Women rule the swinging world, some guys feel left out.

[TheDeal]

Ok, we have been investigating the lifestyle now for many months. We have great communication, sex, love, and openness. We have gone to house parties and clubs, however have only had one small experience and that was in the ultra-soft arena.

The problem is most of the lifestyle is ruled by the women. Therefore the processes, rules, or whatever is there to cater to each woman's fantasies, insecurities, fears, etc. They have many options if they are nervous about seeing their man with another woman or being with another man. Also, if they are insecure about themselves, those feelings are met with equal options. Of course the options I speak of are both the physical and the emotional. Women with the physical fear can take the girl on girl route until they've had enough open experiences to deal with another man or another woman with their man. If the woman has emotional insecurity about her body or attractiveness, the lifestyle offers not just a multitude of both single and married men that will fawn over her, but also the number of women as well. All a woman has to do is be open, the rest will be catered to and taken care of.

I am not knocking this situation or putting it down in anyway. Quite the contrary; I applaud it and feel that it is one more reason the lifestyle can be so liberating and wonderful. The question is however, what about the guy who might have the above mentioned problems? For most of us (me included), the Bi thing is not a desire. Not that two guys being together is wrong, it's just not for me. Also, the lifestyle is so setup for the women. If you are a guy who is insecure or unsure of himself, then too bad. My wife and I began this journey and I was really hoping to be able to feel for once, a connection with a group. For people to seek me out and try and get to know me. I have always busted my ass to get to know people or to try and fit in. I just wanted to feel what is was like to be on the other side for once. Unfortunately, the lifestyle is not setup for guys like that. We are pigeon holed into playing the alpha males, just on standby for when a woman needs a dick. We are expected to pursue and sometimes even conquer, but too bad for you if your a guy that needs to be on the other end for a while. If that were not bad enough, I have to deal with every alpha male in the room coming up to my wife looking to... That's fine if I can't have anyone come talk to me (not even the wives of the guys who are all sitting around rubbing mine), but $hit do I have to just sit there and deal, or try to start competing with the other males for the attention? It's an issue I have dealt with for many years being a male lesbian, lol. It's just one I had not had to deal with for a while, at least until the lifestyle.

[iapr]

I think you are very perceptive and have hit quite a few nails on the head. You are correct, swinging is a females sport. It is by the women of the women and for the women. If you can understand and accept that and find a way to work within that system you will do fine. Does that mean you will be living the life of a porn star every time you leave the house? Absolutely not, but at times things will click into place. I have heard it said one time if a man treats his lady and her lady friends right they will occasionally throw him a bone. I do not like the way that is said or meant and do not totally agree with it but unfortunately there is some truth to that.

Everyone has a preference and a comfort zone, the challenge is to find a common comfort zone where both you and your partner can function in. Noone says it is easy, in fact I will come out and say it is often quite difficult. Keep this in mind though, for the vast majority of people throughout all places and cultures the prevailing preference and comfort zone is traditional monogamous marriage. It has been that way for many thousands of years and it is that way for a reason. I'm not totally sure what that reason is per se but for something to be that universal there has to be a good reason behind it.

Women will always have more sexual opportunities in the swinging lifesyle for the reasons you have discovered. there is a place that is totally geared towards the male sexual experience and that is the brothel. You can either shell out your $$$ there and get what you want or you can go to the swing club and give your lady what she wants and in return you may or may not get what you want on any given occasion. Either way you are paying something, it ain't ever handed out for free. My wise old grandmother told me that 35 years ago and I haven't ever seen anything since then that shows her wrong.

[TheDeal]

Very good reply and thank you. I guess you are telling me what I already knew. It sucks, cause I feel like I have always served/worshiped women. I wait hand and feet on my wife because I love and worship her. I feel as though I am beyond due for a bone. My wife is beautiful and is hit on by guys all the time. She also gets along better with men than women. I, on the other hand feel a stronger connection to women than men. The last thing I need is to step up the serving and hope that one day I just might get a bone. I am ready for a break not a new level of servitude.

