wife prefers cheating

[casleigh]

some background my wife and I have been together for 23 year, there are allot of grey areas after 23 years, but I would like to keep this short.
she is very flirtatious and she has had affairs wile we have been together, which have destroyed me at the time and us as a couple. 10 years ago I suggested swinging as an alterative,to the problem, but she said that she would try it but with out me, she said that it is weird to involve me and she would be unconfutable if I was there in the same room and participating.
she would prefer to cheat on me because to be sneaky is the flavour that she enjoys and with out that it doesn't have the same excitement. my question is there any other women/men out there that can relate to this,
any help would be good, because it dose my head in!!!!

[mixtupcpl]

Yes, I relate somewhat. My wife and I had an "open relationship" for a long time. We recently talked through everything and we've decided to accept that we are swingers and drop the other BS.

She also would feel weird with me in the room and so we will at some point seek out a full swap, separate rooms, encounter with a couple that clicks with us.

We never had cheating though, because we had given each other permission to fuck around. We were just kind of seeing singles. This always lead to drama, but we didnt really understand "swinging" so we just kept it going.

One thing my wife doesnt have though, is the sneaking/cheating thing. What made my wifes flings hard was that she always fought guilt and hated the fact that she felt like she was going behind my back (even though she wasnt).

Ask her to examine what her real motives are. How are you guys as a couple, honestly. I trust my wife with my life. Do you feel you have a fully solid foundation? She may just have a kink or it could be trouble, hard to say without really knowing you guys.

[JustMrJ]

I would have to agree with mixtupcpl in that if you and your wife don't really click anymore this could be trouble. If there is lying going on anyway, it's time to re-examine your marriage.

It seems to me, with the little information that is given, that there is WAY more out of whack here than a simple fetish on her part. Color me confused, but the whole sneaking and getting caught thing just doesn't strike me as a fetish to have without your spouse. I mean you can always sneak around in public and have public sex and she can have that 'almost getting caught' high.

Anyway... more information would help us all point you in (hopefully) the right direction.

[casleigh]

thank you so far for your input, I wanted to keep it short because I could type an epic, it has been a large problem for all of our relationship
to answer some of the question mixtupcpl we don't have an open relationship but she has told her mates that she has one, to make them feel better about the situation and to justify her actions. I think she would like one but she knows that it wouldn't suit me. my wife also got through a gilt trip one that she doesn't handle too well. when we discussed swinging 10 years ago we met two couples but nothing happened, I was just inquisitive and she was scared, so it has never happened. she has told me that it would be ok for me to have someone on the side, but I think this is to justify her actions. her motives are that if she connects with a man she should be able to have her way and I should forgive her or allow her. she doesn't want any boundaries.
I do believe that we have a solid foundation most of the time, other wise it wouldn't have lasted 23 years but I has been pretty rocky at times like all couples.
to justmrj this is not a problem that has just started and for the majority of time we do click, it started in the first 6 month of our relationship. she was telling me that I was her soul mate that she had be searching for, my friends at the time where trying to tell me different in a mild sense, but I was not listening because I had no doubt not to trust her, until I caught her with my best friend.
she told me she didn't want to hurt me and she didn't know why she did it. it has happend 2 times since then that i know of and maybe more, after the first time I got smarter and tuned into her change in attitude, also her gilt trip started to give her away, I don't think that she wanted to get caught because she was getting sneaker in many ways as time went on, but its not hard to know a change in a person to start to get suspicious and start drilling for answers. I would like to come up with a compromise that suits us both, before it happens again, she tells me that I won't, but I have herd that before. I don't think that she will compromise and then I will be forced to end the relationship and know she doesn't want that to happen. you are right justmrj
take it or leave it, easier said than done.

[mixtupcpl]

Man this is a hard one. I'm almost tempted to say something that will make me want to hit myself over the head and suggest couples counseling!

It sounds like she has broader issues that she *should* work through. You guys have been together a long time (same as my wife and I), but don't discount your flexibility in that. Basically, you're being amazing.

If I told my wife tomorrow "you're done with other guys - it just started bothering me for some reason" she would laugh thinking I was kidding, but seriously, that would be the end of it. And same goes my way. The litmus test for if this is being done for the right reasons is if either of you could go cold turkey (unless you've formed some kind of complex poly bond that you both agreed to - but thats something I dont "get" personally so I cant comment)

I don't like your choices here because your wife isn't respecting your boundaries. I suspect that's because she's grappling with feelings and drivers that she herself doesn't fully understand and can't actually control.

I have to ask... Why did your friends have misgivings back then?

