I tried- I tried- I can't do this anymore

[pacpl4funn]

Hello and Happy Belated Holidays,

Thought I should write an update,

As most who have read my past posts, I entered swinging because my husband wanted this, badly. He felt he I should give him a 3sum because I did it once along time ago, so I gave in, he wanted to have ppl watch us, I gave in, he wanted more 3sums, I did it, the moment I had fun, he freaked, he wanted clubs so we went, he wanted couples, so we did and he broke his own rules, he wanted to see me with another woman, I tried it. Granted I've had some fun, not a whole lot, just enough to keep me interested. But our relationship needs a vacation from this.

The more I gave, the less I got, his sex drive for me has been going down hill for about 2 years. We talked and thought it was a form of malemenopause, but then he started saying how we both could use to loose some weight, so a bell went off in my head, maybe I'm not attractive to him cause I might have put on 10 -15 pounds since we've been together, his long ago comments about how his x got fat and he didn't want her began playing over n over in my head.

I told him straight out that for Christmas I wanted a normal life again and that if he doesn't have the desire for me in the bedroom that I will not sacrifice what little sex we still have, so basicly if nothing is happening in our bedroom, then nothing is happening in swinging. period.

Then the other night I was in the mood, he said he was a "little", but then he fell alseep, about an hour later, he woke up and was all over me, I was like , where the hell did this come from? I even asked him what changed your mind, he said , he didn't know. Something got him worked up, but it wasn't me.

Then I went last night and snooped around on his computer, to only see that he's still emailing solo women for 3sums, and couples for swapping, and even sending out msges on yahoo groups to try and hook us up, AFTER I tell him I want a break away from this........ and then I saw his off line msges to some woman, saying how between her boobs and mine, what a way to go.... etc. etc. well that was the last straw, I blew a gasket, went into the bedroom, woke his sorry ass up, gave him a good "what for" and said if he doesn't want me anymore, that if I'm not the woman of his dreams, that if EVERYTHING I give him isn't good enough anymore, to take his pay check and move the f*** out.

Surfice to say, he woke up very quick, full of reasons & excuses, "I only sent those emails cause I knew nothing would come of it, you know everyone is fake" ..."and I only talked to that woman once in 3 months and that was to see how she was doing and if she needed me to update her webpage" , "and if you don't want swinging anymore, just delete the accounts and get someones address to send that free club admission to..." Goes into telling me that he loves me, doesn't want anyone else, that he doesn't have the "drive" that he once had, but that I'm the only woman for him, yatta yatta yatta.

Now I feel like the "bad guy" cause I'm putting my foot down, but he's damn lucky it's not up his ass right now.

Not sure if I over re-acted, but there isn't enough sheet shaken going on between us lately, let alone overall attention (says he wants to kiss n cuddle, etc, but that he doesn't want me to think it's going to lead to more, so he keeps his distance) So I get hardly any physical attention, let alone sex. And what little there is, I'm not sharing it.

I don't really expect any replies, I just needed a safe place to vent.
I didn't delete our swinger accounts, I just put us on "away" because I know I need to regroup and he needs to concentrait more on us.

Phew ! I feel better for getting this off my chest.
thanks.

[Tterrific]

You go, Girl !!!

soapbox


Sounds to me like you are exactly on target, in that you solved all of your own dilemnas, and Mr should pay attention!

It has to be a two way street..................
How do I know that? I am single because of some of the very same excuses your Mr is giving you. Hopefully, he will grow like I hope I am finally doing.
(She is starting to warm back up after a 2 month hiatus)

[EvilMJ]

I agree with you 100% that you have to get out of swinging. You are not enjoying it and it is going to cause more problems between you than it is worth. It sounds like there are quite a few issues that you two have to work through in your marriage right now, swinging should not even be one of them.

I think you guys need to spend some time talking to each other and finding out what is the root of your problems. I hope you can work things out and wish only the best for you.

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

Now I feel like the "bad guy" cause I'm putting my foot down, but he's damn lucky it's not up his ass right now.

Don't feel like the bad guy; he IS lucky he's not out on his ass at the curb right now!

You have nothing to feel bad about, except perhaps giving in to his demands when you were uncomfortable with it all. From what you've told us (and I could be wrong as I haven't heard both sides yet), it seems to me that you're the only one who's actually concerned about the health of your relationship. Hubby seems concerned about the longevity of it - because it's a comfortable life pattern for him, a safety net - but not so much about the actual health of it. Otherwise, he'd be choosing your emotional needs over his fascination with swinging. He's not showing much support or respect.

