No single males? Why not??

[Bob123]

Your elf needs to find his niche -- and he probably shouldn't insist that "all elfs are good dentists" since most folks seem to know better.

I am not arguing that all elfs are good dentists. I am arguing that just because most elves that humans know are not good dentists doesn't mean that no elves are good dentists. You are telling me that I am arguing the basic premise that you in fact are arguing.

You are arguing that all single males are disrespectful when you should be arguing that some of the single males you know are disrespectful.

I say that all males are single when they are not with thier SO. So then it would seem that swinging is for women and the men they invite to join them and not for couples after all. This is fine, but lets call it what it is.

[bear_n_bunny]

Originally posted by EternallySingle
I know most couples are not interested in meeting single men. I know most single women in the lifestyle are not interested in meeting single men. I am not here for them. I'm here to share my opinion and read the opinions of others. If I make friends or enemies along the way, thats life, and I'll deal with it as it comes. I have a life outside of this board and I only come here when I'm downloading large files, like I am now.

I don't hold anything anyone says against them, but if someone makes a detrimental remark about a group, expect members of that group to say "hey, clarify that." You can't lump all single men, or all single women, or couples, or blacks, whites, asians, hispanics, catholics, protestants, etc. together and not expect someone to say "So, thats what you think of everyone like me?"

Just use a little more tact and take a little more time when making a post. Isn't that what a lot of couples and single women say to men about sending emails and writing ads?

Except that I don't recall anyone saying that ALL single men were obnoxious twits, nor was anyone pointed out by name as being such. However, anyone who has spent much time in the online (or realtime, for that matter) singles and/or swingers environment already KNOWS that there are quite a few single guys out here who ARE, in fact, obnoxious twits. Therefore you have no case.

[Flori_DAMAN]

OK, lets say someone named Lonelygal wrote this:

I have been in a swinging lifestyle for 5 years. My husband left me for the secratary at work and I would like to continue my interest in the lifestyle but don't quite know how.

Now lets say the poster's name were Lonelyguy.

I have been in a swinging lifestyle for 5 years. My wife left me because she found someone better. I want to continue swinging but it seems that couples have no interest in me.


ALthough both of these posts are not what the board is about the lonely gal would get much more attention than the lonely guy.

She would be smothered by the females that want to protect her, of course, without bias hehe. She would be flooded by guys that see a vulnerable lady out there, and if anyone dared to confront her they would be lamblasted. Couples would trip over each other to give her advice.

The guy on the other hand would be advised to watch out for self pity. The strong suggestion would be that he should have a female if he wants to swing. He would be put under the microsopic swinging inspectors that would suggest he probably did something wrong to begin with.

As I suggested this board is not about meeting people but discussing swinging. Us males that have been swinging for years and are still interested are just as capable of discussing it as the females that may be in the same boat or, just wondering.

It seems as if any single guy that expresses his feelings is catagorized immidiately as a horny failure, while a thwarted female is some kind of swinging icon.

If this were a meeting board I could have more tolerance.

Ahh....

John

[Bob123]

There are quite a few women who are goldiggers. Yet if I bring that up I am sexist. Why can you bring up a folly in a group of men and get away with it, when all men are not like that. The fact is there is a double standard.

[BettyAnnMBSC]

Ok, I've heard a lot of valid reasons so far but that one just is so 1800s. I don't swing primarily because of people who throw around statements like that.

That was posted earlier today regarding the fact that some women ask "why are you single" when considering single men. To be followed by

but if someone makes a detrimental remark about a group,

requesting more tact in message replies.

First, let me say that stating that some women ask that question is no more or less detrimental than saying that some people discriminate based on race. Certainly, you'll agree that racism does in fact exist in our present society. I imagine that you'll agree too that it's wrong. Stating that it does in fact exist is nothing more than statement of a fact -- an observable, quantifiable fact of social inequality.

If someone were to ask "why do some people not like people that are fat?" -- would the respondant be wrong to answer with his opinions? How can we possibly expect to understand a circumstance if we can't present the facts and opinions involved? Should fat people then be offended by the presented opinions?

If we can't have an open dialog that includes all opinions - whether they are right or not they are still prevailing opinion -- then we can not hope to even understand the tip of this issue.

I do believe I have made it clear that these are only my opinions or observations -- if anyone takes issue with them then present some opposing dialog -- I may just change my mind if you can convince me. I probably won't be too receptive though to "that's not right" as your sole argument.

So, are you prepared to argue that no woman considers the reasons why a man is single in her decision making? I personally know a few that do...

[Flori_DAMAN]

Originally posted by Bob123
There are quite a few women who are goldiggers. Yet if I bring that up I am sexist. Why can you bring up a folly in a group of men and get away with it, when all men are not like that. The fact is there is a double standard.

Bob, gold diggers need gold. There aint much of that going round here. I have seen no men trying to claim they are rich. What the fuck does that have to do with swinging?

[Bob123]

If we can't have an open dialog that includes all opinions - whether they are right or not they are still prevailing opinion -- then we can not hope to even understand the tip of this issue


That is what we are doing. You gave your opinion now he is giving his.


If someone were to ask "why do some people not like people that are fat?" -- would the respondant be wrong to answer with his opinions? How can we possibly expect to understand a circumstance if we can't present the facts and opinions involved? Should fat people then be offended by the presented opinions?

