Can he really love me and still want to swing?

[LAG]

I dated a man for 10 months. We're both 42 years old. We were very much in love then at the 9 month mark he casually mentioned, one night after we'd been drinking, that he'd like for us to swing. I've been a "good girl" all of my life and have had the concept that if a man wants to just fuck you, you're being disrespected. I knew he had done it about 2 years ago with a then girlfriend. Anyway, I FREAKED and started crying and was heartbroken. I felt like if he was willing to see me sleep with other men, then he clearly couldn't love me. Wouldn't he be jealous? I can get why men want variety in women but I was shocked that he'd be willing to let me sleep with other guys. Anyway, we didn't mention it again and a month later he broke up with me. He called me every week for five months. During that time he hooked up with a girl from a swing site and was with her seven times and they went to swing clubs although they never hooked up with a couple. He says it's just the thrill of the possibility. Anyway, just two weeks ago we decided to make things work. He loves me dearly, I know he does and I adore him. But, swinging has to be part of his life so I've agreed to at least be open minded. I've read as much as I can and am slightly interested. He says he'll wait as long as it takes for me to want to do it. Even if it takes a year. He says he doesn't want me to to it for him but only if I get to the point that I want to do it for me. Anyway, I still can't wrap my brain around why I'm not enough and is it possible to really love me and still want to see me sleep with other men and to sleep with other women. I just don't understand. Please explain to me how you can have deep love for someone and yet be okay with this. Where is the jealous? What if he falls for another women we hook up with. How am I not enough especially after such a short amount of time - just a year? Please give me all the feedback you can. I need a lot of help to overcome my fears. Part of me thinks it sound interesting but can't overcome the feeling that he must not love me deeply if he wants to do this. Thanks!

[intuition897]

Don't go offline yet, LAG. I'm about to start on an answer for you, but I think it'll take me a little while lol

Bear with me...

[LAG]

Originally Posted by intuition897

Don't go offline yet, LAG. I'm about to start on an answer for you, but I think it'll take me a little while lol

Bear with me...

Okay, Thanks. I'm waiting. LAG

[intuition897]

Okay, here we go. First of all, I'd like to say that at one point in time, I could have written part of this myself. Especially this part:

Originally Posted by LAG

Anyway, I FREAKED and started crying and was heartbroken. I felt like if he was willing to let me sleep with other men, then he clearly couldn't love me. Wouldn't he be jealous? I can get why men want variety in women but I was shocked that he'd be willing to let me sleep with other guys.

I was admittedly curious, but for selfish reasons. The rest of me was hurt and confused. So I know exactly where you're coming from.

Originally Posted by LAG

Anyway, I still can't wrap my brain around why I'm not enough and is it possible to really love me and still want to see me sleep with other men and to sleep with other women. I just don't understand. Please explain to me how you can have deep love for someone and yet be okay with this. Where is the jealous....How am I not enougth especially after such a short amount of time - just a year?....Please give me all the feedback you can. I need a lot of help to overcome my fears.

Actually, no you don't. While it does take a lot of guts and energy to un-learn and re-learn everything you believed about love and sex, it's not a requirement to be happy. Swinging isn't the only way to be happy, just like monogamy isn't the only way. They're just alternatives. If you're truly not into it, then you're not. I definitely commend you on your openness, though. But please, do NOT try to "wrap your head around it" just to hold onto a relationship, no matter how dear he might be to you. Wrap your head around it because you're honestly curious and interested. It can work no other way. If you're considering it for any other reason, you'll only hurt yourself and those around you.

Originally Posted by LAG

Anyway, we didn't mention it again and a month later he broke up with me. He called me every week for five months and just two weeks ago we've decided to make things work. He loves me dearly, I know he does. But, swinging has to be part of his life so I've agreed to at least be open minded.

This always concerns me. I always find it discomfiting when someone chooses swinging over a relationship. If this isn't the case, I apologize. It's just what I gathered from what you wrote. I personally feel that swinging is just an overflow, a hobby. If I were able to without risking my job or my social life, I'd proudly wear the "Swinger and proud of it" T shirt, but while I proudly identify myself as a swinger, I don't require it to be a whole person. I disagree that anyone "needs" to swing. We just like to.

Originally Posted by LAG

I've read as much as I can and am slightly interested. He says he'll wait as long as it takes for me to want to do it. Even if it takes a year. He says he doesn't want me to to it for him but only if I get to the point that I want to do it for me....

