Confused about standards in swinging... help!

[dezaray]

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contest, although once I saw what they had to do to win the judges over, I thought, there's NO way in HELL im gonna let 4 men I have never met (and were not attracted to) suck on my tits to win! It really made me question if id be able to do this swinging thing. If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?

-or does it just mean im more discrete?

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

thanks,
Dez

[Chicup]

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

We look for people we are attracted to and at about the same age as us, along with the same outlook on life. Basically the kind of people we could be friends with outside of swinging as well.

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

Why do some non swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone? This type of playing is not our thing, and part of what we screen for in couples.

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

Very, I can get laid anytime I want at home by a hottie.

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contest, although once I saw what they had to do to win the judges over, I thought, there's NO way in HELL im gonna let 4 men I have never met (and were not attracted to) suck on my tits to win! It really made me question if id be able to do this swinging thing. If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?


In our 6 or so years of being in the lifestyle Mrs. Chicup has never been in a wet T-shirt contest and has never let a random stranger suck a tit.


-or does it just mean im more discrete?

Just means its not your thing. Welcome to the club.

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

Mmmm well she has surprised me on who she is attracted to now and then, but not in a huge way. If the guy is an asshole though, he doesn't deserve her

-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

To each there own, if you are not 'comfortable' with her for some reason, there are more fish in the sea.

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

This is the kind of thing you can guide with your actions as much as words.

Let me guess you went to a club recently found no one you were really attracted to and they had a wet t-shirt contest?

[Amanda69]

Wow these multiple question posts are getting difficult I feel like I am being interviewed

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

Standards is an interesting word, we choose our partners by attraction which is not always just physical. We look for comfort and openess. There are no real "standards" per say.

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

Ahh now I get a better understanding of what you are meaning by standards. I agree with the prior poster, there are people both in and out of the lifestyle that will screw anyone. People are all different in every walk of life you can only control what you want for you.

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

For the male very important for the female not as much. (female) I find that the men I am at first physically attracted to I don't often end up sleeping with as their personality has something that turns me off. For me it is more often the guy I think is okay to start with but he has a wow kind of personality that just gets my motor running.

If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?

You only have to be comfortable with what you want to be comfortable with. Swinging isn't about being an exhibitionist or about allowing all sorts of strangers to randomly grab you.

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

Yes I would like to know he has chosen a nice person same with he wants me to be safe and not feel pressured into doing anything I am not ready for.

-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

This all depends on your agreement as a couple. In my relationship my opinion does count, and it is never just between her and my man. Whatever happens always is about us as a couple.

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

Very appropriate

[MoonLightKiss]

Originally Posted by dezaray

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

My standards in choosing playmates is the same as it would be if I was single. Do they take care of themselves and try to present a good foot forward, or are they just too scruffy to be considered clean? Do they carry on their side of a conversation? Are they fun (Out of bed)? Are they considerate, kind, or bitchy and cruel? Do they gossip about people they have been with before or are they discreet? These are just some examples of what I believe to be general standards.

Originally Posted by dezaray

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

There are people like this both in the lifestyle and the vanilla world.

Originally Posted by dezaray

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

I would say chemistry is important for me to play with others. Otherwise it feels like "taking on for the team". As far as physically attractive, it really depends, what I think is attractive, you may not. Its simply personal tastes really.

Originally Posted by dezaray

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contes.... If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?
-or does it just mean im more discrete?

No, it does not mean swinging isn't for you. It only means certain wet-t-shirt contests aren't for you. Every one has there own level of comfort when it comes to swinging. Whether its soft swap, full swap, bi play, or straight, voyeurism or dark rooms. Find your own comfort levels and stick with them.

Originally Posted by dezaray

--are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

It really depends on the situation. As far as physical attraction, we try not to interfere too much. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder after all, but we both retain veto power for other reasons. Gut feelings, people into drama, men & women who are disrespectful, things like that.

Originally Posted by dezaray

--if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

Again, I believe your opinion of her would matter, if its for the right reasons. And yes, even though its between her and your man, you said it best, its YOUR man. And yes you should approve of it, otherwise it shouldnt be done. But letting him choose who to be with is also important. It is after all his choice. But you also have veto power. So feel free to use it if you feel that you should. Nothing worse than regrets later.

Originally Posted by dezaray

--If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

Absolutely. Nothing should be done that you are not wanting to do.

[CuriousInOregon]

LOOKS LIKE YOU GOT SOME GREAT ADVICE also you asked some great questions no need to repeat the answers as my opinion doesnt differ much from the above posts BUT I can say post often and contribute your thoughts we love to see and active member

Curious~

[intuition897]

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?
Moral character
Integrity/Honesty
Sexual Attraction
All three are important to Mr. intuition and I.