[carlos_pchot]

Hello there, I think iapr has said it right, just would like to add, that you should give it sometime, or maybe try to find people directly and not into clubs, since they're an easy stage for the situations that you really don't like, when you're only with a couple it's easier to handle and to keep it in control to say so.
Also you should talk it with your wife, there's not worse mistake in swinging that lack of communication, if you stop telling her things or she does, it doesn't get any better, tell her how you feel and she should support you, so you won't feel left out. I'm sure you both can work it out. Take care

Carlos

[TheDeal]

Thanks Carlos! I have and do keep my wife well informed. She try's and understands as best she can, but she has always been beautiful and sought after. If you ain't been on the other side you can't know exactly how it feels. Ha, it's not that I am ugly by any means! I am just not 6' and hung like a horse while looking like a GQ model. I realize not that many are, but if you want women to break the traditional passive role and come up to talk to you... The thing that does have me quite peeved, is I am the one who is a little on the nervous side about all this. I am the one who has not had many sexual partners. If the situation were reversed then ipar's rules more than apply and are totally appropriate. As cool as most of the people in the LS are, you would think there would be more care for anyone who needed attention or to be reassured, not just the new girls.

[iapr]

Actually I should not have painted such a bleak or one sided picture, there is always hope. Very often the club scene can and does leave normal decent guys in the dust (been there done that). Unless you are a male model looking rock star professional athlete who is a movie star on the side, the chicks aren't going to come up and cater to you in a club very often simply because they don't have to. They have plenty of male wolves and other chicks hitting on them to keep them busy. Your options are either grow fur and fangs or change venues.

What was said earlier about getting together one on one with other couples outside of the club envirnment is good advice and can be quite a bit more equal footing although still not truly equal. There are actually a lot of people who do not do the club scene at all for a wide variety of reasons and there is someone out there that would enjoy your company and make you feel appreciated. You just have to put in some leg work, sort through a lot of profiles, send out a lot of messages and be prepared for some rejections, nonreturned emails and some no-shows but there are some real flesh and blood couples out there that are in the same boat your are and would enjoy your company.

Here's a little hint, when you are scanning profiles, the higher the emphasis that a couple places on girl/girl play be it through the written profile or in the profile pics, the higher the chances that she/they are more interested in getting a woman into the mix than actual couple to couple interaction.

[spectraschain]

She try's and understands as best she can, but she has always been beautiful and sought after. If you ain't been on the other side you can't know exactly how it feels.

Spectra has always been sought after as well....difference being, we consider this a team sport.
She never makes a move without considering my wants and needs, nor would I make a move without considering hers....
I dunno, this entire board seems to deal with issues that we've seldom encountered. Insecurity seems to run amuck here. We truly believe that if you're encountering the issues we've viewed in one day on this forum, you really need to reconsider your participation in the lifestyle.
The "lifestyle" is a pursuit born of mutual interest. Nothing more.
The amount of trust and admiration you have for your partner and your partner for you will usually preclude any "rules were broken/she went too far/ what have I done/I'm upset/I'm not gettin' mine" issues...really people, this is a fun pursuit...
Deal, I feel for ya, but I really can't relate. In our world, with our partners, nothing is gender specific. If in fact it was, we would not hesitate to take our leave...this entire "lifestyle" wardrobe should feel as comfortable as your favorite jeans...if it doesn't, well, there are many other things you and your partner can do....don't let this (or anything else) become consuming.
And before anyone asks "then why are you here?"...We were simply trying to resolve an issue with another site....

[Chicup]

Just to get this straight, you are a man who wants to be treated like a woman, by women, who would be acting like men?

You are correct in that swinging is 'ruled' by the women, but it is with the consent of the men. Women are the picky ones of the species, they are the ones who invest the most into sex (child) and even if you take the child possibility out of it, it only changes the dynamic slightly, our evolution does not understand contraceptives.

I'd love to be able to just sit there looking pretty and have beautiful women come hit on me, try to make me laugh, tell me how good looking I am, and do the things men do to women to get into their pants, but I can count those experiances on one hand. I'm an average guy myself and while I won't chase them away with my visage, they won't be throwing their panties at me either, I gotta work for it.

