He's ok with another girl but not ok with bringing another man into the mix

[juniperviolet]

Hey Everyone,

I have been lurking for a while and have wandered around the site, but have yet to see a question like the one I have.

My FI and I have been together for almost 6 years and are very secure in our relationship. We have discussed bringing someone else to join us in play and throughout the site, we have realized that what we are looking for is the "elusive golden unicorn"

I have never been with another woman before and I am very interested, although it would have to include my FI as a one-on-one setting does not appeal to me. He is, of course, all for that.

After realizing that it is near impossible to find a woman to join us, I am open to meeting other couples, but he does not like the idea of another man being involved. I have seen many men on here say that they find it a turn on to see their spouse with another man, but mine says he doesn't want another inside of me. I would LOVE to have a mmf (which I have told him), but am not pushing it.

I have asked him why he is O.K with a woman and he said it is because she can offer me what he cannot. I told him that he cannot offer me two penises at the same time in two different places!

We live quite far from the nearest GTG/Club, but we are looking into going just to get a feel for things/check it out.

Sorry for rambling...And I hope what I wrote makes sense to everyone.

To my question: Are there any men out there that feel the way my FI do about brining another man to play? And if so, how have you gone about being in the lifestyle - if that is still an option?

Thank you in advance

[MoonLightKiss]

Hey there and First, just wanna say thanks for coming out of the lurker corner and joining us It's wonderful to have you here.

As far as I know, there are probably men out there who do feel that having their wife/SO be with another woman is okay, but when it comes to being with another man, its suddenly not okay. In your situation it sounds as if you would like to experience both MFM and FFM and your husband is not to keep on the idea of the MFM. The basic line is, to not do anything you are not comfortable with. If you are comfortable with both, then thats great. If you aren't then thats okay too. I also believe in whats good for the gander is good for the goose. Meaning, if I want a MFM and my husband wants an FFM, then I believe that both or neither happen. It's kind of an equal opportunity thing. But if I wanted both, and he only wanted one, then just the one would be okay in our book.

Just remember the best thing you can both do is respect each other's boundaries and feelings. If you can't come to a mutual understanding, then looking for a different avenue is okay.

As far as choosing a couple for your FFM, there are a few people, (and I cannot think of who right this minute) that have stated here, that getting together with another couple for some FF play with spouse only intercourse is a viable alternative. That way everyone gets the FF play without having to get too discouraged over trying to find that ever elusive "unicorn". And if the men are not up for full swap, you have the boundary of spouse sex only. It might be something to look into.

[dayhiker]

Hi Juniper,
There are men with the attitude that your FI has. So that is common I think. Probably most don't end up swinging as a result.

Something you might consider, is going to is strip club. Often strippers like to see a girl in a audiance. That doesn't mean you'll get a 3some ... but you prehaps can get a lap dance from the girl and enjoy the sensuality of it.

a thought
dayhiker

[LOL_OMG]

Hi Juniper, I thought you posed a very good question and it was one I myself had early on. I think it's probably pretty normal that someone wants A and someone wants B when getting down to fantasies.

We didn't jump into the fantasies right away. We went to clubs and kind of did each other, lol. We watched other people, maybe flirted a little, and we had rules out the wazoo. After getting a bit more comfortable with ourselves, the rules started to drop as the trust level went up. We've fulfilled some of those fantasies, but it took some time.

I guess my point is not to try and rush things, it's better to wade in

[Cpl2share]

In the male psyche F/F does not convey the threat that F/M does. We (the male sex) do not have penis envy for women, duh. It is the inherent fear that "she" will find more pleasure in the other male and leave us. Does this fear go away? For those who develope and "mature" in swinging yes. For those men that do not get over it, swinging ruins the relationship. To answer your question:
He may get over the "fear" associated with you and another man. He may not. It may be that after a FFM he realizes that you did not "convert" to lesbo, therefor you will not run off with the other man. Take it slow and do only what you are both comfortable with. If that means that for now you are both okay with FFM then enjoy that. IF you are not sure about his actual reaction to the FFM then wait and continue to TALK about it. Communication is the key here. Good Luck.

