Why can't we find what we want?

[dutch51]

Ok,before this goes too far..Let me just say this is hubby posting.Not my wife,so please direct all nasty replies my way ok?

Alright,we've only been into the lifestyle for about seven months.And no we don't have jealousy issues,or some problem between us.

My problem lies with the other couples we deal with.There's always some problem between them,or with our personal interaction with them.We've tried everything to get what we want and EVERYONE eventually seems to have some major problem.

What do we want?Very simple.Wife needs to unleash her sexual side without being judged for it,and I just want to be accepted.Accepted enough to get naked with.Accepted enough that I can make a woman happy for an hour or so and feel good about me.Period.

But do we get that?Hell no.Guys approach me with the idea that sucking up to me will help them get in my wife's pants.Any concern for her feelings or what she wants to get out of this?Hell no.

Women come on to me and do I get to enjoy giving them pleasure?Hell no.Someone always gets jealous of what I've done.And strangely enough it's not my wife.

Look I am not so goddamn cute that I'm going to steal your wife,and I have no intention of doing so.On the same hand no one is going to give my wife such a great time that she runs off with them.

As a matter of fact if one of you does something my wife really likes all I ask is that you show me the secret so I can do it for her too.

Some of you may know us.If so I do have a reputation for being sensitive.I've had guys chew my ass for being too sensitive with their wives.What the fuck?Do most of you really want someone who just thinks your wife is a piece of attractive meat with no feelings whatsoever?I thought genuinely liking the person was important because it would make the experiance more fulfilling.Unfortunately it just seems to cause more problems.

If this is the swinging mentality than I gotta bow out.If not,could someone please confirm this for me?Because after the experiances I've had I cannot see a reason to continue this lifestyle.

We are picky.We do like people ht wt and age proportionate.Nothing against anyone else,it's just a personal preferance.If we're going to have sex outside of our marriage we do want it to be with someone we find physically attractive.Benn attacked for our preferance before too so I just thought I'd throw that out there.

What it comes down to is we have not yet met a couple who's relationship equals ours.We are happy with each other.We do need things from other people,things we cannot get from each other.Because at times we are just too close to offer it.Does this make sense to anyone else or are we really alone?

It is not just a piece of ass your dealing with.It is someone's spouse.And if that it all anyone wants to be treated as than we are definitely the wrong type of couple to be in this lifestyle.If all we wanted was to fuck a body,the morgue is filled with them.

Well thanks for listening,I gotta go take my frustrations out on my six-stringed lover.Later A

[Vespertine]

Originally Posted by dutch51

If all we wanted was to fuck a body,the morgue is filled with them.

Ew! (I have a preference for warm bodies.)

I think you share the same frustrations a lot of us have.

Finding compatible couples is difficult at best. There's nothing wrong with having a preference for attractive couples. We are out to enjoy ourselves, and if you only enjoy attractive people- you shouldn't settle for anything less. The idea is to have fun. It can be very disconcerting searching for the perfect couple. But be assured- They ARE out there!

You might want to try to change your approach at finding like-minded couples. Maybe become a little bit more picky so you don't find yourselves coming across the same types of people over and over again. It might mean you play less often but if you're looking for quality and not quanity, it's worth the wait.

There is somebody for everybody.

Patience, Grasshopper.

[Spoomonkey]

Originally Posted by dutch51

It is not just a piece of ass your dealing with.It is someone's spouse.And if that it all anyone wants to be treated as than we are definitely the wrong type of couple to be in this lifestyle.If all we wanted was to fuck a body,the morgue is filled with them.

Well - you are definitely venting...

And I can really sense a lot of frustration. You seem angry and you want to lash out at someone - but keep in mind that the people that you're pissed at aren't here. We're here to help...



Or at least to listen.

This has always been a great place for me to sort out the confusion of the lifestyle. I think, if I read your post correctly, that we are similar to you. We sometimes wonder how we fit in the whole swinger world.

