Have any of you had second thoughts after playing?

[Lawguy]

Originally Posted by cubnamy1995

OK, I don't mean to get on a high-horse either, nor would I knock anyone elses beliefs, but as a seminary graduate and former candidate for ordained ministry, I can't pass this one up.

I too don't understand why this is considered disobedience. After all, the biblical definition of adultery was a property crime committed by women who stole property from their husbands (their own bodies) and gave them to someone else. The other man was simply guilty of receiving stolen property. Swinging doesn't fit the definition of adultery from the biblical context.

Also, polygamy was an accepted practice, and the only known condemnation of multiple relations was in the case of bishops who were commanded by Paul to only have one wife. And finally, for the bi ladies out there who may have morality issues, homosexual behavior was considered and "abomination" which simply meant it was something very un-Jewish to do. We misunderstand "abomination" as "sin."

Sorry for all that, but I paid so much money for that seminary education that I got to use it somewhere

Anyway, I am a deeply-devoted, very spiritual, churchgoing person who has never lost a moment of sleep over swinging. It is something we do together, with love for one another. If God has a problem with that, then He is not the God I thought He was.

Great to see a fellow man of the cloth on the boards, lol. You must know that apostle Paul said "adulterers and whoremongers God will judge." That's simply not a property issue as described by Deuteronomy or Leviticus. I guess since there's no exception for consensual adultery in the New Testament, many folks kinda conclude "a sin is a sin" when it comes to sleeping with someone other than their spouses. As for polygamy, yes, at times it does appear that it was sanctioned by God. At other times, it appears that it was proscribed. Is that God chaning His mind? Maybe, but I doubt it. Perhaps it's a case of changed rules for changed circumstances. My original point was (and it was addressed in an earlier response to my first post) it's much better to say, "hey perhaps this is a sin, but I'm having a hard time understanding why" than it is to redefine sin (or even God for that matter) in order to avoid the hard questions about this lifestyle. Just my humble opinion.

Lawguy

[cubnamy1995]

Originally Posted by Lawguy

Great to see a fellow man of the cloth on the boards, lol. You must know that apostle Paul said "adulterers and whoremongers God will judge." That's simply not a property issue as described by Deuteronomy or Leviticus. I guess since there's no exception for consensual adultery in the New Testament, many folks kinda conclude "a sin is a sin" when it comes to sleeping with someone other than their spouses. As for polygamy, yes, at times it does appear that it was sanctioned by God. At other times, it appears that it was proscribed. Is that God chaning His mind? Maybe, but I doubt it. Perhaps it's a case of changed rules for changed circumstances. My original point was (and it was addressed in an earlier response to my first post) it's much better to say, "hey perhaps this is a sin, but I'm having a hard time understanding why" than it is to redefine sin (or even God for that matter) in order to avoid the hard questions about this lifestyle. Just my humble opinion.

Lawguy

I get what you are saying. Well, I'm not a man of the cloth anymore, but I once was. To be honest, the more I learned in seminary, the more disillusioned with the church I became. It got to the point that I felt I was just going through the motions and got out. I came to the place that I felt that there was a God out there who loves us, but I'm not going to let somebody else tell me what that's all about, whether it was some guy who wrote a letter to a church in Corinth 2000 years ago, or some pastor today. I think if you try to live a life in which you care about the well being of others, are compassionate and generous in spirit, you are in pretty good shape. I think too much time is wasted on the trivial junk.

The God I came to know and understand probably cares a lot more about the pain and suffering of countless millions in this world than what two or more grown-ups do consentualy in their own bedrooms. No disrespect meant to anyone.

[Spoomonkey]

I certainly hope that my referring to morality (which is simply one's perception of what is right and what is wrong) didn't drag us into a religious debate. That was not my intention. A person has a sense of morality whether they are Christian, spiritual, agnostic or atheist. Right and wrong will always haunt us - and much of it is the distant beat of what other people drummed into us.

