Women's Experiences in the Swingers Lifestyle

[lovelypepper]

I've recently had a lecture in one of my classes from a man in the Swingers lifestyle who implied women's experiences were not always positive. Several of my female classmates who had some experience in this scene (which I do not...but am interested...!) stated that women, especially in couples, often appeared to be coerced into participating by their partners and did not seem to derive much pleasure. Since there is not much literature on this subject, I was hoping to get some direct feedback from individuals in this lifestyle on both positive and negative experiences that I could use for a paper I am writing for my doctoral program. All information given will be kept confidential and will be greatly appreciated! Thanks for any help you can provide.

[pairbond]

Wow! That speaker doesn't know what he/she is talking about. We have been swinging for 8 1/2 years, have met dozens of swinging couples, have attended on-premises swing clubs 6-8 times, and have attended probably 2 dozen private house parties, and have hosted a half dozen swinging house parties at our own home.

The only time we have seen women feeling discomfort is when they were new to swinging and were not acquainted with all the guests.

The truth is, women RULE swinging. It is the women who decide whether or not to swing. It is the WOMEN who decide who they will play with, or how many. Women at a swing party do the choosing, not the men. We have NEVER seen a single instance of a woman being forced to participate in anything.

Whoever gave that talk was doing nothing but speculating, pure and simple, based on his/her own insecurities and imagination. The truth is totally opposite.

Although it frequently is the male who talks his female partner into trying swinging, it is the woman who enjoys herself most and who wants to keep on swinging.

That's our experience based on our personal experiences and our knowledge of perhaps 60 swinging couples.

[roget]

My experience is limited, but it also seems to suggest that women take the lead in swinging. Once they get into it and really begin to get hot they can be very assertive in suggesting what is done and how.

[GerdOEvert]

I think I have seen women who are uncomfortable in the "lifestyle" setting. And I think I have seen some who only went because their mate asked, etc.

But I do agree, if a couple goes often and participates, the women control the extent and degree of activity.

In fact, I would go one step further, the bi women are the predominant group in the bi circle. It would interest me to have the Kinsey Group at Indiana have a study on that and report results.

There may be bi guys at the clubs, but not nearly as prevelant as the women.

Otto

[tribbles]

I'm the female and I suggested it and have a blast. Fortunately so does he.

S

[Studios2go]

Lets see this is a deep subject here....First I want to say that there is Very much pleasure in swinging. It for me derives from different sexual partners that are allowed inside my 27 year marraige to my husband. Its just fine to have variety..its even better to have new experiences, and partially to say my age is not young, I have sex now more often then before we started swinging.

The approach of this lifestyle did come to me as a suprise though. I have to admit..the hubby posted a message on a swingers board without me knowing.

When I did find out I was really upset and very head strong on not entering into the swingers lifestyle. But, I did tell him I would think about it with an open mind and make a decission. I did however take my time on thinking about it. I even did some research on it. After learning more about it the idea sounded really fun and exciting to say the least. My worries about STD's did hinder me but as you probably can see almost ALL of us in this lifestyle use and know the importance of Condums ect.

I think that the key to success in the swingers lifestyle is to have a good stable relationship with your significant other, have sound rules and not too many and be safe above all.

This lifestyle for me has opened up my inhibition to sex tremendously. It indeed gives me extream pleasure without cheating and a variety of other sexual partners. I too feel that in an extent it opens up the same avenue for my husband. He is quite happy having a variety in sexual partners and he enjoys seeing me have sex with other men...ditto I say!

The key to this lifestyle is to be able to distinquish love from sex, and a mutual attraction.

This being that when you are with another couple or one person outside your relationship you have to be able to see it as just sex. Maybe it's super good sex, but just sex with no strings attatched. Attatchment in the swingers lifestyle tends to get messy and that seems to be the time that problems arise between all involved.

There are however bad experiences also. Whether it be location or the other partner..we as swingers can just move on.