[casleigh]

she's grappling with feelings and drivers that she herself doesn't fully understand and can't actually control

you are right. i have asked her to have a look at her self, but when she dose she dosen't like the person she see's. so she clams up, and we go no where.
misgivings??? i dont know what this means

[Chicup]

So she knowingly hurts you.

And this has been going on for over a decade.

In my opinion the issue has nothing to do with swinging over cheating, but why you stuck with this woman.

At this point any pain you have only yourself to blame for, nothing is a surprise.

[mixtupcpl]

Sorry! I meant to say why did your friends have doubts about her?

Chicup is definitely right in that this is an issue totally separated from the LS. You guys really do need to consider *gulp* maybe marriage counseling (ACK!).

In other words, you can't lifestyle your way out of a marriage with issues at the foundation, know what I'm saying?

[casleigh]

Sorry! I meant to say why did your friends have doubts about her?

they knew what was going on and couldn't tell me to my face. they ended up loosing respect for me because I couldn't see it at the time, and I punch out my best friend.
i was only 19 at the time

So she knowingly hurts you.

yes, but only if she gets caught LOL, and yes i do blame my self, after the first time she promise it would happen again 2 years after that we had 2 kids a dog and a mortgage etc.
the next fling dident happen again until 7 years after that. marriage has its up and downs right! and i wasent giving up so easy.

[bbarnsworth]

I have to agree with the other posters responding to you casleigh. There's more issues at play here, and trying to swing your way out of this is not going to work. Swinging usually requires solid foundations in the relationship. I don't see that here.

It's terribly hard to judge with so little information, but with what little we've seen here, I can reasonably say your wife has some issues to work through, and maybe you do as well. It's hard to know. A counselor can help with these issues.

For my part, trust is an absolute. If there isn't trust in the relationship, it's over. I trust my wife 100%, without any doubts of any kind. She's comfortable to tell me anything she thinks, and I am likewise. She won't ever do anything more than light flirting with another guy unless I know about it and approve and vice versa. We're in this together, always, forever. We're in this lifestyle _because_ we have a solid relationship, not as any means to make it more solid.

I don't think there's a compromise to be had, at this stage, with your wife that works for both of you. I think the two of you have to back up and get back to basics, and build from there.

[casleigh]

thanks guys for all of your good advise, I was hoping that swinging would be good to brake down the wall, open up more commination,honesty,trust,respecting my boundary's,and hers,that is not so bad having a fling with me,and cheating is not the answer to her sexual desires.

[bbarnsworth]

Originally Posted by casleigh

thanks guys for all of your good advise, I was hoping that swinging would be good to brake down the wall, open up more commination,honesty,trust,respecting my boundary's,and hers,that is not so bad having a fling with me,and cheating is not the answer to her sexual desires.

Swinging may be down the road for you and your wife. I don't think it's the right answer now. You're not going to fix this by swinging. You'll probably make it worse.

[SecretAsianMan]

The first (and second rule) in regards to broken relationships is... you cannot "fix" them by adding another person to the mix. If it's a poly-relationship or a swinging relationship ... adding more people complicates the relationship more.

And if there's already problems - swinging (or adding a polyamorous third/ fourth/ fifth/ or whatever) will only make them worse.

Your wife gets off on cheating on you (betraying your trust and disrespecting you and your marriage) ... and for some reason, you accept this.

You've brought up the idea of swinging with her because maybe you feel that it's simply her libido that needs to be satisfied. But, as she's shown you - it's not just the sex ... she feels this need to sneak around and do it behind your back and humiliate you.

Unless you're the type that gets off on that (being the cuckhold male) that's just not fair to you and ultimately, you'll get tired of being treated this badly and either leave or find some way to hurt her in return (have an affair of your own or whatever).

I dunno everything about your situation - but it doesn't sound like a healthy relationship. You need to work it out between the two of you ... either together or through the help of a counselor.

But whatever it is you choose to do... it honestly sounds like you deserve better than what you've been getting in this relationship. I wish you the best of luck

[mixtupcpl]

Yes! Very good points SecretAsianMan...

It sounds like she may be a bit of a sadist emotionally. And she actually is kind of putting you in a cuck relationship. Now some guys are basically masochists who get off on the humiliation and crave it (emotional masochists). I think of that whole scene as a very interesting variation of BDSM.

What I can say is... Man... if thats not you, you DONT want to be there. You need to find out what's making her tick.

And the scary thing is you guys have been together a LONG time to not know yet.

[JM153]

I have known a couple of women for whom if it wasn't forbidden, it wasn't exciting. I don't have any advice, but I have seen it before.