No single males? Why not??

[BettyAnnMBSC]

Roxy wrote:

"Did you ever stop to think that maybe its not all single guys. Just maybe its your attitude and approach that makes single guys behave the way that they do? "

There is an experiment presented in an earlier post which addresses whether it is the attitude of the women/couples or the single male here that gives a generalized (not all single men - just many) opinion of single men in the lifestyle.

That experiment proposes that you create a Yahoo screen name which is a swinging couple or female with a profile. Then enter a "romance in xyz" chat and say nothing but hello.

In many poeple's experience you will immediately be innundated with messages of the crudest nature asking if you want to do all manner of things and of course, whether you have some pictures he can have.

This then implies that it is not my attitude toward men which cause them to react this way when placed in proximity to the lifestyle -- but instead, their assumption that all women in the lifestyle are an easy lay and that we are not at all selective. Of course, this is a generalization -- I'd bet that Bob would never do such a thing.

This has nothing to do with whether I like men whatsoever -- I do like men. That's a generalization too though. I like some men -- not all men...

So, in answer to your question, yes I have stopped to think that it is not all single men. That is the a point of my writings here. But it also a fact that we must consider many couples do not invite single men to play and also a fact that someone wanted to know "why not?" We can't tell him that the reason that some couples don't invite single men to play is 'because some single guys are really nice"; or can we?

So, I ask you too -- why do some couples not invite single men to play? or conversely, do most couples invite single men to play?

Caution though -- if you answer either question, some readers may take offense to your observations and opinion.

[M&B]

Originally posted by OhioCouple
M&B and Perseus.... did ya'll miss this paragraph which was included in the same post that you quoted and responded to? Did I not spell it out well enough?

I missed nothing, I promise you.

I still want to score.

[BettyAnnMBSC]

Did you ever stop to think that maybe its not all single guys. Just maybe its your attitude and approach that makes single guys behave the way that they do?

I just read over this entire thread again to make sure that I hadn't said "all single men suck" -- I didn't. I have made it clear over and over and over that I am referring to the generalization of "single men" and not to the specifics of any given man.

Maybe I was completely incorrect in what I have written and I do appologize then if I was.

Since I too have obviously upset some folks though -- I will concede that maybe I am wrong here... So, do I understand correctly:

1) most clubs and couples DO invite single men to play
2) most single guys are really great and it's only a very small few that are obnoxious or just out to get laid.
3) I shouldn't attempt to keep my discussions on this board/site to the topic of the thread but should just let my thoughts ramble from point-to-point -- I should expect everyone else to do the same.
4) I should consider that if someone asks any question - it must be answered in the same manner that we answer "is my ass too big" -- ie: "of course not honey..." Otherwise, someone's feelings may be hurt. They didn't really want to know the truth anyway.
5) couples should invite single males into their intimate relations solely 'cause single guys deserve sex too...
6) when a debate gets too heated, it's ok to change the topic or introduce faulted reason, that way people get to hear only what they like and nobody gets ruffled feathers.

I think I understand now...

I'm glad I'm now enlightened on these points and have gained greater knowledge I look forward to the next heated discussion -- now that I know what is acceptable procedure.

Betty Ann
bowing out of this debate before I really piss someone off
I have truly enjoyed reading the reason of some of these posts though -- and hope to read from some of you more often.

[OhioCouple]

Bama, I too understood your intent. It's just that some of the single men (which is what the topic is about) are taking it to heart that they are unfairly treated, where as couples and single gals can do no wrong. Throw in the age factor.... and bingo, we are off to the races again....

As for your question of Harrison For or Kid Rock, well I don't know who the latter is, but Harry can eat crackers in my bed anytime! Woot! Woot!

I'm 42 and I wanna score too, M&B. You are in good company, most of us here wanna score in some capacity, with whoever tickles their fantasy!

[OhioCouple]

Originally posted by Roxysbayou
If the intent of this question was for no single guys to answer then why was it posted in the Swinging Single section of the board?

Perhaps because it pertained to singles and not couples?

Furthermore, several of the "single" men who did respond have had long term swinging careers as a couple and are only recently single. Therefore they have seen the best and worst of both worlds and are probably more "qualified" to answer this thread than you are.

How could a single be more qualified to answer a question about "Why 'couples' don't invite singles into their bedroom "? The question was for 'couples', at least the way I understood it. It wasn't posed to specifically singles that used to be couples and have played both ways. So in my eyes all 'Couples' past or present are EQUALLY qualified to answer, in addition to all singles that have had the opportunity to veiw it from a couples point of view. If only those that have played on both ends of the field are qualified to answer. Well then, what do we have 4 or 5 regualars to respond? Perhaps the original poster should have said... "Gentleman, those of you that have been past swingers as couples, and are now single, why don't you allow singles in your bedroom.?" That would have made a whole lot of sense. Then we would be asking for singles to explain their fears on bi-sexuality or homo-sexuality. Completely different question.

