Questions for Honest single swingers?

[kittylikesmfm]

i have a question for singles primarily but would also like to hear couples reverse experience.

for singles:
as a happily married woman, the point for me of swinging is to regain part of that youthful bliss sourounding a new possible sexual mate. i know it won't be as good, won't be the same, blah blah blah (i know for a fact nothing will ever compare to the sexual relationship my husband and i have had and are still having; i'm talking as garnish to that)

but in developing the whole atmosphere, to really mimic that curiousity and uncertainity about the other person, to me anyway, there has to be a friendship, a mutual attraction. i'm not just talking about seeing a physical body so incredibly attractive you have to fuck it. i mean, if you find that person and they agree to bang you, i'm jealous and happy for you..lol...but i'm talking about the person you find appealing physically, like alot of other people you meet, but their personality really sucks you in and you're suddenly consumed with the drive to make them cum.

as a single swinger, how willing are you to give that much of yourself for the person/s you're attracted to in the couple? do you ever "hold back" on opening up completely to couples, feeling like they have the relationship, so they should be required to 'give more' and 'open up' more since they are at an emotional and maybe even percieved social advantage?

and as secondary questions:

straight single guys; how willing are you to develop a good relationship(non sexual) with the male of a couple you get involved with?

bi single girls; have you been made to feel more comfortable,overall, by the male or female in couples (or with gay couples, by the more dominant or more submissive partner)

[jstlkng]

Originally Posted by kittylikesmfm

straight single guys; how willing are you to develop a good relationship(non sexual) with the male of a couple you get involved with?

Swinging should always be about developing a good relationship with the male of a couple if there is going to be an established relationship with the wife. Afterall he is sharing his wife with the single. However, that relationship is two-way. The husband in the couple must be willing to establish that relationship as well. Maybe that's why some singles (and couples as well) are just looking for the opportunity to have sex with a couple without the strings of relationships. For me, its all about the friendship and then if the sex happens...well thats just great facelick

jstlkng

[Thrax]

...as a single swinger, how willing are you to give that much of yourself for the person/s you're attracted to in the couple? do you ever "hold back" on opening up completely to couples, feeling like they have the relationship, so they should be required to 'give more' and 'open up' more since they are at an emotional and maybe even percieved social advantage?

and as secondary questions:

straight single guys; how willing are you to develop a good relationship(non sexual) with the male of a couple you get involved with?

I've engaged in purely one-off/no-strings -- almost anonymous -- encounters. And enjoyed most of them, too. However, in the swing groups (on-premise clubs, Yahoo groups, house party groups, camping groups, etc.) that I participate in on a regular basis (every other month or two), I truly look at things from the "friends with benefits" perspective.

I open up with couples as much as I would expect them to be open with me. We're friends. It's different from my other friendships in that we occasionally like to get off together , but we're still just friends. I don't have any really, really close friends in the lifestyle like I do in the vanilla world, but quite a few couples are much more than just acquaintances. So, I "open up" to the level of friends. I do not enter any of these swing relationships with a couple with the idea that there will be a romantic element. I DO NOT WANT THAT , so that's where the boundary lies.

And as a single male I always at the very minimum am polite to the male of the couple. My problem here is that I'm generally not that outgoing and small-talk can be a bit of a trial for me, but outside of any swing encounters I've managed to have great conversations with the males of the couples. I would consider a couple of the guys more than acquaintances, but haven't yet met any that I would just call up to watch a football game or have a beer with. If that would happen, that would just be a bonus to an overall relationship with a couple. So I'm open to a non-sexual friendship with the male of a couple, it just hasn't happened yet.

Um...does that answer your question?

[EternallySingle]

Well, I see it as a waste of my time to swing with couples that don't want to be friends outside of a sexual context. What would I be gaining? One of the reasons for singles being friends with couples is to have that opportunity to talk to someone and get both sides of the story, so to speak. Its also fun to see them argue over something each thinks has a cut-and-dried solution.

Seriously, I can get laid anywhere. I just don't like some of my ... options. So I look for people I can relate to and have fun with FIRST. Then I wonder what they would be like sexually. A lot of people in the lifestyle (and strangely enough a lot of vanilla single women) want the sex first, and then, if you are good enough, they will try and become your friend so you will stay around longer. Thats backwards to me.

As far as friendship with a couple, there was one couple I used to swing with and it came about because I became friends with the man first and HE brought up the idea to me. In fact, several of my married male friends have hinted at that, but I only took three up on it, and only because I KNEW their marriage had few power or trust issues, and the wives weren't looking to get even with the guy for sleeping with someone else.

