How do you know if this is just a fantasy or not?

[Mr&MrsGoat]

Hi there,
Been lurking for a few weeks and decided today to join. My hubby and I have talked a lot about swinging. But what we get stuck on is knowing for sure if this is just a really hot fantasy we have or if it is something we should pursue?

I'm thinking once we get into it, it'll be real hot. But I'm worried about afterwards. I don't know how I'll feel. It's kinda scary.

I would love to hear some advice on knowing if this should just stay a fantasy? What are some of your personal experiences with making the 'jump' to reality.

TIA!

[bbarnsworth]

First,

Second, have a look around the archives of this forum at The Swingers Board - Powered by vBulletin. Many of your questions can probably be answered there. Of course, we're happy to answer them too; not just shunt you off to the archives

Is it just a fantasy? A good metric of it is whether you grow comfortable talking about the subject when you're not in the mood for sex, and otherwise engaged in some other completely non-sexual activity. If the only time you can talk about it is in the heat of the moment in bed, there's a reasonable chance it's just fantasy.

Scary gets defined more by you and your spouse; set your rules. Live by them, and allow them to change if both of you want OUTSIDE of playing with another couple (or single). The age old rule in this lifestyle is talk, talk, talk, talk. Oh, and if you get tired of talking? Talk more Seriously, communication is absolutely key in finding yourself in the lifestyle. The more you talk, the less scary any of this becomes.

How will you feel afterwards? Probably pretty good! Post orgasmic feelings can be a bit anti-climatical, but if you and your husband are honest and open with each other and recognize that swinging doesn't inherently damage relationships (rather the opposite usually), you'll have an enjoyable experience.

You're not alone. All people in the lifestyle have had questions starting out. Your questions and concerns are perfectly normal!

[Chicup]

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/9228/dragonsss0.jpg
Some fantasies are unreachable, those are kept as fantasy because you have no means to reach them. You lack the time, the knowledge, the superpowers, to make them real.

Then there are those who advise keeping your fantasies fantasy even if you could attain them. They are afraid that reality won't be as good as their imaginations.

These are small minded people, blinded by risk, or motivated by jealousy. They can't have it, so no one should.

This idea is taken as a truism, and will have a mountain of anecdotal stories to convince you that fantasy is best left there, in your head where it can do you no harm.

I disagree. There are cases where wanting is better than having, but I'd rather have an know it wasn't that great then just want and fantasize.

Maybe swinging is wrong for you, and it will create haze of jealousy and lust leading to the failure of your marriage. Its possible. Its also possible that you will be just like the rest of us, and find it liberating and wonderful, making your marriage stronger and satisfying a desire we all have in our genes without the hurt and shame that conventional affairs cause.

Go in with your eyes open, together, always letting your partner know what you are feeling, and if you decide not to go further, do it together, but don't be afraid of new territory just because their might be dragons.

[Mr&MrsGoat]

Go in with your eyes open, together, always letting your partner know what you are feeling, and if you decide not to go further, do it together, but don't be afraid of new territory just because their might be dragons.

Exactly. That's why I love this section of the boards. I've already had so many of my questions answered without even asking them.

I feel as if we have our eyes open as much as we can. We've been discussing this on and off for a little over a year now. It scares us and excites us. We both don't want this to be something that breaks us apart. So that's why we've been talking about it so much.

What do you think are good rules for first timers? For example, what are the things you and your significant other promised to each other before going in?

And another thing, this is something we don't really want everyone to know about. In fact, I think we'd both prefer that this aspect of our lives remain EXTREMELY private. With that being said, do you find that you usually travel away from your home to *play*? How many people actually play in your own home? I honestly can say I don't want ANYTHING happening in my own home and I'm real nervous about someone knowing where I live. You never know what kind of people are out there. It's a lot of trust you put into someone blindly.

I just don't want to actually run into someone who knows about us. We're in a military town as it is and the gossip hounds are HORRIBLE here. This kind of thing completely gets your banned from 'normal' living. If that makes sense? I mean, honestly, nobody really wants to be talked about badly. So how do you keep it private? By playing in another town?

Sorry, I'm babbling a little bit. I just have so many thoughts pouring through my mind at the moment about it. I'm off to read some more.....

[BiloxiCouple]

The first time jumping into the lifestyle was probably one of the biggest "rushes" we've had in a long time.

Something new, dangerous, maybe a little dirty??? Whooohooo!!!!!! Would we want that feeling again? Hell yeah!!!!!

Enjoy it.

[sweet_tna]

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

Exactly. That's why I love this section of the boards. I've already had so many of my questions answered without even asking them.

