Helping wife get past her past trauma

[frenchie]

hiya and thanks for the warm welcome.

This is the male half, mid 40's, average looks, but female half thinks I'm a stud. LOL. What they say? Love is blind? LOL

ok I guess you can tell I'm nervous, normal?

I've always been what I considered to be very sexual and passionate, my first wife was a low drive to no drive and it always always felt like I was lacking in love, attention, and starved for sex all the time, move ahead, eventually divorced, met my current wife (online of all places), fell maddly and passionatly toe tickling inlove with her, she's fun, very sexual, passionate, she is always looking for ways to please me and I gobble it up. Gready huh? LOL

I've always had this secret desire to try swinging, just the mental thought is so exciting, I kept my secret to myself during my first marraige due to the fact she had no interest in sex or me.

The beautiful woman I am married to now is so sexual, sensual, passionate, with a mouth that was just made for my &^%$. She is so sexual and would love nothing more but to never get out of bed. LOL.

So considering she is so sexual and loves sex, I told her about my secret desire once while we were dating, and she seemed kind of blasay about it, again considering she is so damn ready at the drop of a pin and now that were officially married, I brought up my secret once more, but more seriously, this time there was nothing blasay with her reaction. She literly became unglued, unhinged, distraught, some pretty serious arguments erupted over my secret, I made a few threats about wanting this, with or without her, (bad thing) but after some time passed, she seemed to be getting more ok with the idea, we began reading whatever we could, we took a few swinger tests (online) we talked about what I wanted, what turned her on, what we could handle, not handle, etc... the more she seemed ok about trying this, the more excited I got at the prospect of sharing this sexual woman.



After some nudging we met several couples, attended a few house parties and a club once, all the above just keeping to ourselves, then after more nudging, we tryed a MMF combo with my wife as the center of attention, everything seemed ok, she was definatly turned on during, the fire inside her was on full tilt, after, her thoughts about the event got the better of her, she began breaking down at work, going to the rest room and crying to the point of having to leave work, we're new to this area and I know she has no one to talk to (female friends she can trust) now sh e feels like she's betrayed me adn our marriage and has informed me that if I still want this, then I have to be ok with what she can offer, which is the bare bones min, no others in a physical form, no touching, etc... all I'm offered is live porn when I want the whole package.

I know about my wifes sexual history, she confided in me from the beginning about being raped at 14 by her brothers freind, the 2 male cousins that molested her as a teenager, how she was never unfaithful to her ex husband who was unfaithful. I am her 3rd real sexual partner (not counting the rape)

I love my wife and want to swing with erh, what can I do to make her get over her feelings of regret, betrayal and grief over what we have done together, I have told her over n over that I don't see what we have done as any form of betrayal, but I can't get that into her head.

I want more then live porn, but I want my wife to be truly ok with what we do and have done.

I'll take all the help and sugjestions I can get.

thanks,
F

[Miss_Piggy]

You have to seriuosly consider what is in your wife's best interest here.

It would seem to me that your wife's past experience will make it very difficult for her to reconcile her attitudes about sex with swinging. I say don't push her at all. Commit to leaving the idea of swinging as a fantasy. If one day she decides that it is something she feels like she can persue with you then you might think of moving forward again.
Pushing her into this will only cause you big problems.

Best of luck to you

~Piggy

[JustAskJulie]

Seems to me that you are being pretty selfish here. You have openly admitted that you got this far by pushing and prodding and you pushed and prodded until your wife litterally broke.

Swinging is not for everyone and from the sounds of it your wife still hasn't dealt with her sexual history.... you are lucky she even enjoys sex with you at this point. More often than not women who have gone through experiences such as your wife have can't deal with sex at all and end up only doing it to please their partner and/or for procreation.

Like Miss_Piggy said, you need to think about what's best for your wife here instead of what's best for you. Put that fantasy back on the back-burner and concentrate on your wife. Concentrate on re-enforcing the bond the two of you share and reminding her how important she is to you and how you would never do anything to purposely hurt her. Your pushing and prodding have obviously already hurt her so why would you continue to push and prod and hurt her more?

[frenchie]

thanks for the reply, from my point of view she appears to hate the idea and then after some nudging she kind of gives me the impression that she's warming up to the idea. But then when we have talked about why swinging doesn't apeal to her I get blasted with the comments that she was brought up to be a "good girl" and how she has always taken great pride in herself that she was never one of those girls that laid down for just anyone and how she equates having sex as that same as making love and that how she firmly believes that the one without the other makes it meaningless to her.