Did you ever stop to think that maybe its not all single guys. Just maybe its your attitude and approach that makes single guys behave the way that they do?

And just why do you think it makes couples feel the way they do? I never asked to be IM'd constantly by men asking me what my measurements and age were or if I liked to suck cock. I never asked to be messaged by men that wanted to know if I had some pictures to share. I never asked to be SENT pictures of a hard on. I never asked to be asked to cyber chat. So who's approach is at fault here? I never approached, I was though approached. More times than I can count.

While I understand your efforts, I disagree with your logic.

[Flori_DAMAN]

Originally posted by OhioCouple
Perhaps because it pertained to singles and not couples?

Perhaps if the single had 20 years in a swinging couple relationship. It would be like if you lost your partner tomorrow. WOuld you lose knowledge also? Experience does not leave you once your partner does.

Indeed. Completly different. Perhaps the question was percieved by the readers own sense of reality, whether they be single, married or homosexual with or without fear.

I never asked to be lumped into the sinlge male asshole category either. Believe me I have met many married swingers that fall into categories that make most single male assholes look like saints. The ring does not make the person.

Having been a part of a couple for so many years swinging those requests were nothing more than a mild if not amusing item for me. It is normal. Non threatening and easy to delete.

Logicistal items are opinions. It may be perfectly logical to swing for instance to you, but you neighbor may find it abhorrent sexually deviant behaviour. Both are right in there own reality. It is ok to disagree, but hey, I disagree with yours but the lack of the ability to put ones self into anothers shoes is rather disagreeable to me also.....not that you meant me this time.

John,

[OhioCouple]

Originally posted by BettyAnnMBSC


I'm glad I'm now enlightened on these points and have gained greater knowledge I look forward to the next heated discussion -- now that I know what is acceptable procedure.

Acceptable procedure is posting what YOU feel about the topic at hand and wherever the subject has led to, as quite often it strays somewhat off topic. Just because some people don't like your personal observations does not mean that all do and it most certainly doesn't mean that your opinions have no merit.

Topics such as this can help you learn a lot about people in general.

So back to the original topic. I should have made my first response short and sweet.

Why don't we advertise or allow singles? Because we just freaking don't want to.

[b smith]

From looking at the replies this is a popular topic and have not read through all of the responses. Hope don't vary too much from the original question. As a couple our interest is sigle men in a threesome situation. We have had one experience with a friend and looking at doing it again with someone else. The problem is that we don't know anyone who is interested and so we have tried a few ads. When you have had a few problems it begins to make you less likely to believe the legitmate ones are out there, a snowball effect. An example is one who keeps on hounding us via email to meet us and we have finally reported him. Furthermore we get several response that start out with ".... [insert age] single male with [insert large size in inches] c*ock looking for sex with / looking to please women ..... have pics..... willing to travel ". There are so many problems with such an introduction like that I don't even know where to begin. Finally we get married men who either try to hide that they are married or say that they have their wife's permission. The problem has been a few has "spoiled" it for the rest.

From our experience with single males it is hard on intial contact to take what is being said at face value and they face an uphill battle created by those who lack the jugement to be in such a position. We don't want to sound as though we are bashing single males. By no mean are we but from our experience unless you know them personally, there tends to be a creditbility problem that has been created by a very small minority. The few bad experiences with contact that we have had has made us question everything that is being said to us and for the time being not too keen on trying it again.

Single males do have a role. Especially in a way of providing additional pleasures for the female in the couple. Because of this, it has made us consider it doing it again. It can be quite an enjoyable and erotic experience for all involve. The challenge for single males is building creditbility with the couple in the sense that they are not looking for a "quick lay" or thinking the reason why a couple is looking for a male to join them is because the female is not being pleasure by her spouse. A barrier has been created for those who are legitmate by those single males who lack the maturity for this type of situation. If a single male can be sensitive to the "couple's dynamics" they will be successful in a threesome / swinging situation. Single males should be aware the difficulty that they may be having may be one of two reasons. The first is they are insensitive to couple. This is the a minority of cases and the second reason being they are facing the effects created by the first group, of insentive single males.

[JustAskJulie]

It does seem that some folks in this thread are having a hard time dealing with what the original question actually was. This isn't a debate over why everyone should swing with singles as well as couple, or over why single males have such a hard time in the lifestyle.

The question was simply "why do some couples choose not to swing with single males?".

Several people posted their opinions/reasons for why couples choose not to swing with single males. Whether or not those reasons/opinions are valid in all eyes isn't really an issue. We could fight over that till we are blue in the face. But the fact of the matter was that people were giving their honest answers to the question that was posed.

I think my favorite post in all of this was the one that said, if you aren't one of the jerks then why do you get so defensive when people say that some guys are jerks? Some couples are jerks. Some married guys are jerks. Some single females are jerks.

