Should my SO be seen as a single since I don't play?

[little firefly]

Hi all! I have a question that I need some opinions on. NDN and I are on another swing site that most of its members are in our general area and a lot of those attend the swingers club that we go to. I received a rather mean spirited email from a couple (I'm not sure if it was the man or woman who wrote it) saying that I have no business going to an on premise club if I have no intention of any kind of play with anyone else, that my presence there upsets the atmosphere of open minded adults there to have a good time. I could understand that if I was walking around spewing out hateful remarks about swingers or anything like that, but when I go I'm there having a good time too. I shoot pool, get in the hot tub with friends and play with NDN in the public playroom.

I was also told that I'm being selfish and holding him back from enjoying the lifestyle because I'm on his profile as part of a couple which is misleading because he plays as a single (It's on our profile in a couple of places including our headline that he swings but I don't so I've never even given the slightest impression that I'm interested in play). I was told that if he's going to have fun in the LS that I either need to stop being so uptight (I'm not uptight I'm just not a swinger) or that I need to totally let NDN go solo. It's true that it's been difficult for him to find playmates. Most couples we've come to know want full swap with other couples or they want that elusive unicorn for FFM play. He's had a chance to play a couple of times with couples wanting a MFM and really enjoyed it. I'm just really wondering now if I AM holding him back from having fun. I do want him to enjoy the LS (I'm still not 100% comfortable with it but I'm honestly getting there albeit a bit slowly) so I'm not sure what to do. Part of me thinks that I should just let him have his own profile as a single and that I should let him go to the club alone, but I know that I enjoy going to the club with him and having a fun night out together.

That email was really upsetting to me. I'm pretty sure that it was written by a couple who go to the club (although there were no face pics so I don't know who they are). I just need some advice on what I should do. Do I let him be seen as single or do I keep things the way they are with us being a couple but only him being open to play? I want him to be able to get the most out of the LS.

[TNT]

The truth of the matter is, he's not going to get as much out of swinging being an attached male whose SO does not play, as he would if he were truly a single male.

It's also true that each couple makes of swinging what THEY want, not what someone else thinks it should be.

Should you let him be seen as single when he's really not? I think that's a question only you two can answer. If he advertises as single, chances are he will get more opportunities to play, but is being dishonest about his attachment status what you and he want to do? Or, would you rather be honest, state how it is between you two and enjoy playing with those that know your arrangement and are okay with it?

Personally, I would rather be honest and play with those who are okay with our rules/agreement/arrangement and not give a second thought to those who aren't.


Teresa

[sexcupid]

Perhaps they feel it is misleading b/c it is listed as a couples profile? For example, locally on Swing Lifestyle there are a few couples that also have singles profiles. Either because they were singles that met in the LS and are now a couple or b/c they partner up to go to events. And the couples profile usually says "We have singles profiles and those usernames are XXXXX and XXXXXX". So perhaps he could list a SM profile that references back to your couples profile to see that he is a legitimately attached/playing with permission male (but again you may run into those that either don't want you watching or inadvertently try to get you in on the group play). Do what it is you are comfortable with.

More misleading IMO are the single guys that list themselves as a couples profile to turn up on more searches, since many of couples block single male profiles from even looking at theirs....or the SF profile that conveniently states she has a hubby/BF that wants to watch them and join in...but because alot of people search specifically for SF profiles, it is likely to turn up in more searches.

As for the email you received, sure it was hurtful...but you don't know who sent it. But from some of your other postings here, its not like these sort of things haven't been said to your face at the club. Heck some couples may view it as a bait and switch type of thing (regardless of the words coming out of your or NDN's mouth...people hear and see what they want). Whereas we see postings here about some hot bi-fem hitting it off with the wife/couple and once they are in the room, then here comes her hubby that the wife wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole...perhaps people are seeing it as sort of a reverse bait and switch...he has you to 'lure' in the couples and then presto...you don't play...and they don't necessarily want to play with a SM.

There have been times that I think we have all wondered if we are hindering our partner's enjoyment/opportunities for whatever reason, I know I have. But overall I tend to look on our LS activites at best as a hobby we occasionally engage in...and if someone has a problem with the way we do it vs the way they do it...well they can just go piss off.

[LikeMinds321]

No matter how you and NDN decide to work this, you will have roadblocks due to your unique arrangement. The email you received from that couple was hurtful, and I don't think they needed to send it. However, I do feel other couples who both swing feel as they do - not every swinging couple, but many do - they just won't speak up.

little firefly, you can continue to not swing, NDN can keep his couple profile, but be ready to thicken your skin, because you'll get bashed by some people, however subtle, and it won't feel good. You'll have to decide how much is too much to take. Eventually you may feel that being involved in the lifestyle as you presently are is not fun.

I have seen married/committed men who have permission to play alone set up a "single male" profile and I think that is the better way to go as long as NDN makes it clear in his profile that he has a partner who doesn't swing but sometimes joins him at the clubs to socialize...,etc.

