How can I trust my wife again?

[azcouple85379]

I am in the military and stationed in San Diego in Jan of 2007 I moved my family from San Diego to Phoenix so my wife could take and excellent job at a very large insurance company, Phoenix just also happens to be where I am from.

It was understood that we only played as a couple with other couples and this would happen when time allowed and I always drive home every weekend. While in PHX we went to a few clubs and a few house parties but never really found any couples that we were both attracted to enough to play although there were a few. I also made it clear to my wife that her cheating would end our marriage. I have to throw that in there because her cheating ended her last marriage while they were in the lifestyle, he was also military and it happened while he was deployed. I recently deployed to Iraq and am here as of this writing. Before I left my wife tried to start a conversation with me regarding her playing while I was gone that only got me upset and that was really all the further that went.

About a month and a half into my deployment I decided I was being unfair and consented to letting her play with a couple that are friends of ours that we have played with on several occasions. I also agreed that she could play 3 times during my six month deployment but only with other couples as it was a single guy that got her in trouble with her last husband when she wanted to keep him around after her husband got home. But I wanted to know honestly what she had done, if anything, since she had moved to PHX (there we some emails in our couples email account that made me suspicious) so I needed to know. She then confessed to sleeping with at least 5 other guys while I was away in San Diego during the week and 1 since I had left for deployment at a swing party. Two of the guys she slept with on more than one occasion, all at our house while our 2 year old son was asleep down the hall. The swing party was the weekend after I left for deployment. Three of the guys were from her work where she has now been passed over for promotion two times even though she is the top performer on her team. Not saying its related but she did say that her managers "golden boy" found out about her first trist by overhearing them talking about it at work and she says he has a big mouth.

She says it was just for sex and I believe her. She does crave variety and tells me often that even after she has sex with other guys that I am the best she has had. The problem I have is now I feel I cannot trust her because several times during the year I would ask if there was something else going on and she lied. Her reason was she didnt want to upset me. Even at the start of the deployment (before we agreed she couple play 3 times with other couples) she told me not to worry because she was not going to do anything and would not have men over to our house (also obviously a lie). I do NOT want to end our marriage I love her with all my heart. The other issue is that if I told her that her cheating would end our marriage and she did it anyway, then how much does she really value our marriage? I mean yes it was for sex but does she just come home to me because of the security or our son? The sex was obviously important enough that she would loose all of it to have it, so what do I do? How can I trust my wife again? Is it possible I can put this behind us? She says 3 times with couples will work for her (which now works out at about once per month) until I get home but how will I know she isnt calling up one of the other guys?

I told her when I get back I will be more proactive when we go to parties as I am kind of shy which is I guess another reason we dont always play at parties. She says when we go to parties and dont play it gets her all worked up and that was another reason she went outside our marriage.

I am sorry I probably jumped around alot its just how my thoughts spill out and if I go back to proof it I might end up changing things. Any help would be so very much appreciated.

N

*edited to change email notifications from daily to instant*

[JustMrJ]

I have to ask how long both of you have been in the Lifestyle?

If not both, then who introduced who to the Lifestyle?

Now to the lecture based on your post...

Well, first thing I see here is that she is not being honest with you. Since we are only getting one side of the story (no offense) I would think there may be a lack of both communication and honesty/trust/love.

The communication part could be that she has not expressed her 'needs' properly until your last conversation.

As to the honesty/trust/love issue, I'll break it down like this...

Honesty: You've already said that she had five single men over without ever mentioning it to you AND she knew it would make you jealous. This leads us to...

Trust: I think that jealousy falls into this category (at least for me). If she didn't fear your anger/jealousy, she would have no need to hide things from you. You should both be able to come to a compromise as adults and not have these trust issues. I trust my wife with not only everything we own, but my life as well. She would never intentionally hurt me and I would never intentionally hurt her.

Love: This one is a tough one for me to put into words, so bear with me... It would seem you both have a large rift between you. If you are both loving and respectful of each other, then there should be no subject and no physical or economic reason for her to stay or go. Love should be the reason she stays... not the greatest sex from you. To me this sounds like a 'line'. Spouses should stay with each other because of love, not just sex. Sex can be important, but it is not the end all and be all of a relationship.

My wife is my best friend first... if you find that this is not the case with you and your wife, maybe you both need to seek proper counseling. Even if you consider her your best friend, I see things going on here that best friends would NEVER do to one another.

