Jealousy or something like it?

[Aphrodite]

Well, for my second post,this will be a long one...
My husband and I have been swinging for over a year now...it all started out actually more then 3 years ago when we began tossing the idea around in our heads,then I discovered to his and my own delight that I am bisexual...it started out as curiousity and then we had a threesome with another female a little over a year ago and it was no longer a curiousity, I knew I was bisexual.
So, we at first decided to only look for bi-females,and that was fine for awhile.We weren't having much luck...and gradually, decided to add couples to the mix.We met a few, and it never really went farther than actually meeting.Usually, the wives would get upset that the husband was paying too much attention to me and that would pretty much squash anything from happening because we would back out and let them work out their problems.

Now, trying to get to the point of why I'm writing.
For the past 6 months or so, we have been going to swing related clubs.The first one we went to was an on-premise and things were fine, I danced with him and a few ladies and that was it.Then, we started going strictly to off-premise clubs. There was a new one in town and it was so much fun when we went.I discovered something about myself...and that is I absolutely loooove to dance,I could dance all night long.I have found it to be a great stress reliever,I am a stay at home mom and a part time student...and letting loose on the dance floor is something I sooooo look forward to.
Things went well at that club also...I danced with a few men and my
husband .We both flirted and everything was fine.{The club's owner even asked us to moderate the forums area of a site they were working on,we've been moderating now for almost 2 months}.Well, the next time we went out to a club, it was a different atmosphere in that there were more single men at this particular club than at the previous one.Things seemed to be going well.My husband and I danced and flirted, the usual...and then I decided to go ask the D.J. to play a song...{Mind you, my husband and I have always talked openly about what was okay and allowed and what was not,so I felt I wasn't doing anything wrong.}
My husband gave me a dollar to put in the D.J.'s gratuity cup and I went over to talk to him about playing a song...he began flirting with me and talking...and wanted a kiss to play the song...so I kissed him on the cheek.He played the song...I walked off and got hubby and we danced.A little while later, I went back again to ask for another song....the D.J. asked for another kiss and I kissed him on one cheek and then the other, and he snuck a quick peck on the lips...and then asked me what song I wanted to hear...and I told him a song is all I want from him and that kiss was all he was getting from me.Well, the song I wanted wasn't on his list, so,I decided to go back to our table and ask hubby if he wanted to dance once more before we left because the club was closing soon.But, as I was walking off the stage, a lady had come up asking the D.J. to play a song and he asked me what she said because he didn't hear her, so I asked her,and he said he didn't have that song either and put his arm around my waist and told the girl we were together,joking around and I moved his hand and told her he was full of sh*t for some reason, she was feeling really sad about something,,so I hugged her...and that's when hubby came up and wanted me to leave,I told him to hold on just a sec. and he was insistant...so I told her I had to go...he came up again...and I told him I'd be right there,and told her I had to go and he and I left.Things were fine for us the following week,until I mentioned that I wanted to put some new pics up on a site we belong to.He wasn't his usual self and got irritated at me.He said he was angry about what happened with the D.J. and he didn't want to go to that club again.I was fine with that and said okay and that I understand.
He then said he wanted to take a break from this whole lifestyle business for a little while.I said that was fine,{we stopped for about a week}because then, he decided he still wanted to pursue swinging, so we started again.Last week he was really angry because he was checking our IM's and there were a bunch of IM's from single guys,{he's always checking them on his cell phone} .... some of them knew us from the first off-premise we went to and from the site we help moderate. He was furious,{I have never talked to these men and blow them off whenever I get IM's from any single guys} and so we talked about things and he basically said he felt single men were disrespectful. I told him that I have no problem not seeing single men.So, we put NO SINGLE MEN in our profile.Well, this past weekend was the last straw for me,we had talked about how it would be sexy to just be watched and tease,but not actually have intercourse with anyone.and it was a sexy conversation... then,the next day he tells me he wants to quit swinging altogether.Now, that I have no problem with if he sincerely wants to quit.What I do have a problem with is the fact that on top of that, he no longer wants to go dancing,citing he really can't dance anyway.Which is bullshit, because he's been learning and doing really well..He also says he can't deal with the way men look at me,because he's says he's being disrespected.And it irritates him that I see nothing wrong with it.And, I don't see anything wrong with it.Mind you, not even 3 hours before he told me this, he was online flirting with this girl who was a bi-female and that was fine.That's always fine.
But, I'm being penalized because men look at me and write me. I asked him what exactly he expected when we got into the lifestyle?Men are going to look and they're going to try and pick up on me, but it's what I do about it that matters.So, I feel for one thing, he's jealous and for another he may not trust me.But, I haven't done anything to indicate that he can't trust me.I love him with all my heart and would never do anything to hurt him. I am also hurt because he and I have made friends at the club we moderate for and we were supposed to go there this coming weekend...so while I am fine with the fact that he doesn't want to swing anymore, I am a little sad to have to say good-bye to friends I just made.Not to mention, he no longer wants to go dancing.I just do not understand what happened.I have complied with all his wishes.But, he says he doesn't like the fact that I don't see anything wrong with single men flirting with me. Even though I have said I would not flirt or write back.And, I don't and won't.I just figure it this way, it isn't about what other people do, it's about your reaction to it.People are going to try and make plays on us ...but it's up to us whether or not to pursue it.And that is what I am trying to get him to understand, but he doesn't want to listen, he just gets mad.I think I am angry because it seems like there's a double standard here, in the beginning, he was all gung-ho about this and I had reservations, but gradually have warmed up to the idea and enjoy the flirting and attention.And, as I said, I love to dance.It just feels like now that I am all for the idea, he's getting spooked.He swears up and down that it's not the fact that I'm getting all the attention, but I know that has to be some of it.He gets attention too,but I am the more flamboyant in this relationship.And, now that I've gotten into the whole idea of the lifestyle and etc. I feel like he feels it's not in his control anymore and that is what the real problem is.
Feel free to lend me your thoughts. Surrender