I suggest this approach because if my husband and I wanted to find a single male to join us we'd search the "single male" profiles. Same with couples profiles, when I look at those I want a couple to play with us, and opening a couple profile only to read that the man's wife/SO doesn't play would not sit right with me. People put in searches to find what they want, if you aren't playing as a couple, don't list NDN as a couple. That's this woman's opinion.

Even listed as a single male, attached, but with permission to play is going to be difficult. Once people find out you like to hang out with the swingers but not participate in play with swingers, people may not contact him. Even if you decide to never be involved in the swinging environment and let NDN out all alone, it may be difficult for NDN to find playmates, it's just the way it can be for males playing alone.

As genuine, truthful, kind, sexy, and likable a couple can be, the swinging lifestyle can be hard on couples where one plays and the other just hangs around or only plays with their own mate.

LM

[DigginIt]

My personal opinion is that the couple that sent you that email are a couple of jackasses.

Little Firefly, I agree 100% with what TNT said above. It may be more difficult for your husband to find play partners with your unique situation but the fact of the matter is you are there supporting your husband.

If anything, I would bill it as you are the cheering section and that you find it hot watching him, etc. Build it up that while you don't play, your not a party pooper sitting on the sidelines watching the clock.

I don't recall, I've read all of your posts, but do you participate at all? Even if it's just kissing your husband or playing with his cock some when changing between positions for instance?

You and your husband have rules and regardless what they are, anyone who doesn't like them or respect them has the right to move the fu@k out and should do so without passing judgement on that couple.

My thoughts!

[little firefly]

I don't recall, I've read all of your posts, but do you participate at all? Even if it's just kissing your husband or playing with his cock some when changing between positions for instance?

Whenever he's playing with another couple I just sit somewhere else and watch along with others in the playroom who are watching. I don't want my participating in any way with him to be seen as my willing to play with the other couple. I'm happy to just let him have fun while I watch.....And after he's finished playing with them and if he has the energy left then I have my turn, lol

I do appreciate all the opinions. I think maybe a separate single profile for him linking back to the one of us might be the way to go.Thanks everyone!

[little firefly]

Originally Posted by sexcupid

perhaps people are seeing it as sort of a reverse bait and switch...he has you to 'lure' in the couples and then presto...you don't play...and they don't necessarily want to play with a SM.

That's possible but I really don't see how they could. From the moment a couple engages us in any kind of conversation we let it slip into the convo that I don't play but that he's more than welcome to. One couple took us up on that offer and he had a great time.

[little firefly]

Originally Posted by LikeMinds321

little firefly, you can continue to not swing, NDN can keep his couple profile, but be ready to thicken your skin, because you'll get bashed by some people, however subtle, and it won't feel good.

So much for people in alternative lifestyles not being judgmental!! And please believe me when I say I'm not saying that against just against those in the swinger LS who are that way. I mean that against ANYONE in any alternative LS (including the BDSM one which I'm a part of) who bashes anyone who doesn't see things the same way they do or live the same way they do (kind of reminds me of how a great deal of the vanilla community acts)

[bbarnsworth]

Originally Posted by little firefly

Hi all! I have a question that I need some opinions on. NDN and I are on another swing site that most of its members are in our general area and a lot of those attend the swingers club that we go to. I received a rather mean spirited email from a couple (I'm not sure if it was the man or woman who wrote it) saying that I have no business going to an on premise club if I have no intention of any kind of play with anyone else, that my presence there upsets the atmosphere of open minded adults there to have a good time.

Wow. *wow* I agree with DigginIt. These people are jackasses.

How many other places do people go to and not do what the primary purpose of that place is? Are you forced to have an alcoholic drink if you go to a bar or else face the wrath of everyone who does imbibe? Unreal attitude on the part of these people.

If I were your husband, I'd *want* you there. Why? Because I'm not going to lie to a couple and tell them I'm a single male. If I tell them I'm married, most couples are going to ask for proof of permission from my wife. The fact you are there means it is far more likely he'll have a chance to play with other couples.

Also, just because a couple shows up at a swingers club doesn't mean they have to play with anyone, nor does there have to be a chance they will play with anyone. Some couples like to go for the atmosphere, to watch others have sex, to talk with open minded people, to have sex in front of other people. None of that requires you to swap partners with someone else. The fact that your husband can play with others is a bonus, not a detriment.

The bottom line here is that couple is way out of line.

As for making a single male profile; I think this is a good idea, so long as it's made very clear that he is married, and playing with permission. Further, that said permission is readily available for anyone asking and you (the wife) are happy to provide it, over the phone, in person, what have you. Having such a profile will increase his opportunities for play. As is, as others have noted, his chances are pretty limited through online sources since most people looking for single males to play with aren't looking at couples to do so.

My wife and I happily entertain single males, or married males playing with permission. So far, she hasn't played with a married male playing single. There's been a couple of offers, but both flaked as soon as we asked for proof of permission. If you had a single profile noting permission was readily available, and all else being fine, we'd probably contact you. We've said this before in other threads.