If you truly love your wife and you believe that she truly loves you... SEEK HELP! You two need to communicate without emotion getting in the way of the information. I realize that this can be a HUGE hurdle to clear, but it is essential for both of you to understand one another. If this line of communication is not open properly, I don't believe you will be able to resolve the other issues correctly.

I do hope you two can work it out. I hate to see any couple unhappy or break up, especially with a child in the mix.

I apologize in advance if I seem harsh. I've been through a bad marriage and better communication would have let us work things out sooner so we wouldn't hurt each other so much. My first marriage had to end and it would have no matter what, there just wasn't that two way love going on. It was all one way from me to her... and her side was all 'lip service'.

[azcouple85379]

You are not being harsh at all, and I appreciate your comments. Its not that she stays with me for the best sex ever, I do think she tells me that so I will feel better about myself. We tell each other we love one another every time we talk.

She has been in the lifestyle I would have to say 9 years as part of a couple with her previous husband. I was always a single male and was introduced to it in 2001 before I ever met my wife with some friends of mine who were swingers and invited me into their bedroom. That situation ended rather poorly when his wife and I became too attached to each other. So needless to say I am the less experienced of the two in our marriage.

I know we have problems communicating for exactly the reason you mentioned, emotions always get the better of us and we end up defensive and arguing instead of communicating rationally. I originally wrote most of what I posted in a long email to my wife but like you said I was worried it would just open an emotional fight instead of two way communication, especially since considering the time difference between here and AZ it would be the first thing she read when she woke up and start her day off in a very bad way.

Of course she hid it from me because I would be angry since the rules were that we were in the lifestyle as a couple but i dont really consider myself jealous of another male in a couple when we are playing together as a couple. She even said that when she told me, that she wanted to tell me everytime she did it but was afraid at how upset I would be. I feel that I would be entitled to feel that way given the situation, but that is not what I am feeling now. I just want to be able to put it behind us have it not happen again and be able to trust my wife when she says that it wont.

I feel that I should add that we are in the lifestyle because of her choosing not mine. She said before we got married that she could not be with someone that would not be in the lifestyle. I did not particularly want to be in the lifestyle but I will for her so that is the compromise. We do it but only as a couple with other couples. But as it works out the more we do it the more comfortable I become with it.

[des1re06]

First, thank you for your sacrifice on behalf of our country.

Some people are not meant for monogomy. Your wife sounds like she is one of those people.

You knew she was a swinger when you married, but she's really acting more like a cheater than a swinger (which you know, and seems to be the problem). Swinging to us is an experience we share to enhance our sex life.

Counseling - may be difficult to find someone who will counsel you without being judgmental. Actively seek a sex therapist and let them know up front about your lifestyle.

I know this is doubly hard for you being deployed, and I just hate this for you. Having to deal with a cheating spouse while you're trying to do your job is just awful.

Finally, put your foot down and put a stop to all swinging until you can work things out and she can respect your boundaries. Your post sounds like you feel you should open up and change, and I feel that she is the one who needs to put the brakes on because she's hurting you.

Good luck,

Mrs. D

[ncmd_couple]

AZCouple,

Thank you for your service to this great nation! You be careful in Iraq and make sure that you let us know that you got home safely!

As a Navy combat vet myself, with over three years at sea, I can appreciate your situation. In some ways, I think that serving today on long deployments is harder for you now than it was for me. My only communication back home to the wife and kids was through letters. We didn’t have e-mail and we might be able to place one short MARS call during the entire deployment. So we could always dream of a peaceful home waiting for us when we got back and we didn’t have to worry about it too much.

Unfortunately, underway widows are a reality of life in the service. And quite honestly, I think you should table this until you get home. There really isn’t anything you can do about it right now. So take advantage of the next three months and take your soul out and look at it, and work out in your mind how you want this to be resolved when you get home. Not a hard and fast solution, but guidelines toward working through it with your wife.

Normally, you could go to the Chaplin about this, but not in this case, because swinging could put you in a sticky situation with the military depending on who you talk to. The fact that you laid down the law that the marriage was over if she cheated should be abandoned. That is history, and there is nothing that you can do about it at this point as it sound to me that you do not want it to end.

Tell your wife that what you want from her is for her to be honest with herself, and honest with you. Don’t push her into a corner that makes her feel that she does not have any choices for resolving this with you when you return. And make sure that she knows that you love her and want nothing more than to return safely home to her.

Remember the KISS principal. Keep it simple stupid! Keep it simple and loose until you can get home. Then the two of you can work together to resolve this. In the mean time just ask her to be honest with herself and you and you two will be able to work it out.