As for the opening up part, I think thats pretty obvious LOL

[curiousagain]

It really varies. I am friends with a couple of husbands of couples I met in the lifestyle. We go out and do "guy stuff" together. I met them through swinging but we formed friendships. But, I am friends with the females also. They give me advice and sometimes "I told you so"s just like any female friend. We don't swing everytime we get together.


I have had the brief encounters where the SM is basically there to play a role and you show up, do what you're suppose to and leave.


Some couples/wives want a long build up and a sort of game to it. Maybe once in a while that would be ok, but there are only 24 hours in a day and I am usually dating or "chatting up" more than one single female at a time in addition to work, family, life, friends, etc. So, if something like that doesn't pan out pretty quick I lose interest in it. It's sort of like fishing, you pull up to a spot, throw the anchor, try a few different baits and presentations. If you don't catch anything, you pull anchor, fire it up and move on.

If anything began to smack of "romance" most SM would be gone in about a nano second. For whatever reason they are in swinging, that one isn't it, as far as wives are concerned. A swinging single female?? That could be a different story.

[kittylikesmfm]

i'm not talking about romance exactly..more what eternally single was saying. i'm kind of like him in the sense that without being attracted to the personality, a dildo or adept handwork during foreplay serves the same purpose as another person. and my husband definately feels the same way about the single women. the ones we know that we've discussed it with are good friends and we have alot of fun hiking and cooking or whatever; we just generally enjoy their company and look forward to seeing them. they'll do things like sit on my lap, or we'll play with each others hair. we certainly aren't in love, but that kind of comfort (not identical activities of course) is what i'm asking about. the same as you'd have in any one-on-one sexual relationship that was good but still pre-commitmant; if that makes sense..lol.
anyway thanks for the thoughtful responses guys.

[Paphian]

Originally Posted by kittylikesmfm

i have a question for singles primarily but would also like to hear couples reverse experience.

for singles:
as a single swinger, how willing are you to give that much of yourself for the person/s you're attracted to in the couple? do you ever "hold back" on opening up completely to couples, feeling like they have the relationship, so they should be required to 'give more' and 'open up' more since they are at an emotional and maybe even percieved social advantage?

The brief answer is: I let the couple's desires guide how much I get involved, and certainly do not expect them to 'give more' or 'open up' more.

If they've been interested enough in me and kind enough to include me, it would be pretty presumptuous of me to expect them to 'give more'. Some couples want a single to play with her while he only watches. Some want a more MFM situation. Some want more/other than that and hope for an on-going thing that includes friendship and non-swinging activities. I figure that as an 'invited third' it's therefore up to me to be flexible, within the limits of my capabilities and desires. If I don't figure I can fit what they want, it's time to politely decline.

Originally Posted by kittylikesmfm

and as secondary questions:

straight single guys; how willing are you to develop a good relationship(non sexual) with the male of a couple you get involved with?

If that's what a couple is after, it certainly is a consideration for whether I'm willing to play. Sometimes it gets discussed beforehand, sometimes later; sometimes never--things just develop as they develop. In all cases, honest, polite answers are called for.

Some couples play separately--and with no expectation of an on-going relationship. In that situation, all that really matters is what she wants and if she and I click. After all, it's just for that session/night.

Others play separately and there is an expectation on her behalf (and they have an understanding) that she's gonna have 'lovers' (so to speak). Involvement varies, from her being free to choose who she likes through to him having to approve potential lovers in advance. This can be a lot of fun, IMO, because you get to know each other, and to do 'non-swinging' sorts of things (sometimes only with her, sometimes with both of them). If everyone has their head on straight about things, it's probably the most satisfying as far as I am concerned. Friends with benefits.

Some couples play only together, and again the situations range from 'it's just for tonight' through to 'we'd like to be good friends'. It all can work as far as I am concerned--it really just depends on the people involved.

I've turned down playing for any number of reasons, including that a couple was looking for more in a relationship than I knew would work for me. I'm not gonna agree to play with a couple where I think that the husband and I are just not gonna get along--even where I'm very attracted to her. It simply isn't worth the potential drama.

On the other hand, I have a great relationship with the husband of my current swing partner, and that's something that just happened to develop.

I truly don't know (and often don't understand--based on their behavior) how other single guys approach swinging. Many, I think, see it as a quick route to 'getting laid'. I suspect they don't last long in the swinging world, as word rapidly gets around that they're not in it for the right reasons.

For myself, I approach every club night or encounter as being different in only one real respect from the vanilla world: that we all know in advance what the potential is, as we're all of like mind when it comes to sex. That's the only real difference I see from going to a vanilla club, or meeting people in 'normal' life. At a swing club or party one at least knows that everyone's there for pretty much the same purpose.