This sounds better though. One of the best things Mr. intuition did for himself (as he was the one who brought it up and was initially interested in it), was to back off and let me explore it on my own terms at my own pace. He essentially just presented the idea, let me know he was an open book and would honestly answer any questions I have, let me know that he would only move forward with it when I was comfortable with it, and then stood back and did nothing.

I've beat around the bushes long enough. So to answer your questions more directly:

Originally Posted by LAG

What if he falls for another women we hook up with....

Or what if you fall for another man? Is that possible you think? This is why I feel that swinging works best when it's done by couples who trust one another implicitly and who have intensely intimate relationships and deep committments. If this describes the two of you, then that's great. What I mean is that swinging makes you your own worst enemy. Whatever you fear the most is the demon you'll be battling the hardest. You create your own demons. Like you said, you freaked out, crying and hurt, confused, feeling abandonned, humiliated, worthless...not good enough, not pretty enough... just not...enough.

But is this what your partner is actually trying to tell you? Or is this what you're afraid he is saying with his proposal? Who is the enemy here? The other women? Him? Or is it yourself? Think about it: If you truly felt that you were the best woman in the world for your man, would it matter if he had sex with another woman? Would it matter if she had sexual skills that could leave him grinning for a week? Would it matter if other women wanted to try and seduce him away from you?

If you're wondering, No, it wouldn't matter. Because you would know what you were worth, you would know that you have something unique to offer him that no other woman can. Any woman can offer him sex, and it's naiive to think that we are each the very best lover in the world. So...if you remove sex from the equation, what else do you have to offer him? I think this is the core of it all. Just like the 10 Commandments hinge on the Golden Rule, so does swinging hinge on this one question. What do you have that no other woman has? And does he appreciate that quality in you? So the requirements are two-fold: 1) Trust yourself (know that you have something unique to offer), and 2) Trust your partner (to know a good thing when he has one).

I love that I no longer have to feel jealous. It just doesn't exist anymore. I love that I never need to worry again about one of us cheating on the other. It's just not necessary, because the pain comes not from the sex, but from the sneaking and lying. We have both made a solemn vow (Not just a promise, but a real vow) to never lie to one another. We have to trust one another to make good on that vow. It's all we have. Without that trust, the relationship would be nothing but shit. So I not only trust him, I organize my life around that trust. I refuse to even question that trust. I simply believe him and never question it. And further, I have no reason to disbelieve him. He has given me every reason to believe him when he says he would never go behind my back and hurt me in that way. He has had opportunities, but he has always refused. The other part of it is that I know he would never define himself with such dishonourable actions. He has way too much integrity. And it's the same for me. Cheating is not something I can ever do. It's not just imperitive that I don't cheat; it's virtually impossible. The dishonesty turns me off, the idea of disrespecting and hurting my husband sickens me, and I could NOT live with myself knowing I had disrespected myself by lowering my standards so greatly.

As far as the idea of developing emotional attachments to others goes, we have discovered that we're poly-friendly. This means that as long as it doesn't threaten or damage our relationship, neither of us minds the other developing other long-term relationships. Now, we have chosen not to because it is impractical and we don't feel we have the emotional reserves or the time to devote to nurturing more than one relationship at a time. I have no interest in being emotionally intimate with anyone else. In that sense I am very much a monogamist. But if I did take an interest, Mr. intuition would be receptive to it. We think this way because we love one another, and we just want the very best that life can offer for one another. I'm not so naiive to believe that I am so goddess-like that my husband's desire for other women is rendered impotent. I don't need him to have a limp dick around other women to know that I'm sexy and desireable in my own right. I'm perfectly comfortable knowing that I'm sexy and desireable just the way I am, flaws and all. In fact, I'm all the more confident knowing that he loves everything about me...including my flaws.

I sure hope this has helped some. Have a look around the board, especially the New Swingers forum. It answers lots of the basic questions. Welcome to the board!

[WesternSwing]

“Love is the condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own.... Jealousy is a disease, love is a healthy condition. The immature mind often mistakes one for the other, or assumes that the greater the love the greater the jealousy.”

Robert Heinlein, from Stranger in a Strange Land

It's late, so forgive me if this post is disjointed in places.

I started-off with that quote because from your post I feel it fits your idea of love, the idea that when you love someone you should be jealous of others intruding, or that if you are jealous you must love them.

Things like:

Originally Posted by LAG

I FREAKED and started crying and was heartbroken. I felt like if he was willing to see me sleep with other men, then he clearly couldn't love me. Wouldn't he be jealous? I can get why men want variety in women but I was shocked that he'd be willing to let me sleep with other guys.