[northindycpl]

Well.... believe it or not, there are somethings left out of your post, that I think are important and I will tell you why;

How old are the 2 of you? Important because people in different stages of their lives have different emotions associated.

What are your rules? In your post, you said you talked about things. Well, talking about things is the start, but you have to have clearly defined rules, and I do not think you do.

NO Means NO... when your husband said he wanted to leave, you should have immediately left, not in a minute. If you had clearly defined rules that you were both comfortable with, then that would have not been an issue. When Mr. Indy and I try something new, and even if we are right in the middle of it, if he said to me "ciggarette break" I would immediately stop and talk to him. Now Mr. Indy is quite secure and mature, and we communicate well, so he would never ask me to leave immediately unless he was fearful of my safety.

I am guessing you are fairly young- and from what you have said you are a stay at home mom and student. Getting out, and flirting is one thing- but, take this from a woman who has been there, It is wonderful to have another mans attention- and with it, it is easy to let yourself get carried away. Clearly your man felt threatened by whatever was going on.

Lastly, the im's from others would not be part of our life. I would not allow single men to IM me for any reason, with or without the Mr's approval.

You need to focus on your marriage, and what makes your man comfortable and quit playing around with the other boys. What are you doing this for anyway?

[Aphrodite]

You seem to have things a bit misconstrued here.I should add that at the club we moderate for, my husband actively encouraged me to flirt with,hug and kiss the" very male" bartender the whole time we were there.He was all for that.Hence my confusion.And,, to clarify...we are both in our mid-30's.I am NOT "playing around" with boys. I haven't even slept with one yet. Long before we even crossed the threshold to allowing me to mingle with men, we had extensive looong talks about what our rules are. I wasn't telling him to wait because of the D.J.,I told him to hold on a sec so I could say good-bye to the lady I was hugging when he came up. Second of all, I do always drop everything and go to him.I had been dancing with a gentlemen and a lady previously this very same night and he came up and I dropped everything to go with him.Our rules are very clear or so I thought, in that we each agreed to trust each other and that if we saw something going on on the dance floor,unless the other looks like they're having trouble handling a situation, we would allow the other to deal with it.Such as any kissing or etc. Because there was another incidence at another club,on his part, where he had been dancing with a girl and she kissed him and grabbed his dick while they were still dancing.Since it was a first for us both,he didn't handle it well and we discussed it and got it out of the way.We've read books and again, have talked extensively.I have created every scenario possible for him in regards to another male and constantly have asked him time and again if he was absolutely SURE he could handle me with another guy. Each time something new comes up, we discuss it until we're blue in the face.Up to this point, my husband and I have always worked through any differences of opinion and come to a middle ground.On this one, however, we're having a bit of trouble.
Again, we have very CONCISE rules.
And, I am not ALLOWING anyone to IM me, I cannot control that,I should add that the e-mail addy they send IMs to, is one shared by my husband and myself.And, prior to this incidence, he had given me permision to talk with single males in the hopes of pursuing a mfm three-way.I do not IM these men back!
I hide nothing from him, because I do not have to.
As for getting carried away?
I don't do that,I've had many opportunities,both in and out of the lifestyle to get carried away.I am not in this for that.My husband suggested it first and now that I actually enjoy it, I'm getting penalized.
As for your comment about focusing on my marriage.Lady, you have no idea exactly HOW focused I am.So, please don't judge me when you do not know what you are talking about.I am the most devoted wife you'll ever meet.My husband is well taken care of and never wants for anything.To be blunt, he is quite spoiled. I hope this clarifies things for you.
Also, I have NO problem not swinging anymore,but what I do not get is him not even wanting to go dancing.I'm not wanting to go dancing to fool around with other guys, I want to go to let loose with my husband.If you would go back and read my original post, you would see that.That is the point I'm trying to make here. It's not about the other men or the attention, I may like it, but who wouldn't? The other question is, why is it then okay for the man when he gets flirted with?Makes no sense to me.Again, a double standard.

