another newbie couple - looking for advice

[weifensi]

hi all
my wife and I (both 37, married for 10 years, 2 kids) are curious about getting into the lifestyle. we've been talking about it for about about 2 months but haven't started anyting in this direction.

We probably took it a bit too fast in the beginning in terms of our conversation. after 2 or 3 weeks of intense conversations, we were planning a first visit to a swingers club but didn't go through with it. On one side she was somewhat uncomfortable and I basically freaked out (I come to some of the points a bit later).
That's when I found this website and I found the threads a big help for our conversations since then. We were always able to speak with each other but definitely have opened up some more thru these conversations and feel comfortable with each other and our marriage. We both agree that we are curious about swinging but want to take it in babysteps and will go with the pace of the slowest (that's probably me).

here are a couple of points, we / I'd appreciate to hear some thoughts on :

* Jealousy
Definitely a topic where I have more issues than my wife. Like many other men I have fantasies about watching my wife with another guy. As part of our talking I noticed though that I really don't feel comfortable with this in reality (at least at the moment). I have to admit that it's jealousy and that the cause is my own insecurity (e.g. fear of her liking it more with the other guy etc.). One could say I feel very territorial in this regard. On the other hand, I feel comfortable with my wife being together with another woman (my wife feels comfortable with this given the right person). I simply don't feel threatened in this scenario.
My wife is has less trouble seeing me with another women. One reason is probably that she's able to differentiate love & sex from each other better than I do right now.
It seems that the above is not an uncommon thing for males (at least, reading different threads I get this impression). I'd be interested to know how other males overcame the jealousy of another guy being involved. And also, where this territorial behaviour comes from (Up untill the topic of swinging came up I wasn't even awar that I can actually get that jealous....)

* Swinging in the same room vs different room
This is a topic where my wife and I seem to have different preferences. On my side, I'd like to be in the same room as my wife. It's on one hand a matter of feeling more comfortable (secure?) but then also of feeling more in control about the whole situation. My wife would prefer a set up where we are in different rooms. Mainly because, she thinks that in such a setting she could actually let loose and not feel watched all the time.
We can both understand each others view and would be interested to hear what others think or how they approached it in their first time.

* how to get your feet wet
From reading different threads on her, it seems like that quite a common way to get your feet wet is to go to a swingers club and just check out what's going on with maybe some play with your partner. How did you start with it ?

Also, my wife and I are expats in an Asian country. Swinger Clubs don't exist here (or at least not as open as in the western world). If any of you have an idea of how to get started without having a swinger club "around the corner", pls let me know.

thanks everyone for your advice

[lustylearning]

From the female: My initial impression is that you're not currently in a place to be swinging. The only enjoyment you express an interest in is in watching your wife with another man. You acknowledge that you cannot really handle it and want to maintain control. She does not feel she could enjoy herself with your eye constantly on her. So... from what you present, it will not benefit you. You mention that another woman doesn't threaten you. Well, that's all fine and good, but as a swinging, bi-woman whose gender of preference is male, I can tell you that if the only pleasure I could seek in the experience is from a woman, I'd skip it. Thanks, but no. I don't swing for the bi experience, and I don't swing strictly to please my husband. If it's not mutually beneficial, why bother?

From the husband (and I paraphrase): Eh, they may not be ready, but they're close. He's presenting typical issues that can't really be dealt with until they're confronted. While I now prefer separate room, I would never recommend that for newbies. There are too many questions that will eat away at him. They may try it and find it doesn't work, and that's okay. The bottom line is, he's going to see his wife respond in ways that she doesn't respond with him, because everyone is different, and he has to get over that. The control issue needs to be in the partner selection, not in micro-managing the experience. Rules/taboos should be set in advance and clear from the get go. You can't be saying later, "You came too hard. You moaned too loud. He's not the best lover in the world, so he has to be prepared for the possibility she'll encounter someone with more expertise. Again, bottom line, if his wife is going to leave him because she meets someone who's better in bed, then gee, they don't have much of a marriage to start with. He'll encounter a lot of feelings that even he will know are illogical. Despite that, his feelings will still be valid. If he can't move beyond them, then they don't go forward...
Practically speaking, if there's no local club, meet with couples, go out on the town. See if there's chemistry. If not, go home.

