Arrange a date with a single lady

[belgiumcoast]

Let me first give you some situational info on how we swing...

When I brought up the subject swinging about 5-6 years ago, my wife reacted: NEVER. We had some very long talks (6 months) and ended up agreeing that we would visit a club and it was her call to stay or go home. We had sex with each other that night there and long talks afterwards (positive talks but her first reaction was: next time not earlier than after 6 months, but when I asked to go after 3 month she was ok with it).

When bringing up the subject of having sex with others, her first reaction was again: NEVER... A few (5-6) months later we started chatting with a couple from a swingers site and set up a date. We had lunch, went bowling, had dinner and it was my wife who set the night on fire by kissing him, I followed her by kissing my date and at that time she was already fucking him.

From that moment on we have been seeing some couples but she's always VERY hesitant to meet new people, go to new clubs,... in short new things. I always have to take the initiative, talk her into it, but once we've done something she usually likes it.

And while we talk a lot about what we've done and what we like with our swing partners, tell each other all the juice details (and get horny again ), we never discussed any rules upfront, I always felt perfectly what her limits were and I always did go as far as what she was comfortable at that time. This has worked perfectly for us.

An example: 3 years ago she booked a swingers holiday on a small sailing ship without me knowing about it (I was extremely surprised her doing something completely new). We had sex with one of the couples the first night. The second night my wife was very tired (we skipped a night because our flight was at 3am), and told me she wanted to go to bed (at 8pm). I stood up to follow her to the cabin, but she told me I didn't have to go to bed knowing that I don't need a lot of sleep. For me that was a signal that I could have sex with the other couples without her being there, and without we've ever discussed this subject. I was completely right because the next morning I saw a big smile on her face when she asked me if I had had some fun (she wanted all the juicy details)

Last december we set up a swingers party at our home, we asked 5 couples we knew. One couple asked us if they could bring a single lady with them, and we agreed (though my wife was a bit hesitant about that because there would be someone alone at some time... she's not into 3-somes and didn't know about the other couples).
At our parties people usually mingle around : Mr A with Mrs B, Mr B with Mrs C, Mr C with Mrs D...
So my first partner of the night was that single lady (let's call her J.) and that was an incredible experience, my best swing partner so far. I had sex with some other women and finally again with J. (super again). My wife also had a great night with 2 or 3 other men, best party ever she told me. She also had talked with J. and they really liked each other.

A few weeks later we went to a club to meet some friends and J. was there too. Later that night while our friends were talking with other friends of them (whom we didn't know), my wife an I had a chat with J.
J. is a very crazy, funny person and we did some silly things (exchange ice-cubes/drinks while kissing) and we all had great fun. I was in the mood and wanted to go upstairs to the play rooms with J. That would mean that I would have to leave my wife all alone at the dans floor which would not be nice to her (and later she told me she had some thought of that happening and would have really not liked that).
So I didn't play with J. that night (my wife told me in the car that it was such a shame that I didn't have the opportunity to play with J.)

At the club we exchanged chat addresses and now J. and I chat a lot too (which always gets me very horny, my wife tells me she can always see that I'm chatting with J. because of the huge smile on my face). And while J. is a single lady we ALL 3 know that she is not a thread to our relation, she's a very beautiful, hot swing partner but I love my wife too much to even think about cheating her in some way.
J. also said she has seen the big love between my wife and me and knows her place, so that is a very positive thing. But there is some swingersmagic between the two of us

I want to meet J. and have some fun and I really don't know a good way to set up a date with her. Anything that I can think of would not be comfortable for my wife: she would be home alone while I was having fun, she is not comfortable/shy to find a single man, in a club I would have to leave her alone. Setting up a private party at our place (like the one were we met J.) is the only thing I can think of but we do that only 2 times a year and it's still a few months.
So my question is: any suggestions on how I can have some fun with J., with this IMPORTANT factor in your mind: the comfort, pleasure, happyness,... of my wife is my first concern.

[sexcupid]

Up until this experience with J...you or your wife have not contemplated (or maybe its been contemplated, just not acted on) the idea of playing with singles or having 3somes, it has always been couple swaps (excepting the experience on the cruise ship). Now, you've met this SF that really rocked your world and of course you want to play again.

You don't want to leave your wife alone at home or the club to go off and play. Does the club you go to allow single males in? What about the males of other couples you know/have already played with? Can they play if their wives aren't swapping with you as well? It's understandable if they don't since most couples go to play together, but some just kind of split up and work the room so to speak and can take what ever opportunities present themselves.

