Frustrated & Feeling Left Out

[seriously]

Hi, (trying this post from another computer)
My wife and I are relatively new to this lifestyle. We took our first plunge only about a month ago when we finally went to a club. The first night (we went on a Friday and the following Saturday) we hit it off with a guy who was there as a single. The vibe was really good so we invited him home. The two of us worked on my wife well into the pee hours. Unfortunately, while I enjoyed it, I never really got "closure" that night. After a while I started to get tired and gave up on the possibility of an orgasm though they both had a very nice time.
On the second night, the Saturday, I thought,"Ok, tonight is my night to really have some fun". That is, my turn to have sex with someone new. yay! Well of course, the vibe was not as good as the previous night, plus we were both a little worn out. So once again, I'm feeling a bit left out in the cold- though admittedly we had some super awsome sex Saturday morning.
Now a few weeks later, being the freeks that we aperently are , we are each feeling a bit more open and have been flirting lightly with certain friends and acquaintances. And in the past few days my wife's single, very yummy, best friend has voiced some interest in playing around. Last night she came over and they ended up giving me quite a show (actually she's here now and they're probably playing..I'll catch up in a few minutes). My wife says that she -yemmy best friend- is not ready to have a man directly involved though the friend has given me some positivve signs. Me and the best friend have yet to have a really candid conversation about the boundries. While I respect the best friend's wishes of course, this is leaving me a little frustrated with the situation. There has laso been some suggestions that maybe they should just play alone together (which I letting them do at this very moment). Not getting any attention is starting to bug me! Darn it! I want some stranger (novel) sex! Am I crazy?
To top it off, my wife has put the breaks on any of my other possibilities that I've been pursuing more on my own, though I've been very open and honest with her about them. So I'm frustrated and beginning to wonder whether this is only about her pleasure and not so much about mine.

Any advice?
seriously

[CA91709]

Mr. CA putting in two cents here...
NOT having taken the plunge yet (me and the Mrs.), all I can write is some of the advice I've read in this Forum. A couple that plays apart has to have a pretty solid relationship to keep things together. Many couples only play as a team, some not only in line of sight, but within reach as well. If Mrs. CA and I ever take the leap, We'll definitely stick together!

From reading your post, it sounds like you and your wife gave a rebel yell and both leapt right in, damning the torpedoes not once, but twice along the way.

While I salute your resolve, I do wonder about your bringing in your friends so quickly. It seems a little fast paced to me.

I think you and your wife need to talk and you both need to take care of each other first. Just my `take' for what it's worth.

[L&R]

Originally Posted by CA91709

Mr. CA putting in two cents here...
NOT having taken the plunge yet (me and the Mrs.), all I can write is some of the advice I've read in this Forum. A couple that plays apart has to have a pretty solid relationship to keep things together. Many couples only play as a team, some not only in line of sight, but within reach as well. If Mrs. CA and I ever take the leap, We'll definitely stick together!

From reading your post, it sounds like you and your wife gave a rebel yell and both leapt right in, damning the torpedoes not once, but twice along the way.

While I salute your resolve, I do wonder about your bringing in your friends so quickly. It seems a little fast paced to me.

I think you and your wife need to talk and you both need to take care of each other first. Just my `take' for what it's worth.

[R here] yeah ditto's all the way on the above. You know, rules are kinda a drag but then again they are like a parachute...the two of you seen to have jumped out and maybe forgot your's. Then again this being the computer game era .....everybody loves to just jump in and start playing. You should put breaks on and make some decisions like; together, is seperate ok, Full swap only( this will insure that both of you are having your fun equally) Maybe you could get a dart board and put "the evenings Objective" in the different spots...and play accordingly...."we'll lets see Honey...looks like tonight is FMF, etc.

[seriously]

Well, I should say that my wife had a short physical relationship with her now best friend like 6 years ago, with my full knowledge and approval. Actually they met off a local "singles" line under bi-curious, long story. So in some ways it is not such a huge jump to pick up where they left off.

R, before taking the plunge we talked about it for a year. Though I've got a lot mixed/complicated feelings about this particular scenario, excited and worried about opening the door to a relationship that is more than sex.

