nervous2tryagai

A lot more has come out that I now know. Things my husband said that really have me concerned. Obviously, swinging is off the table right now and I understand this is a swingers board, so if this isn't appropriate for me to put here, I understand. I just feel you guys might understand better. These are the things she said that he said, and upon confronting him, he did indeed say them but can't explain why. He tried to turn it around on me, blaming me for "digging", but I came back with that is my RIGHT...that if the two of them had kept their mouths shut and been on the up and up, I wouldn't have anything to dig about. The situation all started the beginning of June, and continued during a trip with the kids that she and I took. We went for a week, and he and I fought a bit during that week. To the point that at the end while driving, I was telling him how emotionally tough it was for me that week (dealing with living in cramped quarters with her and 7 kids and I felt I was the "babysitter" of her 3 and my 4 at all times) and he said I was to blame for that. Basically, at that point, I couldn't take anymore stress from him, and I was saying I can't do this any more. We talked, he cried and told me he was sorry. He then went on to call her on her phone (we took separate cars) and brag how he even "pretended to cry". That hit me like a ton of bricks when I found that out yesterday. These are the things below that he said to her. The day I called him to log into my credit card account because my ass was in the negative he said "Please let me transfer the money so I can get you the hell out of there. I really miss you and want to see you"-- I said no, don't worry about it, that I will take care of it, he said he wanted to get me out of there and away from you so I would be in a better mood. During the bitch fest on the way home from Vermont, he told me he wonders why you think your fat....because you sit and eat ice cream all day. He knows why he is fat, because he drinks beer. He wanted to leave but knew he couldn't because the money it would cost him to you to pay for child support and alimony he knows he didn't make enough and you would rake him over the coals for it. (rake over the coals is not exact-but to that tune) The Saturday we came down after Vermont...I heard over and over how much he wanted me and missed me so much. To the tune of showing me he was hard when you and Andy where outside. -Yes I did say it back, but if it's all coming out, then it's all coming out. The delete, delete delete issue. Mutual. He didn't want you to see any of the things said. It was not just me, it was he who agreed to it as well, thinking you would be pissed over the talking. Not the amount of which, but what we where talking about. The fight I had with Andy the day we came back home, he told me to make "nicey" with Andy so that he would want to come down, so Alex could be near me. Told me he didn't cry with you on the phone. But admitted to me that he cried to me when he told me he loved me when we where talking on the pass. (when you where trying to beep in that day) One of the extended phone conversations on the cell was a day you where supposed to be home, but hadn't returned from being out yet, he drove around the block for about half hour to stay on the phone with me. Also stopped at "our" Burger King parking lot so he could stay on the phone with me. Our being the word he used, not me. The day Jury duty day happened, I can't count on both hands how many times I asked him, if he was sure he wanted to do it. He said yes. He was sure and wanted it. I am the one who made it a point to make sure this was what he wanted. So, with this information, any insight into whether I am an idiot to stay with him, or whether I should try and work it out?

Trust me, I would love to run away from this person. More than anything. The fact is, my small kids are "best friends" with her kids. It would tear apart more than I am willing to lose. So many relationships would be shattered. These people are "family". I am making the appt for couples counseling today. We have agreed to put any swinging on hold for now and get to the root of this. I am struggling with the fact I really can't confront her, any more than I have. She has run to her husband for "protection" so to speak. (Don't forget, the things that were done, were done at my expense, not so much at his). He tells me to stop thinking about the details and the conversations, that it will just make me go crazy. My argument is that I need to UNDERSTAND how it happened, so conversations ARE important (ie, who initiated saying certain things). He blocks me at every turn, reminding me that this was the "box" that we agreed to open and now that said situation is over, to just move past it. My argument is this is not the "box" that I agreed to, and just because you give 2 ppl permission to sleep together, doesn't give them right to live a "life" with eachother of 180 phone calls in 2 weeks, saying the things they said, etc. This was an emotional affair, plain and simple. And I think the only way I can get control of that, is to see a counselor. I love my husband and do not want to leave and will not leave. I want to get to the root of how he (in my eyes) was manipulated to the point he pushed me out of his head.

From what I've learned in life, the things that are so close to your reach, but just out of it, are what you want the most. I think had she told him to go for it, it wouldn't have been as desirable to him. Just my opinion.

We have decided that we want to explore options with strangers. It was new to us, and I think that's where a comfort level, knowing it was with people we "trusted" came into play. I am considering going to a club/party/etc to try to meet some ppl. What is the etiquette on this? Is it expected that there will be swinging, or is it more of if it feels right, go for it, but if the situation doesn't fit, then it's ok to leave empty handed so to speak?

