Looking for 'friends'?

[2jersey]

We read a lot of online profiles, and it seems that many include some sort of reference to ‘friendship’. Typical examples include: “we are looking for new friends” - “seeking friends with benefits” - and the ever popular “friendship first, and let’s see what develops”.

We must admit, we’re into swinging for the sexual adventure, and developing true friendships is low on our agenda. On the other hand, we screen couples for compatibility by considering whether they have the personal qualities which are consistent with the attributes of our vanilla friends.

To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

In our profile we state: “ 'Friendship first' is a very nice sentiment, but it doesn't reflect our approach to swinging. We seek compatibility and comfort first, sexual activity next - and friendship may develop over time.”

Perhaps most people who say they are seeking friendship have views which are similar to ours, but they are less literal in their use of the word ‘friend’? Maybe we are scaring away some high quality people by including the aforementioned friendship reference in our profile? Perhaps we are being hypocritical by including friendship qualities in our screening criteria, while denouncing the idea that we might develop immediate and lasting friendships? Maybe it’s just a slow day and we have nothing particularly important on our minds?

[djjwp]

We want to really know someone before we play. If a couple can not devote some time to getting to know us and us them, they do not get our time at all. It's too precious.

We can always have sex but to find people that we can relate with and be open with is what we are after. The sex is just the whipped cream on top.

[dallmax1]

Could the friendship reference mean that they don't have sex on the first date? When trying to find a couple to meet there were a few who said "we'll be at this hotel, meet us in the bar and then we'll hit the room." Right now, and I imagine in the future, we want to meet see if there is a connection and then setup another meeting before anything will happen. So perhaps "friendship" reference is just another way of saying we don't play on the first date. The couple we have met are great, we are both comfortable with them. We invited them to a party that we throw for our vanilla friends, I don't think I would want to be with any couple that we couldn't introduce to our friends; but then again we are newbies, so perhaps that will change (I hope it doesn't).

[Chicup]

Originally Posted by 2jersey

We read a lot of online profiles, and it seems that many include some sort of reference to ‘friendship’. Typical examples include: “we are looking for new friends” - “seeking friends with benefits” - and the ever popular “friendship first, and let’s see what develops”.

Anyways I'm SURE at some point we had friends first in our profile. I think its the newbie way to say 'We just don't want this to be about dirty sex!' (lies!) and 'we want to make sure you are 100% safe and not wierdos' (not a lie). With some people who are not ‘ready’ to swing, its an escape to ‘see’ the lifestyle without playing, with others like us when we had it, it sounded good but we still had sex the first ‘date’. For us it’s a red flag on the profile, and if its pared on say Swing Lifestyle with ‘mild/moderate’ we will pass that profile by, on the other hand if they have it and they have ‘wild’ and seem to be ready to play in the profile then we may be interested.

We must admit, we’re into swinging for the sexual adventure, and developing true friendships is low on our agenda. On the other hand, we screen couples for compatibility by considering whether they have the personal qualities which are consistent with the attributes of our vanilla friends.

To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

We are the same way BUT before you say never, you haven’t had your swinger type friends very long. Most of the couples we have been with would fit the above, but we also have a couple that we have been together with for five years now. If the swinging part of our relationship stopped we would most likely still be friends and still do stuff together (depends on why it stopped of course).

In our profile we state: “ 'Friendship first' is a very nice sentiment, but it doesn't reflect our approach to swinging. We seek compatibility and comfort first, sexual activity next - and friendship may develop over time.”

Perhaps most people who say they are seeking friendship have views which are similar to ours, but they are less literal in their use of the word ‘friend’? Maybe we are scaring away some high quality people by including the aforementioned friendship reference in our profile? Perhaps we are being hypocritical by including friendship qualities in our screening criteria, while denouncing the idea that we might develop immediate and lasting friendships? Maybe it’s just a slow day and we have nothing particularly important on our minds?