Interesting enough, I the wife, get to make most of the decisions in this lifestyle.
As a woman I feel more comfortable because I see myself more picky, moody and concious about who we have sex with. Yes I am picky. It makes the sex better if I am willing and eager and want to do it with an individual. I think it stems to womens moral standards also, saying no or saying yes just is the right thing to do.Taking over the ownership also creates a since of stability for me. But also listening to my husbands likes and dislikes and discussing the evening's events is very important. Even if it is for about 10 minutes it really is important.

Thats my 2 cents good luck!
Christine

[oncewere]

Ditto. Once women get over their ireticence they call the shots. We guys are just along for the ride. Our pleasures are very dependent upon our wives enjoying themselves.

Members of this board are helpful, articulate and know what they are talking about. They are wonderful people and you can count on them telling the truth.

A few letters, though, no matter how clear and helpful will not substitute for personal observation. For your research to be complete you need to interview swingers. You don't want your paper to be as shallow as that of your lecturer. The experienced people will share their wide experience and newbies will share their apprehensions. Talking to newbies will also give you an insight into people who will not stay with the lifestyle. You need input from those who don't stick with it.

You really need to attend a few parties or clubs to put the letters and interviews into perspective and to meet a representative sample of swingers. I'm sure that any host will help to make your visits non-threatening in the woman-centered environment.

Perhaps someone on the board in your part of PA would run interference for you.

[Studios2go]

Yes I too think that attending a club to see just what is going on is a good idea also.

One more thing...here in my area a local TV News Anchor did a spot about swingers...and it was tacky...bad and all round gross. The people she had interviewed in my opinion did not even represent most of us here.

Can you please try to do this in a tastefull, full representative prospective?

I know it may take more work but there are decent..and very private people out there that need to be represented in all sexual domination.
Christine

[txduo2000]

There definitely are situations where the woman is sort of "dragged" into it by her husband or significant other. I felt that way in the beginning of our foray into the swing set.

But, let me qualify that by saying that I am a VERY guilty person. I feel guilty about everything, regardless of if I have any control over it or not. So, when my husband brought up the idea, I will admit that it was exciting and intriguing, but when we actually started it, I felt dirty, used and whored out. I really didn't have the healthy mindset that I now possess, and I did feel like I was doing it only for my husband. I knew that I could stop it if I wanted to, but I felt guilty for denying him the fun that he seemed to want so badly. And I had a bad jealousy problem at the time. Suffice it to say that when we played back then, I had to be very drunk so that I would have an "excuse" for doing what I felt in my heart to be very wrong.

Eventually, I did stop it, and we were out of the lifestyle for a couple years. Though, and I didn't know it at the time, hubby was still browsing websites, still emailing people in the lifestyle. Not with the intention of meeting, but to kind of keep connected to it in some way.

We are back in it now, of my choosing, and I have a much healthier perspective. I feel more in control and know that I am doing it because I want to and not to please anyone else.

[Chicup]

For the most part I'd say the women have a somewhat better time of it compared to the men.

There is a saying that its the men who first drag the women into swinging and then have to drag them away, which seems pretty true.

I don't think your 'speaker' had much lifestyle experiance.

[txduo2000]

Originally Posted by Chicup

For the most part I'd say the women have a somewhat better time of it compared to the men.

There is a saying that its the men who first drag the women into swinging and then have to drag them away, which seems pretty true.

Chicup, you are probably not altogether off-base here ... when hubby and I got back into it earlier this year, it was preceded by a separation and some issues regarding a woman he was dating during our separation that he swung with. When I insisted we get back in, he was very hesitant, thought I was doing it for the wrong reasons and suggested we hang back and solidify our reconciliation. We took a couple of brief breaks since we got back in, but once he realized that I wasn't doing it to "prove" anything (and maybe I was in the beginning, but it was resolved through our breaks), he is much more comfortable. I still know that if I wanted to stop, he is ok with that too.

[EvilMJ]

I am the one who brought it up in our relationship and I am having a great time.