[LikeMinds321]

Aphrodite -

I am still a newbie myself, but I would like to offer some of my thoughts.

If you are a stay-at-home mom and student, and feel you have a "spoiled" husband, which to me means he is well taken care of, then maybe he is seeing you in a new arena that is threatening to him. This arena being the confident well-liked woman in the company of others at the swinger clubs. You are now giving your attention to others, like a hostess, since you said you have been invited to fill this role as moderator of the club's forums. You are slowly taking on a bigger position there. This is drawing more attention to you, you're getting more males contacting you and this threatens your husband.

Just a thought.

I really think the two of you can work this out. Give swinging a break for a few weeks or a month so that you and your husband can talk in detail about the changes you are going through. Swinging is changing for you. Talk with your husband like you have talked with us. You seem to have faith in him. I think he will come through for you.

LM

[confunktion]

NorthIndy, I must respectfully disagree with your view on this. Maybe it was the missing information that you referred to in your post, but IMHO Aphrodite's husband is suffering from some sort of insecurity complex. It also could be something more serious, based on the level and frequency of the mood swings.

Aphrodite, I don't see any improper moves by you in your story, based on the rules you described. I mean, you were comforting a person you perceived as being very sad. I call that commendable, not reprehensable. To me, the DJ got out of hand, and you did a nice job in diffusing the situation. It is possible that your husband felt that he was a safety risk for you, but you did nothing to pour fuel on the fire.

As for the IM thing, if you are closing the window and not replying to these single men, then don't worry about it. If he doesn't believe you, computer security types can pull up those records and prove it, if need be. If there's nothing to hide, like you say, then there's no issue on your side.

OK, moving on to the dancing thing...dancing gives me and the Mrs. the same sort of release as you have described. If your husband does not wish to go dancing, is there anyone else you can go with, such as other girlfriends or sisters or something along that line? Would he have a problem with that? If he does, I think he is showing some major insecurity issues here that need to be addressed. Are there other things going on in his life that could be causing him a lot of stress? Is the job going badly? Is he under a lot of pressure? Or did this maybe stem from "a flirt session gone wrong" on his side? Maybe he got stiffed by a woman he was flirting with and took a mega-blow to the ego.

Have a sit-down with him. Ask questions. Try to get him to open up and let you in. Based on your history, he sounds like he can let out his feelings, and maybe then you can reach an understanding. If this doesn't work, then maybe we go another route.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

Mr. Funk
A Caucasian With Rhythm

[Aphrodite]

Thank you LikeMinds and confunktion...
I wonder if you both might be on to something, in fact I suspected the very same thing...but he will not own up to it.He just has said that he thought he could handle it, but realized he can't.However, I will add that I noticed he's checked our e-mail{I haven't opened any since he came out with wanting to quit} and read an e-mail from some people wanting to meet us.So, I got irritated and sent him a text message asking why he's reading those e-mails if we're supposed to be leaving the lifestyle? But, perhaps you're both right,maybe he is having insecurities,I guess since I have spoiled him...which by spoiled I do mean well taken care of...it might be a bit hard to share my attention.That I can understand.Perhaps, I do need to really have a long talk with him,it's just not so easy when you're angry and frustrated.He has said that he loves the way I am and my kindness attracts people,they see something in me that makes them comfortable,I guess. So, maybe he's afraid of losing that.
We should quit for now and see how things go, I'm not bringing the subject of swinging up anymore.But, I do wonder why, if we're supposed to stop,is he still checking the e-mail from people? My concern there is that as long as he has control over everything,he's alright...but he just can't handle it when I have some control of my own.
One last thing:
With regards to dancing...
I don't think he'd go for me going out with my friends or family to a dance club.And, truthfully, I really would rather go with him, anyway.But, thank you for the suggestions.

