Husband says he'll TRY not to kiss other women

[De and Ci]

Julie is right of course. For you its obviously a heck of a lot more than a "kissing" issue.

I can't help but wonder, moral issues aside: Does the idea of you having sex with another man or three turn you on? Are you worried that he will fall in love with another swinger? Do you find that a couple's club is fun place to go? Does the idea of group sex make you hot? Does the idea of a gang bang turn you on?

If you are just insecure (you are afraid he's going to fall for a another if you let him do it) or just have moral issues. Then you may have some hope for transforming from a "tarnished halo" to a "shining little devil"

However, if all aspects of swinging disgusts you, the idea of sex with others totally turns you off, akin to sleeping with a bum who hasn't showered in over a year. Then you just need to just figure out a way to get your hubby to accept it. If you do swing-in spite of the fact that it disgusts you-you might as well go out and sleep with that bum on the street.

[Dee_Lee]

I'm new to this forum however, me and my girlfriend are going through something similar (As far as boundries). She's actually the one that brought up the swing lifestyle.. I have done both
FMF & MFM but never a group party. Her and I origanally REALLY
loved the idea but as time goes on and we read other peoples
issues, problems and regrets it has put many questions into both
of our minds.. OUR concerns are wether we are BOTH ready for this wonderful lifestyle. One issue is that she(Lea) is bouncing back and forth about being able to handle me fucking another woman, when I tell her that I really want us to enjoy the experiance together and if she's not going to enjoy and be happy
I won't do it, then she says "no I really want to do it"..
Honestly I really don't know if it's worth screwing up a great relationship over.....

Point is, and I hope I'm not being too forward but I agree with everyone else. I really don't think you guys are ready or that you
will ever be and you should NOT be pushed into anything you don't want to do.. If your hubby insist and doesn't seem to care enough about your feelings then F... H..!...

Got it!!

Good luck and do what's right for your self!!

-- Dave --

[Mulder]

I think that for us the no kissing rule would apply to each other! Don't get me wrong we love one another, but we are crusty 90 year old cynics in thirty five year old bodies. Other than a peck on the lips every once in a while we don't kiss (almost never during sex). Thus, if my wife kissed another man passionately, it would be especially interesting since it's not something I've ever seen!

In fact, I've told my wife that my number one fantasy is to see her have intercourse with about fifty men as her FIRST swinging experience. She thinks that's excessive, but keep in mind we met eleven years ago due to a classified ad she ran about having sex with as many men as possible (her long time boyfriend had just left her and she felt that by sleeping with enough guys she would feel better about the whole thing, not sure if it worked).

As for me, I don't even like to touch strangers let alone kiss them. I'm about like the character that Tony Schlube plays on USA Adrian Monk (he is neater, smarter and better looking however).

[Rett]

Tarnished Halo,

Yes, Jullie is correct - your husband needs to go to counseling with you.

You're "Old Fashioned" and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that - it can be wonderful.

When you point out your husband gets upset when someone challenges him on thoughts or beliefs , something is wrong. When he says you go get help , something is wrong. If in the past he wouldn't bother talking about your problems, something is wrong. When he says it's easier for you to get help than him, WOW that lumps it all together - it's your problem not his.

From your postings you have done everything you can to try to understand him. Counseling, research, swingers board advice, and tried to communicate with him for quite some time but, has he tried to understand your concerns. What is he doing to make the marriage work? It sounds to me as not much. In reality your postings on the board have been very rational and clearly stated and I sympathize with you in every way. He probably needs more than just marriage counseling .

You also state you don't understand the difference between the attitudes of men and woman regarding sex. Believe me , there are many men that are satisfied with love, devotion, and settling down with their loved one only. If they have any fantasies , that's all they are and remain such. A man's wife is his soul partner, lover, and best friend.

Any man that has someone as determined to go through the steps you have taken to understand him certainly has someone that loves him. He should correspond in a like manner. What is good for one is good for both, what is bad for one is bad for both. That's how a marriage should be. I hope he can allow himself to realize how wonderful and devoted you are in trying to understand him. I have noticed most of the men on the swinging board say the most important person in their life is their wife and at anytime one or the other didn't want to swing that would end it.

All I can say is you'll have to stand firm and insist he attend counseling with you. If he won't do that it spells trouble.

[Mulder]

I think guys (in general) have a natural tendency to act and think like "egomaniacs" who have a right to do as they please. This tendency must be kept in check if we are to avoid being seen as Jerks by our spouces and others. This is probably the SIMPLE truth in your situation:

1. Your husband enjoys, or thinks he might enjoy kissing other females during sex. He therefore is reluctant to give this up for the same reason that when my wife asks me to avoid fast food (and posting personal information on message boards) that my reply is "I'll try".

2. Many men hate being "told what to do" or criticised. When my wife and I worked at the same medical billing service she would sometimes observe while driving into work "you've got shaving cream in your ears". Well, this made me mad and I would usually reply "either tell me before we leave home or leave me alone". She stopped telling me, and one day an important potential client observed "I can't buy something from someone with shaving cream in their ears".

Most men will only make changes when it is obvious that failing to do so will cost them something very important. Unfortunately (for men) women often consider changes made at THAT point to be insufficient (because with women attitude and motivation often matters as much or more than outcomes). Thus, if a man "gets what he wants" it doesn't matter to him that he had to pester, or otherwise "harrass" you to agree. However, if a WOMAN is put in the position of having to do this, she usually won't be satisfied that the she "won" because she feels she shouldn't have had to go that far. Bottom line: Most men are self absorbed selfish pigs that respond only to obvious, threatened pain (which can take many forms).

[SexhoundDog]

Tarnished,

Here's repeating what Julie said:

"I can appreciate your wanting to do anything in your power to make your marriage work and to make your husband happy. What concerns me is that he doesn't seem to want to make that same effort."

I'm afraid I agree with her 200%. The anguish that you seem to be going through is something I can't ever imagine putting my wife or anyone I care about through. Your husband simply needs to deal with your saying "No" and move on with your relationship.

If you wake up tomorrow morning, look in the mirror and see Pam Anderson staring back at you in the reflection and your self esteem jumps way high, that won't change your mind about swinging, will it?

I think this is more your husband's problem than yours.

[aviancpl]

Well - back to the original question

This one is a no-brainer. We don't have any such limitations, but if Mrs. Avian suddenly popped up one day with "I don't want you kissing the other female" then I'd:

1. Agree without hesitation and

2. Start a discussion to figure out why she felt that way, and did she REALLY want to proceed on this..

You have every right to feel the way you do.

Mr. Avian