Spotlight Interview #19 - Pepper & Drew

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by Elusive BiFem

I believe you said earlier that ya'll were parents to some little 4-legged creatures. What kind, how old, personalities...all that stuff. Describe in detail, please.

We have 3 as I said before. The girls are 5 years old and the baby boy is 4. All three are garden variety mutts that we got at the local shelter. The girls are calico and the boy is a tuxedo (black and white). The big girl plays fetch (yes, you read that right) and opens doors with her paws just like a person--by grabbing the knob. She also the most photogenic of the bunch. She poses for pictures, I swear. She's also the mean one. I've seen her whoop up on a dog twice her size and sent the dog running. The baby girl is mine and she follows me around the house. She usually sleeps under the covers with me. She's definitely the best hunter of the group. One time, she brought me 5 moles from a mole hole she found. Then, there's the boy. He's absolutely lovable and the most laid back cat you'll ever meet. And he doesn't land on his feet. He'll fall off the couch and makes no effort to right himself. They talk a lot and they greet me at the door when I come home. They're like little dogs that clean themselves and use the litter box. What could be better?

Do ya'll plan to have the 2-legged variety of kids in the future? If so, how many do you think you want, and if not, why not? If not, was it a hard decision to come to? Family pressures to have kids? That sorta stuff...

Thanks! -EBF

Hmmmm...right now, we're enjoying being just us. We've gone through periods of time where we thought we were ready to start a family, but decided we weren't. If or when I have kids, I want to know that I wanted nothing more to be their parent. If we were to have kids right now, it would be just because everybody else thinks it's time we had them, not because we really want them. My mother keeps telling me that you only have a predetermined amount of years that you are fertile, so basically, she's acting as my biological clock right now. Quite frankly, I think it would be stupid to have kids now just because I MIGHT not be able to conceive if I wait til my 30's, or even 40's. If later on we decide we want kids, we will see if it's possible at that time. If we can't have them ourselves, there's always adoption. Or....just not having children. There's so much work and responsibility to having children that we want to be 110% sure we want them. And right now, we're running at about 30%.

[Elusive BiFem]

Originally Posted by Pepper & Drew

If we can't have them ourselves, there's always adoption. Or....just not having children. There's so much work and responsibility to having children that we want to be 110% sure we want them. And right now, we're running at about 30%.

Bravo! Kudos! I understand people wanting to have their own, but after one or two, I wish people would consider adoption more frequently. There are so many children in this world that need loving homes. And the responsibility comment, too....Bravo!!!!

Now for the question...I believe I read in one of your earlier post that ya'll are a mixed-race couple. I know the world is a different place now (I caught that part about "MIGHT not be able to conceive if I wait til my 30's" - not much slips past me on this age stuff ), but I still wonder about difficulties people encounter as mixed-race couples. From the world in general...Negativity? Acceptance? What about family reactions when ya'll decided to become a couple? Any difficulty meeting swing partners? Any words of wisdom you would want to share with others that might find themselves falling in love with someone of a different race? And...your location...I guess you don't know since you've only been in Alabama and Florida, but I wonder if living in the Heart of Dixie has made anything more difficult (if it has been difficult at all) than living in other regions of the country.

Thanks! - EBF

PS: I'm a dog person, myself, but anyone that loves their pets is

[DBL D]

Hi Pepper & Drew,

You guys seem like a cool pair. Worried that Drew hasn't offered us much about himself; Thank God he has YOU to tell us about him.

I have a few for ya:

1) What rules did you two start out with when you started swinging; how have they changed?

2) Do you like to have a close group of "friends" or do you like variety?

3) Have you had sex without condoms with any of your partners?

Sorry, no food questions.

Male D

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by Elusive BiFem

Now for the question...I believe I read in one of your earlier post that ya'll are a mixed-race couple. I know the world is a different place now (I caught that part about "MIGHT not be able to conceive if I wait til my 30's" - not much slips past me on this age stuff ), but I still wonder about difficulties people encounter as mixed-race couples. From the world in general...Negativity? Acceptance?