I recognize what he's doing. He wants his "safety net", but he also wants to be independent and not be accountable to anyone. He's running away from the relationship and from intimacy. His reaction to your enjoying yourself while swinging tells me that he hasn't thought this through very well...beyond what he wants out of it, anyway.

And he's flirting with an affair to boot. His secret internet life is his way of fantasizing of "something more, something different..." Did it look like his heart skipped a beat when you confronted him about it? Nostrils flared a bit, pupils dilated? The 'what-ifs', left to their own devices, can eventually grow into actual experimentation. Always telling himself he can quit anytime he wants to. Just chat. Just email. Just voice chat. Just webcam. Just "accidentally" running into each other at the same place and time. Just coffee. Just talking about swinging (and their significant others, of course...which makes it perfectly innocent). Just a bit of flirting. Just one kiss, just one, he can stop anytime...

If you're going to work on your relationship, keep an eye out for evasive behaviour. Tell him in no uncertain terms that you will NOT stand for dishonesty in your relationship. Period. His first reaction will likely be to burrow deeper in the sand and just be that much more careful that you don't find out that he's keeping up his hobby. If you discover any more hidden behaviour, look him dead in the eye and tell him, "You are hurting me. Why don't you care about that?"

While I know that life isn't as simple as all that, it really is important to not make idle threats here. If you say you will not stand for dishonesty, you cannot stand for it. If he blatantly disregards your need for honesty, he needs to know that you...will...leave (or kick him out, whichever).

I'm sorry that you guys are going through this right now; getting out the other side of it is going to be a tough go, but if you are both determined to heal your relationship, it can happen. Good luck to you both!

[Tterrific]

Intuition....................

You been reading my mail?

You have very eloquently and accurately given words to my former statements and actions. It brings home to me the places I missed in my last relationship, and reminds me why it is so important to continue to learn.
Thank you
T

[pacpl4funn]

intuition897---- Did it look like his heart skipped a beat when you confronted him about it? Nostrils flared a bit, pupils dilated?

OMG ! He was so scared, he had that "oh shit, I'm dead" look And while I was ranting, my heart was literly pounding so hard I could hear it. I don't think in the 4 years we've been together that he has ever seen me so angry, hurt, shaken, etc. all at the same time, I was absolutly wigged out from head to toe!

He was panicking because I told him I msged that woman he was chatting to. And I did ! I never say I'm going to do something without doing it. Of course she was all dumb and stupid about it. But I am no fool.

And your right, the health of our relationship has been on me from the start of swinging, of course he'd say and do things that made it appear he too was looking out for us, but it was really him he was looking out for. He always has to have that control over everything while making it look like I have the final say.

Everything has always been about what he wants, needs, desires, and I was so stupid and inlove with him that I wanted anything and would do anything that made him happy.

The upcoming holidays we're so busy and so overwhelming and we're expecting our first grandchild in the next few weeks, all I wanted was some time away from this, I spent 3 weeks kniting! Finding someone to play with was the last thing on my mind !

But him! Nooooo, that's all he can think of. I told him I wanted time away, and he still had to push. well now I've pushed back. It may have taken me 3 years to do this, but I'm glad I did. I'm done giving in and getting less and less as time goes on.

His fascination with swinging needs to stop, or as I told him, "If you don't care about us, If you need it that bad? Then go get it without me!" Of course he says he doesn't want this without me.

And right now, there is no room in my life for swinging, even if it was something I truly wanted. Granted I had some fun, not as much if I really wanted this, but I guess that's to be expected when your really doing this for someone else..... And should the day come that I do want it, it will be because I want it, and NOT to make him happy. And if never enters our life again, I know he will be sad, but it's not going to hurt me any. But if he can't deal with never having swinging again, then he needs to move on and find someone else.

I wish he would read the posts here, he might actually learn something, but instead he thinks this site is a joke and that no one knows what they are talking about.

In closing,
Thanks to everyone for all your support.

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

intuition897---- Did it look like his heart skipped a beat when you confronted him about it? Nostrils flared a bit, pupils dilated?

OMG ! He was so scared, he had that "oh shit, I'm dead" look And while I was ranting, my heart was literly pounding so hard I could hear it. I don't think in the 4 years we've been together that he has ever seen me so angry, hurt, shaken, etc. all at the same time, I was absolutly wigged out from head to toe!

It won't stop him. I recognize the mentality he's displaying, and right now he's trying to do damage control. Applying bandaids and slapping on a coat of paint to cover the blood stains.

