feeling like he cheated on me

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by simplynina

This scares the shit out of me and i feel like it is all my fault, because we started the swinging thing and i asked him to look for other women. but for us, never for him alone. we made that clear. i thought.

Nina, you agreed to go on an adventure together with him. You agreed to explore the boundaries of your relationship with him. And guess what? You found one. You NEVER agreed to him crossing those boundaries! This is something he did all on his own, and it is not your fault. Do you blame the rape victim when her boyfriend forces himself on her, even if she initially agreed to it? No! She agreed to a loving expression of their relationship. When she realized that that's not what it was, she said no, and her wishes were not respected. His will was forced on her.

Originally Posted by simplynina

i brought this subject up again last night. and he got really pissed off, saying he knows he made a stupid mistake, and why can't i just let sleeping dogs lie. that i keep throwing it up in his face like rubbing a dog's nose in doo. but, i can't help to think that i wouldn't bring it up if he would just quit talking to her.

Yeah. Exactly. What he's not getting right now is that it wasn't the sexual nature of this relationship with this other woman; it was the way he chose to go about it, the way he chose himself over you, and the way he valued this other woman's opinion more than yours. It's about what his actions say about his feelings for you! He doesn't GET that! He doesn't understand - maybe doesn't want to understand - that his actions and choices bring consequences, and NO! you are NOT going to let sleeping dogs lie. That dog is wide awake and barking its ass off. Saying you're sorry and feeling a bit guilty is not the same as actually BEING sorry for what you did. If he were truly remorseful, he'd take accountability for his actions. He'd fully realize that he hurt you, and that is a very VERY bad thing!! He hurt you. Doesn't he care? If his attitude is that you'll get over it, it says that he'll do it again...because you'll get over it again, right? What he doesn't realize is that these choices he is making are forcing you to make some tough decisions about your entire relationship. Do you really want to be in a relationship with someone who cares more about themselves than they do about you?

So let him get pissed off. You'll find it's not the end of the world. It may be the end of the relationship if he allows it to be, but you're right there wanting to work things out. He's not co-operating by respecting your needs as a person. You need to respect yourself enough to draw that line in the sand and enforce the consequences when he crosses it.

Originally Posted by simplynina

i don't know? i love him and he says he loves me and it would kill him if he ever would lose me, but i can't help to just keep thinking about it over and over and over head bang .........................thank you to everyone for listening

If you love him, you cannot allow him to continue doing this. It damages him as much as it damages you. Just like lack of discipline produces spoiled kids who don't hold themselves accountable for their actions, so does a lack of discipline in a marriage. No, we're not children anymore. But you have not set a firm boundary, and he will walk right on through it again and again if you don't SHOW him that this boundary is non-negotiable. Self-respect is NOT negotiable within a relationship. Explain to him that if you "let sleeping dogs lie", and you don't resolve this issue, if you just let this go without him fully realizing what he has done to you, that he is asking you to surrender a portion of your self-respect. That is absolutely unacceptable. Good relationships allow you to be the best you that you can be. Good relationships never degrade either person.

Him telling you that it would kill him to lose you is emotional manipulation. Do NOT allow him to put the responsibility of this on YOU. It's all him, baby. You have no choice but to stick to your guns and retain your self-respect. You must. When he chooses to ask you to just suck it up, to let your self-respect take a hit like this...he is making himself into a person that it is bad to be around. And you care enough about yourself, and respect yourself enough, to not subject yourself to other people's abuses. He has not shown you that he has changed at all. Making a sad face, saying he's really, really sorry, and not talking about it anymore doesn't change the fact that he still hasn't given up what he wanted; he's just backed off a little and is going more slowly down the same damn road! He can't just be friends with this woman. Doesn't he get that? There's too much history there! And to be honest, why would he want to be friends with her in the first place? This is a woman who has NO respect for your relationship, and for Mr. intuition and I, people like that get dropped like a hot rock.

It's your call, Nina. The end of a relationship is not the end of the world.

[Mr. Mac]

I may be the 2nd man to reply to this....but my wife and I just recently went through a similar situation. She had just had our 4th child, we had her Grandmother living with us, I was busy working, and apparently not realizing was feeling neglected. I started talking to this girl.

Well, in this whole process I never once thought that it was getting emotional or intimate. Nothing physical happened. But I began to "co-exist" with my wife. This was a bad place to be in!!

She knew that I was talking to her and she wanted it to end...and it did for a short period of time. Then we talked again a couple times nothing serious ( cuz I didn't see the problem with talking to a single female and nothing serious in my mind....then one day I just happen to be talking to her at home and my wife heard the words come out of my mouth wihle I was on the phone "I just wanted to hear your voice"

She freaked and I did too....didn't realize the magnitude of what I had said until later. Seeing through her eyes opened mine.

