Why do you full swap?

[Sweet_Candy]

Originally Posted by kinkycouple_21

We have been together five years and he has expressed many times that it is every mans fantasy to have a threesome.

I missed that memo about it being every man's fantasy to have a threesome.

Oh, and the memo about it being every man's fantasy to watch two girls play with each other.

Would someone help me understand why I keep missing these memo's?

[Sweet_Candy]

Originally Posted by CB_n_Red

As for larryt9, resorting to that sort of language and abusive behaviour tells us rather a lot about him. My sympathies are with his missus if she has to put up with that whenever she tries to express her views.

CB

Dito Well put CB!

[larryt9]

To clarify things - My girlfriend has expressed interest in another woman/threesome. I do not impose my wishes upon her. I have been totally honest with her (and no, not abusive. Most people tell me I'm one of the most easygoing people they know). To state again - I would not be able to handle seeing her with another guy. This is an absolute which she is well aware of. She knows that whatever else we do, that cannot happen and us remain a couple. If that makes me immature, jealous, selfish, whatever, so be it. If she has to have that, then we would just not be compatible. As someone asked me earlier in this post, yes, I am smart enough to know that if I get mine, she might want hers, as she might be entitled to it. That is why, as I said in my post, that I am perfectly willing to give up the other woman scenerio if that is the tradeoff. I am totally happy with our sex life as is. Michelle is the most sexual woman I have ever been with, we both love having sex at the swing club (with each other), and I love her. I'm not pushing her to do anything, including the sex club, which she enjoys at least as much as I do. And if anything we do were to make it uncomfortable for either of us, we don't do it. We have excellent communication, and very congruent desires. My question was to find if there are others, both men and women, who do not like seeing their partner with other people, but in order to do what they want to do, allow their partner to have their fun, even though it might bother them. I'm not willing to do that. So I'll pose the question like this - If you knew that your partner would have equal amazing pleasure no matter what the scenerio,
whether it be other partners, watching, threesome, etc, what is the scenerio you would choose? And as far as name calling, I'm certainly not the one who started that. I asked a question. I wasn't asking for advice, or some amateur pscho-analysis. I do think its arrogant for anyone to assume you can read my psyche based on one paragraph. And besides, I think I was pretty honest about things. I can't handle her with another guy. That line cannot get crossed. If she "gives" me a threesome, she will know very clearly that she doesn't get to have another guy as some sort of payback. No lies, no maybe's. And if she doesn't ever want me with another woman, then it won't happen. So answer my question if you feel like it, don't if you don't, but please don't attack me or my motives for putting the question out there. Could it possibly be that there is some truth for some of you about it being "the price you pay", and that it might hurt a little to face up to that? Honestly I hope thats not the case. I hope you do what you do with 100% happiness, and no negative emotions hiding way back there somewhere. Thats why I don't do it. Because I couldn't do it with 100% acceptance and joy.
Sorry to make this my introduction to the board. My sweetie and I will be at the Trapeze club in Ft. Laud. tomorrow night, doing our own thing, totally enjoying having sex with each other in a room with 30 other couples. Hope you all have a great weekend also.
Larry (and Michelle)

[acple4fun]

You know Larry I wasn’t going to reply to this but hell you seem to be on a rant so let me break this down for you so that somebody with even a limited understanding of the English language would be able to understand it.

“you're fucking clueless. did you even read my post you moron?”

As a matter of fact I did, the question is did you. By your response it seems that my reply to your questions must have hit a nerve. If you don’t want to hear the answers to a question then don’t ask them on a public forum, talk about clueless.


“I don't need to do any swinging/swapping - I'm totally happy with things the way they are now.”

Well that’s great and I for one am very happy for you. But that does pose the question, just why then did you come onto a swingers web site and ask the question in the first place if you didn’t want the feed back. Maybe next time you might try just asking for replies from people who are going to give you the answers you want to hear. If that’s the case then you may want to post the answers you want to hear along with your question.

“But if we do end up doing anything at all, both of us need to be 100% happy.”