[savannah_bi_fem]

Originally Posted by lovelypepper

I've recently had a lecture in one of my classes from a man in the Swingers lifestyle who implied women's experiences were not always positive. Several of my female classmates who had some experience in this scene (which I do not...but am interested...!) stated that women, especially in couples, often appeared to be coerced into participating by their partners and did not seem to derive much pleasure. Since there is not much literature on this subject, I was hoping to get some direct feedback from individuals in this lifestyle on both positive and negative experiences that I could use for a paper I am writing for my doctoral program. All information given will be kept confidential and will be greatly appreciated! Thanks for any help you can provide.

Hi! The main thing I've learned since entering into the swing lifestyle is that there are as many different kinds of experiences as there are different couples and individuals. We have seen all kinds. Just as background, our experiences have been through personal ads, off-premise events (like meet and greets, and off-premise clubs), a huge on-premise hotel event (500-600 couples in attendance), and an on-premise club.

There are general guidelines that most swingers acknowledge, or at least know of in the lifestyle. However, we've seen many people who call themselves swingers and are in direct opposition to these guidelines, by their actions. For example: "Swinging should only go as fast as the slowest person involved." Yet, there often is a partner who is feeling rushed, nervous, not ready, and yet pushing forward because they want to please somebody. Or, fear of being left behind by their mate if they don't rush to keep up. I've heard women say that the only reason they swing is to keep their husband from cheating on them. "At least I'm there", I've heard it said.

Another example: "Swinging is not for cheaters." Yet, join any adult personals site, and you'll find many married people who are seeking lovers outside of their relationship and without their mate's knowledge. Hooking up behind their back.

Another: "Swinging is only for couples whose marriages are on solid ground." But, we've seen many whose marriages are in serious trouble and they think swinging will fix it. Or in some cases, they're out for some kind of revenge. On a couple of occasions we've been at events where a couple of "single women" attend. They're actually married women who have "open marriages". They call it that, but the women are very unhappy with it. In one case, the woman is extremely angry and distraught that her husband has a regular girlfriend that he spends every weekend with, leaving her out. So, this wife spends every weekend looking for wild encounters at a swing club - alone (and telling everyone who will listen about her marital woes.) She started pursuing heavily a single guy from the club and wanted to convince him to be her "boyfriend" - this was tit-for-tat, trying to make her husband jealous so he'd give up his girlfriend. (Very immature - sounds like middle school!) The other "single woman", she and her husband live apart due to jobs and rarely see each other. They seem to have a don't-ask-don't-tell arrangement. She is extremely clingy and tries to make an emotional attachment out of her encounters. She writes moody messages to anyone she's been with casually along the lines of, "why aren't you calling me/what did I do wrong?" (As if she's going steady with them.) She even practically stalked the same single guy already mentioned to make him her "boyfriend", too. In fact, both of these married women got into a triangle and big cat-fight over this single guy. Single guy wanted to have MFM with us (we liked him) but he said he had to be careful that these women didn't find out. Noooo....too much drama, and we decided to stay away from ALL of those mentioned.

Another: "Discretion is important - don't kiss and tell." We find that many of the swingers we talk to are indiscreet about name-dropping. Both locally in our area, and at clubs we've been to out of town. Some will bluntly ask if you've been with so-and-so yet, and what you thought. They seem to be looking for references. We're not interested in people who want to tell all about others, or who want to ask us about others - and we find the indiscreet kind more often than not. Even some of the personal ad sites, like Swinglifestyle.com, have a "certification" process where people basically write a review about you that others can read. Blech! TMI!

As for who got things started: with us, it was me sort of (I broke the ice first by sharing my bisexual side with hubby). He was extremely surprised at first. Then, he liked it. Then, we gradually started opening up more and more about fantasies and making some of them happen for real. Though I broke the ice, nobody really "pushed" the swinging agenda in our case. But, there are times when I'm more into it somewhat, and times when he's more into it. At those times, the other partner has to say, "slow down, let's back off a bit". Different paces are entirely natural and to be expected.