She is since out of the picture, met some guy on the internet and moved to TX.

I can't speak for him with all the pics and masterbation...but that is the thing...he needs to see it through your eyes....

Good luck

[intoit_0308]

First of all I TOTALLY 100% agree with everything Intuition said. Let me tell you why. I had been married for 2 years, my husband would have to go away for weeks at a time every few months. One of these times, he talked about this woman who was helping him with his career/education (in the military). Every other time he'd call he'd mention her. When he came home, everyone seemed to know but me. I found out by her husband calling me and reading me their letters. We worked through it and things seemed to be going pretty well, until about 2 years later we had this huge argument. He went out with the guys and met a woman. She was around for 9 months and nothing that I did or said would make him stop. We separated this time (somewhere around week 4 of their relationship). Someone said to me "why do you want to be with someone who obviously doesn't care how you feel or shows no signs that he wants to be with you". WOW! I was pregnant, young, no skills, job, or self esteem. We somehow decided to get back together, after all we already had one child and another to come. Well, 10 years later..... I gained alot of self esteem, a job and a whole new perspective on life and sex. I met someone and he and I decided it would be fun to try and bring her into our sex life. (we had had an encounter before and we had alot of fun with it) We had alot of fun for a few months, and it really seemed to get us talking more and we were closer than ever. Then he had to go away again, and there of course was another woman. It had been 10 years and never any reason since that last one to worry or think anything. Until one night at 2am, a text message came through.... "Missing you already"....... and I too got the "we only talk, there's nothing going on story". Maybe that was true, but if there was no connection then why wouldn't he stop talking to her. The text messages came all the time, and he too got one on Father's Day. (we also had this rule about not bringing anyone or anything into our home because of the kids, we would go elsewhere) If indeed "I and the kids were the most important thing in his life" why would he jepordize that? One day I heard him talking to one of his friends about "trading up", he insisted that is wasn't about her. He saw what it was doing to me, he knew I was having serious flashbacks, I went through a phase where I wouldn't do anything, I lost 20lbs, I lost my job because I was so distracted. (a better one came along shortly after) Then one day, while I was at work, he stopped by the house to pick up something, guess who was in the car. And after a 20 year friendship and 14 years of marriage, I realized this. I DESERVE to be #1 and so do my kids. And if he thought more about how a woman he's only known a few weeks, felt than he did I... I don't want to be with someone like that. I had been through too much with him. He actually made the comment that "it's okay to have another woman in bed when we're together, but he can't do it alone? What kind of crap is that?" As it had been said earlier, we made the decision together, you deal with the consequences together. I know it wasn't my fault, he's an adult he could have said no. I am now divorced and I have all my kids. He however, is supposedly no longer with her and at least once a week asks if we should try it again. I always say no, 10 years down the road, I don't want to go through it again.

[intuition897]

Intoit, thank you for your post. I don't believe that the rule "once a cheater, always a cheater" is absolute. I do believe that people can and do change. But as your story demonstrates, the rule stands for as long as they refuse to accept the responsibility for their actions.

I am sorry that you have had to go through that in your life, but I am always happy to see people using a stumbling block as their stepping stone. Congratulations on your success.

[She_n_Jaybee]

I've been on both sides of the same situation. As a man I was for a time doing the cheating. Later I found out that my (ex)wife was doing her own cheating. We were both hiding what we were doing from each other. It eventually led to us both meeting up with and having sex with others, without each others knowledge. Once we got into the habit of hiding things from each other, it became easier and easier. Near the end, I pointed out to her that we were spending $300/month on phone calls to Florida, and I didn't know anyone in Florida. She just looked at me and shrugged. I can't complain much, I had at least a dozen affairs all over the country. It's not hard to do if you're a truck driver who spends lots of time away from home.

After the divorce, I had a girlfriend that had her own private things going on behind my back. I found out when I was at her house one day. She was at work and her e-mail program popped up a new message and the subject pretty much told me there was something going on. I investigated, found out the truth, and confronted her. She denied everything. It was nothing, etc. So I confirmed my earlier findings, tricked one of her partners into spilling the beans and confronted her again. Obviously, that relationship was doomed.

Now I've finally found someone that communicates with me and is up front about everything. We had an issue a few months back. Going through a major stressful period, and she was wondering if it was worthwhile to stick it out with me, or should she cut her losses and run. She ended up talking with an old boyfriend, met him for dinner, traded several e-mails back and forth and discussed my shortcomings with him. I can't remember why I had gone into her e-mail, but there was some reason. I saw something in a subject line, snooped and got very upset. Things were rather precarious for about a week. Whether or not something actually occurred between them I don't know and it doesn't matter now. She reassured me and has effectively cut off communication with him. They still talk (very briefly) from time to time, but it is typically because of something where his knowledge is of use.