Good Luck!!!!!

S

[azcouple85379]

well i had written a very nice long reply and when i hit spell check it decided to *poof* so here is the short and sweet version

Mrs. D - thank you for your well wishes on my deployment it is my honor and a priveldge to serve, even after 10 years and 4 deployments i am still at a loss for words when people thank me for doing my job.

NMCD - thank you for your service also. i am also a sailor but gave up my sealegs to be on the ground with the guys closer to the fight and have not regretted a minute of it. some nights i even get to sleep in a bed not the two inch piece of foam in the coffin rack on the boat. of course there are the bullets, mortars, grenades and IEDs to worry about but that is why they issue body armor and MRAPs.

i am still welcoming any input and appreciate all the responses i have recieved so far. JustMrJ i think you kind of help me see it from my wifes perspective but i still stand by my reasoning that i reserve the right to feel hurt/angry/decieved/betrayed by her actions given the ground rules we both agreed to.

[JustAskJulie]

Originally Posted by azcouple85379

I know we have problems communicating for exactly the reason you mentioned, emotions always get the better of us and we end up defensive and arguing instead of communicating rationally. I originally wrote most of what I posted in a long email to my wife but like you said I was worried it would just open an emotional fight instead of two way communication, especially since considering the time difference between here and AZ it would be the first thing she read when she woke up and start her day off in a very bad way.

Write it all out and send it to her. Everything you've told us. The problem here is not that she can't be monogomous (anyone can). Once upon a time I would have said that there was no way that I could be monogamous... that was before I learned how to communicate with my partner and was in a relationship where I felt that no matter what I said, they might get upset initially but that we would talk it through rationally and work it out together. I think the biggest issue here IS communication. And the only way to fix that is to start communicating.

On one hand I think it's understandable that you would set boundaries for while you are away but on the other hand I feel like asking her to go without anything the entire time you were gone (after having been actively swinging as well as had you around for regular sex) was a bit much to ask. She should have spoke up then and let you know that she didn't feel she could handle that (and maybe she did and you got upset, which is what led her to do things behind your back... if you got upset at the IDEA of what she might do how upset would you get at her actually doing it?). I'm not trying to justify her actions because they were still wrong, but I do understand where she might be coming from and you need to try to do so as well.

Now, what has happened has happened and you need to be able to move past it. If you have trouble telling her how you feel without emotions getting in the way, write it out and communicate these things via email for now. When you get back home, though, I highly suggest couples counseling so that the two of you can learn how to communicate better face to face without the emotions coming between you and effectively ending the conversations. Hopefully, now that you have given her some leeway and set some boundaries that she feels she can live with, she will stay within those boundaries for the remainder of your deployment and if not, you need to make sure that she knows that she can and should tell you anything that happens so that you can talk about it together and maybe work on figuring out why she felt the need to stray beyond the boundaries.

[WeUse]

Having never been separated from my wife like you are, I can't even begin to imagine what it must be like -- so far away with a sense of not being able to be in control. Whatever happens, I wish the two of you the best- and, like others, thank you for your service to the country!

[azcouple85379]

Just wanted to clear one thing up. She only cheated on me one time since I have been deployed in April, the other times were while I was at home but like I said I am stationed in San Diego and she lives in Phoenix. I drive home every weekend, so the majority of the times she has done it, it was while I was gone during the week in San Diego, not while I have been deployed. So I do think it was wrong of me to ask her not to do anything the entire time I was deployed which is why we worked it out so that she can sleep with other couples that we have been with before.

[VegasLee]

Honestly, only you know if you can forgive her or not.

This all depends on what you want for the both of you.

You can set "rules" that you both can live with and expect those rules to be followed or you can bail out on the relationship. I am not suggesting giving it up but you are the only one that can decide this. It is your trust that has been betrayed here.

Best to work on this in person but you don't have that choice.

Tell her what you have told us. You know how she is, can you live with that or not? She likes to party even when she knows she is breaking the rules. Can you live with a change in rules or maybe if she values her relationship with you enough she can live with a change of rules.

Nothing we can do here can fix your trust in her, only you and her can do that by coming to an agreement that you both can live with. Dwelling on it forever is not going to make things better for either of you.

Good luck to you and Thank you for the service you are providing to everyone in this country!

[azcouple85379]

VegasLee,

Thanks. I guess that pretty much sums it up. I appreciate everyones comments and suggestions, I think I just needed a place to be able to vent it all and hopefully I can word things to her in way that will not automatically put her on the defensive.