As a former fellow "man of the cloth" I can say that god is about as consistent as the weather and the bible about as accurate as a weather man. If god cares about anything, I sincerely doubt he cares about things as trivial as who I have sex with. If he does, he is nothing more than a kid, playing with blocks and given to tantrums.

I am sure the OP is now reading this thread asking, "what the hell did I start?"

But, going back to my original point, I'll simply say that from the perspective of a "born-again agnostic" dragging god into things is just another way of shifting the moral weight of your decisions onto someone or something else. Be responsible for your own choices, be true to yourself, don't live your life tied up in what some other thing (god, friends, society, up-bringing) expects you to be.

That has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with owning your own moral compass.

Spoomonkey

[singleagain]

Spoomonkey said: "That has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with owning your own moral compass."

I once owned a decoder ring with a compass built in. When they made it they evidently put the compass points in backwards because when it was supposed to show me that I was walking north, I found that I was actually walking south. I later owned a military grade compass and it never failed me.

I guess the point in this is that my compass should be based on an accurate specification. So too, should my moral compass. If it is something I create of my own volition, then how do I determine its accuracy? But I digress...I agree that the OP's original post has nothing to do with religion and everything with passing one's own hangups on to another in a seeming attempt to releive a perceived guilt.

In any case I too, am pleased to see that there are others that have made a serious attempt at discovering guidelines by which to set their own compass.

[prettylady]

We went from second thoughts to religion then finally orientering with out skipping a beat. You guys never stop amazing me.

Spoo also said "never life your life tied up". To that I ask, not even for a little while?

Your friend,
Prettylady

[subtoMistressT]

Originally Posted by cubnamy1995

I get what you are saying. Well, I'm not a man of the cloth anymore, but I once was. To be honest, the more I learned in seminary, the more disillusioned with the church I became. It got to the point that I felt I was just going through the motions and got out. I came to the place that I felt that there was a God out there who loves us, but I'm not going to let somebody else tell me what that's all about, whether it was some guy who wrote a letter to a church in Corinth 2000 years ago, or some pastor today. I think if you try to live a life in which you care about the well being of others, are compassionate and generous in spirit, you are in pretty good shape. I think too much time is wasted on the trivial junk.

The God I came to know and understand probably cares a lot more about the pain and suffering of countless millions in this world than what two or more grown-ups do consentualy in their own bedrooms. No disrespect meant to anyone.

Well stated. I commend your choice to see through the BS that orgainzed religion seems to foist on us. Your comments are refreshing.

[cubnamy1995]

Originally Posted by prettylady

We went from second thoughts to religion then finally orientering with out skipping a beat. You guys never stop amazing me.

Spoo also said "never life your life tied up". To that I ask, not even for a little while?

Your friend,
Prettylady

I will say seriously that even though we now have GPS, orienteering is still a very important skill to learn.

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by singleagain

I once owned a decoder ring with a compass built in. When they made it they evidently put the compass points in backwards because when it was supposed to show me that I was walking north, I found that I was actually walking south.

I had one of those too once...

Put together mostly by some guy name Paul

Spoomonkey

[singleagain]

Originally Posted by Spoomonkey

I had one of those too once...

Put together mostly by some guy name Paul

Spoomonkey

Very Preceptive...

Singleagain

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by singleagain

Very Preceptive...

Interesting word choice.

I was thinking it was more perceptive, but "preceptive" is either very clever or a simple transposition of letters. Either way, it makes for a very interesting thought...

Spoomonkey

[singleagain]

Originally Posted by Spoomonkey

Interesting word choice.

I was thinking it was more perceptive, but "preceptive" is either very clever or a simple transposition of letters. Either way, it makes for a very interesting thought...

Spoomonkey

Like George...I cannot tell a lie...I meant perceptive...however since I seem to have coined a new word (didn't find preceptive in the dictionary) I agree it would make for a very interesting thought...line upon line...precept upon precept

singleagain

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by singleagain

precept upon precept

That was how I thought that you "might" have meant it. Would have been an interesting come back. Be that as it may, I do still consider you clever

Spoomonkey