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

He was panicking because I told him I msged that woman he was chatting to. And I did ! I never say I'm going to do something without doing it. Of course she was all dumb and stupid about it. But I am no fool.

Why was he so concerned about your messaging the other woman? Did he have something to hide?

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

And your right, the health of our relationship has been on me from the start of swinging, of course he'd say and do things that made it appear he too was looking out for us, but it was really him he was looking out for. He always has to have that control over everything while making it look like I have the final say.

Damage control.

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

But him! Nooooo, [swinging is] all he can think of. I told him I wanted time away, and he still had to push. well now I've pushed back. It may have taken me 3 years to do this, but I'm glad I did. I'm done giving in and getting less and less as time goes on.

His fascination with swinging needs to stop, or as I told him, "If you don't care about us, If you need it that bad? Then go get it without me!" Of course he says he doesn't want this without me.

He'd probably like to go out and do this on his own, but if he's really getting off on the 'forbiddenness' of the adventure, it'll take something away from the experience to be 'allowed' to cheat. And the pushiness is just another indicator that he's not thinking of anyone's needs but his own. You're 100% right to push back. If you can't trust him to be considerate of your feelings and well-being, then you need to look out for yourself. It's not harsh or cold; it's a matter of self-respect.

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

And right now, there is no room in my life for swinging, even if it was something I truly wanted. Granted I had some fun, not as much if I really wanted this, but I guess that's to be expected when your really doing this for someone else..... And should the day come that I do want it, it will be because I want it, and NOT to make him happy. And if never enters our life again, I know he will be sad, but it's not going to hurt me any. But if he can't deal with never having swinging again, then he needs to move on and find someone else.

Well said. It sounds like you know yourself pretty well, and know what you want. And you're open-minded enough to admit that you can't say for certain how you'll feel about swinging in the future. It's never a good idea to swing to please your partner. You always seem to end up feeling like a prostitute somehow. That's just not the way it's supposed to be.

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

I wish he would read the posts here, he might actually learn something, but instead he thinks this site is a joke and that no one knows what they are talking about.

In closing,
Thanks to everyone for all your support.

A joke, eh? He figures he knows more about swinging that people who actually do it?? And has he actually read any posts here? Or posted a thread? If he did post about his current dilemma, chances are he didn't like the responses he got back. VERY few board member condone cheating, and I don't think ANYone is going to give him a high-five for his self-centred approach to his marriage. So...maybe that explains his opinion of this site. I've, personally, never seen another site with a better atmosphere, swinger or otherwise. I've got a pretty short attention span when it comes to BS, but I've been an SB junkie for over a year now. Can't imagine why he wouldn't like it... :rollseyes

[bear_and_babe]

Even if swinging is not for you, it has done one good thing. It has given you a backbone and communication skills to stand up for yourself and let your husband know what you will and will not do. Good luck, I hope everything works out for you.

[pacpl4funn]

Backbone? Yep, you could definitily say I've grown one,

I'm done bending over back-wards to give him what he wants.. I'm done eating spoonful after spoonful of his shit.

And you betcha, he doesn't want to look at this site, he absolutly can not stand anyone else having a different (or correct) opinion then him! One of the reasons I gave swinging a try to begin with was because of him debating why he wanted it. And why I should do it. Regardless to what I wanted or didn't want.

He knows if he came here and posted; "I want to swing, but my wife doesn't" That he will be told NOT to swing.. Which is NOT what he wants to hear.

He panicked over me msging that woman was cause he was probably worried what I would find out, which was not much cause she would really talk to me. She was giving the whole stupid act. Even when I told her I had half their chat infront of me!

As far as him going out alone to swing, I personally don't think he has the balls or the confidence to do it. He always brags that he never cheated on his first wife and had alot more reason too. He only got as far as he got because he did a wonderful job making me feel guilty.. Not to say that he wont go it alone (if he gets daring), but if he does go down that path, he knows to not come back. Cause if he does, I'll put his c**k through a meat grinder! (j/k ok maybe not)

[intuition897]

Well...actions bring consequences. He chooses to make poor decisions, he reaps some shitty consequences. Simple math.

I never like to advise couples to quit a relationship, but there are times when, if you look at the situation objectively, there is no other alternative. When someone is leaving you no other alternative but to eat "spoonful after spoonful" of bullshit, for the sake of your health, you need to move on. In the long run, it does the other person more good than putting up with their self-centred behaviour. This is real life, and it's childish to think that things are always supposed to go his way.

