How to Distinguish Good Instinct from Inexperience?

[KayJay]

Hey There... Brand New Couple Here... Experience: ZERO beyond a couple of public meets and extensive IM convos with one couple (if we're white belts, they're one or two belts up from that).

My wife and I are looking for another couple with which to explore her bi-curiosities and other fantasies and feel really safe with this couple, except for one thing: The situation we find ourselves in is my wife is really really clicking with the other guy's wife and both of us guys are interested in each other's wives as well, but us guys don't have a whole ton in common yet, save for our lifestyle commonality.

During our last IM convo, the other guy's wife went to bed and it was just the three of us (prob red flag number one). LSS, he ended up divulging information about their previous experiences that he knew was TMI and ended up lying to his wife about saying anything and asked us to keep his discretion on the down-low (red flag number two). His wife found him out the next day and that wasn't so bad except he seemed more concerned that she was gonna throw in the swinging towel rather than how he hurt her (red flag number three).

Obviously this made us uncomfortable, but his wife calmed down rather quickly and we appear to be right back to where we left off beforehand and my wife is very encouraged as we thought that was gonna be a deal breaker given his wife's caring and cautious nature.

My main question here is even though they didn't break the deal, should we still pull the trigger given his indiscretion this early on? In his defense, he simply got carried away and divulged something he shouldn'tve out of excitement but the cover-up is what leaves me uneasy. The communication between my wife and I is awesome and got even better as we talked this problem out, but is their communication our concern too and should all three of us suffer simply because of the indiscretion of one? We feel it could've just as easily been our mistake as we're human too and rookies to boot, but find it funny that our "rookie" communication appears better than theirs. We wonder that if he felt the need to lie at this point, how long has it been going on between the two of them and where does it end? Our instinct says that he's in this for the wrong reasons, even though the other three of our little four-some appear to be on the same page.

Thanks everybody and you can prob guess my opinion here, but my instincts have been wrong before and my wife and I are on very new territory, so I'm not gonna jump to any conclusions w/out your experienced perspectives. Many heads are better than two (no pun intended)!

[Alura]

Wow! I can see the reason for your concern, Jay. Communication is everything in swinging and lying is a big no-no!

My guess is that you and Kay should talk this out some more with an emphasis on how his lying to his wife affects y'all or if it does, and make a decision on how to approach the issue.

Communication between couples is all important, too. I think Mrs. Alura and I would have decided to meet them (for dinner or drinks) one more time and tell them exactly what our concerns were. Perhaps y'all can solve the problem and help the other couple along the road to better communication as well. If not, y'all will be no worse off and the two of you can start looking for a new couple then.

Mr. Alura

[JustAskJulie]

One question to ask yourselves... is the indiscretion you described (as far as what he told you) something you'd be uncomfortable with if you were on the other side of the story? Ie. Later on when they are looking to hook up with the next couple, that may be you are they are telling a story about... how does that make you feel?

As far as the lack of communication between he and his wife that would bother me/ us as well. The one thing you will always see people say here is trust your gut. No matter how new you are to swinging, we all have gut instincts when it comes to people. If you are seeing red flags popping up right and left then you have to pay attention to them. CHances are that won't be the last time you see those flags.

[ViSexual]

I do agree about the red flags. And, definitely about how the husband might let his tongue slip with someone else about you.

But, as far as the couple having issues? Well, she did find out and they dealt with it, right?

It's difficult finding couples with good chemistry and it sounds like you four might be finding that together. I'd talk to them, together, about your concerns.

[Mr. Truelove]

I'd stay your gut instinct on spotting red flags was great. I think you are reading those types of signals correctly.

As for if that matters to you, well that is something you'll have to decide.

I've learned to trust my gut. It seems when I don't, I always end up wishing I had.

[FullThrottle]

We don't play with couples that have issues they can't "keep" from us. If they argue publicly or lie to each other we're out. Period. I would never....ever....ever lie to my wife or try to keep something from her. Especially involving someone whom I could possibly be having sex with. That's borderline affair type stuff. I am 32 and my wife is 37 and we dated for 4 years before we were married. We had a pretty rocky relationship most of the time we dated. Then something just clicked. We always talked about her fantasies to be with a woman but never expected to act on them. We finally about 6 months after being married we decided, "Why not?" Now we've been in the LS and quickly evolved to full swapping for about two years. The ONE thing I can accredit the LS for is a 100% upfront and honest relationship with my wife. It brings that honesty and openness to a whole other level. I could never see myself doing what you decribed the other guy did to my wife and we will not play with anyone who would. That's just my $.02

[Elena]

Hammerhead here guys. Lots of good advice so far, but what Julie said rings true for me and the missus. Let me share;

We met a couple on a site and after trading emails and texts etc, we hooked up. They were "new" to LS tho we wer'nt much "older".... When we hooked up, everything was going good and began to play (same room)... Now Im not much but I do like the female to have "a little" interest in me while Im going to town! While I was getting a few "bad vibes" during the drink/meeting stage the wife and I chaulked it up to thier being nervous. I mean they DID say she was shy.... BUT, while Im doing my thing with her, Im just getting the feeling she wasnt wanting to be there... Now, the reason I like the lady to be interested in me is because my belief is, when she isnt but goes ahead anyway (just kinda lies there ya know?) then really what Im doing is raping her! Think what you wish, this is how I feel.... and in the LS we call this taking one for the team.

