Do I fit?

[Dynamar]

AlexisC--Welcome to the board. As a single female myself, I can empathize with your situation even though I have not had a similar experience. My advice to you is continue lurking and soak up information from this board (There is certainly a wealth of it here, especially if you have the patience to put up with narrow minded couples who create their own private reality of what swinging is and is not.)

I'd really rather not get into this argument, but I will say the definations only mean as much as you want to apply them...

By the dictionary definition I am a swinger, by your personal (and possibly community) definition I am not. Likewise cheating is going to be defined differently by person, couple, and community.

You said a mouthful there, sister, but then again... do not expect most couples to embrace all of the definitions of swinging. Many would rather pick and choose the parts they believe in while trying to marginalize those they do not. As you correctly point out... swinging, in its primary and purest definition, is recreational, no-strings-attached sex between consenting adults. Period. No mention of couples vs. singles, commitment, faithfulness, friends first, any of that.

Now, beyond that broad definition are many, many, many variants. The variant subscribed to by lots of the folks around here is couples who exchange partners, or "wife-swapping," to apply the more sexist term. Does that mean their way is the only way? Absolutely not, although they would have you believe that it is. Does that mean you're in for a cyber version of stoning whenever you expouse something different than that ideal around here? Perhaps so.

As to the topic and your original query, I actually agree with a couple of other posters that your relationship with this guy is probably doomed. Even if he says he is ok with you stepping out and not having knowledge of it, it's simple human nature that ultimately he'll feel left out and resentful of your activities. You're probably better off in the long run to seek out a long-term relationship with someone whose personal values are more in line with your own.

Swinging on your own, as a single female without the encumbrance of a non-participatory partner will then become less problematic and viewed more positively, simply because a potential cause for drama has been eliminated. (Do not, however, presume that you'll be any more welcome around here as a single, un-attached female than as a single, "cheating" female. Response from other members toward me has ranged from polite acceptance to overt disdain, with a definite bent toward the latter.)

All the best to you, whatever you decide.

[fun4Ds]

Dynamar has some valid points, One being Welcome to the swingers Board AlexisC..

Sorry for the overdue welcome, but we play with singles and have learned to be cautious. We have been listening so far. Your thoughts are valid. But honestly, take a look at Dynamar as an example. Her independence and integrity are the very things we were seeking (as a committed couple) in choosing single playmates. Her experience and character go well with her personality.

Alexis,..Could you follow her foot steps in life ? She is older than you perhaps, but you are young and have many roads in life to choose from.

That leaves us to ask you, not about your future but where you are now.

Its a little puzzling about your feelings toward your relationship, with what information you have given. So If we may ask.

You say that you have been in a relationship with your boyfriend for four years. You say that you love him. How deep is that love ?... Do you feel he gives you the same love in return equally ?

You said that you have had sex without his knowledge, and it doesn't bother you. Is it because you feel he doesn't care enough about your relationship, or that either or you know, that it would hurt him ?

We only know of your view point unless you bring him on board with you here, and we would listen to him as well. So, as a couple that has experience with single playmates. Lets cut the chase on this matter.

Its the safety for anyone in a situation playing with single playmates such as your circumstances. Your leaving potential playmates at risk with a boyfriend that doesn't know us or vice versa we don't know him. Crimes are committed sometimes in the heat of passion. You have said yourself you wouldn't want him to do the same to you.

We are a couple that once were attacked. It was vicious and cost us many severe issues and pain that only through our strength in our relationship(and from above) we survived. Could you guarantee someone like us, that your relationship with your boyfriend is safe. Have you touched base with jealousy? You really need to think long and hard about this issue... We do... It was because we wouldn't play with someone that was jealous of what we had.

We would be very concerned about you guys in this situation. What do you know of his reactions when he finds out ? He doesn't know now.. so you really cant say can you ? What if we want to play with you and not him, that is what you are considering now isn't it.

You say you are in touch with with a couple that are swingers, how much do you know about them ? Do you feel you are jeopardizing them in any way ? Our single playmates have partners and dates sometimes, other than us. They are wise enough to be completely honest. Do you feel you are completely honest with everyone, including your boyfriend or even yourself ?

Just take some time and think about what we have said and asked, as well as what others have said. This lifestyle is not on a sexual whim. We are all from different paths in life. We wish yours to be safe, and pleasurable.

