jim-n-nicole

Although not obvious from the title, this recent thread went off topic and covered this subject pretty well.

Many people pick and choose the part of their religion that they follow. Very few people that I have met adhere strictly to every rule laid down by their church. This makes sense to me - they realize that it is very unlikely that their church has interpreted their god precisely correctly. Think about it - even churches have changed their interpretation over the years - including the interpretation of the bible. Does anybody really believe that they have it exactly right at this exact moment in time? Life is full of choices. You need to do what *you* think is right - not what the preacher or anyone else tells you is right. Personally, I don't see how being honest, decent and caring to other human beings can be a bad thing by anybody's definition. But hey, that's me. Jim.

I feel for ya, Spoo. Been there, done that...but to a smaller degree. During a drunken celebration, I told coworkers that Nikki and I go to strip clubs together. Hey, it came up and I was just being honest. If it makes you feel any better, there was no major fallout from it. But I could tell word got around by some of the comments that were made later in the year. The nearest I can tell, that comment of mine clued everyone in that we are a wild couple...and their fertile little minds were trying to figure out just how wild! I'll never tell. The worst effects were some of their wives....Nikki was no longer invited to the wife events. It could have been coincidence since she worked and most of the other wives didn't, but it sure felt like they were less accepting of a wild woman in their midst. So...I think it'll work out for you...but I'll sure be looking here to see what happened on Monday! Also...any chance you can claim you were talking about swing DANCING???

When we were doing our pre-swinging research, one of the first things I ran across was a swinger who said that, if you thought normal dating was hard, it's a cakewalk compared to swing-dating. With dating, you have to be attracted to your date and she (or he) to you...that's it. With swinging, you have many more approvals involved! For instance, I have to not only find the other couple's female desirable, but I have to be okay with her husband's personality since he will be with my wife! If you do that for all four people involved, that comes up to 8 approvals that are needed....not just 2! This can make things a little sticky. Luckily, nikki and i like similar styles so it is not a huge issue for us, but I can see how it could be for others. Jim.

I, apparently, have led a sheltered life. I have never even heard of people trying such a thing until today! Jim.

I believe that the last time someone mentioned a foot fetish in a thread, the thread died immediately and sank to the bottom of the forum pool like a rock. Looks like this one is well on its way to doing the same thing. I am guessing that most people place foot fetishes in the weird & kinky category. I probably do too...especially if it involves any mouth-to-foot contact. Jim.

Wow, Snozz...that was an amazing and beautifully thought out post. Thank you! (and I agree 100%, btw) Also, I finally got around to following Teresa's link to the earlier thread and was amazed at how similar Spoo and I think. I swear I didn't read that earlier thread until after I posted here!! In any case, we have a very bright, articulate and open set of people here. It's a pleasure to know you all - if only via the internet. Jim.

Very good point. That probably is a big distinction between swingers and the population in general...we support others in their right to do what they want to do. Anything between consenting adults is fine by Nikki and me and we'll support those rights at the ballot box (that's why we support gay marriage)...but that doesn't mean we want to be around all possible variations of human interaction! We have our favorite forms...just like everybody else. PS - I've had an hour now to think about why i like watching ff but not mm. I bet it comes down to the fact that I find the female shape very attractive and pleasing to my eye. I enjoy just looking at those soft curves, so putting two of those forms together just increases my enjoyment. On the other hand, the male form does nothing for me. Therefore, putting two male forms together is at best a big zero on my pleasure scale and, in many cases, it can even register a negative number!

No offense taken, Jeff. I found it pretty interesting when we first started going to clubs that clubs have their own set of rules. For instance, gay male activity is not really welcome. One club we go to brings out a birthday cake for couples who have birthdays that weekend...the females blow out the candles because "men don't blow nuthin at this club!". I guess I was relieved to find this out, but it brings up a point I am confused by: why do I enjoy watching two women together, but not two men? But when you stop and think about it, everyone on the face of this planet has their limits. They have to or they'd be dead and buried from overindulging (be it sex, alcohol, drugs, or anything else for that matter)! Clubs just draw the limit-line over a little farther than the average person. The subcategories you name are well past what is acceptable in clubs and, to be perfectly honest, we would no doubt stop attending if they were allowed! Well, okay, maybe we'd get a kick out of the clown suits. Limits are a good thing. You just have to figure out where the proper place for the line is for you.

@ Vespertine Okay, I'm about to declare this the wildest thread yet. The 14yo/20yo story sounds fairly close to the 20 Questions interview with Dustin Hoffman in this month's Playboy....though not exact. He said when he was 15, he lost his virginity at his parent's house to a 20yo named Barbara who, in the darkness, thought he was his brother. You'll have to buy the magazine to get the details. Jim.

That was my first reaction too, Vespertine. And actually I still lean towards that theory at this point. But I was absolutely certain about 3 months ago that someone in here was jerking my chain and someone privately convinced me to give them the benefit of the doubt (you know who you are). It later turned out to be the truth! Therefore, at the risk of looking gullible, I now presume innocence until I have proof otherwise. Very strange things happen in this world....

Gulp!! I hope you make your partners aware of your desire to get pregnant by them before playtime! Legally, they would be financially responsible for those children if you chose to pursue that at a future date. And I'm unclear...a clinic did a vasectomy on your (now) husband before he was 21? Jim.

I guess I don't see your distinction. In her original post, she wanted to cheat and, in fact, said so. I would bet that many of the married men who cheat would also be perfectly willing to swing instead if they could (a) get up the courage to discuss it with their wives and (b) their wives agreed. More couples would probably end up swinging if the mate who originally was interested actually spoke to their spouse about it and then let the idea sink in with their spouse for a good long while before having having any further discussions.

Others have clearly stated the thoughts on cheating around here, so I'll comment on the two lines above...which only one person commented on that I saw. Yes, a pretty, 44 yo black woman with a curvaceous plump mom's body will be in demand at any of those places. Smile, make eye contact, and say 'hi' and you'll do just fine. But - please make sure you bring hubby along. If the two of you decide to go, there are lots of places in Southern Calif to make your fantasies come true - however tame or wild they may be.

I second Aphrodite in wishing you the very best. Thank you for sharing your story. Let me say that I have thought about this thread a lot and it has had a very big impact on Nikki and me. I shoot blanks so we had relied on condoms for her in this lifestyle...up until this thread started. Since then, we have been under a temporary oral-only rule until Nikki started birth control pills - which she has now done. We are now back to our normally scheduled fun. Is everyone aware of the new Seasonale birth control pills, where you only have a period every third month??? Nikki is ecstatic! Jim.