That might just be the most intelligent thing you’ve said in this thread.


“I'm not ok with her being with other guys. Does that make me immature?”

No I wouldn’t say that statement in and of itself makes you immature. What I would say in regards to maturity is that your reply stands alone as a testament to your immaturity.

“I am too jealous to let her be with another guy - therefore its something we don't do. if she doesn't want a FFM threesome, or something like that, we're not going to do it.”

Why don’t you tell me what I’m missing here. That is if your not saying we are going to do what I want to do or we won’t do anything at all. Maybe your not saying that your willing to add another woman into the equation for your pleasure but it sure sounds that way to me. You know what they say, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck chances are it’s a duck.

“I'm not asking her to sit and watch me. How fucking arrogant are you that you can assume that I treat my lady as a possesion?”

Your right, I may have been a little arrogant to think that. I really didn’t mean to arouse your deep since of chivalry. After all you are on a swingers board and did mention that you were open to a FFM three-some didn’t you. Also where in the world would I get the idea that you would treat your lady like a possession? After all anybody could tell she has a lot of input into your pleasures just as long as she wants to do what you want to do.

“Keep your fucking psychobabble to yourself next time, or tell them to me face to face if you're in south florida. Would love to meet you.”

Now how could anybody read that statement and think that you were immature. The only question that I have is are you in of high school yet and does you mother know your posting questions on a swingers web site. You’re a piece of work, but be careful of what you wish for.

[larryt9]

"The only question that I have is are you in of high school yet and does you mother know your posting questions on a swingers web site. "

She helps me with my grammer and some of the bigger words.

[TNT]

larryt9,

First and foremost the thing that you need to understand about posting anything on a public message board is that people are going to respond. Different people will read the same thing many different ways, therefore you are going to get 1000s of different views on any given subject, regardless of whether or not it was the exact question you asked or not. That is the beauty of a message board. If you get a response that is not to your liking, please DO NOT attack anyone. Ignore what you don't like, don't respond to it unless it can be done in a respectful manner.

Now to answer this question...

If you knew that your partner would have equal amazing pleasure no matter what the scenerio, whether it be other partners, watching, threesome, etc, what is the scenerio you would choose?

Everything and anything We like so many different things that it is hard to choose just one...so we do it all.

We don't believe in playing tit for tat...it will never lead to anything good in the long run.

As it's been said before, numerous times :rollseyes , there are just as many ways to swing as there are swingers...it does not matter what others enjoy and/or are happy with, all that matters is what the two of you are happy with.

As far as paying any type of "price"....I pay nothing and neither does Ted...if there was a "price" to pay then we definitely would not be swingers.


Teresa

[larryt9]

teresa,
Thanks for your response. I'm much calmer now. I really am a pretty mellow person.

[intuition897]

Swingersboard is the great site that it is because of its members and the quality of their posts. There's debate, and then there's argument. Even if someone else posts something inflammatory, it does nothing for the board or your esteem in the eyes of other board members to add fuel to the fire. We're all intelligent human beings here, so let's not resort to personal attacks.

larryt9, I agree with others above that no one should ever do this and try to "suck it up". If it bothers you, then it bothers you. There aren't many options. You can:
1) Play it by your rules...for a while. My guess is, human nature being what it is, your girlfriend will eventually get fed up with you being the only one to have all the fun. Maybe not, but I'm talking about probabilities here.
2) Don't play at all. At least not with other people. Keep doing what you're doing now, which is playing with each other. This is a static situation that will not grow beyond this unless you choose to make the changes necessary to facilitate it.
3) ...and this is the tough one: Take a good hard look at why you are experiencing feelings of jealousy. This is not something that is easy to do, because it digs up lots of "interesting" feelings that we've all worked pretty hard at burying. In the long run, this path-less-taken is the one I would suggest. But it is only something that you can decide to do when you feel ready to do so. It is not impossible; just difficult. If you have no interest in changing this aspect of yourself, then your choices when it comes to swinging will, unfortunately, remain limited.