So, I stopped what I was doing, looked down at her and just ask her, "your not into this stuff are you?"... with almost tears in her eyes she just shook her head... I smilled at her, stood up and got dressed and told her im going to step out and enjoy some copenhagen.... Now my wife (in the 2nd bed) sees this, stops and comes out to join me, asking whats up. I tell her and she says "ok we're done then!"... end of night....

Moral to the story, IF EITHER OF YOU FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE AT ANYTHING/WITH ANYONE it stops right there...... so talk with each other first, if thats still a go, talk with the female part alone.... if you get the good vibes shes still ok and alls good, then carry on and have some fun... If not, then you dont have to play! You can still be friends and talk about LS stuff together!!

[Meetussoon]

In response to the title - always trust your instinct. Experience will impact your comfort level and perception, but your gut instinct will still be your best geiger counter.

Swingers are people, you have been reading people and situations your entire life, trust it. The few times we have ignored our instincts, are the few times our stories have less than great endings. Luckily, our bad stories are not too tragic.

Trust yourself, your partner, and your gut.

[Powerglide]

If someone can't keep their lips zipped when needed, I personally wouldn't want to get involved. Discretion is key. Honesty is a big plus, too. You and your wife can do better.

[KayJay]

UPDATE:

Hey all and thanks so much for your informative and heartfelt replies, we expected nothing less from this board and pondered everything you had to say!

After our post we got together with them a few more times over drinks and it is clear to us at this point that we may have misread the situation to some degree and things are definitely looking up now. The more we get to know the couple the more endearing they are and the more clear it is to us that their intentions are nothing but good and we sense no ill-will whatsoever from the male half at all. Turns out they've had some bad experiences in the past (totally not their fault) and have had a really tough time finding a compatible couple, so when the sensitive info slipped out he panicked and was afraid of losing all of the good ground we'd gained. I know it's no justification, but like I said before it could've just as easily been our mistake and being that we're all four relatively new to the scene, we're gonna chalk this one up to "Inexperience" all around.

Thanks so much for looking out for us and we will be sure to keep you all posted as things continue to develop in this very new journey for us! Cheers and Happy Holidays!

[Powerglide]

Originally Posted by KayJay

UPDATE:

Hey all and thanks so much for your informative and heartfelt replies, we expected nothing less from this board and pondered everything you had to say!

After our post we got together with them a few more times over drinks and it is clear to us at this point that we may have misread the situation to some degree and things are definitely looking up now. The more we get to know the couple the more endearing they are and the more clear it is to us that their intentions are nothing but good and we sense no ill-will whatsoever from the male half at all. Turns out they've had some bad experiences in the past (totally not their fault) and have had a really tough time finding a compatible couple, so when the sensitive info slipped out he panicked and was afraid of losing all of the good ground we'd gained. I know it's no justification, but like I said before it could've just as easily been our mistake and being that we're all four relatively new to the scene, we're gonna chalk this one up to "Inexperience" all around.

Thanks so much for looking out for us and we will be sure to keep you all posted as things continue to develop in this very new journey for us! Cheers and Happy Holidays!

Sounds like you've handled this very well. Hope you and your friends have lots of fun~

[qreskupl7476]

Always trust your red flags, ESPECIALLY when you're new! I tell you this from experience, as we have ignored ours a time or two, usually to our peril. Like you, when we were first starting out, we got bad vibes and chalked them up to beginner's nervousness. It got us in a few not so happy situations, fortunately nothing serious, but we learned a few valuable lessons from it. Don't worry about whether or not you're missing out on something by being cautious, chances are you're not missing out on anything except drama. If you continue to feel out the situation and the red flags diminish, which they sometimes/often do, then proceed, but not until or you may end up regretting it. What never happened can't hurt you.

Just my 2/100ths of a dollar.

Mr. Q

[mikeandjenn2001]

I hate to jump on the bandwagon, but I am going to agree with everybody else. You always want to trust your instincts and go with your gut feeling. Jen and I have had a couple of situations that turned out bad, and we had ignored our feelings.

As for arguments in front of other couples, Jen and I are guilty of that, but they're minor arguments and get quickly resolved.