dirtwr04

Curious Again Strikes Again. Bravo Brother. Now if you could just get those rules followed. Some how, I think the crappy people won't be reading this post.

Damn, I love you guys. Especially you LikeMinds - I really feel good about the level of understanding this forum has about the psychology of swinging. I had to think long and hard - no pun intended - about the dynamics of what I was getting into prior to my/our start in leaving the vanilla world but had I found this site in the begining I probably could have saved myself a good 6 months of "what ifs."

I hate my nipples being played with. My GF loves hers played with and sometiems can't help messing with mine but thankfully, as long as I play with hers she is usually content to leave mine alone. The lord works in mysterious ways, I guess it was meant to be. HAHAHA, prolly go to hell for using that on a swingers site but at least I'll go with a smile.

Curious Again, I'm not sure what you are talking about re: new ID vs. real one, I am new to this site and fairly new to the lifestyle. Please do not mistake my observations and preferrences about clubs to be complaints. The clubs have provided me a place to explore myself and my girl and our relationship in ways we couldn't comprehend. I think some of them are really great. Even the ones that allow single guys. My post was not meant to offend just voice and opinion based on circumstances we've had. The last club I went to I met a guy who wanted to get with my GF. The s.guy seemed decent and we appreciated his approach even though he didn't fit her desires, after all, we are all there for some variation of the same reason. I know perfectly well that 1) assholes come in all statuses, 2) we are or were all single at some time and 3) there are a higher number per capita of single guys who can't seem to behave. For us, it is not worth it to go where their are a lot of single guys - don't get me wrong, couples don't do it for my GF either, but we have had a lot of good experiences talking with them, and being around them and my girl has never been literally scared of them the way she has been when single guys sit down next to us, get two inches from her, whip out their dick and try to stroke off on top of her in a circle (not to say a girl, or attached male/couple can't do something to scare her or turn her stomache, just that it hasn't happened and we believe it won't happen at least not frequently) which we can't say the same for single guys. Some single guys appear to be normal, but their seems to us to be a disproportionate number of guys who appear to be sick - they tends to have a glassy eyed stare as they are jerking off two inches from a girl's face like if they just stick it in her mouth she WILL want to suck them off because they are such studs - there are a lot of behaviors that single guys at clubs do that border on sexual assault which gives decent single guys a bad name. When a girl (or anyone for that matter) is sexually assaulted or harrassed they feel violated and it really screws up the mood. Most girls who go to these clubs have a higher degree of sexual openness and don't have a lot of the sexual hang ups common in mainstream society. That doesn't mean they want to suck off everyone in the club. Most of these girls are very confident and have no qualms about asking (or demanding ) what they want - if they wanted cum in their hair from four guys they'd simply say you, you, you and you come with me. They need to feel safe and secure and in control and choose who to "play" with and how far to take things, not be thrust upon. Fact: Couples and single girls can make unwanted advances to the point of taking away control from the receipient/other girl/couple. Fact: It doesn't happen nearly as often with couples and single girls as with single guys. Fact: Some single guys will be lumped in with the bad apples who even if they don't outnumber decent single guys they appear to based on the severity and harshness of their bad behavior. I don't know your personal preferences and I try to live and let live but consider going going to a club with a girl you really care about - it may open your eyes to a whole new world and you may see things from a woman's point of view regarding single guys. You will probably feel like you want her to feel sexually free what ever her preference and comfortable not subjected to a facial or gang bang. Sometimes as guys we tend to forget that we don't have to deal with being less physically powerful. How many guys do you know carry mace? How many girls? I think you'd agree they live with more fear than you or I. Single guys make the girls and by extention the guys they came with, uncomfortable at a rate many find unacceptable. Someone before me said She is A, He is B the other guy is C. For me the other girl is C but you catch my drift. I'm sure not everyone subscribes to that formula but the experiences I've had with my girl and another girl were about us far more so than the other girl (not something I would have believe prior to experiencing it). From talking with other couples this sentiment is often shared. Yes we treat the girls we meet with respect and are attentive to their needs too but to be honest I can't remember what any of them look like even though they were a part of some of my most interesting experiences in my life. Prior to my enlightenment, I thought cool, I'd love to bang two chicks. It was all about my fantasy. After having my eyes opened, the fantasy is the physically the same but now it's all about her and to a slightly lesser extent all about us, but not so much about me. Don't get me wrong, it feels pretty cool to have 2 girls rocking your world, but it just can't compare to the feeling when that experience is with someone who loves you. It the feeling is so much more intense because of the degree of trust she places in me and it makes me humbled and feel honored. For myself and my GF, hooking up with single girls makes us feel like a team and brings us closer together. We get to experience something we both enjoy and at the end of the night, she feels good I am going home with her - our relationship stronger, I feel lucky to be in a relationship where I can be free to be me, how great is it to drive down the road and catch my girl looking at some hottie, or have her catch me looking and not neither of us feels threatened or jealous (it took me a little while to accept that she would be mad if I was selfish and didn't point out some hottie and didn't give her the opportunity to look too), nor do we have to lie or make excuses. We can just be happy knowing we think alike. Most girls I've been with would feel bad if they caught me looking at another. I'd feel bad for making them feel bad. There are a lot of power issues with sex and a lot of empowerment issues. Jealosy is definitely an "issue" magnifier in my book and something I'm glad I don't have to deal with. It allows me to get on with enjoying her and myself in way's I didn't think possible. Swinging requires a lot more trust in your better half than most people can stand, and is directly related to the likelihood swinging will enhance a relationship or destroy it on a one for one basis. If everyone trusted their make like successful swingers do, there'd be a lot more love and love making and the world would be a better place. PS I like your tag line. My favorite is. Everything Affects Everything Else.

