Newbies To the Scene

[sunbuckus]

I have been spending hours on this forum site reading about the issues that bothered me the most. Jealousy. Friendship. Body Image. It's been a real eye-opener and re-education. And I love that. That's not to say that we won't struggle with these problems when we get to our first experience but at least my pre-conceived notions have started to unwind and allow myself to view sex, love, jealousy, and etc differently. I just wanted to extend my gratitude for everyone who has posted here and offered their opinion and thoughts that helped me reach this point thus far.

My husband and I have been together for 12 years, 7 of them married. A guy I knew was willing to engage in a MFM with us but my husband was unsure about it. As it turned out, the other guy either changed his mind, chickened out, or harbored feelings and just disappeared. However, the door was opened just a smidge to get my husband intrigued into checking out a swingers club. We went and just stuck by each other and observed. Oh, and made out a lot. I've always been turned out by being watched so we eventually made our ways to a "safe haven" room where couples can play but single men had to be invited to go. They could watch from the door and windows but that was it. It was amazing and I wanted to actually go farther than my husband was comfortable doing so after playing a bit in the room, we headed home to finish where we left off.

We talked and he mentioned that maybe he would feel more at ease if it was just us and another couple in a room. He didn't really like the number of single men at the club and their staring. That prompted me to register at Swing Lifestyle. At first, we thought we might want to get to know the couple, (possibly friendship first) before venturing into the bedroom. However, I have been reading the forum on this topic. My first response was that I needed that emotional connection with another man to want to have sex with him. But the past week, I have been wondering how smart this approach really is. After all, we're trying the swinging lifestyle as a new adventure to try together as a couple. Ever since our experience at the club, I have felt closer and more in love with my husband. I want whatever we experience in the LS to expand on that...not threaten it. Slowly, I am coming to the conclusion that perhaps we have used the "friendship" stance as a safety crutch. We're new to this and we do want to make sure that any couple we play with is not a couple of psychos. However, is it really necessary to have several dates with them to see if we want to engage in same room sex? (That's all we're starting with for now and work up to swapping if we're comfortable with it.)

So, if we take friendship out, then there's the question of attraction. We've had a few emails from other couples but none has really attracted our eye. Are we being too picky? Are we just too conditioned from the media as to what we should find sexy and appealing? After all, we're no lookers ourselves so why should we hold those that we want to play with to higher standards? Do you ever get over that superficial hump of wanting to play with only pretty people?

As for jealousy, I go back and forth on this. When I think about how my husband has an intense case of "the hots" for a woman who is a lot more attractive than me, I know I'm not ready for swinging. But when I think of sex as a recreational pastime and how he is just living out his fantasy, then I'm okay with it. In fact, last night, I was reading about how couples view each other as being irreplaceable and that is very true. No one can take the place of my husband. He has seen me at my worst and best times and still loved me through it all. He is the father of our three beautiful children. When I'm mad or sad, as grumpy or unlovable as I may act toward him, he is still willing to hold me and make me feel cherished. Most of all, we make each other want to be the best for each other. Why wouldn't I want the most important person in my life to experience different sorts of pleasure and happiness that I may not be able to give to him? What better way to strengthen our trust in each other than to share each other with another couple knowing that we will be returning to where our hearts' reside?

Body image. I've struggled (still struggle) with this one. I have never loved the way I looked. When puberty hit, I gained weight like it was no one's business. In 4th grade, a friend of mine pointed out stretch marks on my legs and asked if I had ever been fat before because her mom had them too. (At the time, I was tall and skinny still.) Well, now I have stretch marks on my arms, tummy, and legs. Throughout high school and college, I was medically considered obese for my height and weight. After my husband and I had our first daughter, I consistently stayed the same weight of 215. Then I saw myself in a company Christmas party picture and I was shocked. I thought that all the walking and being on my feet would help me look better. It didn't. I started exercising and restricting my diet and lost 30 pounds before I became pregnant with our 2nd child. So, for the past 4 years, my weight has fluctuated due to pregnancy weight and weight loss. Besides the stretch marks, I have loose, saggy skin, varicose veins, and an almost non-existent bust. Getting past the "friendship" and jealousy issues, body image is one I'm not sure I can get past. How can I become comfortable enough about my own body to let someone other than my husband see and "enjoy"?