[juniperviolet]

Thanks for all the replies so far.

He is not the type to go to strip clubs, but I asked him to go with me and he did (I'm not saying he didn't enjoy himself - he more enjoyed watching me watching the women) and we did get a "couple" lap dance which we both enjoyed. I think all the advice is really great as we are going to make a date to go to a club and just "wade" in as you put it

Our communication is very open and honest which I love because we both know where we stand with everything and we will hopefully - in time- get some sort of action going that will fulfill both of our fantasies.

Again, thank you for all the replies

[iapr]

I am going to make some pretty grand statements here but I do believe them to be fundamentally true and one is that darn near ALL men are very squeemish if not downright phobic about other men touching their partners. That is why pretty much why every culture in every country on every continent practices monogamy as the official sexual paradigm.


Along with that pretty much every male on the planet wants to have an FMF or FFMF or an FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFM but throw in the idea of his primary partner getting a little extra and the cold sweat breaks out. Alot of men may ask for an FMF from their partner but if their parnter says they will do it but it will cost them a MFM in return, they decide that monogamy is not such a bad idea after all.

It may not be fair or equitable but that is how we are wired as a species. In the swinging world it is really what separates the men from the boys. Or maybe a better way to word it is what separates the "REAL SWINGERS" from the "FEM/FEM PLAY WATCHERS." (I know I'm gonna get some heat on that one so go for it)

If he feels strongly about not wanting you with other men under any circumstances you may be at an impass as far as swinging goes. Actual active swingers make up an extremely small percentage of the population and the issues you have brought up are some of the reasons why.

Some people are able to work it out and move forward, many are not. If he continues to refuse to consider you have a few options -

If you are ok with the idea of an FMF and are ok with knowing that you may never get paid back with an MFM then keep looking for unicorns, they are out there. However one thing that both you and your partner need to be aware of is most single gals that avail themselves to couples are mostly if not entirely only interested in the female half of the couple. Even if you find someone to join you he may still end up as a watcher. Think about it, what female do you know on the entire planet that cannot get sex from a guy? Why would a single gal want to be with a couple if she wanted to have sex with a guy when she could just get her own guy? Then keep in mind that if a single gal is interested in the guy then you may have some REAL problems but that is another topic.

Another option that many people will find distastefull but that I think is a very valid option is to book a flight to Reno and go to one of those legal brothels outside of town. Many of them love to cater to couples and you can call all the shots and get exactly what you want and can walk away scottfree with no strings attached. Of course your credit card will take a hit but it's only money.


There are also some couples that play separately but quite honestly I doubt if many men will let their partners play with a couple where they are asked to stay home just because the other guy doesn't want another man around and they know that they will never get anything in return for it. You can always ask but be prepared for a lot of "no thanks".


Or you can just keep going to the titty bars and getting lap dances. If it works for you two and all is well then go for it.


I hate to sound so negative but it really does take two people to make a swinging couple. It is usually the male half that we are telling to throw in the towel if the female half isn't going for it but sometimes it does work the other way too.

[Dynamar]

Originally Posted by iapr

If you are ok with the idea of an FMF and are ok with knowing that you may never get paid back with an MFM then keep looking for unicorns, they are out there. However one thing that both you and your partner need to be aware of is most single gals that avail themselves to couples are mostly if not entirely only interested in the female half of the couple.

Bolding mine.

Kind sir, you say in your post's intro that you're making some grand statements, and this is certainly one. Perhaps this has been your personal experience with single fems, but I can say that of all of the single females I know (and being pretty active in the midwestern swinger social scene, I know quite a few...) only about half of them are truly bi-sexual and very few of them are interested solely in FF activity.