I still can't wrap my brain around why I'm not enough and is it possible to really love me and still want to see me sleep with other men and to sleep with other women. I just don't understand. Please explain to me how you can have deep love for someone and yet be okay with this. Where is the jealous?

In fact, it is so often the opposite. In jealousy there is more self-love than love. Jealousy is a defense mechanism to prevent yourself from feeling hurt because of your own insecurities. It has nothing to do with the other person doing something wrong, it has everything to do with your fears that they will.

We have been conditioned as a society to believe that if someone loves you that they should be jealous and protective, and that is what shows love. No, that shows insecurity. Insecurity that someone else could be preferred over them self. But, by being jealous they are protecting themselves under the guise of "protecting" you from others. Jealousy is simply the fear that you do not have value to your partner.

Whether you swing or not you have to let go of this ideal of love or your relationship is doomed from the get-go. As Havelock Ellis once said: "Jealousy, that dragon which slays love under the pretense of keeping it alive." Sooner or later you get tired of feeling smothered. And it doesn't have to be even about sex, it can be that they are going fishing, or to the ball game with friends and you are going, etc. Jealousy rears it's ugly head in many ways in a relationship.

But, swinging has to be part of his life so I've agreed to at least be open minded.

I also wince at this statement. I don't think many swingers would say that swinging hasto be a part of their life. It is something they like to do, not need to do.

What if he falls for another women we hook up with.

This is a fear for many that haven't experienced swinging or swingers firsthand. Like Intuition said - what if you fall for another man you hook-up with? Is that possible? Or are you thoroughly, completely, madly in love with your boyfriend and it's more than just good sex between you and therefore there is no sex good enough with any other man to make you fall out of love with your boyfriend? Like Intuition said, any woman can offer him sex, just like any man can offer you sex, but obviously he, like you, have passed-over all the other possibilities out there for each other. Why? Because you each offer more than just sex to each other.

Besides, isn't insinuating that sex is enough to lure your boyfriend away insulting his intelligence just a little bit? Isn't it a bit like saying he's so dumb that he'll fall for anyone with tits and a pussy?

He says he doesn't want me to to it for him but only if I get to the point that I want to do it for me.

That would tell me he's in this for BOTH of you, not just himself. Like it says in the FAQ: you're partner having a great time has to be as important to you as yourself having a great time. Swinging is helping your partner live-out their sexual fantasies while you live-out your own.

Notice I said "sexual fantasies" and not "relationship dreams".

I felt like if he was willing to see me sleep with other men, then he clearly couldn't love me.

Again, social conditioning. I relish Mrs. WS's sexuality. I worship it. I love to watch her with other men. It's live porn starring my most very favorite porn star in the world. I don't love her less or not at all because I love to see her have sex with other men. I love her even more for being such a wonderful, sexual, exciting being that also happens to think I'm the greatest to ever happen to her. It's one of the very things that attracted me to her in the first place, why on earth would I ask her to not be that sexy person I met that night?

To me there is sex with someone you love, and sex with someone you don't. Both are sex, the emotion and feeling afterward are different. The worst sex with Mrs. WS beats the best sex with anyone else any day. The latter is getting-off in a wonderful manner, the second is getting-off in a wonderful manner that also happens to fill my heart and soul with an overwhelming feeling of love.

Since your boyfriend saw others while you were broken-up and came back to you, I would think he himself was missing that with the other women. It may have been fun and good sex, but it was emotionally unfulfilling sex.

Maybe you experienced the same thing during your hiatus from each other?

Believe me, not only do I love Mrs. WS deeply, I love her on a whole new and I feel higher level than I did before we started swinging. Our relationship has moved beyond the petty jealousies that we see in so many of our friend's and neighbor's relationships and we trust each other in ways few will ever understand. She has had sex with other men, and good sex at that, and she still loves me more than anything in the world. What kind of trust, security and respect do you think that builds?

But with all this, I'm not saying you should swing. I am simply saying that because he wants to doesn't mean he doesn't love you. It means that you mean enough to him, and he has so much faith in you, that 1) he can express his fantasy to you, and 2) he knows that you wouldn't run away with the other guy. Take it for what it is: ultimate trust and faith in you. If he didn't have that with you than he never would have brought-up the subject of it with you.

I hoped that helped some and that my tired mind wasn't wandering to much and it all made sense.

Mr. WS

P.S. Intuition said it best in this post from last December. It is so good I bookmarked it in my Favorites.