Let me first say how much I appreciate all of your feedback. It's nice to finally have someone to talk to about this. It's been eating me up for a month. I absolutely agree that counseling is a must. I want to try individual counseling on my own, to gain my "self worth" back so to speak. When I am able, I will have him join so we can work past it. I do not believe this was an ongoing thing. After all this happened, I look and see all the warning signs that didn't make sense (on her end) until this blew up. Before it was even discussed (months ago), her mentioning my husband had a great sense of humor. Or how she felt him to be attractive. Things I hadn't paid much thought to. When the situation came up, my husband was resistant. He is a reserved person by nature. After thought, he was a bit better about it. I was able to recover the first email that started all this, and see his reservations and then see her forcing the issue. My husband is typically a gentle man, not wanting to hurt a soul. I do believe she took advantage of that. This is a portion of the first email, several threads into it. It shows her secretive way and how she set him up to fail. part she wrote: I told T and A, if there is any part of these conversations they have with each other, if they want to keep them to themselves, then it's up to them. I won't ask about what they talk about at all. If it gets them excited to have a "secret" so to speak, then I want them to have it. So I won't share anything at all we talk about if you don't want me to. To be honest, this is new to me as well. A and I have discussed certain things that may involve a third person (female of course)- But then the talking came up about doing for lack of a better word "swap"- That thought got me very excited to think about. I think if you feel comfortable enough to talk, when you want to about it, even if it's just thru e-mail, it may help you a little. Might even help to get the "like a sister" part taken out. You can try to picture me, not as that, but someone getting you excited. Hmm...is this moving to fast this kind of talk? I think if you are interested, and think it's a possibility, your thoughts will definitely change on how you think and react more to how you feel. And maybe gmail isn't the safest to keep some things to ourselves? part my husband wrote: The other side of this has to do with T and A though…meaning I need to be ok with them being together, which is something I hadn’t though of/given much thought to…but the last thing I want to do is break us up as a group. It’s a box that needs to be opened very carefully as a lot will change between all of us and once it is open there is no going back – it can’t be undone… part she wrote: Do you have a myspace? I think gmail is to easy to tap into. So make sure you delete, delete delete :0) I know how you feel about them being together. I know I gave them both a green light to experiment. I want her to feel her excitement and him as well. I am comfortable knowing there will be no love involved. I know how he feels about us (me and him) and that's why I don't want a stranger involved. I trust them both (A and T) to not fall in love with each other. Ok, we need something more private.... and then later on she said: You do but you haven't logged into it since 2005. Dork :0) Less likely to be checked is skype. Or I have a yahoo e-mail. Mypsace might not be a good idea, as thinking about it, I have to add you as a friend, and T will see you as my friend. Hmmmm... End of email. It jumps a lot. I just pulled out the important parts that were relevant. What that email showed me was the manipulation of keeping things secret, coming from her. She tried to tell me that my husband requested her to keep things secret and that she just played along. Never once was "secret" discussed. It was supposed to be "open, honest, purely sex," purely a way to spice up existing relationships, and get that excitement over feeling that new touch. I do believe she fell in love with him. Several times, he told her it could "just be sex" and would she be ok with that. Her answer was "no, I don't think I can be" and then she would cry. when it all hit the fan, she felt betrayed by him, felt he owed her to keep the "secrets" that they shared. The kicker, is that her husband was aware of most of what was going on. So why did she feel the need to keep it from me? To tell my husband she loved him, to tell him she wished that me and her husband didn't exist, so they could live "happily ever after"? My husband was dead wrong. He knows it, I know it. I see the pain in his eyes, trying to figure out how to take it all back. I forgive him. I know he was wrong, but I also feel he played into the hands of a manipulative, selfish person, who would go after what she wanted at any cost. I would love more feedback if you have time. Thanks!!

Hi everyone, This is a long one, and I really need some feedback from someone who understands, so grab a cup of coffee and read on Situation is this. Approached by the wife of a couple that we know very very well. I was interested, hubby was a bit more reserved. Finally got all on the same page. Ground rules were set. We were doing this with people we knew because we felt that there was less of a chance of "love" coming in to play, as with a stranger you don't know. Hubby told me he didn't want to know a play by play of what I did. I told him I wanted to know when he did - it added excitement for me, picturing him with someone else. I never did much. Some petting and kissing. I was led to believe nothing happened between hubby and other woman. I knew some emails were happening, but was told it was "light bantor". Things hit the head so to speak 3 weeks later when it felt like something was going on that I was unaware of. There had been, in fact, 3 secret meetings of full blown sex, phone sex, hubby telling the woman about some of our fights, and her adding her two cents, putting me in a bad light. She pushed for "secret". Told my hubby to delete all emails, make sure phone calls couldn't be traced, etc. Broke the rules her hubby put on her (no cumming inside her, etc). Told my hubby she loved him during sex and begged him to say it to her. Lies, betrayal. Her telling him she was in love with him. And then both of them telling me nothing happened. Hubby, filled with grief and shame told me everything. SHE felt betrayed by him. That he broke her trust. There's so much more but it would take forever to put here and you'd get bored. Not sure what to do. I do believe hubby was very manipulated, but again, he is not blameless. I do believe he loves me and wants to take back the pain he caused me. She would swing with him again in a heartbeat. These "friends" are like family and we have to see them often. Our sex life since all this has been wonderful. Less inhibited, more creative. I think in a sick way, knowing how much she wanted him, makes me want him so much more. Does that make sense? We have talked about taking it slowly with STRANGERS in the future. It is something that I really want to be able to experience. Right now, I am trying to understand how a good, grounded man, could let it get so far before ending it. Any one had this happen? How do I handle all of this? I feel very betrayed and love my husband and want to be with him. I just want to find a way to get past the hurt that came out of it. Let me say, I am not upset about the sex. I am upset that "feelings" came into it. Hubby says it was fantasy, never reality. I do believe it was her reality. She wanted him and wasn't happy with just sex and told him that. Again, these ppl are like family and I have to see them all the time. How do I handle this? Thanks so much for any advice and for hanging in this long!!