I feel as if we have our eyes open as much as we can. We've been discussing this on and off for a little over a year now. It scares us and excites us. We both don't want this to be something that breaks us apart. So that's why we've been talking about it so much.

What do you think are good rules for first timers? For example, what are the things you and your significant other promised to each other before going in?

And another thing, this is something we don't really want everyone to know about. In fact, I think we'd both prefer that this aspect of our lives remain EXTREMELY private. With that being said, do you find that you usually travel away from your home to *play*? How many people actually play in your own home? I honestly can say I don't want ANYTHING happening in my own home and I'm real nervous about someone knowing where I live. You never know what kind of people are out there. It's a lot of trust you put into someone blindly.

I just don't want to actually run into someone who knows about us. We're in a military town as it is and the gossip hounds are HORRIBLE here. This kind of thing completely gets your banned from 'normal' living. If that makes sense? I mean, honestly, nobody really wants to be talked about badly. So how do you keep it private? By playing in another town?

Sorry, I'm babbling a little bit. I just have so many thoughts pouring through my mind at the moment about it. I'm off to read some more.....

It's good to hear you've got your eyes open and are aware of your feelings. Continue to communicate those to/with each other and take things slow. Some fantasies were never meant to become realities. Only you and your other half can decide that.

As for being discovered? I hate to tell you this, but even if you never play at home and always go out of town, you could still run into someone you know. It's a risk you have to be willing to take. If, however you do run into someone at a club/party, they'd have just as much to lose as you do, so likely they'll keep their mouths shut.

And please, keep those questions coming. That's what we're here for.

=)

[Mr&MrsGoat]

Thanks Sweet_tna.

We really want to know for certain there won't be any remorse afterwords.

Does anyone have any advice on the types of questions you and your spouse discuss with one another before deciding to do this? What are good things to ask each other and ourselves to make sure we're both doing this for the right reasons?

[slevin]

Make sure that you are both on the same page about what you are comfortable and only go as far as whoever has the most restrictions is comfortable. If one of you is ready for a fullswap and the other only softswap then only do a softswap. Don't change your rules in the midst of playtime even if you both feel its ok. If either of you is uncomfortable at anytime (even if it's in the middle of some hot sex) then stop immediately and either go back to what you were all comfortable with or stop the playtime completely.

On playing in your home: we play either at a club or at a hotel. Katrina is very uncomfortable with people we don't really know being in our house and knowing where we live. This is less about a desire for anonymity as it is about safety. She would rather (and I agree) that people we've played with, but don't know well, don't know where we live to avoid anyone just showing up as well as any other issues that may arise from that. Once we get comfortable with a couple and know them better we're open to playing at our house, but it hasn't gotten that far with very many people so far.

[PB&J]

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

We really want to know for certain there won't be any remorse afterwords.

I think that you are asking others a question that they can't possible answer for you and your husband.

Yes, it is kinda scary. Honestly, that was part of the thrill for me, trying something that was SO way out of my normal manner of living. I wasn't sure if after the first time, I'd be curled up in a fetal position sobbing, or if I'd be smiling. But I went ahead, took the plunge, and actually what I did was sort of coo afterwards (for about 3 days!!), according to my husband.

You have to talk A LOT with your husband, and make sure that you are doing this for all the right reasons (which vary from couple to couple). You have to decide from within yourself if it's a step that you're willing to take, and really, there is a certain element of risk involved, because I don't think that anyone can really know 100% for sure if this is for them until they've tried it. But certainly on this board you've been able to tell that lots have tried it and liked it.

[sweet_tna]

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

Thanks Sweet_tna.

We really want to know for certain there won't be any remorse afterwords.

Does anyone have any advice on the types of questions you and your spouse discuss with one another before deciding to do this? What are good things to ask each other and ourselves to make sure we're both doing this for the right reasons?

Again, I hate to break it to you, but there's no way to know for certain how you'll feel ahead of time. The key is to TALK to each other about your feelings and LISTEN to each other.

For us, the only real reason to join the lifestyle would be to add a little spice to an already hot and spicy sex life, and maybe even fulfill some fantasies.

The main questions I can think of to ask each other are along the lines of "How do you feel about . . . ?" Basically, just insert whatever situation you and your spouse might be considering (having sex, kissing, orgasming with another man/woman). And, "What would you/we do if . . . happened?" There are many scenarios to consider, but inevitably something may come up you didn't think of. But if you use these questions to help you develop a set of rules/guidelines you feel comfortable with, you have a good starting point.

=)

[Chicup]

I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

Exactly. That's why I love this section of the boards. I've already had so many of my questions answered without even asking them.

I feel as if we have our eyes open as much as we can. We've been discussing this on and off for a little over a year now. It scares us and excites us. We both don't want this to be something that breaks us apart. So that's why we've been talking about it so much.