Originally Posted by intuition897

You sound just like me several years ago. I had these same ideas about love, sex and marriage (and now look at me ). I had a tough time getting over the thought that he valued me so little that he could pass me around like a chunk of meat to other men he barely knew. I felt that this was a great deal to ask of me, to ask me to degrade and defile myself just so he could fulfil some selfish fantasy. I mean, really!? What the hell was I anyway? Some blow-up dolly?? I was hurt and angry. I am NOT some fucking TOY!

After a long time of thinking this and never really telling him how I felt about it (more about communication skills in a second...) we finally cleared the air. He was surprised to know that I felt that way. He finally explained it to me. He wasn't asking something of me; he was giving me a gift! He was trying to find a polite and inoffensive way to return my wedding gift to me: my sexuality. This was him telling me that he didn't want me to cut off a piece of myself like a grisly sacrifice. He loved me too much to ask that of me. He fell in love with all of me, and that included my sexual vitality. He loved my flirtiness and adventurousness. My gift to him was to kill that for him so no other man would ever have it. The trouble was that he would never see it again either. Not really. Just like you don't appreciate the sun without a little rain, when you take away the means for me to prove that no other man can have that one part of me that is reserved just for him - my heart - my marriage vows lose their meaning. So this is our marriage vows in action. When I have sex with another man, that's me saying, "This other man can borrow my body, and he can do nice things to it, and I can enjoy his company...but he is not you, and I love you. This other man will never have this part of me that you have so completely in the palm of your hand. And I love you and thank you so much for giving me the chance to prove this to you."

[Tybee Swing]

Hi LAG, welcome to the board.

For me personally, if I'd been introduced to the notion of swinging the way you had, it would have been too soon and with too little commitment.

Your boyfriend asked you to swing with him after 9 months of dating. Don't get me wrong, there are people here who are just dating and swing. There's no law that says you have to be married to be a swinger. But for me, that wouldn't work. It would be like putting the cart before the horse. I need for the relationship to come first, and to know that he is there for me, before I could swing with him. Otherwise, I might feel like he was dating me more to have a swing partner and get into the clubs, rather than because I was the one for him.

After he told you he'd like for you to swing and you didn't take that news too well, he broke up with you a week later. I would read into that (personally) that the swinging comes first, the relationship second. Then, he hooks up with some chick on a swinger site just to go to the swing clubs with her. Apparently that didn't work out so well (they never hooked up at the clubs with others), and during this time, he's still calling you. I would feel that he cared for me to some degree, but still the swinging was a bigger deal to him.

Originally Posted by LAG

Anyway, just two weeks ago we decided to make things work. He loves me dearly, I know he does and I adore him. But, swinging has to be part of his life so I've agreed to at least be open minded.

It sounds like when the two of you recently decided to work it out, swinging was involved in the topic of you two getting back together. Did he tell you that "swinging has to be a part of his life" in the conversations about you two getting back together? That would bother me. I would feel that there was an ultimatum hanging over us - and that if I didn't come through and become the swinger he wanted me to be, he'd eventually leave.

In my relationship, my husband and I knew that our relationship came first, and it always would. We were married and feeling really secure in our relationship before we entertained the idea of swinging together. From the beginning, we always said that if it didn't feel right to one or the other of us, swinging would be over and done with, no regrets, and no whining. It would be just something we tried - end of story. We've been into it off and on for a few years now, and still feel the same way. Never in a million years would one of us think, "I need to break up or move on if you're not going to swing, because it has to be part of my life".

This is the big difference that would bother me. I wouldn't be able to swing under those conditions.

Think everything through carefully. Don't do anything that you truly don't want to do. Follow your heart.

Big hugs!

[LAG]

From LAG: the person who posted the first question. THAnk you to the couple of replies I"ve gotten. I REALLY appreciate them. I'd like even more because each one is so helpful as it's slightly different. I want to clairfy on thing that I wrote. He never said, It HAD so be part of my life." Rather, he explains that it is part of who he is but often says, ."It is now who I am, just part of who I am." So, it wasn't like .... either you swiwg with me or it's a no-go. It wasn't that harsh. If anyne else can shed their view on it, I'd appreciate it. Even if it's the same Idea as the three I've gotten because each one is helpful to me. I'm scared. And, my fear isn't that he'll fall for someone else because of the sex rather that when interacting in such an intimate way with others, I fear he'll develope a spark with someone else. Yes, I could too but it's him I'm worried about. I'm just so scared although the idea that many of you veterns have about no jealous sounds like where I'd like to get, right now I'm just so scared and nonunderstanding. Help me to understand. THANKS! LAG

[Edison Carter]

Susan here--When I married Ed, he had known that I had group play as a single woman. Yet, my relationship to him as a married woman was much more important than group sex. For me, I let that part of my life go and willingly so. Ed, shortly after we were married asked if I missed it. I said,"No, what I have now transcends that, but if you ever want to try it, even if just once, I'll arrange it."

