Open Marriage: How to word it in ads

[Tybee Swing]

Originally Posted by swyngtyme

Doesn't it already say that we play separately, therefore saying that she does play?

Not necessarily as clearly as most would want to hear it. It could be just the method or style that you've agreed on, not necessarily what's already taking place. It doesn't let people know that she's already actively and happily engaged in playing with her own friend(s).

The thing that you'll have to overcome is the suspicion that you're just another married guy out there trying to get laid. You're working to ease people's suspicions that you're either cheating, or leaving a woman sitting home alone who doesn't want to play or swing, but just "lets" you get some on the side so you won't divorce her. These are thoughts that occur to people looking at ads like yours, which is why it's important to clearly share these facts: you're a team and you're in this together, happily...she's totally on board with it. You're honest and open with each other about it.

good luck.

[graygo98]

I think you have done a great job. Sincerity and intelligence are very attractive.

The only small point: are you looking for a single fem to swing with? A couple for an MFM? All of the above? When we read ads we are looking for someone who wants what we want. We are not looking to to be an item on some guy's shopping list. If it takes separate ads to achieve different ends, so be it.

Now obviously you need some pics. For a single guy looking to hook up with a couple, a clear and friendly looking face pic really stands out. It also backstops your real message.... that you are an above-board guy with nothing to hide. Pics that show you doing normal things that reflect your interests... canoeing, hiking, whatever .... are also a real joy after the 40th picture of some guy wanking off.

[swyngtyme]

Hi, Tybee. I see your point, and I agree. I'll still have to do it in half a dozen words or less, though--I really think that all my previous attemtps belabour the point so much that it might end up seeming *more* like I've got something to hide.

Thanks, Graygo. Yes, all my ads have a picture of me, face included. I haven't got a variety to use yet, so that's the only one. I'm always the one behind the camera, os I haven't much lying around, and as for deliberately posing one or two, I can't think of what to create. Sure, activities--what if I don't do anything like those things? A picture of me reading, watching a movie or playing Scrabble just isn't going to impress. ;-) But yes, I don't intend to have any naked pics on my ads. Perhaps if someone asks for one, after having provided one of their own, but then I have to figure out what to take for that, too. I don't think I close-up of my junk is the right idea--I've seen so many say that it's a turn off, or that "we've seen all that, they don't look so much different from each other", plus it kind of creeps me out. I think showing off my butt in a full-body shot when the time comes might be a better idea, but I *still* have to figure out how to pose that well.

And yeah, I'm looking for either a solo female or a couple to play with. I didn't want to get too far into specifics in this particular piece of text because, a) many of the places I'll be posting the ad, you already specify those things in another place, so you don't need to type them into your ad, and b) I'm hoping that this text will just catch the interest, and then someone can find out more. In many places there's a second section somewhere for further details, where I can get down to brass tacks. This is intended to be just the teaser.

[swyngtyme]

Hey Tybee, how about this:

"I'm in an open marriage, but my wife and I only play separately, at her choice (she already has her own playmates). My wife can and will vouch for my honesty on this."

[NumbskullsX2]

This whole thing wold be too crazy and too complicated for us. There are a milion single men out there, why should we take the time and go through all the drama of figuring out whether your wife allows you to play or not?

Also, you said your wife is seeing her old boyfriend. Isn't that breaking one of the cardinal rules of swinging? (emotional attachments?)

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

This whole thing wold be too crazy and too complicated for us. There are a milion single men out there, why should we take the time and go through all the drama of figuring out whether your wife allows you to play or not?

I completely agree with this. It would seem to me that going through the extra steps necessary just wouldn't be worth the trouble. It is trouble enough getting to know people without the extra hoop or two.

That said, I would guess that you can work through it. There are likely couples that won't care - or that will be more than willing to have an extra dinner on the way to getting to know you both.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

Also, you said your wife is seeing her old boyfriend. Isn't that breaking one of the cardinal rules of swinging? (emotional attachments?)

While this is one of our cardinal rules, I think that swinging in general doesn't really have cardinal rules. I mean, we've seen all sorts of arrangements in the lifestyle so far - and comfort zones that are for more relaxed than ours. I guess if they can make it work - more power to them.

