reasons for NOT using condoms

[Uneed_Love]

Originally posted by PaulKing
...but God, to the best of my knowledge, won't give you cancer if you are wrong....

hummmmm I don't want to start a philosophical thread which could become soon very controversial BUT cancer is a creation of God as any other creation.... or to better say is a result of "bad" human's behavior (what the Buddhists call the KARMA).... in this case Your analogy is not such a bad one. We just differ on the interpretation.

JC (who will been soon reproached to wrote that cancer is a God's creation... but I assume)

[PaulKing]

Useful book on one area (cornstarch) of latex allergy: -

Medicine's Deadly Dust: A Surgeon's Wake-Up Call to Society
by Richard F. Edlich, MD, PhD with Julia A. Woods and Mary Jude Cox

In this intriguing new book, Dr. Richard F. Edlich reveals that if the health professionals treating you wear gloves with cornstarch powder you and your loved ones are at risk of:

Surgical complications /Latex allergy /Sterility /Tumor-like cysts /Blindness /Even Death

http://www.deadlydust.com/Books.htm


-----

You will READ the stories of some of the millions of Americans whose lives have been crippled forever by this silent villain...

You will LEARN the cause and symptoms of numerous medical problems that continue to go misdiagnosed ....

You will DISCOVER what is being done to stop this menace...


------

ABOUT THE AUTHOR: Richard F. Edlich, MD, PhD, is a world-renowned authority on surgical wound healing and infection. He is Professor Emeritus of Plastic Surgery at the University of Virginia Health Center. As a specialist in research on the development of and prevention of intestinal adhesions, as well as on the biology of wound repair and infection, he has published six books and more than six hundred scientific articles.

Protect yourself and those you love... Be an informed consumer and advocate change!

Reviews "It is not often that physicians take on the health care industry. Indeed, it is refreshing to see an insider's critical evaluation. While Edlich makes few friends along his consumer activist path, it is exactly this type of insider advocacy that will be required to eliminate medicine's unnecessary deadly dust from our hospitals and our bodies, and to alert the public to the dangers of latex allergy." Robert K. Jenner and Sarah Weyland, Trial (March 1998)

"A must read for latex allergic patients." Latex Allergy News (April 1997)

"Medicine's Deadly Dust is essential reading for both health professionals and their patients -- especially those who are allergic to latex or have undergone surgery..." Leye Jeannette Chrznowski One Step Ahead (August 1997)

"Medicine's Deadly Dust is a must read for anyone involved in health care as well as for the general public. This information is a wake-up call for those providing health care as well as those on the receiving end!

"Dr. Richard Edlich readily communicates that many proven dangers of lubricating powder (cornstarch) associated with latex products, primarily gloves.

"Dr. Edlich has plainly articulated the obvious dangers associated with cornstarch powder on a level well comprehended by everyone. The solution is obvious and, often times, the reader is at a loss as to why powder continues to be used! Good question." Lise C. Borel, DMD National Director, ELASTIC Inc. (December 1997) (Education for Latex Allergy/ Support Team and Information Coalition) ElASTIC is comprised of regional chapters throughout the country. Its Minnesota chapter is planning a conference for April/98 on Latex Allergy. Stay tuned for the conference agenda!

[OhioCouple]

Originally posted by JustAskJulie

Please don't turn this into a debate over whether or not they affective. Post your reasons and leave it at that... no need to debate.

Originally posted by Julie. I think we have plenty of threads in which to post back and forth the dangers/or not so dangers of latex and condoms.

[Weezie]

Our first rule in swinging is always to use a condom. It's just something we do....always. The only one that gets me without one is my own husband. There was one case where the guy was older and he freaked out when told to put one on. They got dressed and left. We haven't seen them since. We see that type of behavior as very disrespectful. Other than that we haven't had any problems with our request.

[Flori_DAMAN]

I dont use condoms during sex. I always run my anti-virus program though.

John, who really need to get out more.