[Edison Carter]

Susan here-- Yours is a common question on body image and what I've found is that there are all types of bodies in the Swinging world. Other than that, I think you need to keep researching and talking because from what you've said so far, you do not appear ready for this. On the other hand, if you just want to go to a club and fuck, keep doing it.

[SW_PA_Couple]

All I can say is that my wife and I put the "friends first" idea away very quickly. Nothing wrong with doing "try-outs". People come into our lives that way; some stay, some go away. It is very satisfying, however, when people with whom we share intimacies become friends in the true sense. The sex is, in almost every case, fun. Go for it.


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[sandy_paws]

Thank you for sharing. We are also brand new, and have not had any experiences yet. I just wanted you to know that you are not alone. I read your post, and just nodded my head... Thank you for putting all my thoughts into words so well!

[sunbuckus]

Originally Posted by Edison Carter

Susan here-- Yours is a common question on body image and what I've found is that there are all types of bodies in the Swinging world. Other than that, I think you need to keep researching and talking because from what you've said so far, you do not appear ready for this. On the other hand, if you just want to go to a club and fuck, keep doing it.

Susan, we know we're definitely not ready for any swapping yet but I see no problem in having same room sex with no touching. But from what I've seen/read, no one can truly be ready to take that first plunge...just like having a child. You can research and over-analyze all you want but it won't prepare you for the real deal and all it's complexities. Once you go in, then you'll know how it is and get in the nitty gritty details of whether it's for you and your spouse (swinging...can't really do anything once you have a child).

But like I said, I know we're not ready so we aren't going to swap any time soon. Just here to read, learn, and see if we will jump in.

[sunbuckus]

Thank you, SW_PA_Couple and sandy_paws for your comments. Just wanted to share my thoughts thus far for other newbies.

[occ]

we are pretty new to this too. Twicw so far with the same couple. We haven`t tried a club yet. I had less problem with jealousy than Mr Occ. The first time he was clearly bothered by all the kissing I did with the other husband. Then again when he first penetrated me. He admitted that it was a little strange for him to be jealous since his cock was buried in the wife at the time.

in terms of body image, I am just average and in my early 50`s so things don`t hold up as well as they used to. the other wife was pretty but also average but she was a lot younger sp very firm. . Mr Occ is in good shape. the other husband was average, maybe a little overweight. Average in cock size but oh could he fuck. He was amazing and gave wonderful head. So I was happy even thopugh none of us were model quality.

the couple we played with were strangers we met at a party. I`m not sure I could do it with friends

Have fun. Just enjoy the experience.

[two4youinswva]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts about where you're at right now. You two appear to be thinking it through quite well and are taking this seriously. Good for you.

Keep talking with each other, reading the board, and have fun as you explore this possibility. You'll find your comfort level, and it will probably change as you go along.

Whether you end up deciding to swing, or just pass on the idea, you will almost assuredly improve your relationship just from the increased communication and openness a subject like this can bring.

Good luck as you explore, and continue to share your thoughts!

[sunbuckus]

Originally Posted by occ

we are pretty new to this too. Twicw so far with the same couple. We haven`t tried a club yet. I had less problem with jealousy than Mr Occ. The first time he was clearly bothered by all the kissing I did with the other husband. Then again when he first penetrated me. He admitted that it was a little strange for him to be jealous since his cock was buried in the wife at the time.

in terms of body image, I am just average and in my early 50`s so things don`t hold up as well as they used to. the other wife was pretty but also average but she was a lot younger sp very firm. . Mr Occ is in good shape. the other husband was average, maybe a little overweight. Average in cock size but oh could he fuck. He was amazing and gave wonderful head. So I was happy even thopugh none of us were model quality.

the couple we played with were strangers we met at a party. I`m not sure I could do it with friends

Have fun. Just enjoy the experience.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with us. Part of my body image problem is that I'm only 29 and it just seems like there's this pressure that I should have a "rocking bod" for being so young. I'd hate to have that expectation around me and then that disappointment and rejection from the other couple because of it.