[EggPlantKing]

What a bunch of... a load of... but on the other hand... if He... but if She... Well I guess it would be hypocritical to say anything at all to break it down into so called black and white the ony thing that matters is the understanding that he has consented to her doing what ever makes her happy he has just included that he dosn't want to know. If he is not lighting her proverbial fire in the sack then like all creatures of sexual habits she is going to look for something or someone who does. I think her need to express her self sexually is just to overwhelming for to simply deny it. You can justify or argue the point over and over. This lifestyle is about sex plain and simple. Do whatever the two of you decide is ok. My question is how would he react if he walked in aon it? I mean come on seeing your woman in the arms of another man only has like two reactions "Let me have some." and "You slut how could you?" Wonder what his take on this would be. Maybe she should let him read her posts to really get the communication going.

[iapr]

Originally Posted by AlexisC

And as hypocritical as it will sound to some people, I'm very against cheating/cheaters/etc. I just see this as something I am doing for me, and not to him.

This is exactly what cheating is. At it's core cheating is not about sex it is about selfishness and putting your own wants above the pain and suffering it will cause to others. Cheating is not an act of sex, it is an act of selfishness, selfcenteredness and a lack of compassion for those that you supposedly care about.

[LikeMinds321]

Originally Posted by AlexisC

That's hard to say. I am absolutely certain it's not something that would put an end to our relationship.

Hi Alexis ~



Since you feel that your relationship with your boyfriend wouldn't end if he knew about you swinging, why not just discuss it now, rather than trying to swing secretly? I think the strain of a clandestine approach would be harder for you - and your boyfriend - than you realize.

If he has held back from conversing on this topic in the past, I think bringing it up again would be wise. Really, this isn't so much about swinging but about your differences in sexual non-manogamy.

I believe you can love someone very much but may not be right for each other as partners in life for the very reason you've brought to the Board; you each have differing views on sexual freedom.

We are a couple who feels singles can be swingers, too. We don't seek out singles because our interest is in couples, but if we did, we'd use the same guidelines we use to find couples; we look for people who will bring the least chance of complications/drama into the bedroom. As others have mentioned, attempting to swing alone without the knowledge or approval of your boyfrieind would likely pose some restraints on finding people to swing with.

My bottom-line advice is to talk to your boyfriend about how you are feeling.

LM

[tribbles]

It sounds like an open relationship where you both agree sex with others is okay. You want to know what he does and he doesn't want to know what you do. It's not cheating from my POV.

To me, cheating involves having to keep secrets and even lie to your partner. If he came to you and asked what you have been doing, you could tell him and not lie about it. And he can tell you....now, what if he decided to play but couldn't bring himself to tell you he did? So that he also played but same as he doesn't want to know what you do, he didn't want to tell you what he does?

You two have a very different relationship and that will cause discomfort in many of us but it does not mean it's not the exact right relationship for you!

[EggPlantKing]

You know according to the definition of the word you may be swinging. Just not from our type of tree. Our swinging (Speaking for me and the Queen) is to enrich our life through sexual experiences. Mostly with couples but the rules we have don't apply to you seeing how your not us.
You need to understand that by posting you are asking for opinions. There is no real LAW book for swinging. If your BF says goes swing just leave me out of it then Damn have fun. Just don't expect that to be his real feelings. Sometimes men lie to there significant other because its what they want to hear. " No that dress doesn't make you look fat." " I really do love your parents." and " If having sex with other people makes you happy then go ahead just don't tell me about it.". They all sound pretty close to me. I if I were you I would think hard about the possibility that you are taking advantage of him being kind and generous enough in your relationship to put your need for something more then him above his emotional security and well being. Just a thought.

[Mr. Sweet]

Welcome to the Board!!

As to your questions...In my opinion, we don't know you yet and therefore cannot really fully answer this. I personally would second most of the concerns, questions, issues raised by fun4Ds.

Originally Posted by fun4Ds

You say that you have been in a relationship with your boyfriend for four years. You say that you love him. How deep is that love ?... Do you feel he gives you the same love in return equally ?

You said that you have had sex without his knowledge, and it doesn't bother you. Is it because you feel he doesn't care enough about your relationship, or that either or you know, that it would hurt him ?

We only know of your view point unless you bring him on board with you here, and we would listen to him as well. So, as a couple that has experience with single playmates. Lets cut the chase on this matter.

Its the safety for anyone in a situation playing with single playmates such as your circumstances. Your leaving potential playmates at risk with a boyfriend that doesn't know us or vice versa we don't know him. Crimes are committed sometimes in the heat of passion. You have said yourself you wouldn't want him to do the same to you.

Could you guarantee someone like us, that your relationship with your boyfriend is safe. Have you touched base with jealousy? You really need to think long and hard about this issue... We do... It was because we wouldn't play with someone that was jealous of what we had.

We would be very concerned about you guys in this situation. What do you know of his reactions when he finds out ? He doesn't know now.. so you really cant say can you ? What if we want to play with you and not him, that is what you are considering now isn't it.