Spoomonkey

[swyngtyme]

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

This whole thing wold be too crazy and too complicated for us. There are a milion single men out there, why should we take the time and go through all the drama of figuring out whether your wife allows you to play or not?

So don't. Maybe there are others who won't find it such a chore to meet someone before they fuck their husband.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

Also, you said your wife is seeing her old boyfriend. Isn't that breaking one of the cardinal rules of swinging? (emotional attachments?)

Based on the people I've met and the things I've read, I'd say that the only cardinal rule of swinging is to respect everyone's rules, and this particular way of playing is one of ours. Perhaps when you say "emotional attachments" you mean :falling in love." That's a very different thing. I consider "emotional attachments" to include caring about one another, and I'd hope to have that with anyone I chose to swing with. Swinging is not, by definition, anonymous or random sex, is it? You're allowed to give a damn about someone before you fall into bed with them?

You run your swinging based on your rules (and the rules of those you're with), we'll run ours based on our rules (and the rules of those we're with). Thanks for the input.

[LOL_OMG]

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

Also, you said your wife is seeing her old boyfriend. Isn't that breaking one of the cardinal rules of swinging? (emotional attachments?)

Let me say this, there are no Cardinal rules in swinging. There are certain standards that most couples tend to abide by, but even then individual couples tastes can differ to the point some think others are totally nutz. Back in the 70's the 'Cardinal Rule' of swinging was fuck the first person that moves, the eighties and aids changed that. We have good friends in the lifestyle that have girlfriends and boyfriends and appear to still be in love. That type of 'swinging' is not for myself or the Missus and we do not play with them but, it's still considered swinging and if they are happy then God bless em.

Mr.

[graygo98]

Too complicated? I don't know. The complications in the MFM world (certainly from what has appeared on this board) seem to arise from guys that don't have a clue about any other sort of relationship than the one they imagined Mom and Dad had.

From this Board (and more than a few emails) a single guy who understands that sex and love within a marriage can be separated and sex enjoyed for its own sake, without it meaning that the wife is longing for something "extra" is not all that common. Our OP would get that in spades. Seems a lot simpler, really, than responding to an ad from Mr. "9inch Wonder."

As far as "cardinal rules".... we missed that book. And from what we have seen its pretty much in every one's own mind. In this case, what his SO feels toward another is their concern, certainly not mine.

[Alura]

Several posts ago I wrote:

Don't mislead anyone by pretending to be married.

To which Swyngtyme replied:

I hope you're not suggesting above that I'm pretending to be married.

Sorry about being so unclear, Swyngtyme. I meant that if you find a "girlfriend" to swing with, don't pretend to be married to her when you seek other couples. That seems to be a common mistake such couples make.

Alura

[swyngtyme]

I see what you mean now, Alura. No, I wouldn't do that, either. Even beyond the fact that it's just not who am I to prevaricate like that, once I've gone through so much hassle due to telling the truth about the rest of this, why would I start lying at that point?

Yes, hassle. Not from you, Alura; I don't mean this paragraph as a personal response, but generally around the lifestyle community as I've experienced it so far. I used to find it mystifying and confounding that the general public, just because they understood it better, had more sympathy for sleeping with someone not your spouse without their knowedge than they had for sleeping with someone not your spouse with their knowledge and approval--they had more of a problem with swinging than with cheating. But now, I'm discovering another problem. It almost seems like some people, if they were looking for a man to add for a threesome, they'd rather choose a guy billed as single, even though they suspect him of being a cheater, than choose a guy billed as married but not cheating and with no secrets. It's almost like some don't care if he's actually cheating, they only care whether they can say "but he *said* he was single" if something goes wrong. *That* I totally don't understand.

[NumbskullsX2]

Originally Posted by swyngtyme

So don't. Maybe there are others who won't find it such a chore to meet someone before they fuck their husband.



Based on the people I've met and the things I've read, I'd say that the only cardinal rule of swinging is to respect everyone's rules, and this particular way of playing is one of ours. Perhaps when you say "emotional attachments" you mean :falling in love." That's a very different thing. I consider "emotional attachments" to include caring about one another, and I'd hope to have that with anyone I chose to swing with. Swinging is not, by definition, anonymous or random sex, is it? You're allowed to give a damn about someone before you fall into bed with them?