I know she loves me and wants nothing more then to please me and make me happy and I feel she's only partispated in what we have done thus far for just that reason. And to be truthful it did excite me beyond words to have another man pleaseing her with me. She was so hot and excited, so turned on, But in the days that passed after, she was emotionally ruined and totally grief stricken believing that she broke our vows, I just need to find a way for her to get over it and understand that I was there too, and if I don't view our actions as breaking a vow to me then she shouldn't.

I want the whole package, and I feel if I can get her to see things my way (that I'm ok with another man pleaeing her / that we're still being faithful to each other) then maybe shell be more ok with giving it another shot.

thanks,
F.

Originally posted by Miss_Piggy
You have to seriuosly consider what is in your wife's best interest here.

It would seem to me that your wife's past experience will make it very difficult for her to reconcile her attitudes about sex with swinging. I say don't push her at all. Commit to leaving the idea of swinging as a fantasy. If one day she decides that it is something she feels like she can persue with you then you might think of moving forward again.
Pushing her into this will only cause you big problems.

Best of luck to you

~Piggy

[MattMann]

This really isn't the kind of thing you should try to talk her into, especially if she has had traumatic past encounters with unwelcome sexual contact. For her to really enjoy swinging, even if it is with your full blessing, she needs to have the desire to do it herself, otherwise it will not be fulfilling and may even become a trauma that she feels you pushed her into and that would be bad for both of you. You got a good wife the second time around, you should be happy about that and quit while you are ahead.

It sounds to me like swinging is not for her.

She proved she loved you enough to try it for you.

Sounds like it is now your turn to prove you love her enough to not push her into doing it again.

If and when she is ready again she will more than likely bring the issue up to you since she knows how much you enjoy this.

We are also fairly new to this but it was a 100% mutual agreement.

Just my thoughts. I am no expert.

[wrnakedru]

This is waaaay more than an "itsy" problem here - this is huge! My words are going to convey just how HUGE I believe this is.

The fundamental rule for lifestyle activity is that a couple never goes faster than the slowest partner is comfortable about. You have broken that all to heck and gone.

I think her attitude when you first shared the news of your interest was probably because she didn't realize how serious you were about pursuing that interest. She may have thought your interest was because of your prior marriage not being satisfactory to you sexually.

I think her reaction to you bringing up your "secret" again after your marriage was in great deal based on HURT that you would still desire it despite the excellent sexual relationship the two of you have. In your desire to live out your "secret", you have not listened to her reluctance and lack of agreement. You have only heard the thin threads she may have offered in an attempt to not totally disallow a future possibility. You took that as agreement and ran with it, pushing prodding and nudging all the while. As a result you have, at least for now, robbed her of her very essence - - her self esteem.

Yet you still continue to think that if you can just make her believe you that she has not violated your relationship - everything will be fine and you can go full steam ahead.

Do you not realize that there is a very big part of her right now that doesn't respect your opinion or believe you, because when she tried going along with that - it resulted in her present condition?????? head bang

You have some serious fence-mending to do here. And that means all thoughts and all talk of swinging must stop here and now. You must concentrate on repairing the breach of trust you have created with your lady. You must focus on the relationship the two of you have and how important that is to your happiness. [remember what it was like before??] You may have certain fantasies in your mind - but you'd best put those away for quite some time.

Broken trust is a huge problem.

There are men on this board who have had unfulfilled fantasies for MANY YEARS, but it has not made them stop considering their wife to be the most important person in their life. They would not consider for a moment pushing as you have and risk destroying the relationship they share. You could be well served by learning from them.

If living out your "secret fantasy" is so important to you - - that you feel you MUST pursue it, then do this lady a huge favor and cut her loose before you do irreparable damage to her that cannot be mended by the love of one who puts her first - and above himself.

"Itsy" problem, indeed!!

[Alura]

Dito

Wrnakedru has once again hit the nail on the head, in my opinion. Perhaps she used a railroad spike and sledge hammer, but it seemed necessary to me.

Here's my addition:

I'd suggest you memorize the following:

"Sweetheart, I am so sorry for the pressure I've put on you about swinging. I had no right to continue pushing you toward something you don't want. If you will forgive me, I will make it up to you. I promise never to ask again."

If you cannot do that sincerely and without regret, my prediction is that your marriage is doomed.

Mr. Alura

[Buck]

Originally posted by wrnakedru
[B

There are men on this board who have had unfulfilled fantasies for MANY YEARS, but it has not made them stop considering their wife to be the most important person in their life. They would not consider for a moment pushing as you have and risk destroying the relationship they share. You could be well served by learning from them.

[/b]

DITTO to that!