My primary thought is that while your wife may be friendly with J...your wife may have less than charitable thoughts of her and you if she feels like you are trying to concoct an elaborate scheme to get in J's pants again. Particuarly if you have never had this type of reaction to a playmate before.

Talk to your wife, she probably isn't clueless to the attraction you have. You may just have to compromise your desire to have sex with J everytime you see her to waiting for your semi-annual house parties (or hope that someone else in your group will host a party that J will be at).

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by sexcupid

My primary thought is that while your wife may be friendly with J...your wife may have less than charitable thoughts of her and you if she feels like you are trying to concoct an elaborate scheme to get in J's pants again. Particuarly if you have never had this type of reaction to a playmate before.

You're right about this... if I would do this without taken her into account, if I can find some way that she get's her part of the cake... I'm pretty sure she would be happy.
I'm looking for a way to involve her in our play and will discuss this upfront!

[fun4Ds]

Why not just have a get-together between the three of you ?

Have you thought about just having dinner or event outside the club/party and see where it goes, or is J only available for clubs or parties ?

[femnewb4u2]

Originally Posted by belgiumcoast

(though my wife was a bit hesitant about that because there would be someone alone at some time... she's not into 3-somes and didn't know about the other couples).

When you say she is not into 3somes do you mean she is not into any combination of 3 people at all? In which case you could talk about what it would be like for her to watch a show that you put on for her with J? Her own live theater porn show. This could culminate in her having all your attention. It would then be a matter of when this attention is given...with J still in the room watching or after J has departed.

Or is it the possible bi aspect in some 3somes that has her not being into them? What about a straight FMF? Where you pleasure 2 women and the women pleasure you. More work on your part than a FFM but can be very delightful and erotic.

I am not speaking to how J could react to either of these senarios. That is a whole other series of questions....

But whatever you do, please be careful of creating some setup to be with J without your wife if full agreement before hand. Heck, she may have some ideas of her own if you let her know your desires.

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by femnewb4u2

When you say she is not into 3somes do you mean she is not into any combination of 3 people at all? .

No not really. She doens't mind touching, kissing or even oral from another woman, but she once told me (though long time ago), that she gets much more excitement, pleasure, fun,... from a man than from a woman.
And I want my wife to have as much fun as possible (usually when I set up a date of arrange something I try to make sure it's a better experience for her than for me)

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by fun4Ds

Why not just have a get-together between the three of you ?

Have you thought about just having dinner or event outside the club/party and see where it goes, or is J only available for clubs or parties ?

I guess since I chat about 3-4 times a week with J., and 90% of those chats are now NOT swing related that a 'vanilla' date may be a good idea. We'll surely have a pleasant evening.

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by femnewb4u2

But whatever you do, please be careful of creating some setup to be with J without your wife if full agreement before hand. Heck, she may have some ideas of her own if you let her know your desires.

That, (I'm sure) won't be a problem. I was 99% sure before this post that I could set up a date with J. and mywife's would immedeately agree, but the reason for this post is that in most of such cases my wife would be 'home alone'. She wouldn't be jealous or so, but lonely and I love her too much for such things to happen. I surely want to have fun an a great time, but NEVER at the expense of my wife.

[sexcupid]

Ok, so let me make sure I understand...this has gone from 'how do I set up a playtime with this SF that rocked my world' to 'I want to take this SF out on a date'?

Here's my (admittedly slightly jaded) take on this. We swing, we go to parties/clubs/hotel parties/etc with the intent of fucking other people. And things are usually pretty good with those scenarios. We have friends that we chat with, look forward to socializing with. However, I would have a pretty big problem with my SO wanting to take one of our playmates/LS friends out on a vanilla date. Why? Because it smacks of you know...actually DATING this person...not just enjoying company in certain settings.

And if its just going to be a 'vanilla' date (dinner, movie, whatever)...then exactly why is it that you wouldn't want your wife to be there?

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by sexcupid

And if its just going to be a 'vanilla' date (dinner, movie, whatever)...then exactly why is it that you wouldn't want your wife to be there?

Did I write somewhere that I don't want my wife to be there ? I can't find it but if so sorry, that's certainly not what I want...

I want to set up a date with J. in a way that my wife feels comfortable with it, and has as least as much fun as I do! Like I wrote I'm pretty sure that if I asked my wife if I could set up a swing-date with J. and she would agree (immediately) but wouldn't have much fun (not sure about that though), so IF and WHEN I set up a date with J. it has to be one that my wife is really enjoying! (that is the reason I want some advise from the group).