Don't ever let anyone, ANYone pressure you into doing more than you want. If you don't want to play with someone else, that's perfectly, absolutely, 100% fine. Whether you eventually do so or not is of no matter, no concern. So far as I'm concerned, you're very welcome in the lifestyle. I'd be quite happy to sit with you, chat with you, while your husband has sex with my wife. It'd be a very enjoyable experience. There's plenty of room for that in the lifestyle. Anyone sending a letter like the one you received is effectively clueless. Fun doesn't come in one size fits all.

[little firefly]

How many other places do people go to and not do what the primary purpose of that place is? Are you forced to have an alcoholic drink if you go to a bar or else face the wrath of everyone who does imbibe? Unreal attitude on the part of these people.

LOL, I never thought of that but definitely true!

If I were your husband, I'd *want* you there. Why? Because I'm not going to lie to a couple and tell them I'm a single male. If I tell them I'm married, most couples are going to ask for proof of permission from my wife. The fact you are there means it is far more likely he'll have a chance to play with other couples.

That's the way I had seen it as well. I mean with me there to give the ok then the other couple knows for sure that they aren't getting a cheating spouse!

Some couples like to go for the atmosphere, to watch others have sex, to talk with open minded people, to have sex in front of other people.

That's why I enjoy it. I love the exhibitionist and voyeuristic aspect of being there

Thanks bb, you've sure helped make me feel better!!

[SecretAsianMan]

If NDN *does* create a single-guy profile... then he's going to take all the crap from people accusing him of being misleading in his profile since he has a S/O and others who'll immediately assume he's cheating on his S/O because he's now selling himself as "single/unattached"

I say - keep your "couple" profile (from what you've said - you've more than clearly stated that he's the only one in the pair who'll play).

No matter what you do - SOMEONE is going to have issues with it. (Despite how "open" the people in the lifestyle are ... there are still a LOT of immature / drama riddled -folk who'll never be happy because everyone isn't doing it THEIR way)

[VegasLee]

Few things to get real about here.

First off, the email came from a nobody in your life so don't let it upset you at all. They are no more then a pixel on the Internet. As stated above, you need to get thick skin and forget about the nonsense that will come your way.

As far as being at the club goes, there are many, many, MANY people that go to Swingers clubs and conventions that ARE NOT swingers. They are there for their own reason just as you are.

Be very up front with people that talk to you at a club, you are not here to play, period, right up front. No use wasting there time or yours.

As far as people in this lifestyle or any other lifestyle being less judgmental, where did you get that? People in any lifestyle are still just people. They are not more open minded or less judgmental at all. They are just "different minded."

There are going to be people in person and on the Internet that are going to have things to say to your face, behind your back and otherwise. If they have no direct connection to your life in general then don't let them have the power to effect you or your moods. They are not worth it.

I have read many of your posts since you came here. Personally I feel you attempt to bring some of this upon yourself. I think you need to figure out just what works for you and yours and go with it and stop nit picking it do death. You have put yourself into situations that did not work out and it hurt you or made you upset. Don't do it. Keep it simple.

If he wants to play and you want to allow it, then do it. KEEP IT SIMPLE.

I hope it all works out for you and him.

[exploringRM]

Since you are part of the encounter, though just watching or nearby, then a couples profile should be ok. If someone contacted you and you went to meet them..do you go as a couple? If so then couple it is. If though NDN heads out on his own for solo play instead of both of you involved somehow (you don't play but you still are involved) then I think a couples profile would be misleading.

[little firefly]

Be very up front with people that talk to you at a club, you are not here to play, period, right up front. No use wasting there time or yours.

Believe me I do. That's always one of the first things I mention whenever anyone engages me in conversation.

As far as people in this lifestyle or any other lifestyle being less judgmental, where did you get that?

I got that from several people in the LS who were trying to educate me on the way lifestylers think. I've been told that since they don't live or think as vanillas do that they don't judge people as vanilla society would....I've seen this mindset in the BDSM lifestyle (as I stated I'm a part of) as well.

I have read many of your posts since you came here. Personally I feel you attempt to bring some of this upon yourself.

Honestly thats not what I'm trying to do. I'm just trying to navigate my way through a lifestyle that is foreign to me....And not doing so very well I guess.

I hope it all works out for you and him.

I'm sure that it will one way or another. Thank you, and I do appreciate all the advice.

[The Fuse]

My take on the profile is this: we look at profiles to find potential playmates. Since NDN is playing and you're not, I feel that puts him in the category of "single" for play purposes. So, he should have a single male profile. He can clarify within the profile that he has a non-playing SO who will give permission and be present.

This is, of course, my biased view as someone who looks at couples profiles to find couples who play. Your situation doesn't fit into an easy category, so some people will find that beyond their ability to deal with. But for swinging purposes, my opinion is that NDN is more like a single than part of a couple. Either way, you have to explain yourselves, but I think the single category is more descriptive in the context of swinging. I mean no disrespect to your actual, real-life status as a couple.