In our case we did and he enjoyed himself and Swinging is now part of our life. Group sex was never so much a part of who I am that I couldn't walk away from it for the right reasons. Reasons that include that the person I love, cherish and completes me, yet simply is not mentally 'wired' to engage in it.

Now, as far as the 'good girl' thing goes. I'm a 'good girl' who can enjoy multi-partner sex. I do not feel that it's dirty, extreme, freaky, weird, etc. It is simply something that I enjoy with the right people. It is never some cheap sexual thrill.

Because of my love of Ed, if I never had another threesome or moresome it would not have mattered. Swinging is fun, but I would never put it ahead of the needs of my spouse. Lastly, I told Ed that I enjoyed group sex the first time he asked me out, not after nine months. I knew he was the monogamous type looking for a relationship and I did not want him to 'fall' for me and then I'd say,"By the way, do you mind watching other men fuck me ? If you don't, we have to break up." That is so irresponsible and controlling in my opinion.

Be well. Remember, you have choices and there are plenty of men out there that will accept you monogamously. But don't do anything that doesn't feel right or at least worth trying once.

[SouthBond]

Dump the guy. He doesn't love you. You are just something that he can trade for more women. Women being forced into swinging is some form of rape. Don't do it because he wants to do it. Do it because both of you want to do it.

[twobears]

well,I never would have thought that I would be a swinger,ever because of my own weak feeling of self worth. I wanted to have good marriage,be able to trust my husband,myself,be balanced emtionally. Well it took me lots of years,much love for each other to over come my personel passed heartache to be that person. My first marriage ended with a hatefull man trying to push me with fears of losing my children. I am telling you this to let you see how our love for each other lead us into a more trueful,loving relationship,it took 20 years to learn this. I still have a few things that pop up now and again that I feel stressed with fear to free myself. I talk to my mate fast as I can,I laugh and look at the situation,knowing that my husband always wants what is best for me and our marriage. We know that if we feel hurtful feeling over an issue that it was not done to hurt the other one,it was just a moment I felt jealous or hurt. We swing for our personel pleasure,for adult fun, we love to see each other be the natural human being that the Spirit made us to be. We do not have to swing to keep our marriage together,we are very carefull about each other,we set our guidelines and with time each become less improtant our joy in sharing our pleasure with each other,seeing the other enjoy life. I wish I could have been what I am now years ago, but this is a personel walk. Keep reading this board and talking to your mate,it will work it self out with the love you have for each other.

[Fringeswinger]

"What's love got to do with it?" -Tina Turner. Remember that song? We did a whole class on it in college (Marriage and Family).

Dear LAG,

I'm not a swinger (let me know if you want the details and I'll answer you with a private message), but I like to read this board; it's extremely interesting. The people who have experience swinging provide what seems like great advice, but maybe coming from the other side I can say something here that helps you too.

You raise lots of valid questions, and I compliment you on picking yourself up off the emotional floor and doing the research. Thats quite open minded of you and tells me you are trying really hard to salvage your relationship with your b/f. What more could he really ask of you?

First, you never can be 100% sure your mate won't leave you (for any reason). You don't have to be a swinger to fall for someone else. As many have said before, its TRUST. Like faith, trust means you don't have to have "proof", you just believe. You have to take the chance based on history, personal feelings, intuition, performance, etc. It isn't instant, it has to be earned.

Secondly, you ask how he could love you and still want to swing. Lots of answers there, many good ones put forth already. Hopefully I don't offend anyone here, but my opinion is that swingers are just wired differently. They can compartmentalize sex and love, separating them more easily than "most" people. Part of that is doing away with the green monster, which is HUGE.

Another part of it is simply togetherness (communication). Basically experiencing almost everything together, including sex with others. I think someone once made an analagy to playing doubles tennis or getting a really, really nice massage together. Its kind of recreational, not essential, but looked at as a fun activity. I guess if it is essential, it becomes an addicition which has unhealthy undertones. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but a lot of the threads I have read are basically saying "we could stop anytime we want to and be ok". Stay away from the guys who get off on the concept of "pimping you out".