We have seen the proverbial passive and scared wife being dragged into swinging by a very anxious husband. Sometimes, the husband seems more interested in boinking something new, than in being tuned into his wife's feelings and her desires. Many passive-natured wives are more afraid of saying no and risk having him cheat, than they fear going forward with something they don't feel ready for (or perhaps not even interested in). We have developed radar for these folks. (We find them in the personal ads and in-person in clubs.) We get that radar when it's the man (in the personals) who is doing all the online looking and pursuing - like some big-game hunter. And, he does all or nearly all of the contacting and emailing when talking about what they want, likes/dislikes. When I ask, "Is your wife there? Does she ever get involved at this stage?" Often the answer is something like, "She just wants me to find somebody for us, and let her know about it after I do." Or, "She wants to explore bisexuality, but she wants me to find a woman for her." HUH? If she were really interested, wouldn't she be getting to know the potential lover, herself? In one of the cases where the husband did all the looking/contacting (until I said we have to talk to HER, too), I get the impression that she goes along for the ride mainly to give him the variety he wants, and to make herself "the cool wife". In their case he's the better looking of the two and I think she fears being left behind - if she's not cool. KWIM?

Recently, hubby and I attended a huge weekend-long hotel event with hundreds of lifestyle couples. At the "meet the new people" mixers and such, I met several scared women. One was literally shaking like a leaf. At the bi-lady-only meeting (no sex, just talk without the guys around), the main gist of the talk by the leaders was "don't do anything you're not ready for or that you don't really want to do for yourself". Many of the women there admitted that they were scared, very ambivilent about being there at all, and were doing it because their husbands want it so much (particularly the girl-girl fantasy, seeing their wife with a woman). I just had a feeling that the weekend was going to be a disaster for them, and that they were in way over their heads, starting out at a huge event like that. Maybe they thought the weekend would get it out of their husband's system. More than likely the opposite would happen, the weekend sights and experiences would have really whetted their appetite to push for more. Perhaps for some of the women, it all worked out and they eventually relaxed and enjoyed. For others, they probably hated it and regretted ever going there. It's definitely not for everybody.

As far as who controls things: I've seen a few couples where the wife has all the control. I've seen couples where the husbands are pushing their wife with a bulldozer. We don't feel comfortable with either of these types. We prefer the company of couples that are entirely comfortable and seem to be making choices 100% TOGETHER, and with complete regard for the other. These are the folks with the secure and stable marriages. Both partners seem content and relaxed, no hidden agendas or unspoken anxieties between them.

I feel like my husband and I are equals in it, even though sometimes I'm a bit more interested and other times he's more interested or pursuing it more. I tell him who I'm interested in getting to know better and/or who I'm attracted to, but I really want and need for him to tell me what/who he's interested in, too. We agree to not "take one for the team". We feel like if we are both equally having fun (or at least close to equal) with a couple, it's much more likely to be a good thing for both of us. If one of us is having a grand time and the other is not, then "we" are not having a good time.

Some of our standards as a couple have come through much talking ahead of time, and agreeing. And some of it has come through experiences, trial and error. A bad experience or "error" doesn't have to be the end of the world, or the end of swinging. We talk through what went wrong from our viewpoint, and then talk about how we'll do it differently next time. In the lifestyle, there is no room for misunderstandings between couples. They have to talk.

Hope that helps a little!

[Carol_Danny]

Originally Posted by Chicup

There is a saying that its the men who first drag the women into swinging and then have to drag them away, which seems pretty true.

In General, this is true. As the "Orientation" couple at our old club, we were the ones who first met with couples entering the Lifestyle. We would give them information and answer their questions. We did this for about 5 years back in the '80s. In many cases, it was the man who first broached the subject to his partner, and at first, the women always were just a bit leery about it, but willing to give it a try.

What usually ended up happening was the woman would get right into it, rather quickly, which in many cases shook up the male partner. Once he got over his initial shock (and had his ego and confidence stroked by his wife) things would get smoother. But, it always seemed that the woman was the partner driving their journey through the Lifestyle.

Even with us, after all these years, Carol is the priority in what we do and who we do it with. I really just follow her lead.

[Vespertine]

Originally Posted by EvilMJ

I am the one who brought it up in our relationship and I am having a great time.

Dito

Same here.