First Swap! DH forgot OUR rules! What to do??

[pacpl4funn]

did he know that during the 3sums with other guys that I was holding myself back???? Yes he did, and it took me awhile too, It wasn't until I was comfortable knowing he was truly ok that I COULD even really enjoy it.

The mfm 3sums was new, we had never done it, so I was proceeding with extreme caution.... You know that old saying, do unto others as you would have them do unto you???

That is my feeling on all this and his too, but somewhere during that night, he lost touch with that...

So of course it's natural of me to presume he would give me the same care and consideration as I gave him. Just I got the shitty end of the stick and now I don't know what to do with it. LOL

[lovefest04]

I know I am not going to be popular for this...but

The posts I read from pacpl4fun concern me. I agree that everyone should take things at the pace of the slowest person. I agree that rules are rules and they should not be crossed or ignored. But, the your posts are full of anger, control, distrust and jealously. I personally think your rules point to deeper problems, not with your marriage, but with whether your should participate in this activity at all.

I think you need to question if swinging is right for you and certainly consider soft swing not swapping at this time. I thinks its clear that you're not ready for MFMF full swap. That's OK, it isn't for everyone.

Ask yourself a lot of questions, what do I want from this, why do I want this, what personal issues do I have with sharing my husband or wife, what if he or she has a much better time on a date than I do, can i handle watching him get off if my partner is not performing.... theres lots to think about.

Try to get over the actual night, don't spend so much energy getting him to apologize, sometimes we humans just plain f*#k up. Work on moving forward positively.

In your case, really step back and see if this is for you.

Good luck,

[EvilMJ]

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

So of course it's natural of me to presume he would give me the same care and consideration as I gave him. Just I got the shitty end of the stick and now I don't know what to do with it. LOL

I am not sure what more you want. Your husband admitted his mistake, wrote you a note basically calling himself a f**k up and how his actions were not meant to hurt you. Either you love him enough to accept that he made a mistake, feels bad and move on, or you keep letting this eat at you.

I say trust your husband, trust that he loves you, sit down and talk to him and made a game plan for the future. Maybe you have to create some signals, or agree that if either one of you are doing something that make the other uncomfortable, then speak up. Maybe you need to determine if soft swap is more the way to go, so he finishes in you.. whatever the case maybe.

My final point is the person that you need to talk to this about is your husband. Put away the accusations, he admitted screwing up, and start working toward something you both can live with.

[pacpl4funn]

Originally Posted by lovefest04

Ask yourself a lot of questions, what do I want from this, why do I want this, what personal issues do I have with sharing my husband or wife, what if he or she has a much better time on a date than I do, can i handle watching him get off if my partner is not performing.... theres lots to think about.

What do I want from this???
To have a good time, exerience life and all it's many wonders WITH my husband.

Why do "I" want this? Because it's something he's wanted to try for along time and I am cruious, I'd like to try it and I also want to have a good time while making us both happy.

What personal issues do I have with sharing my husband? Tough question to be honest. I can share to a point, every adventure is different, and if the situation is handled correctly, however, I don't want to throw away the things that make our life special either.

What if he or she has a much better time on a date than I do, can i handle watching him get off if my partner is not performing? No I don't think I can, what your asking is like if one wasn't having a good time, should the one who isn't go out and sit in the car and wait??? Sorry but I thought the pretense of swinging was that both have a good time or the night ends early!!

What More do I want??? the answer no one here seems capable of giving,
How do you move on, how do you forgive when your trust has been violated?

[tribbles]

How do you move on, how do you forgive when your trust has been violated?

For us, I had to KNOW he knew how he came to make the mistake he did.

Then I had to know what he had learned from it.

And finally, I had to accept he didn't do it to hurt me...he did stuff cuz he is just another messed up human and we both learned from his mistake.

S

[ANGEDKY(mr)]

I'm gonna throw an abstract point of view out there for consideration, feel free to set me straight if needed !!!

1) his various stories....could they be panic talking? you had said its been three years getting to this point and in less than a second he thinks he screwed it up so bad that its gone forever. Think about how many time we have seen on t.v. the cops in a high speed chase for miles only in the end to have the driver reply to the "why did you run" question with a "duh, i was scared" and they only wanted to ticket him for a broken taillight (at first)

2)I (if it were my situation) would have issues with the other females actions........... not like she was screaming "no no dont cum in my mouth", in fact she went back for seconds

3) i get the impression that he did at least TRY to abide by the rule, why else was his cock in the cold air instead of her mouth......not to say that he was 100% successful but it was removed from her mouth somehow, someway so shouldnt he at least get some benefit of the doubt based on this rather than condemnation

4) what you want from this is entirely acceptable, and I think (based on your replies) that he does realize the err in his ways and that a touch of compassion from you will help his recovery and allow you to move foward as a couple and in the swinging realm. After all the note that he left you has numerous red flags indicating some self esteem issues!! who better to help him than his loving and caring wife (rather than the hurt, blaming wife that appeared here) if you cant, maybe therapy?? that is your call as a couple but it has to be addressed or he will undoubtedly be accepting blame without regard to who or where the blame is coming from which will have disasterous results in every facet of life