Geez, how do you remember this stuff? I actually mentioned it in our into to the board, about a month ago, but didn't put it in our brief bio at the start of the interview. I figured if it came up in conversation, I'd talk about it then. I tend to get up on my soapbox . But, since you asked, I'll climb aboard!

What about family reactions when ya'll decided to become a couple?

I find it rather amusing now, although at the time it wasn't so funny. My parents were worried about what people would say, what his true intentions were with me, and that I would get hurt. They grew up in an era where dating outside of your race could at best get your feelings hurt and at the worst, get you killed. But, once they realized that our relationship was not just some rebellion stunt, my parents were fine, as I knew they would be. Drew's dad was fine with our relationship from the start, but his mom was certainly not. She didn't know any black people, so her only frame of reference was TV shows and the 6 o'clock news. But, as she got to know me and my family, she changed her tune. She realized that we were not any different than her family. We wanted the same things out of life, etc. And of course, neither set of parents taught anything other than we are all the same, don't treat others differently, yada, yada, yada. I find it funny that they both sang the "We Are the World" tune until we brought somebody home. It was "Guess Who's Coming to Dinner"--the 90's addition.

Any difficulty meeting swing partners?

Are you kidding? I think it probably gets us more offers, because I've had several men in couples we've played with tell me that being with a black woman has been a longtime fantasy for them and I don't quite know how to take that. Are they hooking up with us because I'm black, or because they like us and that's a bonus. Or, am I supposed to be a woman of great sexual prowess just because I'm black. Uh, that's no pressure. News flash, folks, (and I'm going to be graphic), it's all pink on the inside. The anatomy is the same. Oh, and while I'm myth busting, all black men are not great, well-hung lovers. Trust me. It doesn't make me angry or anything and I hope that's not how I'm coming off, but I don't guess I really understand the fasination.

Any words of wisdom you would want to share with others that might find themselves falling in love with someone of a different race?

Hmmmm....don't ever let anyone make you feel like you need to apologize for who you love. And, you've got to talk about the social issues you will face, preferably before you have an uncomfortable situation. And, when people ask you the "what about the children" question, ask them 'what about them?'. There are thousands of well adjusted, high functioning, happy-to-be-alive biracial people out there. And, the more there are, the less the "what about the children" question will be relevant.

And...your location...I guess you don't know since you've only been in Alabama and Florida, but I wonder if living in the Heart of Dixie has made anything more difficult (if it has been difficult at all) than living in other regions of the country.

I don't think there's any more biggots in the South than there are in any other region of the country. I just think here they are more open about it, which I prefer. If you hate me for preconceived ideas, I'd rather know it upfront, rather than you pretend that you are PC, but you really have the same ideas as "Bubba".

But, let me answer your question. No, we've not had a difficult time here. Nothing more than a few looks. In fact, in the limited situations we've had, none of them have been here at home. Bottom line, I think everybody has difficulties. If it wasn't our racial differences, it would be something else. We consider ourselves lucky that we are so compatible in so many other ways.

Whew! I need a nap after that one. Thanks for the questions. Oh yeah, and I'm stepping off soapbox

[Elusive BiFem]

Thanks for the soapbox answer! I really hesitated to ask, but having read all your stuff, I somehow didn't think you would be offended. As for what got me to thinking about it, while I was in the worst mood possible yesterday (see my thread in the Advise Forum ), I was walking through Target and overheard this woman say, in a wonderful tone, "Mommy just loves you so much!" I turned around to look - that's such a great thing to hear - and it brought another smile to my face. Only the second one of the day, I might add. Later, in check-out, I was behind her and for the first time, although I had looked at her earlier, I realized she was white (and seriously white -as in really, really pale white - poor thing) and her little daughter was very black. It struck me...on first observation, I had not even noticed that aspect of their being and that's a good thing, IMHO.