I am not aggressive, like other swinger guys. I don't make up bags of jello shot filled syringes and walk around trying to drunk up and kiss every woman in the place. My wife doesn't strip naked on the dance floor and show her boobs to every guy who smiles at her. We prefer to get into a conversation with people and take things more naturally.

We went to our club Friday and the mix of people made it really tough for us. We left and I was kind of frustrated - even said something in the car on the way home about just giving up on it altogether - not because I didn't "get any"... I didn't (until I got home - YUM!) but that's beside the point. Honestly, there was only one couple that we came close to agreeing on, so it was a "target poor" kind of night.

Oh - we could have gotten laid. I have no doubt. I was hit on a lot that night - and if Mrs Spoomonkey had been a little looser with "the goods" - well, it would have been a piece of cake. But, you know, that's just not us. We like to LIKE people first - and that is tougher to find (but the prize for patience is pretty awesome!)

Anyway - we're picky, too. We are in the lifestyle for us - and we know what turns us on. There is nothing in the world wrong with that. Loosen up a bit and we'd get more action than a summer blockbuster... As it is, we are pretty active, but we are less than we could be because we want a lot from playmates.

Sometimes I wonder if there is room in the lifestyle for a "nice guy". Or - can a lady still be a lady even if she is wearing knee high boots and a leather choker that says, "SLUT"?

Either way, we are confident in what we want and aren't going to let the "lifestyle" spoil that for us. We are willing to wait for people who can sit down and have a deep conversation with us. We are willing to wait for people that we'd love to be friends with. In the meantime, we'll us our club visits as a way to sharpen our pool skills

I do have one question - what is "age proportionate"?

Spoomonkey

[LikeMinds321]

Originally Posted by dutch51

I've had guys chew my ass for being too sensitive with their wives.What the fuck?Do most of you really want someone who just thinks your wife is a piece of attractive meat with no feelings whatsoever?I thought genuinely liking the person was important because it would make the experiance more fulfilling.Unfortunately it just seems to cause more problems.

Maybe the way you express "genuinely liking" these women is the problem. Could it be that you come across interested in them in a way that is off-putting? Maybe your need to be accepted comes through in a show of too much closeness or intimacy for the other couple's comfort.

It might also be that you have not found a way of choosing the right people for you.

You didn't say if you are meeting these couples through swinger clubs or ad sites, if we knew this, it might help us give you better guidance.

I'm curious to know how many couples have you played with thus far?

LM

Mrs naughty and I stopped trying to be friends with couples We swing with. In fact we gave up swinging with couples all together.


We found it to be really too much work, because like you said in your post, someone always has an issue. We spent more time trying to work out issues than swinging. Plus it took away from me being able to veiw what a beautiful Woman Mrs naughty is and to see her in total extacy. Which is my favorite part of this entire lifestyle!!!!

We have couples that we know are swingers, as a matter of fact we hung out with a bunch of them last night. But we do not swing with them. We find their company more enjoyable than "Vanilla" friends because we can be who we are without having to worry about saying or doing something we shouldn't have.

Bottom line for us,
Swinger couples make good friends as long as we keep it at that level.

Give us a single male who is up for one night of HOT SEX and it is a Mrs Naughty Sandwich until dawn!! facelick

[EternallySingle]

whoooooo

There are so many things I can relate to, but I'm only going to choose one tonight.

Some of you may know us.If so I do have a reputation for being sensitive.I've had guys chew my ass for being too sensitive with their wives.What the fuck?Do most of you really want someone who just thinks your wife is a piece of attractive meat with no feelings whatsoever?I thought genuinely liking the person was important because it would make the experiance more fulfilling.Unfortunately it just seems to cause more problems.

This actually causes problems for a lot of singles, men and women. Why? It sounds like you are saying you try to build some kind of rapport apart from a sexual one with the people you meet. The problem is a lot of spouses, even those not involved in swinging, can overlook, or at least forgive, having sex with someone in the heat of the moment. To some, however, becoming friends with someone you've had sex with sounds too much like what happened when one person fell in love with the other spouse. You APPEAR to have an ulterior motive. You only have two choices when it comes to this part of your frustrations with swingers.