[northindycpl]

Originally Posted by Aphrodite

You seem to have things a bit misconstrued here.

As for your comment about focusing on my marriage.Lady, you have no idea exactly HOW focused I am.So, please don't judge me when you do not know what you are talking about.I am the most devoted wife you'll ever meet.

First let me begin by saying-

How ridiculous it is that you create a post, which is nothing less than a poorly written novella .... that I take the time to read... and you ask for help/advice, and tell me I have no idea how devoted you are?

I have found in my many experiences that the squeeky wheel always get the greese, so to speak. Take that however you wish, but lady you have problems and if you don't want advice from more experienced people don't ask!

This is the last bit of experience I will ever give to you; If I didn't touch a nerve with what I previously replied, then you wouldn't have take the time to write yet another novella describing how wrong I am. You need to get that wheel fixed before it breaks!

[Aphrodite]

Indy, you asked for more details/clarification, and I gave them to you.
And, I'm real curious to find out why you are so quick to be so rude.I asked for advice,not attacks and judgement calls.The only one who has the right to judge is the Lord Himself..
You say you touched a nerve? Perhaps you did, but not for the reason you think.It touched a nerve, because I knew you were wrong.I know I am a good person and I know I take care of my husband.Simple as that.I felt I needed to clarify and I did.Enough said!
And,my novellas must have been pretty interesting if you felt the need to come back for more.

[JustAskJulie]

My first thought is that he is feeling left out. While you may be completely devoted to him at home, do you make sure that he is a priority when you are out swinging? Does he get attention from other women when you are out at clubs?

Since your original plans regarding swinging involved only another female and his hopes for FMF threesome (and your own), chances are that he had hoped for a more equal situation. However, since you are going out to swing clubs where singles are allowed, YOU are going to get more attention than he is.

If he is ok with how things go out the main club you attend (the one you moderate the forums for) then perhaps you should stick to only going to that club where he is comfortable? When you do go out to the clubs, dancing or whatever, make sure that he is still your priority and is getting the majority of your attention.

I can definately see how being a SAHM, you would enjoy getting out and dancing and just cutting lose. Perhaps you don't need a swing club for that? Perhaps a regular club would suffice and the two of you can go together and dance together. There are ways that you can both be happy, but you do have to look at what it is that is making him uncomfortable and try to find a middle ground.

You are right that you can't control who IM's you, and I am all too familiar with the unsolicited IM's that can come in just by having a sexually charged profile or having an email address that is in the public eye. There's not much you can do there.

Regarding the situation with the club and the DJ, did you explain to your husband what was going on?

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by Aphrodite

I think I am angry because it seems like there's a double standard here, in the beginning, he was all gung-ho about this and I had reservations, but gradually have warmed up to the idea and enjoy the flirting and attention.And, as I said, I love to dance. It just feels like now that I am all for the idea, he's getting spooked.He swears up and down that it's not the fact that I'm getting all the attention, but I know that has to be some of it.He gets attention too,but I am the more flamboyant in this relationship.And, now that I've gotten into the whole idea of the lifestyle and etc. I feel like he feels it's not in his control anymore and that is what the real problem is.
Feel free to lend me your thoughts. Surrender

I've heard about this sort of thing happening: guy gets girl into it (because he's always wanted to have two chicks mauling him at once), girl finds out she really likes it, guy gets mad because it's not just his fantasy anymore. Sounds like you guys started out right and you've just hit a snag. My advice? Don't swing until you get it straightened out (but you knew I was going to say that right?) and let him know that you really are trying to help him out here, but that you're not a mindreader. Ask him what specifically bothers him the most. Sounds sort of like he's just not levelling with you about the REAL root of the problem. Make sure he understands that you simply enjoy the social aspect of the lifestyle, meeting new friends, dancing and - yeah! - expressing yourself sexually. But assure him that he will ALWAYS be your #1 priority. It's difficult to really offer advice because it sounds like you guys have a pretty good system going already, and you've likely tried all of the above. My feeling is if you approach him with an open heart, with concern, and with love you'll both get it figured out. Good luck to you.