And yeah, I can remember little fine details...but ask me my name sometime....

Question...

You mentioned that on your desert island you'd take a pen and paper (OK, we'll count that as just one) as you feel you have a book inside you somewhere. What would your book be about? Funny? Serious? Fiction? Non-fiction (I'd think not since you wouldn't have access to research, but maybe you're just really smart? )?

And...have you started your book? If not, why not (no fair using time as the reason!) - EBF

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by DBL D

Hi Pepper & Drew,

You guys seem like a cool pair. Worried that Drew hasn't offered us much about himself; Thank God he has YOU to tell us about him.

I know it's a one-sided conversation, but a lot of times he'd rather that I answered emails we get and this has been the same way. Now, he loves to yahoo, but that's more of a live conversation. He's real, I swear.

I have a few for ya:

1) What rules did you two start out with when you started swinging; how have they changed?

At first, we didn't quite know what to expect, and were interested in soft swinging. Our rules were that anything that happened we would do together. I was fine with him being with another woman, but I really didn't think that I would be interested in being with another man. Well, after our first experience (soft swap), I changed my mind. So then the rules were together and that we'd use condoms. Then, we entertained at our home, so we added the rule that no one does anything in our bed but us. We played with a single male and I didn't like it, so now single males are out. And, those are still our rules, except....we've met one couple that we've had to completely rethink our rules for. We've played somewhat separately and we've slept in their bed and we'd feel comfortable with them sleeping in ours. So, I guess they're the rules, unless we say otherwise.

2) Do you like to have a close group of "friends" or do you like variety?

We have a close group. Anonymous sex doesn't appeal to me or to Drew, although we don't have to know your entire life story before playing. Just some sort of connection.

3) Have you had sex without condoms with any of your partners?

No, we have not. I really hate condoms, but hey. A lot of other couples we've played with don't insist on them, but we do.

[Vespertine]

Originally Posted by Pepper & Drew

If you hate me for preconceived ideas, I'd rather know it upfront, rather than you pretend that you are PC, but you really have the same ideas as "Bubba".

I hate the "Bubbas" of the world.

Kudos to you for your feelings on people's prejudice. My Sister-In-Law is in an interacial marriage and having a hard time where we live. She's a clone for the mother EBF was describing and she catches a lot of slack from both races. You were so right on the money when you said:

There are thousands of well adjusted, high functioning, happy-to-be-alive biracial people out there. And, the more there are, the less the "what about the children" question will be relevant.

We need more people like you in the world.

Okay. Now my questions:

What kind of playmates are ya'll attracted too?

What type of couples turn you off?

Big boobs or small?

Kinky sex or sensual?

What kind of perfume & cologne do you two wear?

Are those your kitties in your avatar?

[JustAskJulie]

I have a cat that plays fetch as well. She gets a little irritated when she brings you her ball and you don't throw it. Her latest thing tho is that she has learned how to unscrew the toy that hangs on the closet door (has a little pole that screws into the door hanger with a long string with a mouse hanging off it). She figured out how to unscrew it and every time I put it back she unscrews it again and drags it through the house.

So how long have you guys been together? Married?

The mixed race thing really interests me. In two weeks my mom will be getting married. He's black, she's white. He just moved down here from DC and they are both expecting a good bit of backlash from it, but so far have been pleasantly surprised with their experiences.

The typical stereotype mixed race couple is the black male/ white female, do you feel that the experience differs when you are in the opposite end of the spectrum?

What has been your worst experience because of being a mixed race couple?

What advice do you have for new mixed race couples?

[Elusive BiFem]

Originally Posted by JustAskJulie

I have a cat that plays fetch as well. She gets a little irritated when she brings you her ball and you don't throw it. Her latest thing tho is that she has learned how to unscrew the toy that hangs on the closet door (has a little pole that screws into the door hanger with a long string with a mouse hanging off it). She figured out how to unscrew it and every time I put it back she unscrews it again and drags it through the house.