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?
Because, IMO, they've allowed swinging to overtake their lives which is not healthy. It really should be done in moderation, as with all things. Just like overindulging in alcohol eventually leads to an increased tolerance level, too much swinging will eventually burn you out (at least in our own experience) and you find you need more and more stimulation to get that same "buzz".
Not healthy.

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?
For us, it is essential. I mean, otherwise what's the friggin' point, right? If you can't get excited about it, why do it?

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contest, although once I saw what they had to do to win the judges over, I thought, there's NO way in HELL im gonna let 4 men I have never met (and were not attracted to) suck on my tits to win! It really made me question if id be able to do this swinging thing. If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?
This just means raunchy public displays are not your thing. They're not mine, either. Would I mind trying out for a wet t-shirt contest or something similar? Sure, I'd do it...but only if I didn't feel like a piece of meat in heels.

-or does it just mean im more discrete?
Just means you're more discriminating, which is seriously more preferable for couples like Mr. intuition and I.

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?
Because we prefer quality over quantity, and do not agree with the quantity over quality approach. Screwing huge numbers of people - some you liked, some you didn't - just for the sake of saying you did it, does absolutely nothing for me. In fact, knowing that a person went about swinging in this manner tells me that they have a careless attitude. Sorry folks, but this is JMHO! It's like glutting one's self on huge amounts of food - some of which you didn't even enjoy eating - and then complaining when you developed some kind of disease. For swingers, this translates to risks of STDs passed on from, possibly, that partner you didn't really like anyway. So in retrospect, would it seem worth it??


-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?
I dunno...do you think your feelings/opinion should matter to your husband? If so, then why should they be considered unimportant when it is something that will directly affect you? And make no mistake, this directly affects you! It might be his penis, but it is your relationship that could be affected by the negative feelings that might arise. If, for example, the other woman he takes a fancy to, makes her disdain for you and her utter lack of respect for your relationship completely obvious...and hubby doesn't put her ass out on the curb...well...I'd say you have every right to be pissed off. If some other man disses Mr. intuition/our relationship in any way, he is OUTTA THERE! No questions, do not pass GO, do not collect $200. NObody disrespects my man, and that feeling goes both ways.

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?
Hey, as long as everyone is cool with it and having fun, do whatever blows your hair back.

[WesternSwing]

Originally Posted by dezaray

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

Our litmus test is whether or not we are attracted to them both physically and most importantly socially. There needs to be chemistry there. Kind of like "would we be friends with these people/this person outside of the lifestyle?" It doesn't mean we have to be, it's just a good indication of whether or not the chemistry is there.

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

Personal preference I guess. Some people will have sex with anybody whether or not they were swingers. Other are more discriminating in and out of the lifestyle. This question could just as easily be asked of vanillas.

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

Very important. Physically is the first attraction, chemistry is the most important. I'd say 40% physically/60% chemistry. There are those I wasn't immediately attracted to that by an hour later I just have to be naked with, and others that I was immediately attracted to that an hour later I can't wait to get away from. Sometimes I've asked myself "why do I want to have sex with this woman, she is hot!". Chemistry is very important to me.

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contest, although once I saw what they had to do to win the judges over, I thought, there's NO way in HELL im gonna let 4 men I have never met (and were not attracted to) suck on my tits to win! It really made me question if id be able to do this swinging thing. If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?

Swinging is so not about that. So not about it. Swinging is what you want it to be. Just because someone else is okay with a certain kind of activity doesn't mean another person should be. I know Mrs. WS wouldn't participate in one either. She's just not that kind.

Once again, you could ask the question "why do some vanilla women participate in wet tee-shirt contests but others don't?" Whether or not you would has nothing to do with whether or not you'd be comfortable getting naked intimately with another person.

-or does it just mean im more discrete?

It just means that getting naked publically isn't for you.

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

I am not totally picky about who Mrs. WS will be with because it's really her choice and she has impeccable taste. Also, sometimes she's really attracted to someone I didn't think she'd be attracted to at all. Although, I have veto'd one or two in the past because they just rubbed me the wrong way for some reason or another and just really creeped me out. She trusts me on this like I trust her about women. Being a man I know how men are and visa-versa with Mrs. WS. Sometimes things are apparent about another man that she doesn't see, and sometimes things are apparent abotu another woman to her that I don't see.

-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

It all depends on why you are playing with her in the first place. Is it because you want some girl/girl time? Or is it because you want to give your husband a FMF and FF play isn't important? If FF play is important to you then it should be a deal breaker and your husband shouldn't pout about it. If it doesn't work for either of you, it doesn't work for both of you.

Once again, not everybody swings the same way, some like FF, others don't. What if the shoe was on the other foot, would your hubby say you can't play with another man if he doesn't get any of him? See how rediculous that sounds?