I'd say your problem is how you view it. Its not worship. I do not worship women, I am not their servant. Be a bit more forward, take charge, let them know what you want, if they want it to fine, if not, move on.

Another thing is we only play as a couple. If the other wife dosen't do it for me, my wife won't lead the husband on, and the same applies if she isn't attracted to the man. Same applies if its apparent the other wife isn't into me.

This might mean we take longer to find couples, or that we go home without playing, but thats how it works best for us.

[spectraschain]

Another thing is we only play as a couple. If the other wife dosen't do it for me, my wife won't lead the husband on, and the same applies if she isn't attracted to the man. Same applies if its apparent the other wife isn't into me.

Exactly. Very well put.

[TheDeal]

I guess I can clear up some confusion by saying ipar's suggestion of doing the couple date thing is something I have found MUCH more satisfying than the clubs or parties. What I was talking about in the original post was something that happened at a party. I will not attend anymore of them and that sucks. It's not that I mind having to be the one who must go and pursue or make conversation. Hell, I am more than outgoing and you usually have o tell me to shut up, lol. I just don't like that I can't really be with my partner cause every "wolves" or alpha male and dang even a bunch of females won't let me forget how gorgeous my wife is. It makes me feel like I am just a hindrance to them having her. All things being equal, I could go and have a good time if I didn't have to deal with that display. I know there are couples out there who are mismatched in levels of social attraction. I'm sure the women and men who have partners that are very attractive have the same issues. When I first met my wife, it took me a while to deal with her being so attractive. I know, it sounds stupid, but I would prefer to be with someone that was more on my level. Too late now as I love her more than life, and we have been together forever. Just had no idea the lifestyle would hit any possible insecurity I ever had.

[TheDeal]

"Just had no idea the lifestyle would hit any possible insecurity I ever had." As well as make sure I would have to wait for any fun for me, not to mention watch my partner get all the offers and attention.

OK, I AM DONE WHINING!

Thank you all for your replys!

[flkeyscouple]

Originally Posted by spectraschain

I dunno, this entire board seems to deal with issues that we've seldom encountered. Insecurity seems to run amuck here. We truly believe that if you're encountering the issues we've viewed in one day on this forum, you really need to reconsider your participation in the lifestyle.

I have to say, spectraschain, that you have joined this board at a time when there are many threads and posts that are like you've stated - drama/issues. I said earlier today that anyone joining the board at this time would wonder if they should even TRY the lifestyle! Lots of drama being talked about.

I agree with you. We haven't seen even a tiny percentage of the drama that has been brought up lately. Knock on wood!!

Stay around, spectraschain, it's not always this way. But that's why the board is here. Anyone with ANY lifestyle related problem (and many non-lifestyle related) can ask it here. And anyone can relate ANY information about the lifestyle. It's a GREAT place for exchange!!

Sarah

[OnHArry]

My two cents worth. I used to be much like you and sort of hang back and watch while my mate was hit on by most of the guys in the room. I am average looking but certainly not outstanding.

A couple we swung with were both high on eveyone's list as she was openly and overtly bi and he was hung like the proverbial horse. His advice to me was just say hello to anyone that catchs your eye, and go from there. I found it actually worked quite well just say hello, ifthey are not interested be polite and move on. Basically what you have to do is either fish or cut bait

[SW_PA_Couple]

Originally Posted by OnHArry

His advice to me was just say hello to anyone that catchs your eye, and go from there. I found it actually worked quite well just say hello, if they are not interested be polite and move on. Basically what you have to do is either fish or cut bait

I can confirm that his is the way to operate. We attended a private party just last weekend. I spotted a woman who appeared to be thirty years younger. But I was thinking, "just me type". This is not bragging but to my complete surprise she really warmed up to me. I eventually discovered she was thirty-five years younger -- boy, did that tickled this old man's ego. Also to my surprise, J encourages this behaviour on my part. I should give her more credit.

M

[Larry & Michell]

Chicup said:

Another thing is we only play as a couple. If the other wife dosen't do it for me, my wife won't lead the husband on, and the same applies if she isn't attracted to the man. Same applies if its apparent the other wife isn't into me.

Ditto