My husband and I were just talking about how we're afraid of being jealous and the other getting jealous if we do swing. Clearly something we need to work on but sometimes you can go in circles because you just don't know until you do it. If we are serious about this, I think we would eventually take the plunge and see how we feel. If it's too much to handle, we can stop the playtime, go home and talk about it. I'm not afraid of doing that. I know we won't lose each other...part of me just wonders if this jealousy/insecurity comes from the culture we live in...that sex should only be connected with love and that each person "belongs" to the other and no one else. Those notions that we grow up with are hard to shake but with continued reading and coming to our own conclusions, I'm certain we will find what is most comfortable for us as a couple.

I hope you have much more fun in your adventures!

[sunbuckus]

Originally Posted by two4youinswva

Thanks for sharing your thoughts about where you're at right now. You two appear to be thinking it through quite well and are taking this seriously. Good for you.

Keep talking with each other, reading the board, and have fun as you explore this possibility. You'll find your comfort level, and it will probably change as you go along.

Whether you end up deciding to swing, or just pass on the idea, you will almost assuredly improve your relationship just from the increased communication and openness a subject like this can bring.

Good luck as you explore, and continue to share your thoughts!

Thank you, two4youinswva! I definitely hope we're going about it the right way. I know this is the swingers board but this is kind of like deja vu for me where I did a lot of reading and researching in regards to strategically defaulting (please, don't flame me!) before coming around to my husband's decision.

I can already tell you that our relationship has improved just by having that special experience as a couple and having something different to talk about. And let's not forget the added sex drive I'm going through!

[sunbuckus]

I think that we just need to jump in and see how it goes and if it goes badly then stop. We won't know for sure how we feel until we're doing it (literally). We can go around in circles and talk and talk and talk but that's nothing like getting out there and doing it.

Our plan is to try going to some parties and if we feel up to it give a show to everyone else and maybe do some same-room playtime and just keep expanding our minds to the possibilities that are available.

I know Mrs. Sunbuckus is interested in trying different men, and multiple men at one time. While I fantasize sometimes about having her be a submissive slut while men take turns banging her, I'm not sure the reality would exactly match the fantasy.

So, we'll take it as it comes along as long as we both come home together.

[weifensi]

sunbuckus,
we're a couple both 37 with kids and as u curious about swinging. we haven't tried it out yet so I can't give any advice on that. but u certainly mention some points which go throuh our heads too.
we started talking about swinging about 2 months ago and I can definitely say that our way of communication has deepened and got more open. we could always talk very well with each other but the topic of swinging has added depth into it.
we both feel very comfortable in our relationship with each other and my wife is my best friend in life. we feel very happy to have each other on the journey of life.
the topic of jealousy is something we discussed as well. like a lot of men I've fantasised about my wife with another guy. now that we talked about swinging I definitely want to take it slow as I realised that I'm actually jealous. you are asking an interesting question, where does the jealousy come from. I've though a lot about it and I'm far from over it yet. For me it's definitely an aspect of insecurity. I know that my wife will stay with me because she loves me and wants to spend the rest of her life with me. nevertheless, If I imagine her with another guy now, I wonder how I would react when she gets really into it. There's this feeling of being in competition with the other guy. difficult to explain but at the moment I would definitely feel the need to compare myself to the guy (did he make her come harder etc., u get the picture).

The other point u are highlighting is the separation of love & sex. something where my wife is defnitely ahead of me. she was always very closed about her past experiences but as part of our talking she came out that in her early twenties she regularly had one night stands. whereas I tried one night stands two or three times but it never really worked for me. Logically it makes sense that sex is not love but there's definitely the way I was raised that u have sex only with the one u love etc.

hope I did not take over yr thread. just wanted to put some of my/our thoughts on here.