Personally, I think I've ran into more pushy married men and couples than I have ever have single males within the lifestyle, but I have run into my share of pushy/jerky single guys as well. Fortunately, it hasn't been a high enough number to make me not want to swing with single guys as a general principle... just makes me not want to swing with those particular ones.

[De and Ci]

I don't know if this has been brought up before, But I think most of the "single males" that respond to postings with crude comments and disgusting photos are just fuckin' with people. I wouldn't be suprised to find out that many of them are just 14 year olds with their friends getting their jollies off as well as adults who haven't grown up yet. Its a shame-but since girls are from an early age are taught to be "appalled" by crude and sexist remarks, boys who want to make mischief find them easy targets.

[Soulfinger508]

...
So, here's another "why" possibilty for you...

Couples don't invite single men into their bedroom because some single men can't have a conversation and remain on topic. They let their mind run from her to there and back again. This would imply then that they won't be able to stay focused on a couple+single relationship either. It would appear too that single men tend to use "I" with the frequency that couples use "WE" -- many couples have developed a relationship over time that has created not a 1+1 is 2 people but instead 1+1= 1 couple. That is an idea that many single folk can't clearly understand.

This statement is a generalization. Not all couples and single males behave the way you desrcibe. One of the reasons I'm involved in the swinging lifestyle is that there's more directness as opposed to when you meet someone at a club or a bar. If they want sex, they will tell you and be upfront about it. It's obvious that we all had different experiences and opinions as far swinging goes, but I feel at the same time that it's unfair to pigeonhole everyone based on the actions of a few.

[topdog6]

I know women fantasize about two men and that is normal. If you want to fulfill the mfm thing with a single guy though don't fool yourself that he is there for any other reason except that you will DO him. I go crazy when I hear women say that they feel the men are there to please them. They are they because the women will spread..period! Frankly I worry about men who want to fuck everyone else's partner but never seem to have one of their own. Face it, your single male in the male-female-male combo is a lonely loser who can't believe some strange woman will let him go to town on her or that her husband will share in the first place. Unfortunately, one of the huge tests here and or in any relationship is would the person still associate with you if you weren't opening holes to him? I doubt it!

[Bob123]

I have seen many threads get off of the topic. I have not read every single thread on this board. I have never seem people being critisized for being off topic. Why is this thread any different? Are you only allowed to get off topic to chastize someone for being off topic? Are you only allowed to acknowledge the first thread? Do you have to ignore what was said by someone you want to address simply because they did not start the thread? Should you quote what the person said and make a whole new thread if you want to respond? These questions are for you Julie. Will you please clear the air for me? I am a little confused as to the rules on this.

Thank you

[De and Ci]

Originally posted by topdog6
I know women fantasize about two men and that is normal. If you want to fulfill the mfm thing with a single guy though don't fool yourself that he is there for any other reason except that you will DO him.

Wow! Really? I have seen the light!!

Uhh..what is that the woman wants from this "single" guy (or male half of couple for that matter)??? A meaningful relationship??

I cannot believe the bullshit that has been going back and forth on this thread!! All women basically like other women-men are just for sperm. Almost all single guys are jerks-makes you wonder who are these women married to? Their husbands were single at one time. And so on.

I guess we are oddballs! My wife loves cock, sometimes she will play around with other women in a limited way but only to entertain the men, she is not attracted to women at all. Translation: They can go down on her-but there is no way she will go down on them. The thought of a MMF turns her on and we did do a little of that and she enjoyed it. If we bring a single guy to play with us-I hope all he wants is an easy lay. Because all my wife would want from him is his cock-for her pleasure. Sure a friendship is ok, but when it comes down to it-swinging is about sex and making it exciting.

[Roxysbayou]

Originally posted by De and Ci
I guess we are oddballs! My wife loves cock, sometimes she will play around with other women in a limited way but only to entertain the men, she is not attracted to women at all. Translation: They can go down on her-but there is no way she will go down on them. The thought of a MMF turns her on and we did do a little of that and she enjoyed it. If we bring a single guy to play with us-I hope all he wants is an easy lay. Because all my wife would want from him is his cock-for her pleasure. Sure a friendship is ok, but when it comes down to it-swinging is about sex and making it exciting.

I agree with your last starement totally. The thing that I find so interesting about this lifestyle is that I find that my desires are always evolving. When I started out I was only interested in a FMF, and as time went on I progressed to couples and swap. I never really desired a MMF before, but I am opening up more to the idea all the time. I think for me, I would just have to be totally comfortable with the guy. I am not looking to replace or find something better than my hubby. Because there is no better. But there are still tons of fantasies that we have that have not been fulfilled. I think that if we stumble into the right one then we would have no problem with swinging with a single. Until then, I agree that the ones that bombard you with cyber and picture requests are a major turn off.