[Aphrodite]

Originally Posted by JustAskJulie

My first thought is that he is feeling left out. While you may be completely devoted to him at home, do you make sure that he is a priority when you are out swinging?

Absolutely.

Does he get attention from other women when you are out at clubs?

He has/does get attention, but just not as much as I do.Which is part of the problem.




Since your original plans regarding swinging involved only another female and his hopes for FMF threesome (and your own), chances

are that he had hoped for a more equal situation. However, since you are going out to swing clubs where singles are allowed, YOU are going to get more attention than he is.

In hindsight, we've realized this is very true.

If he is ok with how things go out the main club you attend (the one you moderate the forums for) then perhaps you should stick to only going to that club where he is comfortable?

Excellent idea!

When you do go out to the clubs, dancing or whatever, make sure that he is still your priority and is getting the majority of your attention.

I have, will and will continue to do so...

Regarding the situation with the club and the DJ, did you explain to your husband what was going on?

One thing my husband I definitely have is almost too much honesty and open communication.I was very open and forthright about the situation with the D.J.

I do have an update for everyone, but wanted to answer some of these questions before I let everyone know what's been happening.

[Aphrodite]

Originally Posted by intuition897

It's difficult to really offer advice because it sounds like you guys have a pretty good system going already, and you've likely tried all of the above. My feeling is if you approach him with an open heart, with concern, and with love you'll both get it figured out. Good luck to you.

Thank you so much for your advice and kind words.

[Aphrodite]

Okay everyone...
It's been a few days and I wanted to give you all an update.
Basically, we had a few long talks and the conclusion to all of this is,while he wanted to pull back....he was concerned that it would anger me to slow things down a bit.Which,I feel,stems from him feeling insecure.This really bothered me that he felt I would get angry,because as I have said, we really do talk and discuss things openly.Sometimes, no matter how secure you think you or your partner are, I guess there's always room for doubt.To make a long story as short as I can.We have decided first of all to eliminate singles of either sex...ONLY married couples now.He asked if I would consider single females, but I have decided that unless I can see she's truly bisexual and not playing the role...than I'd prefer not to go that route.{And we all know how elusive truly bi females can be. } We have also decided, as Julie was saying, to stick to the club we moderate for and that's about it,until or unless we can find a club that truly caters to couples, because we feel comfortable there and he prefers the sexually charged atmosphere.We discussed vanilla clubs and the energy there isn't the same.So, basically, we are just slowing things down a notch or two.We'll still be going to the club and dancing and flirting, but unless we meet an actual couple, that will be all that happens. He said I really don't ignore him when we're out, but at times when I'm conversating and etc. he does feel left out.And, from now on...no matter what I am doing,even if I'm just offering comfort to a lady friend or whatever,I will always drop whatever I am doing and go to him.
He asked me if I am angry at him or am just agreeing to slow things down because I don't want to leave the lifestyle.I told him I would quit if that's what he truly wanted to do.And, I am agreeing because I love him and want him to feel secure and we should go with the pace of the slower person,and while I don't want to leave the lifestyle,I also sense he doesn't either.But I stress I will if he ever feels he wants to.I also told him, and I meant it,that I really do not care if I never sleep with another man again...I just love the sexual atmosphere, the flirting, the dancing and dressing sexy.He agreed that he too likes that atmosphere.So, for now,we're on the same page.I have made a mental note to periodically ask him if he's feeling okay,or if I am making him feel left out.And I have told him to tell me right away if he has any problems or concerns.So, we'll see how things go.We've also decided to start out slowly if we do meet a potential couple with just soft swap and then see how we feel.Thank you again to everyone for all your advice and kind words.{Save one very negative INDY!! }

[CB_n_Red]

Sounds like you two are well and truly sorted! Great to hear that you are on the same page and moving fowards in the way that suits you both best.

We do like a happy ending

CB

[confunktion]

Rock on, Aphrodite. That is wonderful news. Have a great time together, and keep us in the loop.

Mr. Funk
Now able to take "Communication Breakdown" off of the record player...