You are being blunt, direct, and honest, and maybe you are scaring away new couples by seeming to ‘vet’ like. As a newbie couple we shied away from vets who we thought were to ‘into’ swinging. Our approach to the lifestyle is the same as yours, our approach to friendship in it is the same too, and we find the ‘friends first’ to be a bit comical in retrospect, BUT we state it a bit differently. We approach it from the other end, we state (and I’m not sure of the exact wording) that “We don’t expect to be friends first but we are looking for socially compatible people”.

[good times]

Its funny, but the people we have met through swinging that have become good friends we often haven't played with.

We are probably pretty much like you, we have come to realize that what makes someone really great in bed has very little to do with the qualities that make good friends. So, for us, if we become good friends with play partners over time, thats great, but it isn't something we consider when picking playmates.

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by 2jersey

To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

Perhaps most people who say they are seeking friendship have views which are similar to ours, but they are less literal in their use of the word ‘friend’? Maybe we are scaring away some high quality people by including the aforementioned friendship reference in our profile? Perhaps we are being hypocritical by including friendship qualities in our screening criteria, while denouncing the idea that we might develop immediate and lasting friendships? Maybe it’s just a slow day and we have nothing particularly important on our minds?

No, I don't think that most couples who say they want to be friends mean we want to be "fuck buddies". We really are looking for friends. Maybe not BFF-barbecues-every-weekend, how's-your-mama-n-them kind of friends, but the hey-do-you-guys-want-to-go-listen-to-this-new-band-next-weekend kind of friends. We have very close friends who are pregnant right now (well, she's pregnant) and are not playing right now. They still hang out with their swinger friends in totally vanilla ways--going to the movies, to dinner, hanging out at home. I think more people are looking for friends like that. But, I could be way off-base....

Pepper

[cj22s]

We state in our profile that we are looking for friends in and out of the bed room. We mean it. We can't see ourselves having sex with someone who we can't go to the movies with or worse someone who can not intermingled with our vanilla friends (who BTW spend a lot of time at our house.) We are very social people who are new to VA and are out to make new friends. It just so happens that we like to be able sleep with our friends too.

[NandTfromCA]

Like it says in our profile (paraphrased), meeting long term friends is great (and welcomed) but that’s not what we need to get naked.

2Jers- We appreciate the directness of your profile. We agree with Chicup that you may be coming off as “vets” to the newer people but if you change something in your profile to attract one group, you will turn off another. If any of your statements inaccurately reflect what you are about, change them. If the statements do reflect your personalities then either keep them how they are, or keep them but wordsmith them a little.

[WesternSwing]

I think the "friendship first" comment for many is simply a way of being comfortable with the other people. They get to know them well enough to know how their relationship operates and if they might be harmful to their relationship. This is probably mostly a newbie situation since it seems that as experience takes over this does not seem as important.

Another aspect of it is that some of these couples may be more poly then they think at first. We've developed many friends in the poly community in our area because even though we are technically swingers, we are very poly-friendly and have found occasionally that our relationships with others has been more then just a screw on Saturday night. Especially Mrs. WS. She gets more attached to those we swing with then I do. Interestingly enough, we've met several of Mrs. WS's high school friends in the poly community. Who'd of thunk it?

The trick is figuring out which is which.

Mr. WS

[Sweet_Candy]

Originally Posted by 2jersey

We read a lot of online profiles, and it seems that many include some sort of reference to ‘friendship’. Typical examples include: “we are looking for new friends” - “seeking friends with benefits” - and the ever popular “friendship first, and let’s see what develops”.

We must admit, we’re into swinging for the sexual adventure, and developing true friendships is low on our agenda. On the other hand, we screen couples for compatibility by considering whether they have the personal qualities which are consistent with the attributes of our vanilla friends.

To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

In our profile we state: “ 'Friendship first' is a very nice sentiment, but it doesn't reflect our approach to swinging. We seek compatibility and comfort first, sexual activity next - and friendship may develop over time.”