-seriously

[two4youinswva]

Originally Posted by seriously

My wife says that she -yemmy best friend- is not ready to have a man directly involved though the friend has given me some positivve signs. Me and the best friend have yet to have a really candid conversation about the boundries.

I think all three of you should have this conversation about boundries. But only after you and your wife have had a candid conversation about where you really are with this.

Obviously we're only hearing "one-side" of the situation, but based on what you're relating to us, it doesn't sound like you two are on the same page.

I'm getting the vibe from you that she's not comfortable with you playing with anyone else. Is that what it feels like to you?

[Spoomonkey]

What it sounds like you need is a little reassurance honestly.

First, going to a swing club isn't a guarantee to play. You might - you might not. The last three times we have gone we only played once. Both of the other times we could have, but one week a couple who we weren't interested in kept following us around and the next week we simply weren't in the mood, even though some friends of ours were trying to "hook us up" with some couples - we just wanted to play pool. At a swing club, "your mileage may vary" as they say. Scaring up a little "novel" sex isn't as easy as declaring it "your turn."

Having said that, you may have opened a bit of a Pandora's box by letting an old lover into the picture. You can put the lid on it - but I doubt everyone would agree with my approach. You need to see if your wife is willing to give up the relationship and move forward into swinging together. Ask her to. Watch her eyes. Listen to her reactions. If this is really about the two of you - if she really believes that - she may be disappointed, but will respect your request.

I know Mrs Spoomonkey would.

I just don't think you're sure of her.

Slow her down and ask her to walk at your speed for a while. If she isn't willing to, you will know whether or not you are being "taken for a ride."

Spoomonkey

[wiscpl]

I see a bit of role reversely here but from what I see your still early in your lifestyle experience. If you read the board from top to bottom you would find a common theme throughout and thats communication. It's an esential part of a relationship and even more so when you are swinging.

Your experiences so far have been by chance so far. It doesn't suprise me that you hit it off with a single male in the first place. Single males need to be a little more outgoing when it comes to the lifestyle as they have little opportunity otherwise. Here's where you could have moved on and in the future I suggest this.

As far as your wife picking things up where they left off, consider yourself lucky. There are countless guys out there who would give anything for this kind of activity. The fact that your are not involved at this moment is discouraging but promising. Let your wife know your feelings on this matter. Discuss the possiblity further about your swinging seperately also. If she doesn't agree with it then you need to put your foot down and stop her activities with her girlfriend. What's good for the goose is good for the gander!

[EmpyreanPleasur]

Everyone here has great insight and advice.

Realize that maybe we aren't saying you jumped into something too quickly, but that maybe your involvement is moving too fast without any real limits.

Everyone should have very clear limits and sometimes we have to go back and reset our limits after we've had an experience and realized that it did not work for us.

Also, if you are truly both ok with what the two of you are experiencing and you are just feeling left out because you haven't had "your turn" yet, you need to realize that even though it's very difficult to be patient. Sometimes one partner will have more opportunities than the other. This in our experience is most often the case for the female, especially a bi-fem who has more opportunites for herself.

[Tempest419]

Okay folks... this is seriously's wife. Husband's been sharing everything with me and I was more than bristled at the way things have been painted.

First, while the implication is that I'm fucking all the time while he watches on the sidelines, this is not true. We both went to the club two nights. We both had opportunities to get to know people. The fact is, he is more shy than me and as Empyrean pointed out, it's probably easier for outgoing, bi-females to get action. That is unfortunate for him but I do not see why I have to be strung out to dry because I'm outgoing. I cannot grab a woman and force her to fuck him, and neither can he. All you can do is put yourself out there and go with the flow. If the universe has been more returning to me, does that make me selfish, or more easy going and friendly?

Second--I haven't done anything without talking to my husband first. Communication lines are open. He has given me the okay. I'm not taking advantage of anyone. We have talked, and talked and talked some more.

Third-- as for my best friend; as circumstances turn out, it was fairly "easy" to talk to her about opening up that part of our relationship, (and might I add that what we did years ago was before Seriously and I married) AFTER I spoke with hubby at length. Again, I'm sorry he doesn't have the same type of history with his best friend, but I don't see how that equates to what he is suggesting (the part he mentioned about me putting the brakes on).