SIDEBAR COMMENT, PLEASE:
First, WR is speaking to me again! So we're both on the phone (she's on the speaker phone which sits right next to the monitor) reading the board together. Not talking - just reading. Dead silence on the phone. I was just reading Julie's comments about her cat...sitting here with my feet propped up on desk...when all of a sudden, I hear this long, drawn out "MEOW....". I'm sure my expression was one of those that should have been caught on video as my first thought was, "HOW DID JULIE DO THAT!?! Make a cat meow sound on this thread!!!" Then I realized...WR's cat....

Question: How did ya'll discover the Swingers Board and did you lurk for a time before posting? Was it as tough for ya'll to make those first few post as it seems to be for many?

- EBF

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by Vespertine

What kind of playmates are ya'll attracted too?

Drew has his "type" and I have my "type" and they're so not the same. I like women with dark hair, dark eyes and kinda on the soft side. Think Angelina Jolie or Katherine Zeta Jones. Drew likes little shorthaired blondes. Think Reese Witherspoon. I could walk into a room and tell you who he would pick out. As far as men, I like dark hair, broad shoulders and nice legs. Now, as far as couples we already know, what attracts us to them, much more than what they look like, is a connection with them. The ability to sit and talk and enjoy their company with our clothes on. Now, that's not to say looks mean nothing. But, personality goes a long way.

What type of couples turn you off?

Ones that are painful to talk to. Couples that don't have their shit together is pretty much a turnoff too. Once we met another interracial couple who we thought we would really hit it off with, but during dinner, it became quite obvious that we didn't even like these people. They were a damn train wreck, telling us about how he cheated on her with this girl, then she ended up in bed with the girl without telling him, etc. Yeah, we practically ran away from that one. Too bad too, because she was smokin' hot.

Big boobs or small?

I assume you are talking about what we like, not what I have. Drew is not a boob man, so pleasantly small to big is fine with him. I like big boobs. I actually like anything that's really feminine. Big boobs, big hips, soft skin, long hair...

Kinky sex or sensual?

That's subjective, isn't it? One man's kink is another's sensual. Hmmmmm....it depends on what day it is....

What kind of perfume & cologne do you two wear?

I wear Coco Mademoiselle by Chanel and Drew wears Curve by Liz Claiborne.

Are those your kitties in your avatar?

Nope, those are some generic kitties. Ours don't sleep a whole lot during the day, at least not inside, so we don't have any sleeping pictures of ours. They're usually squirrel, butterfly or lizard catching.

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by JustAskJulie

I have a cat that plays fetch as well. She gets a little irritated when she brings you her ball and you don't throw it. Her latest thing tho is that she has learned how to unscrew the toy that hangs on the closet door (has a little pole that screws into the door hanger with a long string with a mouse hanging off it). She figured out how to unscrew it and every time I put it back she unscrews it again and drags it through the house.

It's hell having smart cats, isn't it. Ours play look out for each other. If one gets up on the kitchen counter, the other one will meow really loudly to let the other one know to get down.

So how long have you guys been together? Married?

We've been together 8 years and married for 5. At times it seems like yesterday, at other times it's like we've always been together.

The mixed race thing really interests me. In two weeks my mom will be getting married. He's black, she's white. He just moved down here from DC and they are both expecting a good bit of backlash from it, but so far have been pleasantly surprised with their experiences.

Well, congratulations! Like I said earlier, I think people may look, people may think things, but most don't say anything to you. And hell, let's face it, they'll be the new gossip for a while, but then someone else does something that people want to talk about, and nobody will talk about it anymore. I used to look at other people to see if they were staring at us, but the longer we've been together, the more I've realized that I'm not ruining my dinner/shopping trip/whatever just because someone might have a problem. Also, I've met so many people that say that their sister, or brother, or son, or daughter, or (now) mom is in an interracial relationship. A lot of times the looks your getting are of approval, or at least of curiosity.

The typical stereotype mixed race couple is the black male/ white female, do you feel that the experience differs when you are in the opposite end of the spectrum?