I think one huge misconception about the lifestyle is that it's all one big orgy and there is all this bisexual play, women and men. It's not the case at all. Although there are many more bisexual women then bisexual men in the lifestyle, bisexual play is not the majority of play. Mrs. WS is bi, but we've played with many couples where the woman wasn't. It didn't matter because it's not all about that.

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

Yes, the key here is that she's bisexual, not lesbian. She's there to have sex with your husband just like you are with hers, the bisexual part is just a part of it and I've never known it to be a deal breaker unless that is all the other couple is after.

Mr. WS

[WonderWhat]

Ummmm.... Let me skip the Q&A format and summarize:

There's no "wrong" or "right" way to swing, just as there is no wrong or right way to scramble an egg, or to have great sex with your SO in your bedroom.

You do what you like and can handle, in concert with your partner, first, and the other people involved, second. Any situation can be talked and negotiated, and must be talked and negotiated. If not, misunderstandings abound, egos are bruised, and Armageddon ensues (well, not Armageddon, but you get my drift).

[Pepper & Drew]

Originally Posted by dezaray

-what are your standards in how you choose playmates?

I don't know if standards is the right word. We look for people we feel comfortable with and are attracted to. Could we have a good time with this couple is what we always ask. If the answer is no, then they don't meet our "standards."

-why do some swingers have NO standards and will screw anyone?

Well, I think it's because their outlook on swinging (or sex in general) is different than a lot of people. I am of the live-and-let-live camp, myself and I don't care why or if they'll screw anyone. It only matters that they aren't screwing me.

-how important is it to be physically attracted/chemistry to someone for play?

We've played with couples that I wasn't initially very attracted to the male, but we had such a good time that the attraction grew. In fact, both couples have become our good friends and we both look forward to playing. Sometimes personality goes a long way....

-I tiny shy part of me wanted to participate in the wet-t-shirt contest, although once I saw what they had to do to win the judges over, I thought, there's NO way in HELL im gonna let 4 men I have never met (and were not attracted to) suck on my tits to win! It really made me question if id be able to do this swinging thing. If you have to be comfortable enough to do that, and im not, so does that mean swinging isnt for me?

-or does it just mean im more discrete?

I've been in wet-Tshirt contests and there's never been tit sucking involved. It means that you were in a dive joint, not anything about your ability to swing or not.

-are you picky about who your partner will be with? If not, why?

I have to like her. I don't necessarily have to be attracted to her, but I have to like her as a person.

-if the women of the couple isnt bi and not interested in playing with me, should my opinion of her matter? since it will be between her and my man. Should I approve of her screwing my man? or let him totaly choose for himself if its a woman i wont play with or vise versa?

Again, as long as he thinks she's hot and I like her as a person, it's fine with me.

-If the woman in the couple is bisexual, and im not attracted to her, but I am attracted to her man, and my partner is into the woman... would it be appropriate to say we'll play but no fem/fem play, only male on female?

Unfortunately there's no regulation on this one in the Swinger Manual. If the other couple is fine with that and you are too, it's great! It depends on whether the other female's main interest is being with other women or not. If it's not, then you're good to go.

thanks,
Dez[/quote]

[dezaray]

Originally Posted by intuition897

[b]
for example, the other woman he takes a fancy to, makes her disdain for you and her utter lack of respect for your relationship completely obvious...and hubby doesn't put her ass out on the curb...well...I'd say you have every right to be pissed off.

That actually happened with our 2nd and last soft swap. It didn't bother me at all that they were sexually charged by each other, she was hot, just not into me, which was fine. What bothered me was (my X-partner and the woman part of the couple) their total lack of respect. All agreed on boundaries beforehand, and once things were moving they both thought they could push the issue and get away with it. Well they didn't! And he heard about it later.

This was one of the many reasons I slowed down with it all, which only made him think I was jealous, and not being truthful about wanting to swing. Once he convinced himself I wouldn't swing with him, he was done with me, regardless of my many efforts and assuring that I DID want to. Alcohol has warped his mind!

I don't want to end up sounding like a whining baby or a basher here... I'm just reallly pissed at him and myself. I made my choices, and some of them weren't very good ones I admit, but I just need some help in understanding some things, and feel it necessary to give some history at certain points in my posts, and replies to them.

BTW, thank God he wasn't my husband! Only a BOYfriend, I hate to even call him that (friend), when he wasn't much of a friend at all these last few weeks.

Thank you all SOOO much!
XOXOXOXOX
Dez

[WesternSwing]

Originally Posted by dezaray

That actually happened with our 2nd and last soft swap. It didn't bother me at all that they were sexually charged by each other, she was hot, just not into me, which was fine. What bothered me was (my X-partner and the woman part of the couple) their total lack of respect. All agreed on boundaries beforehand, and once things were moving they both thought they could push the issue and get away with it. Well they didn't! And he heard about it later.