One thing I read a while ago which stuck in my mind is that only you can make yourself feel embarrassed. It is you who turn others thoughts against you. If you choose not to be embarrassed then there is no embarrassment in what you do. The same goes for breaking you apart here. Only you can do that with your own consent. If you both agree to it, both do it, and then it breaks you apart then the fault is with you. Caution is natural, but if it seems like something you both WANT to do then how can you be mad at each other after you agree to do it together? If you know yourselves well enough then these questions really don't need to be asked, and you are trying to find a reason to not swing that doesn't mean facing your fear of this new territory.

What do you think are good rules for first timers? For example, what are the things you and your significant other promised to each other before going in?

Our rules are always the same. Either one of us can call it off at any time. Beyond that no rules. Rules can be too confining and I think give you something to be hurt about if they are broken. Some people make pages of rules, these people tend not to really swing, but that is another issue. Lets say your rule was 'no kissing' and after she goes nuts on his penis for a while and she goes to kiss him, hes suppose to say 'no sorry its a rule?' Now of course you could discuss it prior but outside of a few turn offs the rules should really be kept to a minimum. If you don't want to full swap right away or the like, thats fine, but don't make it a codex of laws. For rules I'd keep it simple to a few big don'ts you just are not comfortable with. I'd also add keeping it in the same room is psychologically easier than separate. Separate seems better to some to start but the mind can imagine things far more unnerving than reality at times.

And another thing, this is something we don't really want everyone to know about. In fact, I think we'd both prefer that this aspect of our lives remain EXTREMELY private. With that being said, do you find that you usually travel away from your home to *play*? How many people actually play in your own home? I honestly can say I don't want ANYTHING happening in my own home and I'm real nervous about someone knowing where I live. You never know what kind of people are out there. It's a lot of trust you put into someone blindly.

I just don't want to actually run into someone who knows about us. We're in a military town as it is and the gossip hounds are HORRIBLE here. This kind of thing completely gets your banned from 'normal' living. If that makes sense? I mean, honestly, nobody really wants to be talked about badly. So how do you keep it private? By playing in another town?

Ironic since many people credit the Air Force for 'inventing' suburban swinging though I'm sure its far older than that in reality. Privacy will be up to you, and how you pick your partners. You could always do the travel thing to start, but you roll the dice each time. The common retort is that 'well they are their for the same thing' but there is always a chance someone will see you that you don't see yourself, or that they don't care if they are outed. Keep your pictures private, maybe without face shots until you can 'vet' the other couple a bit if you do online. Privacy is very ephemeral these days, and we were discovered once by a business associate of mine, nothing ill came of it, but I still wish he didn't know. So the risk IS real but so is the reward. We would rather be outed to our families than never have swung in the first place. Its done great things for us, things we wouldn't want to go back to the 'old us' even if it meant people knew about us.

Remorse is cureless,--the disease
Not even God can heal;
For 'tis His institution,--
The complement of hell. - Emily Dickinson

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

We really want to know for certain there won't be any remorse afterwords.

Does anyone have any advice on the types of questions you and your spouse discuss with one another before deciding to do this? What are good things to ask each other and ourselves to make sure we're both doing this for the right reasons?

Honey, if you saw a me giving a guy a bj, while his wife gave you one, would it turn you on, or would it make you want to kill him?

As silly as that sounds, its pretty much the type of question to ask. Remorse should only happen if you feel guilty about it, if you wish it wasn't done. Jealousy on the other hand, can happen and it can be real, the question is how well do you handle it if it happens. It can be shocking seeing just how quickly your partner gets into the act with someone else. For some I think it sparks a visceral fear that 'she/he doesn't really need me!' but how you handle it can vary far to wildly to give you good advice. If he really loves you, and you really love him, then you should be fine. Jealousy isn't about love but possession, and if you know they love you enough that you don't need to possess them to keep them, then you can do this without much worry.

[realcplub2]

Excellent choice of quotes to start a post to a thread like this one, Chicup..

Now, I understand the question asked.. But, if you are standing on the beach there is only one way to know how warm the water is.. right?

If you are standing at the edge of a pool, How do you know how deep the water is? How cold it is?

How does a bird learn to fly?

Do I need to keep going, or do you sense a theme?

As far as knowing if its right for you / or if you are ready.. Have you discussed in detail the whole thing? After fantasy, the reality is, so long as you both can fully TRUST each other, TALK to each other about everything, and KNOW you are both secure in your relationship with each other.. KNOWING that after a evening of FUN, you are both headed home together..

Then you are ready..

Now as far as jumping right in, thats a personal choice, just like getting in a pool.. some jump right in, others ease there way in..