One, never EVER talk to the wife of a couple alone. For some husbands thats a big red flag and will cause more jealousy issues than her letting you squeeze her butt while you kiss her. They are there to have sex with someone they are compatible with. They got to know as much as they needed to know to feel comfortable while both couples were talking, so why should you want one on one time with his wife? Well, from what you wrote, thats what the other men are feeling. When I was with my last girlfriend and swing partner, I felt that from both sides. There were couples that actually took her aside and said I was just using her to get into "their" club. But I was single and dating, so I expect a woman's friends, even in the vanilla world, to say things like that. Guess what a husband might think when his wife is being chatted up behind his back? Don't do it, and you will have fewer problems. Thats just you being you, but sometimes you have to censor yourself in certain social situations, or remove yourself from those situations if you feel you are betraying yourself.

Two, (and you single men who complain about the women you want not responding favorably should pay attention as well), make the move toward sex as soon as she seems willing. We are all here for sex. Friendships are a bonus for some and a neccessity for others. However, not everyone wants to be friends first. Some people are even turned off at the idea of being friends, so as soon as sex is an option, make a move and let her say "NO". Don't assume that she will because you don't know enough about her. Thats what the initial meetings are for. If its a club or house party setting, prolonged talking will, again, be seen as you trying to steal someone away, not you being caring and sensitive.


Shoot. I wrote too much, again, but this post reminds me of a talk I had with some boys earlier today. Don't worry, they are all over 16, but they are too smart and sensitive for most of the girls they find attractive. Its just funny to have to say the same thing to adults.

At least we know you are not a troll

[dutch51]

Ok let me clarify(dopey me never giving enough information.lol)

The term attractive only means what we find attractive.It was not meant to imply others are not attractive.We have just dealt time and again with people who are offended merely because we will not fuck them.They do not appeal to us.I'm sure they appeal to someone,just not us.But no matter how polite you are about these things people always take offense.

As for what "age proportionate" meant,let's just say if you remember Eisenhower,and voted for Kennedy,your probably not what we look for.On the other hand,if you think Wings was Paul Mccartney's first band you are definitely not our type either.

As for likeminds comment.Whew good going guys.Your making me give WWAAYYYYY more detail than I orginally wanted to.But you asked so here you go.

We have met couples on the internet.It never goes well.We get cancelled on at the last minute.Or only get to talk to one spouse in chat...ect.ect.

Occasionally we would meet someone.But that is where we found out that I can't just fuck someone I barely know.I don't know maybe I just am too used to fucking someone I care about after all these years.But I have to at least know you well enough to have an idea how to please you before I do anything with you.

The incident which led to my posting happened this weekend.And it involved a couple we first met in a club. We have known them about 6 months.

We got along quite well at first.Than we had a disagreement.After which I was accused of ONLY wanting to fuck the guy's wife.

Than the next time we all get together I couldn't fuck her.Too many things bothered me,I never want to make anyone feel like all they are is a fuck toy for me to cumm in.So we got naked and talked.Yes I said just talked.

While wifey is banging away with someone she genuinely enjoyed being with,we are talking.Which should be a good thing I thought.Reassuring them they are respected as a person,yadda yadda yadda.

But instead the next time we get together I get told by him that she's offended because we didn't fuck.Funny she didn't look disappointed when we left but anyway...

Than I get told I'm too sensitive and a pussy and by the end of all this the guy is swinging a chair at me(no I am not kidding.)

So look I'm not perfect.And really I would be the first to admit anything I've done wrong.Hey I have really bad gas ok?There I admitted something embarrassing.

We've swapped with four couples so far,and these two got in the closest.I was blindsided by his behavior.And really no one here deserves to deal with it.But thanks for listening.
A.

[Handyman69]

We totally understand what you are dealing with (by the the way..female half here). We have met many couples...and yes issues have been seen (not on our side as yourself). One of the first was the hardest to understand..we all like each other...actually would have been close friends if not for the sexual issues. Have looked back at it many times, still don't know what happened but we got blind sided bad.