We have swinger friends that become/became vanilla friends too, not much but it happens (3 couples now). Actually one couple is more vanilla than swing for the moment as she's pregnant. Another couple has a small baby and our oldest daughter often goes babysitting there. With all 3 of them we do vanilla things like shopping, DIY, go to the movies,... (our kids obviously don't know about our swinging activities and we never swing when they're in the house)
There are (much more) other swinger 'friends' who are not more than just 'fuck-buddies'.

So this vanilla date with J.: I wrote (obviously to quickly) is NOT me alone, but the three of us going to get diner together.

I now find out it how hard it is to explain such things on a forum as you obviously don't get the complete picture, and I forgot to give you some info, but here it comes...:

"90% of those chats are now NOT swing related" > this happens quite often with swinger friends: in chat it is not always about sex.
As I/we chat quite often with J. it's obviously not always swing related. When I wrote the post above about the 'vanilla' date, I chatted with J. yesterday evening about her getting a new job (she's signing her contract tomorrow).
When I told my wife about this (who was watching TV sitting next to me, while I was chatting), she said "this calls for a celebration" (she knows J. has had a hard time behind her: lost her job and was now in a job she really didn't like but had to keep because she's a widow).

I wrote J., that we wanted to celebrate this and she found it a great idea. So she asked what kind of celebration we had in mind, in the mean time my wife was following the chat on screen with me and told me to write: let's have a nice diner.

I hope it is clear now that my wife doesn't see J. as a thread (which is 100% correct!). Once again, YES I met a woman who (with your words) "rocked my world", but hey that only means swinging and has nothing to do with the relationship I have with my wife. Actually it does have something to do with it: again I realize how special she is, how much I love her so and how great it is that we can experience swinging. And yes it was the first time that this happened to me, but I'm so happy that this already happened a few times for my wife. Such experiences are pure sex and lust!

I still want to set up a swing date with J. in the way I described (in a way that my wife really enjoys that date or evening), maybe comes the diner date may lead to one..., if not tips on how to arrange one are still welcome.

(hope this is clear now, English is not my native language so I may not be using the right words sometimes) (can you explain the word 'jaded')

[lovinher]

I must be missing something so I have to ask. What's the problem? Your wife has already set the table for a "date" with J so go for it and make sure she (your wife) has a good time then go from there. Don't push the swinging with J until you see how your wife reacts on the dinner date.

But then....
This post below is a bit confusing because then you post that your wife will be there. If it's all about sex and lust why do you want vanilla dates with J?
If you are so worried about your wife being left out (and you should be), again, why would you want to go on dates alone? It sounds to me like you are a bit too enamored with J and over thinking something that you and your wife should be able to come to some sort of agreement on.

Originally Posted by belgiumcoast

That, (I'm sure) won't be a problem. I was 99% sure before this post that I could set up a date with J. and mywife's would immedeately agree, but the reason for this post is that in most of such cases my wife would be 'home alone'. She wouldn't be jealous or so, but lonely and I love her too much for such things to happen. I surely want to have fun an a great time, but NEVER at the expense of my wife.

[sexcupid]

belgiumcoast..the reason I am thinking that your wife would not be there is exactly what lovinher posted above.

It originally sounded as if you were trying to set up a swing date with J but didn't want to because you didn't want your wife sitting home alone...then you added more to say that you didn't care if it was a playdate, but a vanilla date. So adding the bits of info you gave (wife doesn't like 3somes, you don't want her to feel left out,etc), it wasn't a far stretch to think you were wanting to go out with J by yourself.

But I am of like mind of lovinher...your wife if obviously ok with meeting J for dinner (since she initiated that thought)...so she obviously is ok with spending time with J outside of a swing setting and it may provide a good opportunity for them to get to know each other without the pressure of being in a swing environment.

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by lovinher

I must be missing something so I have to ask. What's the problem? Your wife has already set the table for a "date" with J so go for it and make sure she (your wife) has a good time then go from there. Don't push the swinging with J until you see how your wife reacts on the dinner date.

But then....
This post below is a bit confusing because then you post that your wife will be there. If it's all about sex and lust why do you want vanilla dates with J?
If you are so worried about your wife being left out (and you should be), again, why would you want to go on dates alone? It sounds to me like you are a bit too enamored with J and over thinking something that you and your wife should be able to come to some sort of agreement on.

Once again I may have not been clear or misunderstood (probable the language barrier).