Wanna ease your way in, make it clear you are new to ALL of THIS.. and go at the pace you are comfortable with.. Some take a few "dates".

[Mr&MrsGoat]

You all have done such a wonderful job in answering my (somewhat confusing) questions.

The main questions I can think of to ask each other are along the lines of "How do you feel about . . . ?" Basically, just insert whatever situation you and your spouse might be considering (having sex, kissing, orgasming with another man/woman). And, "What would you/we do if . . . happened?" There are many scenarios to consider, but inevitably something may come up you didn't think of. But if you use these questions to help you develop a set of rules/guidelines you feel comfortable with, you have a good starting point.

This is perfect. I really want us both to open up and look at this in all ways possible. I don't know if either of us sees the reality of it sometimes. I want us both to think through these things before starting something.

I think what I'm worried about the most right now is separating sex from love. I know in my head, we can each have sex with other people and it not mean any more than just having fun. But in my heart, going from the vanilla way of thinking to realizing that it could be just something else we do together is a tricky step to take. If that makes sense? So that's why I want to talk, talk, talk and ask questions and see how he feels about these things. I want to know if this is something he wants to do as well. Not something he's doing just to go along with me.

Thank you all again for all your thoughtfulness and support. I know I've found the right place here.

[screaminggood]

Feel free to continue with the thoughts and questions. Sometimes it helps to type it out and get responses that confirm that you're on the correct path for you.

[bbarnsworth]

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

I want us both to think through these things before starting something.

This is VERY good! Good self advice for a first time couple

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

I think what I'm worried about the most right now is separating sex from love.

Well what do you know! We have an archive that covers just that Separating Sex & Love - The Swingers Board

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

I know in my head, we can each have sex with other people and it not mean any more than just having fun. But in my heart, going from the vanilla way of thinking to realizing that it could be just something else we do together is a tricky step to take. If that makes sense?

That makes complete sense. Trying to separate sex and love is something that women, on average, find harder than men. For my wife, this was a concern of hers as well. The way I viewed it, and expressed as much to her, is that so long as we're in the same room together, it's an extension of our own love making. We play with real live humans as living sex toys. If emotions begin to become deeply involved with the other person, then there's a problem and our rule is we drop that couple cold turkey (though politely to them). We've also talked about the what if scenario of if we are with a particular couple for a few years. You can't help but develop some emotions for them. But, there's a difference between romantic love and friendly love.

Sex is one _small_ part of traditional marriage. As my mother said, it's not the bricks of the marriage, but the cement that helps hold it together. Having more cement (no double entendre intended!) from others isn't going to detract from that I can make love to my wife just holding her hand. I can make love to my wife by scattering flower petals in her car while it's parked at her job. I can make love to my wife by sending her a sexy text message. I can make love to my wife by doing the laundry, dishes, cleaning and putting the kids to bed while she is sick (did that last night). I can make love to my wife by going out in pouring rain to the car to retrieve her umbrella so she doesn't have to get wet on the way from the house to the car. I can make love to my wife by filling her car up with gas when she's out with the other car, so she doesn't have to deal with filling it. I can make love to my wife by using her favorite sex toy on her in just the right way (just about makes my arms fall off, but she loves it!). I can do all of these things and not involve my penis in the process at all. (images of trying to involve my penis while pumping gas aside )

I can have sex with my own hand. Sex is a physical act. It can and often does involve deep emotions, but sex is not an emotion itself. It's a physical act.

A fantasy of mine is me partially sitting, with my wife's back to me laying against me, while she is getting it from another man and her having a mind blowing orgasm at the same time he does. I would love to see that, and I would feel very deeply, intimately connected to her (not that I don't already!).

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

So that's why I want to talk, talk, talk and ask questions and see how he feels about these things. I want to know if this is something he wants to do as well. Not something he's doing just to go along with me.

From his posts, it certainly does NOT sound like he's doing this begrudgingly just because you want it. Some men, myself included, are very wired towards pleasing their partner in whatever way they can. In my case, that includes other men having sex with my wife while I am with her. It sounds to me like your husband is very similar. Rejoice! You have a husband who is extremely devoted to your pleasure! That's a GOOD thing!

Originally Posted by Mr&MrsGoat

Thank you all again for all your thoughtfulness and support. I know I've found the right place here.

Even if the two of you never swing, you're absolutely in the right place. The kinds of questions you're asking can really only be answered here. And trust me, if we think you're not ready for swinging we will tell you. I can't tell you how many times I've seen posts from the regulars here telling a couple that they are not ready, or need to really consider xyz before embarking on this, etc. I've never seen any pressure from anyone here encouraging people to do something they are not ready for.