I'm sorry you're going through this Mrs. pacpl. "Venting" is a good thing to do, and this is a perfect place to do it. So please let us know if there's anything we can help out with.

[twoferfun69]

Hmmm. Interesting turn of events, eh?
I love it when we guys have the best women in the world, have everything we could dream of when in comes to a relationship (if we were mature and thoughtful enough to dream of such things), but yet we are STOOPID enough to think there is more out there, and we should put the good stuff on hold to go get it.
Ok, that even confused me.
Anyway, what I'm getting at is that a lot of times we have these wonderful women in front of us, but we don't want to see it. Then when confronted with our own blatant stupidity, we panic, professing our undying love. Because we know that we have something comfortable, familiar, and we don't have the self confidence to start over, even though we may not be totally happy with what we have.
Kudos to you, mrs pacpl, for not backing down. Your hubby needs to wrap his brain around the idea that swinging should only go the way of the "least interested" partner. (for want of a better term...not the best, but I couldn't come up with anything better ).
I hope things work out for the best for you two.

Mr Twofer

[Edison Carter]

Susan here:

Simply put, if you BOTH are not into it, then neither of you are into it.

There was this guy running for US Senate in Illinois, named Jim Ryan. Now, Jim was married to Jeri Ryan, the actress and a beautiful woman. When they were married he tried to get her to try Swinging. She protested several times and he kept trying to get her to Play. They divorced and it became a topic in the child custody. When those records were unsealed it ended his run for the Senate.

That's a great case of why you both have to be interested to Swing.

[twoplayful2]

pacpl4funn, it sounds like your guy puts more priority over his kinky desires than he does over you and he needs a reality-slap in the face to snap out of it. It also sounds like you have, justifiably so, lost a lot of respect for him. IMHO the only way you two get things back to where they should be is he stops all this crap, including the wishful emails, completely and immediately and starts focusing on you instead. He *might* need some counseling as well, as he's sounding like he's a bit out-of-control with his sexual desires. I'd also continue to monitor what he's doing. I know sneakiness and distrust isn't the way of a healthy marriage, but you've got reason to doubt and he needs to prove his trustfulness to you again. And you need to know whether he's actually stopping it or not because if he's not then the situation will only get worse and more difficult to repair. I always have huge doubts people like this can ever come back to reality, but I hope that things do work out for you. I think it's great you've taken charge of what you want to do, stick with that!

[2 Hot J's]

Originally Posted by twoferfun69

Hmmm. Interesting turn of events, eh?
I love it when we guys have the best women in the world, have everything we could dream of when in comes to a relationship (if we were mature and thoughtful enough to dream of such things), but yet we are STOOPID enough to think there is more out there, and we should put the good stuff on hold to go get it.
Ok, that even confused me.
Anyway, what I'm getting at is that a lot of times we have these wonderful women in front of us, but we don't want to see it. Then when confronted with our own blatant stupidity, we panic, professing our undying love. Because we know that we have something comfortable, familiar, and we don't have the self confidence to start over, even though we may not be totally happy with what we have.
Kudos to you, mrs pacpl, for not backing down. Your hubby needs to wrap his brain around the idea that swinging should only go the way of the "least interested" partner. (for want of a better term...not the best, but I couldn't come up with anything better ).
I hope things work out for the best for you two.

Mr Twofer

Wow! What an excellent response! I think Mr. J would have to agree!

[pacpl4funn]

well I know it's been awhile and I'm still reading the board, so I thought I would post an update.

On the marriage front, we're ok. Still together, he still checks our swinger account for email but has not sent out anything. And from keeping a watchful eye on his chat msger, I haven't seen any conversations.
So from what I've seen, at least it appears he's cooled it.

On the sexual end, since I pulled the plug and put my foot down, sex on the home front is better, the frequency has improved and he's trying different dietary suppliments and testosrum (sp) cream to help boost his libido. He's also definitly more attentive and affectionate towards me. And even just a little possessive too.

Swinging, Nope, nothing yet, I miss the socializing, parties and select friends we've made, but I'm not ready to jump back in just to give him what he wants, "One Way" streets never work and that is something he has to come to terms with for us to ever be part of swinging again. when, or if we get back into it. It will be for "us".

And even better news.... I finished the baby blanket, and have begun a new one to keep here for when we have the baby visiting, and ohhhh it's a girl, we have a brand new grand-daughter as of Jan 21st. 8 pounds 20 inches long and the sweetest most perfect and soon to be very spoiled baby.

I hope everyone is well, safe and happy.
pacpl4fun