Perhaps most people who say they are seeking friendship have views which are similar to ours, but they are less literal in their use of the word ‘friend’? Maybe we are scaring away some high quality people by including the aforementioned friendship reference in our profile? Perhaps we are being hypocritical by including friendship qualities in our screening criteria, while denouncing the idea that we might develop immediate and lasting friendships? Maybe it’s just a slow day and we have nothing particularly important on our minds?

2jersey, why do you have to live so far away? I copied all of this to a word file; you've put into words our feelings as well about the overuse of the word "friends" in profiles. We take the word literally too. Friends are few and far between acquaintances are many. Hope you don't mind if I use your line in our profile too?

[xxoticangel]

Our profile states something to the effect that we are looking for playmates first and if we become friends thats just ok too. We typically skip the profiles that state "friendship first". Our lives are too busy and hectic to spend a lot of time in the "get to know you" phase. We actually expect to play on the first date unless something goes bad, ie. major lie in their profile or having to get intoxicated first. We want swinging to be about "dirty sex" and see what happens after. Some of our best playmates have been with people that we really don't have anything other than sex in common with and would never cultivate a relationship with in a vanilla setting.

[BiloxiCouple]

Maybe they are trying to equate friendship and sex together. Much like when people are younger they equate sex and love together?

Just a thought.

[havefuninsun]

Originally Posted by 2jersey

We read a lot of online profiles, and it seems that many include some sort of reference to ‘friendship’. Typical examples include: “we are looking for new friends” - “seeking friends with benefits” - and the ever popular “friendship first, and let’s see what develops”.

We must admit, we’re into swinging for the sexual adventure, and developing true friendships is low on our agenda. On the other hand, we screen couples for compatibility by considering whether they have the personal qualities which are consistent with the attributes of our vanilla friends.

To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

In our profile we state: “ 'Friendship first' is a very nice sentiment, but it doesn't reflect our approach to swinging. We seek compatibility and comfort first, sexual activity next - and friendship may develop over time.”

Perhaps most people who say they are seeking friendship have views which are similar to ours, but they are less literal in their use of the word ‘friend’? Maybe we are scaring away some high quality people by including the aforementioned friendship reference in our profile? Perhaps we are being hypocritical by including friendship qualities in our screening criteria, while denouncing the idea that we might develop immediate and lasting friendships? Maybe it’s just a slow day and we have nothing particularly important on our minds?

We think a lot like you do. And it's because, for us anyway, it's easier to keep out all the emotional stuff. Some folks LOVE getting wrapped up in others emotionally; that ain't me. And I have Mr. Fun for all the emotional things I need -- he's awsome, and I don't want to share that.

We met a great couple recently -- I emailed with the wife a lot and we got the ball rolling -- we met for dinner/ drinks/ room, and all was good until I realized we all weren't on the same page as to what we wanted to get out of our individual (or couple) swing relationship(s). She needed the emotional closeness; she wanted to gaze into his eyes, become mesmorized, cuddle with him aftwards -- which caused the green-eyed monster in me to come out. It was a gray area I didn't expect to be in...

I didn't want to look into her husband's eyes, or cuddle, or anything like that. I wanted to get it ON. For us, it's about sex.

Mr. Fun and she chatted a few times, and the last chat made it real obvious to me that they were just looking for something different than we were in their friends. They had been together a lot longer than we have; their relationship is in a different place than ours. Maybe in 10 years we'll be looking for what they are, but not now. For NOW, I'm not sharing anything emotionally -- that to me is sacred grounds.

We have friends who we get together and get it on ... and for me, and Mr. Fun, and the other couple, that is FUN. Nothing emotionally going on. Just the physical stuff.

We want to get to know another couple before we play for SAFETY reasons; not to necessarily establish a life-long friendship. We want to know we're all on the same page as far as taking care of our health, that we "like" each other, and we find each other attractive.

I think it's all in preferences. I still think this couple we met are super people. They're just not compatible playmates "emotionally."

[TeamSoBe]

Originally Posted by BiloxiCouple

Maybe they are trying to equate friendship and sex together. Much like when people are younger they equate sex and love together?

This statement is profound and I think you're right.