You run your swinging based on your rules (and the rules of those you're with), we'll run ours based on our rules (and the rules of those we're with). Thanks for the input.

I didn't say that meeting people was a chore. What I said was that meeting a guy who says that his wife says this but he says that, but we don't know what she says because we're not meeting her we're meeting him and she's not available anyway because she's out with one of her other boyfriends and we don't know if she's really his wife anyway or just somebody pretending to be his wife and bla-bla-bla-bla-bla-bla.

Too much drama!

Yes we all play by our own rules and we do prefer to be friends with the people we play with, but if somebody (esp a single male) told us he wanted to have a emotional attachment w/me I'm pretty sure my husband would cancell his ticket before we even met. If he didn't, I would, becasue of the unneccssary drama!

Sorry but you asked the question i'm just giving you my answers, that's all.

[swyngtyme]

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

I didn't say that meeting people was a chore. What I said was that meeting a guy who says that his wife says this but he says that,

Huh? She and I say the same thing.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

but we don't know what she says because we're not meeting her we're meeting him

No, you'd be meeting both of us, that's what I'm talking about.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

and she's not available anyway because she's out with one of her other boyfriends

Well, not available for swinging, no--because that's the way she's chosen to operate in our open marriage. But she is available to talk to, because she'd be sitting right there in front of you at this first meeting.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

and we don't know if she's really his wife anyway or just somebody pretending to be his wife and bla-bla-bla-bla-bla-bla.

Well, how about these wedding photos I've brought along to the coffee shop (please don't spill on them)?

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

Too much drama!

Yes we all play by our own rules and we do prefer to be friends with the people we play with, but if somebody (esp a single male) told us he wanted to have a emotional attachment w/me I'm pretty sure my husband would cancell his ticket before we even met. If he didn't, I would, becasue of the unneccssary drama!

Friends, that's all I'm talking about when I mean an attachment. Rather than random, anonymous sex, I'd be looking to have a situation where we know something about each other, care about each other's feelings and well-being, where we're less than boyfriend/girlfriend but far more than strangers who happen to be in the same bed.

I should hope your husband would veto that setup, and I would too. That's becoming ployamory, which is not what I'm looking for nor what my wife has.

Originally Posted by NumbskullsX2

Sorry but you asked the question i'm just giving you my answers, that's all.

Right you are, and thank you for giving them. I'm just rather surprised by some of them, that's all.

I just think that, if one is the sort to pick someone out from an ad and want to meet them for a coffee on a separate occasion to see them face-to-face before falling between the sheets, then picking someone out from and ad and meeting them for a coffee on a separate occasion to see them face-to-face, and his wife is there to tell you that it really is okay with her that he plays without her, and oh look, here's our wedding photos in case you think I'm just a friend who owes him a favour--that doesn't seem to me like a whole lot of extra hassle or drama. It's just one more cup of coffee sitting on the table.

Contrast that with the extra drama of picking someone out from an ad who says he's single, but one suspects maybe he's lying, but because he said so one just decides to believe him; get coffee, hit it off, get together another time to swing and *then* meet his wife, irate and throwing things when she catches him cheating.

[NumbskullsX2]

Originally Posted by swyngtyme

I'd be looking to have a situation where we know something about each other, care about each other's feelings and well-being, where we're less than boyfriend/girlfriend but far more than strangers who happen to be in the same bed.

But aren't those the things that makes a person a boyfriend/girlfriend? If there not, then what does?

Also, in your first post, you said you wanted to have an intimate relationship with whoever you meet. Sorry, but that crosses the line! I woldn't want my husband having an intimate relationship with any of our playmates, and I'm sure he wouldn't want me having one, either.

I'm sorry, but as my husband says, "this dog just don't hunt"

[Alura]

I tried hard to give the proverbial married-man-playing-alone the benefit of the doubt but have to admit we agree with you Numbskulls. We want our playmates to be married to each other. Not just for the lack of drama but the extra possibilities. With a lone man (or woman) there is only one possible threesome. With another couple who are willing to take turns (with the left-out person watching or not) there are four. Each person gets to participate in both an MFM and an FMf.

Since suitable couples are easier to find, why settle for less?

Alura