To be perfectly honest...we do have friends but meets usually mean that we are going to lead to sex. We don't look as deep any more..meaning we look for attraction and also compatability but we know we may never have family grill parties (I hope you understand that). We also now look more for people that have been in the lifestyle awhile...most of the time we don't find the hang-ups.

I wish I could tell the answers...humans are humans...fickle as ever..but there are couples who are on your wave-length, finding them is the problem.
Your choice to stay with it or not......can have a lot of fun but there are pitfalls every so often

Rhonda

[Greg & Sheryl]

Wow! All we can say is that you ran up against a seriously dysfunctional couple! Vespertine described it best when she said that finding compatible couples is difficult at best. Don't let a few crazy couples drive you away. The longer you stay in the lifestyle, the better you will become at picking couples who are ideal for you. You will also become better at recognizing signals which may indicate that the husband is the type who might swing a chair at you. Hang in there!

[corkwan]

just a small comment: if you can't get everyone to say hello on the phone, then don't bother meeting them. chances are it is lopsided desire on the part of one person (usually the man), and the chance of being stood up is pretty much guaranteed.

sounds to me like you'd like more of a raport with the couple. emails can be good, as long as you're sure everyone is reading them. also, letting them know that you'd like to be friends as well as sex partners can help.

...in short, be explict about what you want, from sex to social, etc. there are plenty out there, but finding the right ones for you is tricky. think about it statistically, you're more likely to meet couples who like to meet for anonymous sex (who are sleeping with as many as they can) than a couple who want to build up a relationship (since they are busy building relationships).

[D_and_K]

Mrs. D here,

The Mr. and I belong to a swingers site, and I notice that there are couples who want to have a relationship in and out of bed. So don't give up! There is a couple out there for you.

On a personal level, we've become friends with people who swing. Hang in there!

Mrs. D

[northindycpl]

Originally Posted by dutch51

We are picky.We do like people ht wt and age proportionate.

We seek out the same, and it is definately a challenge. There are a lot of couples that are too young, too old, or too young/old combined. And then there is trying to find the couples that have similar 'life' characteristics with.... Like do they kids, do they also work, what kind of music do they like, etc... It is a difficult task. Mr. Indy and I decided a long time ago that we would have patience. We are worth the wait

Originally Posted by dutch51

What it comes down to is we have not yet met a couple who's relationship equals ours.We are happy with each other.We do need things from other people,things we cannot get from each other.Because at times we are just too close to offer it.Does this make sense to anyone else or are we really alone?

I am not sure what other things you need from other people that you do not have with your wife? But regardless, I think you are correct in focusing on exactly what you want, and going for it. IMHO, again, there shouldn't be compromising done in swinging, especially if you are reaching compromises with yourself.

Something I have noticed (now others may disagreee) Is with couples married for less than about 8 years, there seems to be conflict-always. We have yet to meet a couple that is under 8 years married and is on the same page as we are. In fact, it is so important to us, length of marriage is one of our first 'interview' questions. It also seems important to us to find those who have swinging experience, just because we have found it a lot less stressful. We are somewhat new...er, but have found that those married for a length of time and have been swinging regularly for a period of time, have it together.

At our club, we have seen husbands get jealous,couples argue, all kinds of Drama, and we try to avoid it!

I think you ae right to vent... and we also get frustrated too. We just remember that we are going to have patience looking for the right couple, in comparrison it took Mr. Indy and I a long time to get to the point that we are at. What is a year looking for the right couple? And it doesn't mean that we can't test the waters along the way.

[ALilOEverything]

That seems so weird to me to have the husband's get so upset like that. So far we haven't had any experiences like that to relate to. Our experiences have been very enjoyable and drama free. We haven't sensed any obvious jealousies between the couples we've met. With all the couples we find the better we communicate the better experience we have. We try to feel out the other couples to feel how possessive they are with one another and if they appear to have those kinds of issues we don't even consider playing with them at all.