Watching you enjoy yourself with another man (or woman) in a healthy relationship I believe serves several purposes. One is to give you the freedom to enjoy the ultimate pleasure - express your sexuality - with complete trust. Pretty cool gift. Why do we enjoy giving things? We like to see people be happy.

Another is that for the men interested in it, it is a huge vouyeristic sexual turn on to see your SO having a great time. Once again, hard to explain. Call it a kink or just sophisticated sexual taste, some people will just never be turned on by it. You may or may not be one of those people.

Bottom line is that no one here can tell you what your b/f is likely to do based on your exclusive input. We don't "know" either one of you, all we have to go on is your viewpoint and events as you relay them to us.

I would say that few people fall into this lifestyle quickly and easily. From what I have read, its takes a lot of communication, self examination, and complete honesty with yourself and you SO. I don't beleive there is a magic pill that will permit you to all of a sudden "get it". You may never "get it". Your sexuality is personal to you. I can't think of anything I posess that makes me more vulnerable.

I can imagine for a woman, sharing that with anyone is even more of a very special thing (emotions, fear of beinf considered "loose", pregnancy, etc.) We as guys for the most part are still primeval hunters who don't think too much about it, think with our you-know-what's, etc. For some idiots like me, the mentality may go like 1) My wife is my best friend, 2) I'd like to do other women so 3) She'd like to do other men. Think, Bill, THINK!

Anyway, hope that helps. If you stay around the board, I think you'll learn more in 5 minutes here than you could in a lifetime anywhere else. Just don't do anything till you're satisfied you've done enough research and that you are doing it b/c you are comfortable with it. Don't compromise yourself on behanlf of someohne else. If they really love you, they won't ask you to do that.

Bill

[Tybee Swing]

Originally Posted by Fringeswinger

Another part of it is simply togetherness (communication). Basically experiencing almost everything together, including sex with others. I think someone once made an analagy to playing doubles tennis or getting a really, really nice massage together. Its kind of recreational, not essential, but looked at as a fun activity. I guess if it is essential, it becomes an addicition which has unhealthy undertones. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but a lot of the threads I have read are basically saying "we could stop anytime we want to and be ok".

I agree with you completely, Bill. You nailed it!

Swinging is non-essential. The focus is the relationship. If swinging is supporting and enhancing the relationship, and both parties feel comfortable and positive about it, cool. But if not, it goes.

[ShellyM]

In response to the OP,
Well I can tell you for a fact that the love I have for my husband is never challenged for a moment. It is because we love each other as much as we do that we indulge in this hobby. NO, its not for everyone. Heck, its not for alot of people who call themselves swingers. I don't know that I have any good answers for you other than to say that yes, Jay and I love each other as much as 2 people can. We respect each other. Now, I would say in my opinion (and this is just my personal opinion) that a couple should be a couple for about 10 years before they venture into this....only because it takes a long time to really establish the trust that is needed in order to really enjoy swinging. If you do this you do not want to do it with jealousy or apprehension, but it should be something you both truly have fun at doing.
Shelly

[Lovethenights]

LAG, you've gotten some really awesomely thought out responses from this board, a very real example of the measure of friendship and caring that can exist in the swinging community. I can't really improve on the details of what they have said to you, but only might add, I married my wife 10 years ago and the times I have experienced her sharing her sexuality with other men have made me feel so intensely in love with her I would have done anything for her. I've never felt so close to her and so joined with her. Rather than mean I don't love her or care for her, sharing her experience of her own sexuality has meant I love her more than anyone else and want for her the maximum sexual pleasure she can ever experience, whether derived from me or another. It's about her feeling wonderful and me wanting her to feel wonderful. If you keep falling into the trap of a religious upbringing, take the time to read the excellent and scholarly tome called, "Divine Sex: Liberating Sex from Religious Tradition," by Philo Thelos. It is truly liberating in a way that doesn't at all force you or push you to disavow your faith. Rather it offers you a vision into the fullness of your faith and that might allow you into a relationship with a man willing to give you all of the pleasure you can imagine. Good luck.

[LOL_OMG]

Wow the responses have been wonderful to read. I can only add that once on this board someone noted that a couple sharing sexuality was somewhat of a gift to each other, and that in itself became a selfless act of love. Viewed in that light jealousy is no longer an issue.

The mantra of communication is key. Talk about what you want, what you expect, how things went....etc. You will be drawn closer just from the open conversation.

Mrs