[sunbuckus]

Originally Posted by weifensi

sunbuckus,
we're a couple both 37 with kids and as u curious about swinging. we haven't tried it out yet so I can't give any advice on that. but u certainly mention some points which go throuh our heads too.
we started talking about swinging about 2 months ago and I can definitely say that our way of communication has deepened and got more open. we could always talk very well with each other but the topic of swinging has added depth into it.
we both feel very comfortable in our relationship with each other and my wife is my best friend in life. we feel very happy to have each other on the journey of life.
the topic of jealousy is something we discussed as well. like a lot of men I've fantasised about my wife with another guy. now that we talked about swinging I definitely want to take it slow as I realised that I'm actually jealous. you are asking an interesting question, where does the jealousy come from. I've though a lot about it and I'm far from over it yet. For me it's definitely an aspect of insecurity. I know that my wife will stay with me because she loves me and wants to spend the rest of her life with me. nevertheless, If I imagine her with another guy now, I wonder how I would react when she gets really into it. There's this feeling of being in competition with the other guy. difficult to explain but at the moment I would definitely feel the need to compare myself to the guy (did he make her come harder etc., u get the picture).

The other point u are highlighting is the separation of love & sex. something where my wife is defnitely ahead of me. she was always very closed about her past experiences but as part of our talking she came out that in her early twenties she regularly had one night stands. whereas I tried one night stands two or three times but it never really worked for me. Logically it makes sense that sex is not love but there's definitely the way I was raised that u have sex only with the one u love etc.

hope I did not take over yr thread. just wanted to put some of my/our thoughts on here.

Hi, weifensi! Don't worry about taking over any one's thread. We're all here to figure things out and help each other.

Mr. Sunbuckus and I have definitely become closer just by talking about swinging and our fears and thoughts about it. So whether or not anything happens, I think it's a good thing to have at least come from that aspect of "swinging."

I think there are many facets to jealousy. One is definitely insecurity. We're insecure that the other person will leave us. Or that we're not enough for the person we love so they have to be with someone else. We're either insecure about how our spouse feels and thinks (which is why talking is so important) or we're insecure about ourselves (which is where competition and comparisons can come from). Two, I think jealousy can also come from that illusion of possession. By getting married, we feel like we "own" each other. My spouse is just for me and me alone. I will not share them, etc. However, it goes against the grain of individualism, I feel. They are their own person. If we get into possession, we then get the idea that we can control them. And that's not love. We love them as an individual. We shouldn't want to control what makes them happy or how they feel. We love them, support them, and choose them to be the companion on our journey through life. And they choose us. We should be willing and able to share many experiences together and grow as a couple through them.

As for love and sex, I'm still trying to uncondition myself that sex equals love. In the culture we live in, we are taught that sex should only be done with those we love...which might play into the part of why so many newbies request to be friends first before playing together. They want that emotional attachment to reinforce that sex is love. However, as some one else pointed out on this forum (I forgot where), he gradually moved away from sex is love to sex meaning, "I really like you," to "I like you," to "I think you're attractive" to "Let's just have some fun!" Right now, I still view sex as being an intimate act between two (or more people).

But love is deeper than sex. If my husband couldn't have sex with me anymore due to libido or an accident involving his lower half, I would still love him. Just because I can't have sex with him doesn't mean I don't love him anymore. I would still stay with him and continue our life together. We also show our love for each other in different ways besides sex by presenting them with little surprises or even just doing mundane things like putting away clean dishes because you know they don't like doing it. We also show our love by supporting them in their decisions or when they are not feeling like themselves. Sure, sex can be used as a way to show our love but we also know that people can use sex as a way to hurt people. So sex does not always equal love.

Keep up the conversations with your spouse and work things through. Good luck to you!

[bbarnsworth]

Sunbuckus...

I really like your approach to all of this so far. You're not ready to jump into the deep end of the swinging pool yet, but your approach is great. I think you're doing wonderfully well.