We've talked to a ton of couples to find the right ones who we are really compatible and comfortable with. We have found the more comfortable they are with sharing their insights with swinging, the more insight they have into their thoughts and feelings with it, the better of an experience we have with them.

[dutch51]

I am not sure what other things you need from other people that you do not have with your wife? But regardless, I think you are correct in focusing on exactly what you want, and going for it. IMHO, again, there shouldn't be compromising done in swinging, especially if you are reaching compromises with yourself.

Hello, wifey chiming in for a moment here....

I'll try to explain the comment. We're not looking to find something that the other one of us doesn't offer the other, it's more of something that reaffirms what we already have. We already love each other, support each other, think the world of each other. But when someone else comes along and says "hey, you're cute, we like you, you have something to offer the world" or whatever, it makes you feel good, you know? And a willingness to be naked helps, lol. Sure we are in this as a couples activity and for the excitement it brings us, but we don't want to be completely selfish- we'd like to bring some happiness to the other couple too and make them feel good.


We've gotten frustrated because we didn't think our expectations were so high. We're not looking for another couple to "marry" and when we find a couple where everyone seems to click, we are very open and honest about what we want. If someone reads our profile on a site, we state upfront that we want someone we can talk to, socialize with outside of bedroom activities; we make it known we are in this together. We don't meet singles, we don't meet people separately and we've met way more couples than we've swapped with. If things seem alright, we've always been willing to give a couple a chance- talk to them, meet them, see if we click and go from there. The only time we've passed a couple over right away if they showed interest in us is if their "rules" are so different from ours- like if they insist on separate rooms and refuse safe sex or only want one-night stands- that's just out! We do the emails and chats first to exchange information, preferences, etc. and if there are no deal-breakers or red flags, and everyone's still interested, we plan a meet and greet and take things from there. Our profile on an old site stated all this so there were no surprises, and the couples we talked to mostly preferred to do things the same way.

Like Handyman said, we too look for compatibility. We don't expect to have our swinger friends at our family reunions or kids' birthdays, but hey, before going to someone's house or a hotel, what's wrong with getting together to shoot some pool and go out to eat first, right? Sex is not a definite requirement every single time we get together, but it's nice to know it's an option if everyone is in the mood and the opportunity arises. We have done purely social things with swinger friends and we've all had a good time- and the flirting we all did was just icing on the cake

This last couple really caught us by surprise. We'd already established good rapport, all felt comfortable together. We'd always done things as a foursome, but sometimes it'd be the guys talking while the girls danced, or two of us would be talking about some place they both knew about, things like that. It wasn't someone pursuing someone else and ignoring the rest of the couple. Nothing was EVER done behind anyone else's back and anything that did or did not happen was by mutual consent and agreement between the four of us.

Bottom line is we try to be respectful of everyone involved, and want to receive the same thing in return. We're not interested in cheap meaningless sex- that can be found anywhere with or without the swinger lifestyle. Hubby will never make another woman feel like she's nothing more than a place to stick his penis, and I don't want to feel that way either. That's why we seek couples with whom there is compatibility and a friendship beyond "let's swap partners tonight."

Okay, wordy wife is done for now. I've really got to find another outlet for my desire to write... lol

[dutch51]

I'm not really sure if anyone is still reading this thread,but I'll just add one more thing.

Before everyone thinks we are idiots who never look for warning signs,and don't pay close enough attention to the other couple.This last couple we were with own a swing club.Which I'm only mentioning it because it does seem to put all this in a different light.

We did stupidly figure that a couple who own a club must be comfortable enough with the lifestyle to not suddenly have "issues".But they obviously do,at least with me,and THAT is why I needed to vent.

We've been fucked over before.That's really not important.The main point is after having things blow up in our face from a couple that really should have been the last people in the world to have a problem with things,we really feel like our luck sucks.

There now I said too much so me and wifey are even...lol

thanks for listening,now turn off the computer and go have some fun dammit!! A