While Mrs. Sweet and I haven't played with singles at this point, I can only say that from what we've discussed we would not be looking at you guys.

In the end, you and boyfriend are your own people and you'll have to deal with any of the repercussions of your decisions in this lifestyle if you choose to go on without his full knowledge of what you are doing. I.E. what is that line in the sand he doesn't want you to cross...is it sleeping with the person, being in MFM, bondage, anal, etc. If you haven't discussed these things, you probably should even outside the lifestyle. Mrs. Sweet and I have been together for a lot longer than 4 years and when the idea of swinging came up, I thought "no way would she go for that".....Sometimes it's nice to be wrong!!

Good Luck!!

[absingleman]

Originally Posted by AlexisC

It took me a while to figure out where to post this... feel free to move it if I picked wrong

I'm trying to figure out if I should pursue swinging as a single female, without telling my boyfriend. This is probably something I can only really decide on my own, but I'm also interested in how this situation will be perceived by others.

So here are the dirty details... I've been with my boyfriend for about four years, and I am very much in love with him. I've talked to him before about swinging or something like it and at this point in time it is really not for him. He told me a while back that if I decided to do something with another man that he would rather not know about it. He wants me to be happy, but it's obviously something that he's really not comfortable with, and I wouldn't want him to be something he is not.

I know that in general communication is a huge part of this lifestyle. Which is why I can see people having a real problem with my situation.

I have met two men for sex recently. I don't feel guilty at all about it, I see it as something I am doing for me, not to him. *sigh* So I don't know exactly what I'm asking, I just don't know where to go from here.

AlexisC, Welcome to the boards.

I've lived through what you are going through twice, and I have an ex-girlfriend/swing partner that had to make the same choice you have to make. Its not easy to give up a part of your sex life, but you HAVE to choose between your sex life and your relationship, because if you are in an emotionally exclusive relationship with someone your sex life is part of that relationship. If your sex life and your emotional relationship with another person are seperate, you have no real say in the other person's life. Period.

I'm really big on relationships(of all kinds), and if you can't sacrifice casual sex for the sake of the relationship with your boyfriend, leave the relationship. The ONLY thing worth taking seriously is your relationship with others. While there are many different levels of relationships, I treat each one with the same respect that I give my mother and grandmother. I don't step over any perceived boundaries. I don't break promises because something comes up that will be more fun. If I can't show up when promised I at least call and explain things at that time. And I don't hide things that should be in the open in the context of the relationship.

Yes, every relationship is different, but some relationships come with built in rules that can't be broken, only amended by agreement by all parties involved. And saying "You can do what you want as long as I don't know about it" isn't agreement. Its the coward's way of saying "If thats how you feel, fine. I'll still have sex with you and play the good boyfriend, but the second I find someone that feels the same way I do, I'm gone."

I hope I am wrong, but I don't see you and your boyfriend being together too much longer. Sooner or later, either you will meet a single man who is not only accepting of your desire to swing but encourages you and actually becomes more attractive to you than your current boyfriend emotionally, or he will meet a woman that cares more about being in a relationship with him than pursuing her potentially active and adventurous sex life.

Forget talking about swinging, cheating, commitment. What kind of emotionally exclusive relationship are you looking for, and can you have that kind of relationship with your current boyfriend? If you want to swing and he doesn't, then you can't. You can't be emotionally exclusive and keep secrets of this magnitude.

[iapr]

[quote=absingleman;309352]

And saying "You can do what you want as long as I don't know about it" isn't agreement. Its the coward's way of saying "If thats how you feel, fine. I'll still have sex with you and play the good boyfriend, but the second I find someone that feels the same way I do, I'm gone."

I hope I am wrong, but I don't see you and your boyfriend being together too much longer. Sooner or later, either you will meet a single man who is not only accepting of your desire to swing but encourages you and actually becomes more attractive to you than your current boyfriend emotionally, or he will meet a woman that cares more about being in a relationship with him than pursuing her potentially active and adventurous sex life.

QUOTE]


Yup.

[lovinher]

Originally Posted by iapr

This is exactly what cheating is. At it's core cheating is not about sex it is about selfishness and putting your own wants above the pain and suffering it will cause to others. Cheating is not an act of sex, it is an act of selfishness, selfcenteredness and a lack of compassion for those that you supposedly care about.

Perfect!

Do the guy a favor and leave him now.

[sexcupid]

OP,

It is a emotional subject in general (swinging or cheating).

Now, my posts are not meant to attack you...but to maybe yank your head out of the sand and give you other view points on it.

There can be alot of hypocrisy in the replies supplied here at times. If you were a man posting here that you had stepped out on your long term girlfriend, I would almost lay down money that ALL of the responses would have been similar to mine. However, since you are a female...some of the responses were 'go for it', 'do what you need to do', etc.