[JustAskJulie]

Originally Posted by azcouple85379

Just wanted to clear one thing up. She only cheated on me one time since I have been deployed in April, the other times were while I was at home but like I said I am stationed in San Diego and she lives in Phoenix. I drive home every weekend, so the majority of the times she has done it, it was while I was gone during the week in San Diego, not while I have been deployed. So I do think it was wrong of me to ask her not to do anything the entire time I was deployed which is why we worked it out so that she can sleep with other couples that we have been with before.

That does make a BIG difference in my POV on the situation. I agree that knowing that she couldn't even last a week of seperation without cheating it was probably a bit much to think she could go 6 months. But the fact that she couldn't even make it a week without cheating and lying tells me there really are much bigger problems that need to be addressed. At this point I don't even think it's about swinging ... for her swinging is just a way to cheat with permission. You guys need councelling both as a couple and from the sounds of it she needs it on her own to work out her issues. She may have a sex addiction or it may be some other deep rooted issue (fear of committment, etc) that is causing her actions.

[JustMrJ]

azcouple85379,

I do hope you can work this out. As others have said... write it out in an email as that will keep the emotions out of it some. To really tone them down, even in an email, write it out in something like 'notepad' or 'wordpad' and review it a few times after you have fully read and touched it up a few times. Maybe even leave it for an hour or so (if it's your own computer) and then go back and read it again to make sure there is a very neutral tone to everything you say.

You want to communicate the information at this time. Trust, boundaries, partners, etc.

As to the 'love' portion... keep your emotions in it as that is what you say you really want to communicate to her.

Be safe... *HUGS*

[iapr]

God bless you for your service and sacrifice and I wish you a swift and safe return home after your deployment.

IMHO this really isn't a swinging issue but rather plain old adultry and unfaithfullness. The lifestyle was just a venue where she hooked up with some of the guys. At it's core, adultry is often about selfishness, disrespect and lack of compassion for all the parties that are hurt in the process. This ain't swinging this is just fucking around.

Screwing 5 guys under your nose and 1 more as soon as you are deployed is just plain over the top. That is not an inability to remain monogamous and it has nothing to do with needing variety, that is just plain bad behaviour.

Keep in mind also that this is what you have found out about. God only knows what other secrets are still out there. the only predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour and her past ain't soundin' so good at the moment.

I honestly do not know if one can communicate and counsel away bad behaviour, selfishness or disrespect. I don't know if the problem here can really be "fixed." I think what needs to take place is you need to decide what is best for you and your son.

You need to circle your wagons and get your affairs in order and prepare for battle to protect your own interests and the health, safety and welfare of your child. Only you can decide what you can live with and tolerate but whatever choice you make you will need to protect yourself and your assets and your child.

You may love her and she may be the hottest thing you have ever laid eyes on but she is not sounding like a good person and you need to protect yourself and pursue your own best interests. I agree with counseling but that counseling should be for yourself on how to stand up to the bitch and fight tooth and nail to protect your assets and how to protect your child. God only knows what kinds of guys she is bringing around your son. You need legal counseling, financial counseling, child welfare/parental counseling and probably a good dose of personal counseling.

I don't know if your marriage is worth fighting for but you are worth fighting for and your son is worth fighting for. Fight for yourself and for your son with all you have.

I wish you Godspeed and good luck.

[ViSexual]

Military separations are a bitch!

When I was a Combat Controller (we were gone a lot), during Viet Nam, I had a friend who'd get divorced each time he went overseas. Really!

They were a very attractive and happy couple but just agreed this was the best way for both of them. He didn't like writing letters and she didn't want to stay horny all the time. That's exactly how they put it. They did this three times that I know of.

I was single and had the opportunity to be with her while he was away but they were just too good of friends for me to feel comfortable with it.

OK, that said, you're in a little different situation than he was. Your wife was an active swinger and you'd had at least that one threesome relationship. Your's ended badly and that might have made you a bit apprehensive of the lifestyle in general.

Now there's really no defending her being deceptful to you but it might be because she doesn't feel she can be totally open and honest with you yet.

And, the fact she doesn't want to just leave you and find someone else tells me she loves you and wants to stay with you.

If it were me I'd think that I have to decide whether to drop all rules and just enjoy her for who she is or think about separation.

Good luck and watch out for yourself over there. Don't let your mind dwell on your relationship to the point of not thinking about your safety.