[larryt9]

"Play it by your rules...for a while. My guess is, human nature being what it is, your girlfriend will eventually get fed up with you being the only one to have all the fun. Maybe not, but I'm talking about probabilities here"

I've probably made a mistake. I've assumed that since Michelle and I go to a sex club and have plans to introduce a third party at some point in time that I could hang with "swingers". That doesn't seem to be the case. My apologies. Michelle and I will probably never get to the swap stage (just for the record, this whole thing started because of her interest in another woman. I just feel that whatever we do we should do as a couple). Responses like the above assume that swap would or should be our ultimate goal, which I assure you its not from either of our perspectives. Thanks for those that responded pleasantly, and my apologies to those I've offended with either my question or responses. Have a great weekend, and if you're in Lauderdale, Trapeze is an amazing club.
Larry

[good times]

Originally Posted by larryt9

Responses like the above assume that swap would or should be our ultimate goal, which I assure you its not from either of our perspectives.

I think you have incorrectly identified the assumptions of the previous posters. Their are a lot of ways to enjoy swinging and not all of them involve "full swap", and I didn't get the impression by reading any of the above responses that anyone assumed that full swap is the only way to swing. But you specifically asked "here's my question for those that do swap", so it is no surprise to me that the answers you received are in reference to swapping. I think the responses you got above are based on thier interpretation of your original question and they assumed, as I did, that you feel that people are making some form of concesion or sacrifice to let their partner play with others.

Your original question was,

Originally Posted by larryt9

here's my question for those that do swap - Is allowing your partner to swap simply the price you have to pay for you to have your fun, or does the swap itself turn you on?

This question implies that one of the partners is doing something that they wouldn't normally do to satisfy the other partner. The answer to that is, no we don't, I would never ask my partner to do anything that they aren't comfortable with doing just to make me happy, nor would anyone else who is successful in this lifestyle. In fact, I wouldn't enjoy it if my partner was just doing it to please me and didn't enjoy it herself. I don't 'allow' my partner to do anything, she is a grown woman and we are both more than capable of deciding what we want to do together. Nor do either one of us have to 'pay a price' for anything we do. And yes, in our case we do swap and swapping is what turns us both on.

You then rephrased your question,

Originally Posted by larryt9

So I'll pose the question like this - If you knew that your partner would have equal amazing pleasure no matter what the scenerio,
whether it be other partners, watching, threesome, etc, what is the scenerio you would choose?

Same answer though, I would choose to swap as that is what gives both of us pleasure. Again, we would never do anything that either one of us doesn't find pleasurable. For us it is a team effort, we always decide what we are going to do together so that we both get a good experiance from any activity we participate in while swinging. This doesn't mean that I think someone who isn't into full swap is wrong or somehow not doing it right. As has been said many times on this forum, their are probably as many ways to swing as their are swingers.

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by Sweet_Candy

I missed that memo about it being every man's fantasy to have a threesome.

This is a huge myth for us as well. Sure - MFFs are really great, but they aren't something we pursue. We really do prefer couples. Singles are nice either way - and honestly single males and single females are about equal on our "interest radar".

Spoomonkey

[Spoomonkey]

You know - I have a list of "Things About Swinging That I DON'T Like". It is going to make a great chapter in a book someday...

One of the things I absolutely detest is the idea of "tit for tat". I think the original question is simply that, "do you engage in 'tit for tat'? I scratch your back, you scratch mine?"

It is a fair question.

If Larry is uncomfortable with adding a man to his play - then Michelle needs to know that up front. If she is doing a MFF to "earn" a MFM, then she is doing it for ALL the wrong reasons. If she enjoys MFF and is okay with Larry's boundaries - then what's the problem? I mean, swinging is what THEY make it - right?

I don't indulge my wife so that I may earn something for myself. We both agree that we only do what we would both enjoy. I would never do something that I couldn't handle so that she'd give me something in trade. That just isn't us - and I don't think that is particularly wise.