My point is, my advice tends to stay consistent regardless of your sex. Not a few days before you started this thread did I give almost the same advice on this thread. To a single male (who is basically a married man misrepresenting himself on the board and SLS...but he slipped in this thread by stating his marital status).

Again, I will wish you luck in having that conversation.

[JustAskJulie]

Originally Posted by AlexisC

Should I not be posting here?

In the most specific sense I am still posting here because I started this thread. This is the only place I have posted.
Why am I still posting in this thread? Because as long as you and others are responding I'll reply to you. I've been around message boards enough to know that it's generally considered "rude" to start a thread and then disappear.
This thread and the responses have given me a lot to think about. Just one more boost in helping me to figure out where to go with all this.

On a broader scale, why did I show up here at all? Because I have been talking to a couple who are very active swingers in the area. They made me re-examine my idea of "swingers" (for example I didn't know a single, male or female, could be apart of the lifestyle). I started researching, and I found this board which has been a wealth of information. So even if I never post in another thread I'll probably stick around and lurk through the archives.

Alexis,
I'm glad that you have stuck around as much as you have and I do hope you will continue to stick around, as you have said, and read and post some more. Perhaps even an update on your situation.

Originally Posted by AlexisC

I was looking for advice mostly about how my situation could be perceived. Which has given me a lot to think about. This thread has kind of taken on a life of it's own, but that happens. I don't know that I have to be looking for anything to be here? I guess I'm just looking for information at this point in time. I mentioned before that I've been talking to a couple for a little while now, and they are members of one of the local clubs. So currently that's more or less the "who" of what I'm looking for.

I think that you have gotten a lot of advice on how your situation may/will be perceived. Everyone is different though. As you've already found from couples that you've met personally, there are couples who will have no issue at all with your situation. There are others (as you've seen here) that short of meeting your husband and asking for themselves if he has a problem with this, will assume he does and assume you are cheating on him and because of that will not want to have much to do with you (even if you do seem to be a perfect unicorn otherwise). I think for most it is really just a matter of the unknown. They don't know (and your answers don't really help them feel comfortable) whether or not your husband would react badly if he did know about what you are up to. And if it turned out that he did react badly we/they just don't want to find ourselves in the middle of it.

Originally Posted by absingleman

Yes, every relationship is different, but some relationships come with built in rules that can't be broken, only amended by agreement by all parties involved. And saying "You can do what you want as long as I don't know about it" isn't agreement. Its the coward's way of saying "If thats how you feel, fine. I'll still have sex with you and play the good boyfriend, but the second I find someone that feels the same way I do, I'm gone."

Originally Posted by AlexisC

If I thought that any of this would seriously damage my relationship then I would never have done anything at all. I have a good bearing on my relationship, and I'm not worried about it.

I think the advice others have given regarding actually talking to him about this is good advice. It is important for you (and for those you play with) to know for sure which of the above is true. Is he just saying it? (Much as we've seen many wives here show up who have said "ok I'll try swinging" just to get their partner off their back about it? Or is he really ok with you doing whatever you need to do in order for the two of you to be happy together?

[Additude]

Alexis...

Sounds like trouble right here in River City.....

The problem is that your BF doesn't want to know about it if you have "Sex on the Side" (Which BTW is a load of crap, he just doesn't want to face it if it happens and he surely is not telling you to cheat on him) and you obviously want him to not only know, but also participate to some degree in it...which even includes him just knowing about it and being OK with it.

It's a matter of you wanting to and him not.

Thats what you need to fix. If you do not resolve this issue then you'll always have this sore spot between you both.

A previous poster said, "Be true to yourself" and that I agree is good advise, but take it a step farther and be true to your BF also.

Option #1. If he is truly OK with your promiscuity, then you need to have a serious discussion with him and make him commit and validate that thought. And tell him, if your BF agrees to this, then you will venture out and have sexual relations without him. If he doesn't want to know, then fine, you'll respect his wishes, but if he discovers you "did it", then he in turn has to respect your wishes.

Option #2. Convince your BF to join you in your escapades and become a swinging couple, not a swinging SF. (Probably best choice is here).

Option #3. Leave your BF and start your new life without him.

Option #4. Quit what you are doing and live with being monogamous with your BF.

I hope things work out for you. I get the impression that you are a very caring and thoughtfull person. However, are you willing to make a sacrifice like option #3 or #4 for what you want?

If not, then do you want your cake and want to eat it too?

[Playful1]

Honestly, what you did is generally consider cheating.

I'd say either talk to him openly and honestly about your interests and see where it goes, or sit down and have a talk with yourself about how important he is and how important swinging is, etc. You need to make some choices.