However, if she had told me conflicting stories about him, and obvious lies then we would have never been able to work things out. If you don't make a firm move, you could very well get a phone call telling you he's not coming back. Take it from a man (and a trucker) who has been down that very road. He's heading towards a breakup with you to be with her. The crazy thing is, chances are, things won't work out with her and he'll be wanting to come back to you.

[simplynina]

just to update everyone

my husband called me today and said it was over with her!!! She called him up and he told her to lose his phone number, that it was causing too much problems with me and that it just wasn't worth it. I am so happy. He was home this past weekend and I was down and just really didn't talk much. He said he would show me his phone bill at the end of the month, just so i could see there would be no more phone calls, texts, or pics from her or to her. No more secrets. A big sigh of relief. i am on cloud nine. thanks to all who have listened to me and cared enough to reply. thank you

[lovedoctor]

...Great

But now the work starts. I would recommend you two get into counseling as soon as possible. It sounds like it's a ripe time to identify the underlying problems and work through them. Your relationship can be stronger in the end. But if you don't figure it out, it will happen again. JMHO.

Good luck!

[invisibletouch]

Great news, but please keep an eye on his e-mail and also any odd amounts of money that come up missing or can't be accounted for. I went through so much with my husband; multiple affairs that he said 'meant nothing' including one 'friendship' where he also claimed the woman was a full lesbian and I was just jealous of him having friends. When I found out about the many affairs; some physical, some emotional & some that started through internet chats; he put on this big production that he was a changed man and he 'gave them all up' because of his love for me. :rollseyes It was a few more months before I found out he'd just traded calling on his cell phone for buying calling cards to keep in contact with his honeys. I found the e-mail where he told his longest lover(8yrs) that they'd have to be extra careful; that I was still suspicious but he thought I was convinced that it was over. Do you know how painful and humiliating that was; I'd never want anyone to go through those feelings.
I'm not saying your hubby will do that but I know how it feels to be way down on the ladder of importance and made a fool of-I just don't want you to blindly allow yourself to be decieved also.
Best of Luck and I really do hope he saw what a treasure you were and gave her up.

Originally Posted by simplynina

just to update everyone

my husband called me today and said it was over with her!!! She called him up and he told her to lose his phone number, that it was causing too much problems with me and that it just wasn't worth it. I am so happy. He was home this past weekend and I was down and just really didn't talk much. He said he would show me his phone bill at the end of the month, just so i could see there would be no more phone calls, texts, or pics from her or to her. No more secrets. A big sigh of relief. i am on cloud nine. thanks to all who have listened to me and cared enough to reply. thank you

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by invisibletouch

When I found out about the many affairs; some physical, some emotional & some that started through internet chats; he put on this big production that he was a changed man and he 'gave them all up' because of his love for me. :rollseyes It was a few more months before I found out he'd just traded calling on his cell phone for buying calling cards to keep in contact with his honeys. I found the e-mail where he told his longest lover(8yrs) that they'd have to be extra careful; that I was still suspicious but he thought I was convinced that it was over.

Uh-huh. Damage control. No interest in fixing anything; he just wanted to not feel bad about it. A bit like taking a painkiller while tying the severed limb back onto the stump with some duct tape and chewing gum. There. All better now, see? :rollseyes *sigh*

I'm just wondering...Did you print out the email and sit waiting at the kitchen table? Did you hand it to him without saying a word? Did you demand that he read it to you with his own lying mouth? Did you watch him squirm, or maybe become enraged that he'd been found out (maybe that you "went snooping")? Did you make him read it to you, or maybe stand in his way as he tried to make his escape, reading his words back to him?

I think I would've threatened to take out a 1/4 page ad in the local newspaper and have them print his email, word for filthy word, if he didn't read it to you with his own mouth. Slander? Oh no. Those are his own words. He's only slandering himself. You're just making it known. If you're that ashamed of them, maybe you shouldn't have been saying them in the first damn place. Okay, maybe that wouldn't have held up in a court of law, but it sure makes a tasty thought.

[She_n_Jaybee]

Originally Posted by intuition897

Uh-huh. Damage control. No interest in fixing anything; he just wanted to not feel bad about it. A bit like taking a painkiller while tying the severed limb back onto the stump with some duct tape and chewing gum. There. All better now, see? :rollseyes *sigh*

I'm just wondering...Did you print out the email and sit waiting at the kitchen table? Did you hand it to him without saying a word? Did you demand that he read it to you with his own lying mouth? Did you watch him squirm, or maybe become enraged that he'd been found out (maybe that you "went snooping")? Did you make him read it to you, or maybe stand in his way as he tried to make his escape, reading his words back to him?