Here is what happens at a club allowing single guys. There will be a lot of couples talking with each other and having a good time, some couples "intimately" playing around (mostly by themselves sometimes with another couple), a handful of well mannered, civil, respectful single guys who are hoping to get lucky and a significant number of single guys who will swarm a couple like flies on shit if they are engaged in any affectionate embrace even if it is only making out and some petting. Single men tend to invade the girl's comfort zone and or touch without invitation or permission and or make inappropriate comments. Single guys tend to think that all women in the club are there for the sole purpose of being f**ked by them. I have to respect a guy who acknowledges me and treats my girl with the respect she deserves. She's not into guys (other than me) but I know she's hot and I can't blame a guy for appreciating her, however, hell will freeze over before I allow a guy to touch her without her permission. What single guys typically fail to realize is couples tend to respect the sacred feminine, women are treated like goddesses and their boyfriends or husbands enjoy the benefits. Single guys often treat women like meat confusing sexual confidence with whorishness. Lets be honest, these girls can get laid anywhere, anytime - these girls don't need a single guy to grace them with his presence. If a girl wants some cock she can get it from the guy she came with (who tends to respect her), from some other girl's guy who will also tend to respect her, or she can get it from some single guy who treats her like shit. If you were a girl who would you chose. There are a scant few who would pick number three. That number is further reduced becuase there are a lot of girls who only want to play with girls. Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason - because their are a statistically significant number of a population that exhibit some trait, not to say their aren't decent single guys out there, it is just that they are so out numbered by jerks who make the girls uncomfortable. After seeing the difference between clubs that allow single guys and those that don't, we will not go to an event with single guys unless they are sponsored by a couple. There is no benefit for us to go to a venue where single guys are allowed but there are a lot of benefits for us as a couple at events where they are not allowed. A lot of couples feel the same way which is evident at clubs which have restricted nights - check out the attendance at the same club on a "no single guys" night and there will be a lot more couples and single girls. If a single guy wants to be successful here are some tips. One, befriend the guy she came with. Two, treat her like a goddess. Three, never, never, never invader her personal space or touch her without her permission. Four, the time to get with her is not when she is already being intimate with someone, it was an hour prior to that when she was on the dance floor or at the bar. Five, go with a sense of humor, and humility because even if you follow my tips and are good looking you will probably go through a lot of rejection - and like it or not the hotter the girl the more likely a single guy will get rejected.