So here is the real rub; Seriously hasn't gotten laid by any "strange" yet. His argument is that, because I have a best friend who will also (happily for me) let me make love to her, that he needs a "girlfriend" as well, and that is where I put the "brakes" on. The fact is, Seriously has been carrying on with an older woman who is a friend of a friend for a month; I mean, she emails him personally, calls him personally, and has been mysteriously showing up at a mutual friend's house every Wednesday when he is there, and I am not. And she has been rather flirty. To top it off, he suggested that he should spend time with her by himself and go bike riding together yesterday--not inviting me, or anyone else for that matter-- developing this "friendship" (with hopefully sex soon) And while many of you guys may think this is "equality", (and as Seriously points out, if I get to fuck another "person" then he should too) I beg to differ and here is the way I see it:

ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL--if his best male friend wants to give him a little action on the side, he is more than welcome. Go knock yourself out, honey, it will not hurt my feelings. Men might have an ass, but they don't have a pussy. I would not feel threatened by this... of course, this isn't what he wants and he didn't bother to tell anyone this.

I am, however, threatened by another adult female "friend" who is single and childless most of the time, who wants to just "hang out" with my husband, who doesn't even know we're "swinging." As far as I can see, she could be a black widow. What happens when she catches the flu, and poor little [girlfriend] doesn't have anyone, and hey, he should go over there.... and then the lines get blurred. Am I crazy, or does anyone else see where this is going? With what Seriously is suggesting is another adult, female love relationship (friend-love, whatever) that could easily deepen. And yes, he could potentially see this other woman as "wife" material and if she can suck a cock better than me...

Bottom line, I think it is a dangerous step, and if the shoe were on the other foot, this would not have even been posted here. I have not asked to contact the one-night stand guy and go to a game. I don't email with him, or call him on the phone, or hook him up with the 419 when he needs it. We are not "friends with benefits" (as husband wants with another woman) Nada, zip, nothing. In fact, I wouldn't even DREAM or DARE to have suggested such a thing to Seriously, because it is bringing direct competition to my primary relationship, and--gee-- I imagine it would hurt his feelings! And guess what--when I suggested this, he openly admitted that he wouldn't like it. Okaaaaaay.... so what he's saying is, he would be threatened if I wanted to form a fast, sexual friendship with this guy... but HE wants to do it?

As for my best friend--she has been around for 8 years, lived with us for six months (no sex) and knows us probably better than most anyone. She loves Seriously as a friend, loves our son, and would never want to break up our home. Everything we've done, she's been like, "Are you sure he's okay? Are you sure?" and repeated several times that she didn't want to upset him. She cares about BOTH of us. In fact, she has said that she is not opposed to involving him in the future, but that she wanted to make sure that *I* am okay with it first, and wants to develop things with me first. She wants to make sure we don't rush in and complicate things before we're ready.

The fact is, she is not "husband" material. She's been around eight years, slept with her before, and I don't see myself running out on my marriage for this person. Not gonna happen... I love my husband, and I love having sex with women.

Seriously is welcome for us to go back to the Club and try to make a "friend" there (where the boundaries are clear and open) that he would like to hook up with. I *do* want him to have fun. I do want him to experience these things, but with people we both agree on, under circumstances where things are not threatening to either of us.

Last but not least, I have been clear that if he is ultimately not okay with me sleeping with friend (damn, in his own house, even) then that is a rule I will abide.... but he might want to be careful what "rules" he institutes out of impatience and lack of foresight; rules he might not want to follow in the future when *his* options open up. If he were, for instance, to institute the rule of only sex with both of us with other couples... we will probably be waiting a while. I am simply not AS interested in sleeping with other men as I am women, and from what I saw, the pickins' were slim. I'm not fucking some guy I don't' like or am not attracted to just to even the score card for him. Furthermore, I'm not interested in stranger-sex as a rule. Better sex happens for me when I am in a trusting environment, and that doesn't happen in a night.

I could go on and on....