Frenchie you need to ask yourself what's more important to you, fulfilling your fantasies or your relationship with your wife. If it's the former, do her a favor and release her now before more damage is done to her mental state. If it's the latter, then you need to learn to live with your fantasies without expecting her to fulfill them.

It sounds like you two need to run to a competent counselor....fast!

[Brit_Pair]

I'm going to have to Dito Alura's Dito. It appears you're in the position of having to choose one thing or the other: the protection of your marriage, or the realization of your fantasies. I hope you choose wisely.

'Nuff said.

[frenchie]

Well I'm guessing that perhaps in my excitment I didn't really see what my nudging was doing, this has been something I wanted for a very long time and I really thought since she likes sex that this wuold me a great journy for both of us.

Knowing her sexual history and mine, but taking into account that she does enjoy sex, I thought perhaps it wasn't "that" tramatic, or that she had put it behind her.

I'm also guessing that in my excitment I didn't stop to think that she really was just going along with everything to make me happy (as she does with everything else)

I should state that I never forced her, I simply stated my opinion that this was something I have wanted to explore for a very long time and that there is a difference between sex and making love and that I have no trouble separating the two, even if she does.

I've explained my desires and whytp her till I'm blue in the face that having sex would make us more closer and the excitment and fun would only be enhansing the great sex we have, (not replaceing it) It is very difficult now that I've had a taste of my dreams to simply forget they exist.

But when I say, ok fine, we'll just forget about it... and I won't check "those" accounts so often, but then a few days or weeks will pass and then she brings it up and gives me hope.
Like the other day, she said that maybe for my b'day we can go back to the club, (she has stated that she did enjoy going) but that IF we go, the same rules apply, she wants us to keep any and all sexual activity to just us. That if anyone wants to watch us, that's fine, but that's it.

I want to go back to the club,but is she for real, or only offering this to please me, or just stringing me along.

thanks for the replies
F.

[IndyGirl2004]

If your wife is giving you mixed signals here then it will be difficult for you to decipher what she wants. Maybe she's trying so hard to please you that she doesn't have a clue as to how she really feels about any of it. After what happened to her earlier in life (the rape and molestation), maybe she's very confused herself about what she wants. Can you understand that? I sure can. You know your wife better than anyone. She could be serious about wanting to go to the club and just being into softswing, or she might be testing you to see where your allegiance is at this point. Maybe she wants to know if she's more important to you than going to the club. Can you blame her?

Not trying to be tough on you. Just trying to bring out some points to ponder.

Good luck to both of you. I sure hope things work out well for you both

[Rett]

Frenchie, sorry to say that you still seem to be very insistant in your desires and fantasies. After reading your response to the advice given on the board you still seem to imply that what you want is more important than your relationship with your wife.

Please go back and read the advice Wrnakedru gave above and then reread it, and reread it.

I can imagine how your wife feels after hearing your response above. It sounds like you may be putting more pressure on at home than you are relating on the board and use her love and faith in you to get her to do your bidding. How unfortunate!

[Brit_Pair]

Originally posted by frenchie
But when I say, ok fine, we'll just forget about it... and I won't check "those" accounts so often, but then a few days or weeks will pass and then she brings it up and gives me hope.
Like the other day, she said that maybe for my b'day we can go back to the club, (she has stated that she did enjoy going) but that IF we go, the same rules apply, she wants us to keep any and all sexual activity to just us. That if anyone wants to watch us, that's fine, but that's it.

I want to go back to the club,but is she for real, or only offering this to please me, or just stringing me along.

For me, that last bit borders on being contemptible. From what you've told us about her, the last thing your wife would do is string you along. More likely, with you telling her until you're "blue in the face" how important this is to you, she's *still* trying to do her best to please and satisfy you, even when it's something that makes a wreck of her. You should treasure her, rather than think that she's stringing you along.

Take the pressure off her *completely*. Tell her what Alura suggested you say, forget about swinging, and put your relationship back together. And perhaps, in a few years, **she'll** say to you out of the blue and out of genuine desire, "Maybe we could . . . "

[meowkittyhascla]

Hi Frenchie,
Being a victim of rape myself, I understand some of your wife's fears. The first and most important thing that needs to addressed in this situation is getting your wife the help she needs. Find her a rape crisis center, it is never to late to get the help she needs. And. please don't ever pressure or push her into a sexual activity she does not want...in other words you are could be adding to her fears and anxiety, which I hate to say so bluntly but I don't know another way to say it..is a form of rape. If you love and respect your wife, you will give her the help she needs. Good luck to her and you.