"What's the problem? Your wife has already set the table for a "date" > The idea vanilla date came after the initial post (at that time J. was just a swing experience). In the initial post I just wanted to know a way to set up a date with J. (and my wife) in a way that my wife would have at least as much fun as I have and being it a date with 3 (and not 4 as we're used to) I don't/didn't know how. I just don't want her to be left out. We're 17 years married next week and know each other for over 22 years in a way that I thought that couldn't be improved, however swinging did even improve our relationship beyond what I never thought could be possible. So once again a swing date would be very hot but I NEVER ever want to plan one at the expense of my wife.

"If it's all about sex and lust why do you want vanilla dates with J?" > When I wrote the initial post there wasn't anything 'vanilla' going on with J., we just had a great swing experience, it's by chatting (for hours ) that we learned to know each other better and are getting more 'vanilla'. And FYI that chatting is also never behind my wife's back. My wife doesn't chat very often, but often sits next to me reading everything, sometimes telling me what to write. When she is not reading along if something important/funny has been said I either tell her, send the chat logs by mail or open them and show them to her. We absolutely have no secrets for each other.

"This post below is a bit confusing because then you post that your wife will be there." + "again, why would you want to go on dates alone" > I never intented to go out alone with J. not on a swing date, not on a vanilla date but I realize that the way I wrote it down may have been confusing for you, writing stuff in English is not always easy for me.

"Don't push the swinging with J until you see how your wife reacts on the dinner date. " > I never push things, I think that is not very respectful, and the few times I did try to push something I found out that the harder I push, the harder she pushes back . It's not that I MUST swing asap with J., it was just such great experience that I would want to repeat it, just like when we meet great couples, we (both) want to meet again. And with those couples we never take one for the team but there may be a better click with one of us/them than the others, and in the case with J. well it's 3 not 4 and that's so strange... I don't know how to click with 3. But hey maybe I may worry about things that I shouldn't worry about and is my wife more comfortable with the situation than I expect...this happens quite often: she has surprised me enough in the past by doing things that I never imagined she would do/like... (separate rooms, booking a surprise swingers vacation while I was under the impression that she wasn't completely comfortable with swinging yet,...)


My only problem is that we never had swing dates in the past with 3, and given the fact that my wife is more in to men than into women I really want her to feel good and have fun. It's also that she (and I read in another thread that this quite often the case with women) often finds it easy to do something new, only by talking a lot I can let her try it and 99% of the time she likes it so much that she may even take the initiative the next time.

[fun4Ds]

Belgiumcoast, first I would like to thank you for staying with us patiently. I do think perhaps the language barrier or even customs may cause some misunderstandings. But its cool, just like in swinging that we can all get along. I think that shows great character.

Mrsfun and I never played separately although we did date as triads, male and more-so, females.

May I ask or clarify, do you want to play or even date separate ?

Or, have you decided to date and play as a triad together ?

The latter, we might be of some help on... but I would definitely want opinions from those who have been at home alone, while the other plays, if it's the former.

Either have different outcomes. If you combine both, you will have to combine rules of conduct and understanding, that overlap.

Fun4ds

[belgiumcoast]

Originally Posted by fun4Ds

May I ask or clarify, do you want to play or even date separate ?

Or, have you decided to date and play as a triad together ?

The latter, we might be of some help on... but I would definitely want opinions from those who have been at home alone, while the other plays, if it's the former.

Either have different outcomes. If you combine both, you will have to combine rules of conduct and understanding, that overlap.

Fun4ds

Dating separately is not something that is on my/our 'wish list', but should the opportunity arise that it seems fun for both of us for whatever reason I think it wouldn't be a problem for either of us. For me the most important thing in swinging is that my wife is comfortable, has a good time,... if she has fun, I automatically feel better. The same goes with dates, we never take one for the team but there are alway couples were either I click better and others were she has a better click. It's kinda funny but I always try to arrange a date with couples where she has better click with and vice versa... I guess it just shows how much we care about each other.

I guess dating separately (although again one step further) is similar to play in separate rooms... we never expressed to each other that we really wanted to try it, we did it because it was "natural" in that situation.
Specifically with J. there aren't any real plans yet, I think neither of us would have any problems with it. However as she's a single lady chances are bigger that some day it'll happen than with a couple. And since it would be my date, my only concern would be the feelings of my wife wether she's home alone, or at another party or ... So tips from couples who date alone and have someone home alone would always be welcome.

For me however (and I think even more for my wife) dating separately would be only possible with people we really know well and have a good click with, never with a blind date.