Originally Posted by iapr

Even if you find someone to join you he may still end up as a watcher. Think about it, what female do you know on the entire planet that cannot get sex from a guy? Why would a single gal want to be with a couple if she wanted to have sex with a guy when she could just get her own guy? Then keep in mind that if a single gal is interested in the guy then you may have some REAL problems but that is another topic.

While you are correct that most single females can get all of the one-on-one MF activity she desires, single fems involved in swinging (again, in my own personal experience and knowledge) mostly do so to play concurrently with a man and a woman, i.e. a couple. The problem--which is hard to imagine when so many couples advertise the fact that they are strictly interested in a single, bisexual female--is that many, many couples just don't have the foundation in place to handle the activities which they purport to desire. That is, they've not done their homework... and they've not fully communicated between each other what they desire and why.

After that, they often do not follow through. They send lots of letters but do not put in the time and/or effort to "court" the object of their desire. Or, they are not equally engaged in the pursuit of the single female. Remember, a single female does not have the automatic support or "back-up", if you will, of a partner to look out for her. She needs to feel safe around both halves of a couple, as well as have an attraction to both halves.

To the OP, I'm also squarely in the camp that what's good for the gander is good for the goose. It's not so much a question of quid pro quo, as much as what each partner desires to experience. Unless you and your SO can find a way to handle the jealousy issues that arise from pursuing your separate fantasies together, you're best not to involve any singles in your potential drama.

[Perseus]

I know as a single guy, I don't have the experience to tell you what it is like, but it occurred to me while reading this thread that you might find what you are looking for by advertising for a 'Soft Swap' couple. If you are not familiar with the term, my understanding from the SS couple I know is it is two couple who have sex in the same environment and the only contact between the couples is the ladies. This would seem to me a way for you all to proceed with out the possibility of contact between you and the other man as that is laid out in the ground rules before the meeting. As to your desire for DP and contact with another man, you may have to play a wait and see game to see if he becomes more comfortable after a couple of soft sessions. You never know, he may get that itch to go for more after he has been in a comfortable situation.


Perseus

[KinkyKat]

Along with that pretty much every male on the planet wants to have an FMF or FFMF or an FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFM but throw in the idea of his primary partner getting a little extra and the cold sweat breaks out. Alot of men may ask for an FMF from their partner but if their parnter says they will do it but it will cost them a MFM in return, they decide that monogamy is not such a bad idea

after all.

Hi KinkyKat here,

I had previously posted about this same question, and it was like the same idea, where he only wanted a fmf or ffm to have fun, but I of course coming from a "swing" background myself, rejected that I wouldn't be limited cause I know what I prefer mfm or mmf but open to exploring play with another female.

Then it was a question of who would get their fantasy first fmf or mfm. This dilema and drama went on for some time. We talked and talked and talked and explored what we would Both be excited about pursuing and we have decided on a couple who are both bisexual!

We both had experienced the lifestyle as "singles" and never had to compromise before, for it wasn't necessarry. Working through this has brought Us to a better understanding of one another And no need for drama, cause now we are Both on the same page. This believe it or not took years of figering out, but thats what it took for us , but this can be a huge roadblock but worth the time and effort and could of destroyed any hopes of having fun together with others.

I guess my advice would be keep talking and exploring and think of all the possibilities

KinkyKat

[iapr]

Originally Posted by Dynamar

Bolding mine.

Kind sir, you say in your post's intro that you're making some grand statements, and this is certainly one. Perhaps this has been your personal experience with single fems, but I can say that of all of the single females I know (and being pretty active in the midwestern swinger social scene, I know quite a few...) only about half of them are truly bi-sexual and very few of them are interested solely in FF activity.


While you are correct that most single females can get all of the one-on-one MF activity she desires, single fems involved in swinging (again, in my own personal experience and knowledge) mostly do so to play concurrently with a man and a woman, i.e. a couple. The problem--which is hard to imagine when so many couples advertise the fact that they are strictly interested in a single, bisexual female--is that many, many couples just don't have the foundation in place to handle the activities which they purport to desire. That is, they've not done their homework... and they've not fully communicated between each other what they desire and why.