[MagicEnigma]

Its another reason I have been dating only women for nearly a year now. I don't want to mess with the condom issue and guys I don't know. Its not a lock they will actually prevent anything, just a better chance you won't get something. And I also don't want to risk mixing my life with my friends I swing with. I've had to many of them break inside me, over me, near me, and have many more leak because either we use them to long after he cums, or its just not out before some leaks up and out. Inside of my most frequent group, we only use them if somebody has concern about an outside encounter or somethign along those lines. I don't like the taste of condoms, and don't go down on guys wearing them. I'm not fond of going down on guys how have worn them at some recent point, but don't make a big deal out of it. Some of the guys wear them because they don't prefer the entire sloppy seconds issue. I personally do prefer it if I'm playing with the girls between men, keeps things neater. But its not an absolute, I've gotten more cum on my face from going down on women, then with men, of course thats apples and oranges there. I'd like to try clubs more, or branch out to more people, but don't exactly because my current circle is a nice comfy group I know and trust. I do worry about the chemicals, much the same reason I do about cervical cancer given my very much above average sexual activity. The amount of intercourse I have, and most of the women here, puts us at a higher risk. But I don't suspect any of us serious are going to say "I should do this less" because of it. Human skin and seamen don't cause cancer. I wonder about some of the stuff in and on the condoms.

[Bob123]

I think condoms suck.

I think stds and unplanned pregnancy sucks worse.

I think we need a male birth control pill

[Chris&Amelia]

We always use condoms for intercourse, except with a couple we've known for years. Then, and only then, do we go bareback (unless Amelia and I have having intercourse, obviously.)

Both Amelia and I have a background in the medical field, and despite PaulKing's arguments, we still feel that condoms are the best way to prevent the spread of STD's.

Also, last thing I want to hear is either (1) my wife is pregnant with another man's child or (2) I knocked up one of our playmates. After all, the pill isn't 100% effective, but a condom and the pill are pretty much foolproof.

[MagicEnigma]

I guess the STD issue is more the thing. I'm on the pill, and I have enough faith in it that it isn't my main concern. And my view on it overall, guys still typically wear them, and I make sure there is one to be had if I expect any sex with another guy that isn't somebody I swing with. Maybe the debate applies more directly to those that are swinging more openly than I am right now.

I think more of the times with people I know well, and the limited context I am engaged in.

[PaulKing]

VERY RARE

Average syphilis rates 2.5 cases per 100,000

http://www.cdc.gov/nchstp/dstd/Fact_...ilis_Facts.htm

[oliverx]

We don´t use them with people we know well. But we do use them when out of the country playing with people we don´t know in clubs. The vote was for not neccesary although there comes a time we feel the neccessity, then they cause a loss of sensation. But in most cases we don´t use condoms, cause we feel relatively secure and like to feel the sensations of sex.

[oliverx]

I should add if we know the women we are playing with are fertile I use them of course, not wanting pregnancy outside our marriage.

We use them.
If they are only good for "Piece of mind" then so be it.

Mrs naughty thought they would take away from the experience but she says she has found they do not. The only down side for her is a little increased soreness from the friction from the condom.

I havent found it to take away from the sensation that much at all. Being attracted to the person I am having sex with is where most of the sensation comes from anyway.

[Mr. Bliss]

Originally posted by PaulKing

AIDS CASES IN 2001

France 1528
Holland (legal prostitution) 45
Sweden (legal prostitution/very sexually liberated) 42
Denmark (as above) 74

These current statistics hardly suggest a link between AIDS and sexual activity.
France had over 1528 AIDS cases in 2001 (http://www.avert.org/eurosum.html) compared to 74 in Denmark BUT uses condoms almost 300% more of the time than people in Denmark. Sweden with the LOWEST condom usage rate also has the LOWEST 'AIDS' rate.

NOTE: Even the figure for France is really tiny and hardly represents an 'epidemic'. Of these 1528 'cases' most are gay, drugs users or minorities. The 42 cases in Holland in an entire year shows just how safe sex really is!
[/B]

`

Paul is comparing the absolute numbers of France (60.000.000 people with Denmark 5.000.000 people, Holland 16.000.000)

Paul is praising Holland as a safe country (I am from Holland) The reason for this low rate is that we use condoms over here Paul, study showed that people use less condoms because of the low rates and good AIDS drugs. Result --> more aids infections after 2001. 1191 in 2002

The only reason Paul is disease free is luck and all those people that do use condoms and thus lower Pauls chances to get a disease. If we al did like paul he wouldn't be so lucky.

[da2ofusgb]

Guess we just dont like the feel of them. The majority of people we swing with are like us we are both fixed and cannot have children anymore.

If another couple asks to use them, that is fine we have no problem with that at all. In my case though I will only have soft swing with the partner than and let Tam finish me off after we are done.

Are we worried about std's........yuppers, but we dont lose any sleep over it. We take risks everyday of our lives in our chosen careers.

One more thing, we do get tested on a regular basis and we would definately let anybody know if we had anything at all. After all this lifestyle is based on honesty and trust but that is another topic....

Peace...
Ed