I think I would've threatened to take out a 1/4 page ad in the local newspaper and have them print his email, word for filthy word, if he didn't read it to you with his own mouth. Slander? Oh no. Those are his own words. He's only slandering himself. You're just making it known. If you're that ashamed of them, maybe you shouldn't have been saying them in the first damn place. Okay, maybe that wouldn't have held up in a court of law, but it sure makes a tasty thought.

Remind me to never piss you off. Surrender

[invisibletouch]

I forwarded the whole file of cheating e-mails that I'd collected to everyone in his work and personal contact list. I know that action probably seems like overkill but you see we'd been married for 30 yrs when this came out and I'd stayed faithful the whole damn time. Plus he appropriated over $20k of communal funds :rollseyes & ran up debts without my knowledge. head bang Revenge was the one area of my life that I still felt I had under my control!
I may pay with some extra Karma but damn it felt good to hurt him just a little. Surrender

Originally Posted by intuition897

Uh-huh. Damage control. No interest in fixing anything; he just wanted to not feel bad about it. A bit like taking a painkiller while tying the severed limb back onto the stump with some duct tape and chewing gum. There. All better now, see? :rollseyes *sigh*

I'm just wondering...Did you print out the email and sit waiting at the kitchen table? Did you hand it to him without saying a word? Did you demand that he read it to you with his own lying mouth? Did you watch him squirm, or maybe become enraged that he'd been found out (maybe that you "went snooping")? Did you make him read it to you, or maybe stand in his way as he tried to make his escape, reading his words back to him?

I think I would've threatened to take out a 1/4 page ad in the local newspaper and have them print his email, word for filthy word, if he didn't read it to you with his own mouth. Slander? Oh no. Those are his own words. He's only slandering himself. You're just making it known. If you're that ashamed of them, maybe you shouldn't have been saying them in the first damn place. Okay, maybe that wouldn't have held up in a court of law, but it sure makes a tasty thought.

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by invisibletouch

I forwarded the whole file of cheating e-mails that I'd collected to everyone in his work and personal contact list. I know that action probably seems like overkill but you see we'd been married for 30 yrs when this came out and I'd stayed faithful the whole damn time. Plus he appropriated over $20k of communal funds :rollseyes & ran up debts without my knowledge. head bang Revenge was the one area of my life that I still felt I had under my control!
I may pay with some extra Karma but damn it felt good to hurt him just a little. Surrender

DAYamn! And I thought I was mean.

Well Inviz, you know what they say about karma coming back around...sounds a little more like righteous anger on your part and if anyone was due for a karmic ass-munching, it was your ex-husband. I'd say that makes you and he about even.

[vikings69]

This is my first reply, i am a newbie, i'm a male. baby girl, go to a club, pick out the most handsome man you can find, bring him home, introduce him to your husband and say to your husband "we will talk about this in two weeks", don't wait up, he's gay! IF A MAN CAN'T LOOK AT HIMSELF IN THE MIRROR, SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO BRING THE MIRROR TO THE MAN.

VINCE

[simplynina]

funny you should say all that. i am so seriously thinking of divorce. i don't even know why i was even trying to make it work. and he still isn't talking to her, i checked his phone bill, but i actually met someone else and he and i have been talking for about 2 weeks now and he has already made me feel more special than my husband ever has. i know i should get a divorce before i start meeting other people. but, i am a little afraid of my husband and i don't know how to tell him. but it feels a little good too, to do to him what he done to me. <EG> and the new guy knows that i'm married, so i am not lying to him.

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by simplynina

funny you should say all that. i am so seriously thinking of divorce. i don't even know why i was even trying to make it work. and he still isn't talking to her, i checked his phone bill, but i actually met someone else and he and i have been talking for about 2 weeks now and he has already made me feel more special than my husband ever has. i know i should get a divorce before i start meeting other people. but, i am a little afraid of my husband and i don't know how to tell him. but it feels a little good too, to do to him what he done to me. <EG> and the new guy knows that i'm married, so i am not lying to him.

You know what they say about two wrongs...

Don't sink to his level, Nina. If you choose to start a relationship with someone else, unless you and your husband are into polyamory, you'll need to end the one you're in right now. He hasn't been fair to you, but that doesn't mean it's okay to do the same to him. Like we were talking about before, let karma do the dirty work for you.

If you're actually afraid of him, you may need help in leaving him. Might be a good idea to post an entirely new thread on this subject, as there are women on this board, I'm sure, that have experience in this area. You don't want to end up a statistic.