After that, they often do not follow through. They send lots of letters but do not put in the time and/or effort to "court" the object of their desire. Or, they are not equally engaged in the pursuit of the single female.




To the OP, I'm also squarely in the camp that what's good for the gander is good for the goose. It's not so much a question of quid pro quo, as much as what each partner desires to experience. Unless you and your SO can find a way to handle the jealousy issues that arise from pursuing your separate fantasies together, you're best not to involve any singles in your potential drama.

Even though you are trying to contradict me, I do agree with most of what you are saying. In fact for all practical purposes your statements about single fems supports what I was trying get across as far as from the perspective of the OP.

While I cannot speak from personal experience as we do not pursue single fems in the lifestyle at all. My opinion is formed from what I have seen with my own eyes at clubs and parties as well anecdotal accounts from conversations I have had with other people as well as reading many forum posts written from both couple in pursuit of single bi fems as well as posts from single fems themselves.

While I will just take your word for it as far as numbers and won't argue over statistics I still believe the draw for most single fems IN THE LIFESTYLE aka not vanillas and psuedo swingers that may post a profile on a website but are actually looking for a boyfriend (that' a whole other topic) are in fact mostly interested in the fem/fem aspect and may tolerated a certain amount of male contact to get to the female. But again I will take what you said at face value and concede that you are probably technically correct.

But here is the point I want to make - from the standpoint of the OP does it really matter if the % of single bi fems willing to have the male half is over 51% or under 49%??

By just shear numbers the number of couples that want a single fem to join them VASTLY outnumbers the number of available and practicing single fems by a HUGE amount. Then add to that the fact that in most couples the female half is just downright more attractive and desirable than the male half and the bottom truth comes out in the wash that the chances of this particular guy having a porno movie-type 3-way is very low. Now for all we know he may be as rich as Bill Gates, look like Brad Pitt and be hung as horse I am just talking in numbers here.

Now you were right on the money in that many of the couples that want a single fem do not have their shit together enough to make it work. You said it exactly right, everyone has the fantasy but not many do their homework and put in the time and energy to make it happen or especially to make it a good experience for all.

You also scored a bullseye in saying that many couples do want to put in the time and energy to "court" a single gal. Amen to that, and you can put us in that catagory. We are here for fun and erotic encounters and not to work. I spent years "courting" mrs iapr and niether she nor I are interested in putting ourselves back in the meat grinder of courting and drama when we can just find like minded couples and have a great time for all. The problem with this particular couple is he is not ok with being with other couples so it just goes back to them not having their act together again.

And finally I agree wholeheartedly with your final paragraph as well. These two have issues that need to be worked out and it will be a long and complicated process if they decide to try and move forward.

So in the end, even though you were disagreeing with me and maybe you are correct and I am wrong, but the bottom line is I think we are saying the same thing.

[sexychoclit]

As an "elusive golden unicorn", I completely and totally agree with Dynamar. I am in the lifestyle to explore my bi-sexual side. Although I could go out and get "laid" any night of the week, it gives me great pleasure to be in the company of man and woman who I am attracted to. The biggest issue is that most couples do not know how to treat a single female. We tend to be more cautious because we have to look out for our safety and most couples do not understand this. There are single females out there, but you have to really set yourself apart from the other couples who are trying to get with them. I can only advise the following: (1) Be respectful to the single female and her limits; (2) Be open and honest regarding what you are looking for; (3) As the female, be prepared to communicate with the single female. Personally, I find it sexy when the wife approaches me first; (4) Ensure that you and your husband are on the same page and that your rules for play are clearly communicated to the single female. These things can help so that if you are able to meet a single female, hopefully she will feel more comfortable in exploring other options with you and your husband.