No a respondant would not be wrong to answer with his opinions. It is also not wrong if someone responded to his opinions saying that they are wrong. You are saying he should not be able to state his opinion if his opinion is that yours are wrong. Fat people can be offended by anything they want.

[Bob123]

Bob, gold diggers need gold. There aint much of that going round here. I have seen no men trying to claim they are rich. What the fuck does that have to do with swinging?


Her trying to say that single men think women in swinging are whores is like me saying that single women thing men in general are a mealticket.

The point is alot of men want to use women just for sex and alot of women want to use men just for money.

I bet that if I said I am sick of gold digging women I would be called a mysoginist. Yet these women say this about single men in general and then on top of that act like men are out of line just for disagreeing with them.

[BettyAnnMBSC]

You are arguing that all single males are disrespectful when you should be arguing that some of the single males you know are disrespectful.

I missed where I made that argument -- I wrote a reply to why "some couples" don't invite single men to play with them. It was not a discussion of "the men" but of "the couples".

It became a debate about "the men" when some posting took offense to my observations (based in reality) on why "some couples" don't invite single men to play.

So, let me put the nuber one reason that many couples don't invite single men to play in as plain language as I can. Then you can tell me how you intend to prove me wrong.

A large number of couples are looking to ad another woman to the mix. Since you don't have a coochie, you are not a qualified applicant! When you grow a coochie then you can come play with those couples. They may allow you to come play if you bring a coochie with you. Either way, it's about the coochie! How hard is that to understand?

Now, there are some couples who want to add another pecker to the mix. You have a pecker! You are a qualified applicant for those. There are other couples that want to ad a bi-sexual pecker to the mix. If you are bi or willing to be bi, then you are a qualified applicant. These are about the pecker! It's easy to understand.

There are some couples that want to bring in a pecker for her and a coochie for him -- if you happen to have both then you are a qualified applicant! That's easy too.

Now -- any of these can decide that you're mean, ugly, too tall, too short, too fat, too skinny, too young, too old, too poor, etc. etc. etc. if they want -- it's not about you being single as long as you're a qualified applicant.

Some may put even more requirements on their applicants than just the right anatomy -- they may require a particular size, age group, marital status (ie. not cheating or cheating), performance level, etc... You must meet these application requirements too or you're not a qualified applicant. Some don't approve of drugs, smoking or drinking, some require condoms, some require a certain education level.... IT'S THEIR CHOICE, you don't have to apply if you don't like it.

Sex isn't an equal opportunity adventure -- you have no inherent right to be included in any intimate relation - Ever! If you are afforded that privilege then you have been granted something special.

So, if a few of you will come to understand that sex with any woman you want is not your right but instead her privilege, you might just get better responses!

wheee! :evil:

[Bob123]

This is not about sex this is about respect. I do not know why people say swinging is not all about sex to single males like we don't know that and then in the next breath act like it is. The fact is females get better treatment pertaining to sex or not.

[Bob123]

So, if a few of you will come to understand that sex with any woman you want is not your right but instead her privilege, you might just get better responses!

I don't think that anyone on this thread said or even implied that sex with a woman is his right. If I did I know I did not mean to.

[Flori_DAMAN]

It seems that the only people interested in MMF's are couples that are pretty rock solid.

John

[BettyAnnMBSC]

Bob wrote:

No a respondant would not be wrong to answer with his opinions. It is also not wrong if someone responded to his opinions saying that they are wrong. You are saying he should not be able to state his opinion if his opinion is that yours are wrong. Fat people can be offended by anything they want.

after he obviously missed my statement that read in part:

I do believe I have made it clear that these are only my opinions or observations -- if anyone takes issue with them then present some opposing dialog -- I may just change my mind if you can convince me. I probably won't be too receptive though to "that's not right" as your sole argument.

So, Bob -- I'm waiting for some rational and reasoned dialog here if in fact

That is what we are doing. You gave your opinion now he is giving his

What have you provided to explain why some couples do not invite single men to play with them? You do understand that question I'm sure? The original question was regarding why some couples don't invite single men to play -- it was not about whether they should invite single men or whether single men are good or whether Bob is good.

Certainly you can stick to the main topic of "why do some couples not invite single men" instead of trying to redirect and refocus the discussion to your own agenda.

I'm sure you've made your agenda clear on these boards in other places. But I've yet to see you answer the question that was asked...

So far, I've seen counter-point fallacies that can be described as ad hominem, straw man, slothful induction, post hoc, non-support, and begging the question among others. This thread will make a great instructional page.

Now, opposing views, let's get to the question at hand.

Bunny2 asks:

I've seen a LOT of places that put great restrictions on the number of single males that can attend, plus a lot of personals that say "no single males, please". What is the problem with single males?

This question does not ask anyone to defend single males -- it simply seeks insight into why "a lot of personals ... say "no single males, please"

You can either address this question or you can not!

[Bob123]

The lack of sensitivity to single males hurts me. One woman started a thread about how no one asked her to dance at a swingers club. People all responded with very warm and caring sensitivity. No one told her it is not your right to dance with any man you want. No one told her that people just did not want her. No. They gave her advice and helped her feel better about herself the way people should.

[thump29]

Until recently we had considered single males up until I decided to give one a chance and he was a jerk. After that experience I do not really know whether we would consider another single male. I do happen to think there are some decent single males in this lifestyle and they do deserve a chance, but you have to understand that it is guys like the one we included that hurt the single males reputation.