[km34]

I don't think there is a right or wrong answer here... From what you've said about your jealous feelings, you're not ready to actually swing, but after working through a few key issues you could be.

Here are my thoughts, take them or leave them as you will:

1. Your wife says she won't be able to let loose if you're in the room. Why? This seems like a big issue to me as you two should be comfortable doing everything TOGETHER.

2. You want control and will only be comfortable if you're in the same room. She says she will only be comfortable if you're in separate rooms. Major differences in opinion = major issue. This is something that needs to be worked out WAY before you get close to a swinging situation. If you go in with hazy ideas, it is way too easy to just go with the flow of what others are doing and not think about what is best for your relationship.

3. I am amazed at people who start at parties or clubs. I would have felt pressured the first time. As long as you aren't going to let people push you into something you aren't ready to do, finding a club is a viable option. However, you need to make sure it is legal, as well.

4. I would recommend just trying to meet people outside of a party setting. It is a bit more personal so you can get to know each other and get comfortable more easily.

[two4youinswva]

Originally Posted by weifensi

Also, my wife and I are expats in an Asian country. Swinger Clubs don't exist here (or at least not as open as in the western world). If any of you have an idea of how to get started without having a swinger club "around the corner", pls let me know.

That's really going to depend on the country. I only have a layman's understanding of Asian cultures, but I do know that what is acceptable in one country may be highly frowned upon in another. You understand the culture you're currently immersed in a lot better than we will, so I think you'll have to use your instincts to work through this one.

[weifensi]

thanks everyone for yr comments. some good points for my wife & myself to discuss with each other. definitely a confirmation that we as a couple are not ready yet and I got some stuff around the jealousy to work out.
I'm sure I'm not the first guy with these feelings, if someone can share how they worked on their jealousy issues that'll be much appreciated.

[Alura]

Jealousy results from a fear of losing your spouse, in my opinion. Make sure both of you know that there is no reason for that fear, that you'll never even think of leaving. If you don't already, say "I love you" often.

When y'all finally get around to "doing the deed" with another couple, be sure that the experience is very different from the way y'all make love. Don't try to be serious. Laugh and joke, talk to each other, have fun. Create an atmosphere that y'all are doing this together, even if you're each fucking somebody else at the time.

If either of you finds the experience unpleasant, don't do it again, of course.

Alura

[JustAskJulie]

Just from reading your post it sounds like you might have some control issues? Until you can let go and just let things happen a bit and also allow your wife to enjoy things without feeling like you are looking over her shoulder you aren't quite ready yet. I get that impression because of your comment that she would prefer separate room so that she can "let go" and enjoy herself more. And also from your statement that you would feel more "in control". This isn't really an issue of same room vs separate room as I do think that's totally a personal thing that each couple has to decide on. But, if her main draw back is worry about your reactions (and it sounds like it is) then some more talk & time is definitely in order.

[weifensi]

hi julie
u are spot on with yr observation. the same room set up for me is definitely a thing to stay in control. I've started to work on my jealousy, to find out what underlying fear(s) I have. I'm doing this primarily to get a better handle on jealousy in general, it is simply not healthy to have such strong negative feelings.
I started working on this with the help of a professional. Everyone has there on way to work on matters like that, I find this is the way that works best for me.
One of the things which got clearer to me is that when my wife told me about her sexual past I immediately felt in competition with these guys. I'm realising now that there is no need for that. All lot of these encounters for one night stands, so no emotional connection, it was just for having fun. And even if there was a certain emotional connection with her lovers, it was in no way a connection like we have with each other. Just realising this has put me at ease a lot.
I spoke with my wife just yesterday on this and a lot of my personal things seem to fall into the right place. Don't get me wrong there's still stuff for me to work on but this is a first step for me. Taking it in baby steps and let's see where it goes.

[-jb-]

"Careful you must be when sensing the future, Anakin. The fear of loss is a path to the dark side."..."Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose." - Yoda