Sincerely,
Tempest

[CA91709]

Mr. CA on this post...
THAT is the most complete and fullest `other side' of the story I've read in quite a while.

While I hate being judgmental, seriously, you've got a son involved. It's best to straighten up now with your wife, in my opinion.

[BodyScape02]

Am I crazy, or does anyone else see where this is going? With what Seriously is suggesting is another adult, female love relationship (friend-love, whatever) that could easily deepen. And yes, he could potentially see this other woman as "wife" material and if she can suck a cock better than me...

Dearest Tempest...no you are not...it sounds like Seriously is looking for justification for what he is contemplating doing and using this board to get it. He nicely "omitted" very relevant items painting you as the uncaring and philandering spouse.

I would advise him to consider all he has to loose by courting this woman ( since she isn't aware of the lifestyle she is acting as an adulteress and courting your husband)

I am a tad ticked at him honestly... I don't know what to tell you to do... as you are communicating on every level...and he is miss communicating and self justifying ... shame on him...

All I can hope is, he posted it here hoping you would read it and maybe, we can surmise that he wanted you to find it. What you do with the information is up to you... but it would seem pertinent to CYA and to return to a traditional marriage arraignment until such time as the other woman is irradicated and the problem has a solution.

I for one think I would take the time to call the other woman and let her know... you are not welcome. But then again...I tend to prefer a confrontation to being screwed royally in silence and eventually humiliated in public. Then at least I feel, I defended myself and my territory. Cheaters tend to shun the light of day. Outing them is the only way to stop them...they thrive in secret.

Mr. Body and I had a single female long ago who I suspected of trying the same thing... I called her on it...she was pissed at me and he was pissed at me( I came to the board with it for advice, too) ....I dealt with the fallout and flat out asked him which he preferred- to argue the point or to preserve our relationship ? We are fine...she is gone...but we took a long time off to work it out.

Best wishes hon... for the record... I am on your side. He blew it with me when it became apparent how he ommitted some critical elements. He sure knows how to “spin” the story to make it come out sympathtic for him.


Ms. bodyscape02

[BodyScape02]

I should have picked up on (trying this post from another computer)....geeze that is another one I have to add to the red flag list!

There is also ( upon re-reading his post again... ) the hint that he thinks he is to be part of a ffm threesome with you and your girlfreind and is getting mixed signals...or perhaps just really really wants it and is looking for any hint of a signal and reading even the slightest nice "hello" as a signal.

May be ( if she is willing) a little threesome could quell his ego at not being as marketable as you. ( I agree with your analysis of shy vs gregarious...but...would add that often shy people seem to think others should "come to them".)

All of this may be his brusied ego at how well you are doing and are recieved, his jealousy over it triangulating into an affair with a woman who is playing to that weakness... Adulterous individuals tend to look for that opening...( I read the damn website from the other link too... it sucks...but they do it.)

Just free thought here hon... hoping to make sence and help and get her the hell out of the pic and you back to hunky dory

take what makes sence and works and disguard the rest.

[..R&M..]

reading thru i can understand how you are upset about the other woman and him. But to an extent, tempest what you are doin is unfair for your relationship. You get to play with someone else and he can't. Even if you justify it as only playing with the same sex, for some people it doesn't matter if your playing with the same sex or the oppisit sex you are still getting action outside of the relationship and he may feel that since you are not being 'fair' by sharing this experiance with him that he needs to find someone for himself. I'm not trying to stick up for him but you kind of seem selfish, in your post, by justifying your playing by basicly saying 'well its a girl i'm with and no threat to our relationship.' But to him it could be a threat no matter what because that girl can give you something that he can't give you. Am i making sense. I'm not trying to start anything by posting, just adding my $.02.

[Spoomonkey]

Regardless of the rights or wrongs, equals or unequals to this situation - you are both obviously not on the same page. One of you is miscommunicating badly and I would suggest, for the sake of the marriage, putting things on hold until you can both find a common ground.

Spoomonkey

[wiscpl]

Dito with what spoomonkey said!!!! Take a step or two back to asses the situation calmly. Grab a piece of scratch paper and write everything down and come to a conclusion that BOTH parties are satisfied with.