When I was younger I saw sex as an expression of the sentiment "I LOVE YOU!!"

After a couple of girlfriends and my wife coming along and introducing me to the concept of guiltlessly fucking your friends, I started to see sex as an expression of the sentiment "I REALLY LIKE YOU!!" At that point I could more clearly see the distinction between fucking and making love.

After swinging for a while I'm starting to see a new concept, guiltlessly fucking strangers. Sex isn't even an expression of "I REALLY LIKE YOU!!" any more. Now it's just "I'M HUNGRY FOR YOU RIGHT AT THIS MOMENT!!" I feel like I'm starting to become illuminated to the concept of sex without friendship or familarity or any of that.

We used to have lots of words in our profile about making friends with people and seeing where it goes from there. I still kind of prefer being a second-date kind of couple but now our feeling is that some of the people who we meet to have sex with might become long-term friends after the sexual relationship has already started. Some others might instead be just sex for one night, and that's okay. We hope to make lots of long-term friends with whom we have a lot of things in common and who are freaky like us but we're not so preoccupied with it as a requirement now.

[Tybee Swing]

Originally Posted by 2jersey

We read a lot of online profiles, and it seems that many include some sort of reference to ‘friendship’. Typical examples include: “we are looking for new friends” - “seeking friends with benefits” - and the ever popular “friendship first, and let’s see what develops”.

....
To illustrate a point: We’re happy when we meet a couple, like them, and have sex with them. If we have multiple encounters with a particular couple, we might develop a mutual fondness and respect. But, to be blunt, if/when the sexual activity has permanently concluded, the relationship is over (thus disproving the notion that we were ever true friends).

In our profile we state: “ 'Friendship first' is a very nice sentiment, but it doesn't reflect our approach to swinging. We seek compatibility and comfort first, sexual activity next - and friendship may develop over time.”

Jerseys, you ask a very good question! The truth is, there are many degrees of how friendly this friendship stuff is. One end of the spectrum is "we already have friends, don't need more - we just want to fuck", and the other end, polyamory - very intermingled emotional relationships.

In our case - we are not a friends first couple, but we do tend to most enjoy eventually cultivating a friendship with other couples that we happen to have sex with. Why we do - there is so much more than fucking when spending time with people. Sometimes, we all have to open up our mouths and talk to each other, and when people connect in a way that they have things in common, can laugh about the same things, and enjoy some of the same kinds of activities together, it can make the whole experience just a whole lot more FUN. Example: we have a few Lifestyle connections now that happen to ride motorcycles, as do we. We could make a sexy event out of going riding together, the women switching riding on the back of the guy's bikes and flirting before we get to a room later, etc. etc. This is just one example of how adding a little more common ground, a shared social activity and more interaction can make the whole swinging thing more fun for people.

For us, having friendships + sex (friends with benefits) is all about having more fun and a better experience. It's definitely not about emotional entanglements for us, any more than we'd have with anybody we socialize with.

If fucking is the only thing we had in common with a couple, there'd be nothing to say or do outside of getting in the room, humping, and leaving. Kind of hit-and-run. For some people (like us), this is just "blech". Not very sexy, not real fun. Know what I mean?

We're in the Lifestyle for fun. To us, sex + friendship = fun. We'll start with the initial connection (like them;comfortable with them), then the sex, and if it's fun, look toward the friendship, too. This is the same pattern that you said you enjoy, also.

I think that "looking for new friends" or "friends with benefits" defines a couple who is like us. It could define a few other types in the broad range somewhat similiar to us, somewhere in the middle between "don't know you, don't care, let's fuck" extreme, and the polyamorist extreme. (Note: we don't have anything against any of these types.)

I think that "friendship first, and then let's see what develops" defines something quite different - a very slow-going couple that will want to have numerous dates before anything sexual happens. They may be newbies. Or, they may be polyamorist types. Or, they may be looking for just that "one special couple" (we've met some like this - they would rather go exclusive with no more than 1-2 couples). The relationship with you is of primary importance to these people. We're not them. We're the latter, in the last paragraph.