There've been a lot of nights--far more nights than those on which I've played with someone--where I've just ended up having a good time talking/flirting. Nothing at all wrong with those. The fun part is that, unlike vanilla nights out, people are free to be more bold and do non-vanilla things like being naked.

Ramble, ramble, ramble...

Originally Posted by kittylikesmfm

as a happily married woman, the point for me of swinging is to regain part of that youthful bliss sourounding a new possible sexual mate.

This is what can make things really fun from a single guy's end of things as well. Flirting, playing around, and generally approaching things from this perspective are great, and make for some really hot sex, too.

[kittylikesmfm]

Originally Posted by Paphian

For myself, I approach every club night or encounter as being different in only one real respect from the vanilla world: that we all know in advance what the potential is, as we're all of like mind when it comes to sex. That's the only real difference I see from going to a vanilla club, or meeting people in 'normal' life. At a swing club or party one at least knows that everyone's there for pretty much the same purpose.

that's what i'm talking about. i'm kind of confused with alot of the approach towards swinging being so different from regular sex...i just can't imagine that. i mean the same things are going to draw me to an individual whether i'm approaching them with my spouse or not; the same qualities and rapport with the individual are going to drive my desire to fuck them.

i guess this kind of falls under the category of how superficial are you and/or your s.o.'s attractions to people and what relevance does that have on your ability to have sex with other people as a couple. my husband and i are both, "attractive at a glance, but upon talking up close, physical faults pale in comparison to personality flaws" types when assessing anyone we meet, male or female. if you're that type and your partner is shallow, i can see how you could have some big issues on who you wanted to be involved with and how.

and, btw, i love the term 'included third'. perfect.

[EternallySingle]

Originally Posted by kittylikesmfm

that's what i'm talking about. i'm kind of confused with alot of the approach towards swinging being so different from regular sex...i just can't imagine that. i mean the same things are going to draw me to an individual whether i'm approaching them with my spouse or not; the same qualities and rapport with the individual are going to drive my desire to fuck them.

i guess this kind of falls under the category of how superficial are you and/or your s.o.'s attractions to people and what relevance does that have on your ability to have sex with other people as a couple. my husband and i are both, "attractive at a glance, but upon talking up close, physical faults pale in comparison to personality flaws" types when assessing anyone we meet, male or female. if you're that type and your partner is shallow, i can see how you could have some big issues on who you wanted to be involved with and how.

and, btw, i love the term 'included third'. perfect.

I don't think its neccessarily being superficial. I think its a matter of where their comfort level is. Some couples refuse to have anything to do with a single man or woman that doesn't want a platonic relationship and only wants to meet for sex occasionally. Some couples refuse to have anything to do with a single man or woman that wants to establish a friendship on any level other than sexual. The same goes for some singles. Its what they are comfortable with. Like I said, I can't imagine going through all the work of meeting a couple if all I'm going to get out of it is sex. Even if I pursue single women in that way, there is a possibility of something deeper evolving. That isn't usually the case with couples, because they have their own lives to lead.

I don't agree with the sex for sex sake idea anymore unless I'm at a club or house party (and I don't make the effort to travel three or four hours to clubs anymore either). Even with the house party situation, I would have established some kind of rapport beyond sex that allowed the couple to trust me enough to know where they live. With clubs, everyone is there for one thing (to hook up with someone) and in a way, finding someone to swing with is just a little more involved than getting someone to slow dance. Attraction, interest, and its a go. But for me, I don't have time to approach couple after couple after couple just to have sex. I reserve that kind of energy for single women that might be interested in something more permanent, even if it is just a friend to have sex with.

If I contact a couple to swing with, its because something they said or something I read led me to believe that the THREE of us would be friends even if the idea of sex wasn't a possibility.

[kittylikesmfm]

Originally Posted by EternallySingle

I don't think its neccessarily being superficial. I think its a matter of where their comfort level is. Some couples refuse to have anything to do with a single man or woman that doesn't want a platonic relationship and only wants to meet for sex occasionally. Some couples refuse to have anything to do with a single man or woman that wants to establish a friendship on any level other than sexual. The same goes for some singles. Its what they are comfortable with.

i completely agree with what your saying here. i wasn't real clear. i don't mean shallow as an insult at all. i meant sort of promiscuous i guess..lol.

i was never, even as a single very promiscuous. i was rarely faithful..lol...but it was always with people i had or ended up developing friendships with. for me it just seems like it wouldn't be worth the trouble unless there wasn't more of a payoff than the same physical orgasm you could have with anyone or anything.

experiencing new people you're attracted to, on alot of levels; the desire, and flirting, and foreplay are what makes swinging, and sex in general, appeal to me. (of course, i am a girl..lol) but i certainly appreciate the 'just in it for the sex' approach.