Body image; I've said this many times here, as it's a very common concern. Our society intensely programs us to believe women must fit into this very narrow definition of what "good looking" is. It's a bunch of rubbish. Women come in all shapes and sizes. You've had three kids. Guess what? Most swingers have had kids too. You look around Swing Lifestyle and you'll see most women do not fit the prototypical "perfect" airbrushed cover of Cosmopolitan image. I read something recently that ~50 years ago, the average model weight 8% less than the average woman. Now it's up to 23%. Gah.

You shouldn't let body image get in your way. Whether you are 500 lbs or 95 lbs dripping wet, some men will find you attractive and some won't. You can't change that. All you can do is put your best foot forward. If a given couple or single man is not attracted to the two of you or you, then they saved you the time of chatting with them, right? On to the next. You ARE an attractive person. Proof; your husband isn't insane, right? He's attracted to you. So many wives refuse to believe what their husbands tell them because "Well if they don't lie, they're in the doghouse!" It's just not true (in the vast majority of cases). PLENTY of men will find you attractive in the swinging world. I've looked at your profile. I'm not blowing sunshine here. You've got great hips and a killer smile (the pic of you and your husband together at the table...)! I'm 2000 miles from you and some years past your age range acceptance, but for those things we'd be contacting you.

Enjoy the swing club scene. I think you'll soon find a number of men who are appreciative and attracted to you. What happens from there, you've got a lot of talking and talking and talking to do yet. But, I think you're on the right path. I don't see any red flags with what you're doing right now with what your comfort level is.

[sunbuckus]

Originally Posted by bbarnsworth

Sunbuckus...

I really like your approach to all of this so far. You're not ready to jump into the deep end of the swinging pool yet, but your approach is great. I think you're doing wonderfully well.

Body image; I've said this many times here, as it's a very common concern. Our society intensely programs us to believe women must fit into this very narrow definition of what "good looking" is. It's a bunch of rubbish. Women come in all shapes and sizes. You've had three kids. Guess what? Most swingers have had kids too. You look around Swing Lifestyle and you'll see most women do not fit the prototypical "perfect" airbrushed cover of Cosmopolitan image. I read something recently that ~50 years ago, the average model weight 8% less than the average woman. Now it's up to 23%. Gah.

You shouldn't let body image get in your way. Whether you are 500 lbs or 95 lbs dripping wet, some men will find you attractive and some won't. You can't change that. All you can do is put your best foot forward. If a given couple or single man is not attracted to the two of you or you, then they saved you the time of chatting with them, right? On to the next. You ARE an attractive person. Proof; your husband isn't insane, right? He's attracted to you. So many wives refuse to believe what their husbands tell them because "Well if they don't lie, they're in the doghouse!" It's just not true (in the vast majority of cases). PLENTY of men will find you attractive in the swinging world. I've looked at your profile. I'm not blowing sunshine here. You've got great hips and a killer smile (the pic of you and your husband together at the table...)! I'm 2000 miles from you and some years past your age range acceptance, but for those things we'd be contacting you.

Enjoy the swing club scene. I think you'll soon find a number of men who are appreciative and attracted to you. What happens from there, you've got a lot of talking and talking and talking to do yet. But, I think you're on the right path. I don't see any red flags with what you're doing right now with what your comfort level is.

bbarnsworth, thank you for such a warm welcome! I've read your replies thus far (I'll get to the other one soon) and I really appreciate all that you've said.

Concerning body image, almost everywhere that I've seen on the forum, it's almost unanimous that men are used to all shapes and sizes. Of course, being the newbie around, it's hard to fit that concept until we actually have that experience under our belt. And that continued brainwashing that we see everywhere doesn't help. I workout to exercise DVDs every day and all I see on the videos are these insanely fit women. I suppose that doesn't help. lol

Having the kids has definitely helps us to slow down, too, since they require a sitter or an overnight stay with family for us to go out. I know that there have been times where it seems like we can ask a lot of "what if" questions but we can't answer them until we actually experience that situation. But I'm still on here, reading what I can and pondering how it would be for us. As I've stated before, no matter what happens from here on out (whether we do nothing or actively swing) our relationship is closer, stronger, and the sex is definitely hotter.