisified by our primary relationship. I feel highly motivated to satisify his needs. Am I wrong to wish he felt as strongly? If you saw Dr. Phil's first show on swinging, the husband said he wished that they has a "normal sex life". I feel where he is coming from. In my past, both men were the driving force in the swing relationship. Now that I have been doing it for nearly 10 yrs, I am not sure that I could give it up. I truly feel that primary relationships should be completely satisifing.

However in the real world, it is often difficult to separate from those that do not meet all of our needs. The devil you know, vs. the devil you don't, and all. Most people, both men and women are willing to settle for less than their ideal.

I don't know where I am going with all of this. But I don't want to be guilty of hijacking a thread, so I will be a good girl, and check out that link. And if I feel it is necessary, I will start a new thread.

I truly apprerciate the welcome, and the link on vows - I'll check it out after I hit "submit reply".

Thanks to everyone for reading my message.

[BradAndJanet]

Originally Posted by Rombi's Girl

... Most swingers are married. Most marriage vows include the phrase, "forsaking all others". I just wonder how all the religious and married swingers that desire "honesty" resolve this issue. I mean, did, or did most couples declare before a God of their understanding, in front of family and friends this sacred vow? ...

Technically, we would be guilty of that, but I suppose that it depends on the definition of 'forsake'. I don't love anyone else (in the husband-wife sense) but Janet, so I don't believe that I have forsaken her by having sex with others with her blessing. Anyway, we have the traditional vows that were said because of her overbearing family, and then we have what is in our hearts for each other. The latter is what's important, but maybe at our 25th anniversary in a few years, we'll pick something we want to say.

As for the good Dr., has it never occurred to him in all his 30 years of 'research' that people with good relationships don't usually need therapists? Why would a happy swinging couple go see him? Dr. deVal is right, he needs to get out more...

-B

[Mrs Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by BradAndJanet

As for the good Dr., has it never occurred to him in all his 30 years of 'research' that people with good relationships don't usually need therapists? Why would a happy swinging couple go see him? Dr. deVal is right, he needs to get out more...
-B

Great point Brad I saw the commercial for the show and missed when it was on so I didn't get to see it. I'm glad he had someone on "our" side on the show. It does sound like he needs to do more research especially if he is counseling people in the lifestyle who are having problems.

Mrs Spoomonkey

[intuition897]

A friend of mine taped the original show for me and I need to pick up the tape. Still haven't seen the rebuttal show. Hmmm, I think I like Dr. Robyn. Philsie says it never, ever works...ever. And he has never seen swinging work in all his 30 years of "research". And yet he refuses to go to a swingers convention because he's afraid he might catch something????? Oh...my...God. What an idiot. Nobody asked him to have sex with them. I suppose he doesn't like to be in the same room as an AIDS victim either for fear of catching it, eh? Sounds like he needs to update his knowledge of STD's. And I really can't say I have much respect for his "research". He won't go to a convention or talk to 'real' swingers because the man doesn't want to be proven wrong. Period.

Rombi's Girl, Welcome to the board! I don't have specific links to threads here about vows but I will offer my opinion, since you asked. While everyone is entitled to believe what they will, and swing for whatever reasons they choose, I feel that perhaps your reasons for swinging could stand to be examined a little more closely. If you feel that what you are doing is wrong, and you are simply accepting that you are being bad and doing something wrong, I don't think that's a healthy place to start in the lifestyle. If you are doing this because you are unsatisfied in your relationship with your significant other, that's a red flag for me as well. Mr. and I do this because we are so satisfied with one another, and this is just another way for us to express our love. We had a traditional wedding and vows, and while others may interpret what we do as a blatant violation of those vows, I don't feel that it is. I have forsaken all others. There is no one else on earth that I put as a higher priority than my husband. While he and I would each gladly give our lives for our children, aside from that he is my main priority. I think that, because we weren't swingers when we were first married, our vows could stand to be updated. Maybe someday we will. But until, I'm not losing any sleep over it.

[intuition897]

Here's the slideshow for the Dr. Phil/Dr. Robin debate: http://www.drphil.com/slideshow/slid...e2.xml&start=1

It's closed-minded attitudes like his that make me so glad I'm a swinger

[Bella&Cooper]

RG,

I find it ironic that you are concerned about the line of vows specifying "forsaking all others" and yet you broke the key part of your original vows "til death do us part". This isn't a judgement on the validity of your divorce on my part. Merely an observation.

I think like most texts that are bible/church based, there are a lot of ways to interpret it and for many, forsaking all others, means that you will not leave behind your spouse for someone else. A relationship with others with the consent of your spouse would be considered to adhere to that vow for many couples.

I will say that if your conscience tells you that what you are doing is wrong, for whatever reason, then one should definitly abstain.

I haven't seen the Dr.Phil episodes but it disappoints me that he would be so strongly opposed to it without being willing to do effective research.

[DBL D]

Dr. Robin caught him off guard a couple times and he showed that he really lacked any kind of informed opinion about what swinging is supposed to be about. I think he took the hook though and lord help THAT household when he decides it's worth a try.

Male D