This was one of the many reasons I slowed down with it all, which only made him think I was jealous, and not being truthful about wanting to swing. Once he convinced himself I wouldn't swing with him, he was done with me, regardless of my many efforts and assuring that I DID want to. Alcohol has warped his mind!

It sounds to me like he was more into the swinging then into you. When you confronted him with these issues you were having he spun the situation around and blamed you for his actions. Manipulative to say the least. You are much, much better without him, dezaray.

Mr. WS

[dezaray]

Originally Posted by WesternSwing

It sounds to me like he was more into the swinging then into you. When you confronted him with these issues you were having he spun the situation around and blamed you for his actions. Manipulative to say the least. You are much, much better without him, dezaray.

Mr. WS

you are exactly correct Mr. WS

lessons learned!
Dez

[sereneiders]

Originally Posted by WesternSwing

It sounds to me like he was more into the swinging then into you. When you confronted him with these issues you were having he spun the situation around and blamed you for his actions. Manipulative to say the least. You are much, much better without him, dezaray.

Mr. WS

Dito

There's an interesting question that brings up from time to time, and it is how solid a couple shoud be before swinging.

From what I saw so far, it seems there are two approaches:

1) A well grounded couple/marriage wanting to enhance their sexuality. They engage in swinging activities but already invested a lot in the current relationship as to know it is more important than the fun.

2) Singles open to the idea, or wanting to swing, looking for a playmate to have fun with and, eventually, develop a grounded relationship.

There's nothing wrong with the second approach. There are considerations that varies from one generation to another, young people today had a less conservative education and a more natural relationship with their sexuality, while older people with a more conservative education may feel more confortable developing a relationship and, later on, be up to swing.

The problem arouses when there's a mix betheen this more natural relationship with the sexuality and the need to feel confortable enough, it's a matter of expectations.

You engage in a relationship expecting your partner to give it more importance than swinging, while you partner does the same giving the swinging more importance than the relationship itself.

In a sense, none of you two can be blamed for your desires. You both failed in communicate each other your expectations (or some of you lied about it). You may fool yourself by believing with some time the guy will fall in love enough as to put the relationsip in the first place, and if you do so, then you cannot blame on him. He may fool himself by believing you'll adapt and give up certain "emotional expectations" as you have fun, and if he does so, then he cannot blame on you because you don't want to swing.

As in ANY couple, the key here is COMMUNICATION.

In the other hand, you may say your partner is a wishfull thinker. At any point of your life someone of you could want to stop swinging for a while (or at all) and, unless he's up to accept it, the relationship will die. But once you know this, to avoid being yourself a wishfull thinker, if you care about the relationship you'll develop with someone who meets you wanting to swing at first, you should have to ask yourself how long it will take for the relationship to settle to the point where by stopping swinging it will survive, and how long are you up to wait for the relationsip to settle.

I am not telling this cannot be achieved, just that it's way more hard to achieve, thus this requires a LOT of communication and planning.

This guy fault would be to break the rules during the gameplay, and this tells you clearly he doesn't have the wood required to achieve the degree of communication and planning required to "engineer" such a relationship.

I don't know how usefull it it to beat the dead horse here, and certainly it would be a mistake to believe that "you aren't good for swinging" or "to build a relationship". But I think it would be usefull for you to identify your mistakes as to avoid them the next time.

Then, my question for you is: why you didn't noticed BEFORE this guy didn't had the wood?

It's hard to believe you didn't had a clue about his attitude, it is likely that you disregarded these clues. The problem would be to learn how to be aware of these clues for the next time.

[WonderWhat]

Originally Posted by sereneiders

Dito
Then, my question for you is: why you didn't noticed BEFORE this guy didn't had the wood?

It's hard to believe you didn't had a clue about his attitude, it is likely that you disregarded these clues. The problem would be to learn how to be aware of these clues for the next time.

As a once-divorced man, I'm painfully aware of how you can miss the clues for a loooong time. We consciously or unconsciously disregard them or think that they'll change.

Glad you noticed before too much happened, dezaray.

[sereneiders]

Originally Posted by WonderWhat

As a once-divorced man, I'm painfully aware of how you can miss the clues for a loooong time. We consciously or unconsciously disregard them or think that they'll change.

Glad you noticed before too much happened, dezaray.

I agree with you. We all trend to look aside to certain things thay may lead to some pain, moreover when one have expectations and a "personal agenda" to build a desired, succesfull relationship.

However, it is different when you engage in a "vanilla" relationship (disregarding the lifestyle) than when you engage in a relationship conditioned by the lifestyle, as hapend to the OP. This conditioning should be limiting, by itself, your expectations. If you develop expectations going beyond these limits as to face a wall, then there's more than a "clue" being ignored, unless your partner misleads you into believe the limits weakened or were shifted, and for sure there were clues about the missleading.

I was asking for all the clues, including the clues for a missleading here, and this may differ from what you have to care about in a "vanilla" relationship.