That's a great question. I think we have an easier time of it than mixed race couples where the male is black and the female is white. Of course, I'm speaking in generalizations, and in my own opinion, but, in that senario, you are getting it from all sides. Black women are upset because they view that you've 'taken one of their men', white men don't like it because they feel in competition with black men anyway for masculinity, white women view other white women who date outside as someone who is loose, or a big renegade and black men feel like other black men are selling out. In our case, Drew immediately gets "cool points" with black people, black men have more black women available to them, so they aren't usually upset with me, most black women understand dating outside of their race, even if they don't particularly think it's the right for them, and there hasn't been a large outcry from white women. So, I think it's a good bit easier in our type of relationship.

What has been your worst experience because of being a mixed race couple?

We had some friends (notice *had*) that we had gone to visit and we were playing cards. There was another guy that they were friends with, but we didn't know him, there too. We started talking about songs, and there was one that our friend had not heard of, so he asked who sang it. So, the guy we didn't know answers, 'a bunch of n******s.' I was outraged. And was even more outraged by the fact that Drew didn't say a word. So, we talked about it and he was dealing with the fact that he didn't want to be a hipocrite. He's said things in the past that were not PC, so he didn't want to say all of a sudden that it wasn't tolerated. I had to explain to him that his future children, if we had them, would be considered black, so that man could have been talking about his children. We also had another incident of the n word with that couple, so I decided I dang sure didn't need friends like those. Drew still occasionally talks to them on the phone (maybe once a year), and I don't mind. He just knows I'm not subjecting myself to that kind of language again and they aren't welcome to our home.

What advice do you have for new mixed race couples?

Walk softly and carry a big stick? Try hard to understand where the other person is coming from. Sometimes it's difficult to understand because it's not part of your life experience, but if you are going to make it work, you have got to.

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by Elusive BiFem

Question: How did ya'll discover the Swingers Board and did you lurk for a time before posting? Was it as tough for ya'll to make those first few post as it seems to be for many?

I honestly don't remember how we found the board. I think Drew found the SLS first, then I started looking on the forum every once in a while. And yes, I lurked for probably a few months. Gotta check things out before jumping in, ya know?

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by Elusive BiFem

Question...

You mentioned that on your desert island you'd take a pen and paper (OK, we'll count that as just one) as you feel you have a book inside you somewhere. What would your book be about? Funny? Serious? Fiction? Non-fiction (I'd think not since you wouldn't have access to research, but maybe you're just really smart? )?

And...have you started your book? If not, why not (no fair using time as the reason!) - EBF

That's just the thing...I don't know what subject I'd write about. It seems like fiction would be easier, but who would my hero or heroin be? More than likely, anything I wrote would be funny. Not Drew Carey put-the-book-down-cuz-i'm-laughing-too-hard, but in the way "Save Karen: One Shopoholic's Journey to Debt And Back" is funny. (By the way, a great book). Or, I think non-fiction, as in a memoir would be fun to write--no research needed. But, how old do you have to be to write a memoir? I could write about swinging, because I could certainly get published if some of the books I've read did. I've thought about trying my hand at erotica. I think I could do a really good job at that one. And, just think of the fun I'd have doing the research for that . Can you see why I've not started yet? I change my mind all the time.

[JustAskJulie]

Do either of you have any fetishes?

What are your favorite drinks? Alcoholic and non.

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by JustAskJulie

Do either of you have any fetishes?

Hmmm....I don't know that we have fetishes, but there are some things we like. Drew likes pretty toes and high, strappy sandals. We also delved a little bit into some BDSM, but the deeper we got into it, the more it freaked me out. I enjoyed being submissive, but I couldn't handle how I felt after coming down. And, Drew didn't really get into it.

What are your favorite drinks? Alcoholic and non.

We both drink a lot of water and some fruit juices. I like wine and Shmirnoff Ice Twisted. Drew likes Jack and Coke.