Honestly, I think it cheapens the moment. I mean, if one partner is doing this just so they can earn a favor down the road... :rollseyes The ugliest word in swinging is "obligation" and that is all the "trade off" mentality is. "Because I did this, you are now obligated to do that."

That shows a lack of respect, maturity and communication. Larry, if you and Michelle are doing MFF because you both want to and enjoy it - then good for you. That is what the lifestyle is about. You make it what you want it to be - no one else can define it for you. Everyone puts their own twist on it.

I think I see where you are coming from and hope my post kind of clears things up a bit.

Have a good time at trapeze.

Spoomonkey

[Dynamar]

Originally Posted by larryt9

I am too jealous to let her be with another guy - therefore its something we don't do.

larryt9, perhaps you are a very mellow guy... but there's just something about this phrase that just struck me the wrong way. I'm not a "tit-for-tat" proponent either... to each or each couple's own, I say. There's obviously many, many ways to swing and each person or couple needs to decide on the boundaries for themselves.

However, the way you've phrased your posts in a couple of instances leads me to believe that your female 1/2 doesn't have a whole lot of say in the thing, and we've not gotten to hear her side of it all.

I'm with the ever wise and level-headed intuition when she suggests examining the whys of your jealousy. If the two of you communicate about this, it's very possible that it can take your relationship to a whole new level and that can be a very positive by-product of the lifestyle, indeed.

All the best to you both...

[funn]

[quote=larryt9]Hi,
(eventually we'll get to having another woman in some way).


Actually Larry, you did mention in your post that you were going to have another woman in some way.

BTW, you are very rude.

[larryt9]

"BTW, you are very rude."

Once again, my apologies.

Spoomonkey - thanks for your response. You get exactly what I'm saying/asking.

Others seem to think its all my way. I wrote "I am too jealous to let her be with another guy - therefore its something we don't do." to which someone responded: "larryt9, perhaps you are a very mellow guy... but there's just something about this phrase that just struck me the wrong way... leads me to believe that your female 1/2 doesn't have a whole lot of say in the thing, and we've not gotten to hear her side of it all."

Then let me add to my original sentence - "I am too jealous to let her be with another guy - therefore its something we don't do. In addition, she has said that she would be too jealous to see me alone with another woman. Therefore that won't happen. (True - I didn't just make that up)." I actually like that she feels jealous of me in that way. Michelle gets total input (from me - get it!!!). We are 100% partners. The fact that I only wrote about my limits is only because I am doing the writing, but I'll be sure in the future to talk about her side of things.

But this all leads me to another question, and the real reason I'm writing this response. More then one person has suggested I examine my feelings of jealousy, and if I can get past my insecurities, doubts, etc, and can let Michelle be with another man, it will move our relationship to a whole new level. (Read Intuition's response). I find it a little strange, particularly from a group that probably has to fight for some acceptance of their lifestyle, to not just just accept the choices Michelle and I make. I don't agree with the premise that feelings of jealosy, etc, have to be gotten over, and that I am too insecure to let her be with another man. I hope no one gets defensive about what I'm going to say, because I certainly don't mean it as an attack of any kind. To each his own, live and let live. But I don't quite hear that in return. I feel that certain acts of intimacy between a woman I love and who loves me should not be shared with others. I truly couldn't imagine another man touching, caressing, making love to Michelle. I don't think that is something I should try to get over. The "its only sex" thing doesn't fly for me. Intuition and others seem convinced that their way is "better", as opposed to just saying it is better for them.

Funny thing happenned last night. Michelle and I were making love, and I started talking about how I see the "other woman" joining us, which up to now we both got into. But last night she didn't get into it the way she usually does. Later I asked her whats up. She told me she had been thinking that things are so awesome between us as it is, and she loves what we do at trapeze, and she changed her mind - she doesn't want another woman joining us. She just wants to keep it striclty between her and me. So thats how its going to be. I don't think there's any feelings either of us need to work past. Anyway, thats how I see it and what I'm picking up from some responses. Is it just my imagination, or do some of you feel that Michelle and I are less mature emotionally because we don't want to swap?
Thanks
Larry