5) how do you move on............COMMUNICATE COMMUNICATE COMMUNICATE its the only answer, but it must be done with a certain amount of caring, address the self esteem and the rest will fall in place


angedky(mr)

[biblonde]

I have been debating on wether or not to reply to this...so here it goes. I have to agree with alot that has been said here but there are alot of red flags coming from you IMHO.

first you say you have been in the lifestyle for 3 years and this is your first "play" time. I see alot of security problems. You freaked because you THINK he came in her mouth. I think he honestly tried to pull out but beings that he was on the bottom that isnt as easy as you think. I dont see this as being a violation of trust. If this woman also knew your rules then she is partly to blame. Sorry dear but most men cant control when they cum. I have had some that barely start to fuck and then are done just as quick as that and believe me they really dont want to finish that fast. You may not like this but I think you WAY over reacted in this situation. I really dont think you belong in the lifestyle if something like this is going to throw you over the deep end. Could this be just an excuse for you to get out all together without saying you cant handle it...kinda like shoving the blame on him so he feels so guilty that it doesnt ever happen again???? This is the way I am reading all your posts. And no that doesnt make you a bad person, hey this lifestyle isnt for everyone. Some people get into it and love it some cant stand it or cant handle it. I really think you need to talk truthfully to your hubby. I think right about now he feels lower than dirt and I truthfully dont think that is fair. It sounded like he really tried to pull out and mostly did...she went back he didnt force her to do anything. There are going to be mishaps from BOTH you if you remain in the lifestyle..hey we are all human and make mistakes...if a tiny one like this has caused you so much pain maybe you should not be in the lifestyle. It really isnt worth breaking up your marrage over or hurt feelings and resentment. But hey that is just my 2 cents worth!

[mark069]

I really think you should just forget about what happened and move on. I really can't exactly see where your husband broke the rules since by your description he came OUTSIDE her mouth. She actually broke the rules by going down on him after that but that's not his fault. In any case, he apologized anyway so I think it's time to just let that incident be "water under the bridge"...

[lovefest04]

What personal issues do I have with sharing my husband? Tough question to be honest. I can share to a point, every adventure is different, and if the situation is handled correctly, however, I don't want to throw away the things that make our life special either.

You need to really determine if the "point" at which you can't share will still allow you to be swingers. "Situation is handled correctly"... this is sex, it is IMHO best when it isn't handled. You need freedom to experiment, freedom to take risks and see what happens, not control. No one wants to throw away anything nor would I recommend you do. You have concerns and fear and should consider what ways there might be for you two to experience a little wild sex without others. Videos, phone sex, cams, peep shows.

What if he or she has a much better time on a date than I do, can i handle watching him get off if my partner is not performing? No I don't think I can, what your asking is like if one wasn't having a good time, should the one who isn't go out and sit in the car and wait??? Sorry but I thought the pretense of swinging was that both have a good time or the night ends early!!

Read the posts here about how often men don't perform. Many women have experienced a less than satisfying experience only to see their own husbands/partners giving the other woman the ride of her life and enjoying every minute of it. I can't imagine jumping up and telling the others to stop simply because I'm not getting mine.

There is no keeping score in swinging. Yes you can both have a good time, but you will find that sometimes one of you will have a better time than the other and yes, sometimes you and your partner may just get up, grab a glass of wine and go outside and talk (not the worst thing to be doing, spending time with another like minded human being) while your partner is making Ron Geromy look like an amateur.

That is partly what sharing and enjoying your spouses pleasure is about. For us it's about each other not ourselves. This is not a game for the selfish, but an opportunity to share the most important person in your life with others and to allow your partners to experience and enjoy blissful play. I have often sent my partner to get a massage and love just knowing shes enjoying herself even if I'm home with the children cleaning the bathrooms. I enjoy giving her pleasure.

How do you move on, how do you forgive when your trust has been violated?

I don't know that you can. Do you love him? Can you understand that this experience was as new for him as it was for you? Can you simply forgive him and trust that he loves you? What has happened has happened, the question is, and i don't mean that you should ever swing again, is your relationship important enough for you to let it go and move on. Life can be difficult, and frankly, this isn't as bad as it gets. Love him anyway and SHOW him you love and forgive him.

S

[hilltop]

Originally Posted by biblonde

I have to agree with alot that has been said here but there are alot of red flags coming from you IMHO.

first you say you have been in the lifestyle for 3 years and this is your first "play" time. I see alot of security problems.

I dont see this as being a violation of trust. If this woman also knew your rules then she is partly to blame. Sorry dear but most men cant control when they cum. I have had some that barely start to fuck and then are done just as quick as that and believe me they really dont want to finish that fast. You may not like this but I think you WAY over reacted in this situation. I really dont think you belong in the lifestyle if something like this is going to throw you over the deep end.

Could this be just an excuse for you to get out all together without saying you cant handle it...kinda like shoving the blame on him so he feels so guilty that it doesnt ever happen again???? This is the way I am reading all your posts. And no that doesnt make you a bad person, hey this lifestyle isnt for everyone. Some people get into it and love it some cant stand it or cant handle it.

I really think you need to talk truthfully to your hubby. I think right about now he feels lower than dirt and I truthfully dont think that is fair.

It sounded like he really tried to pull out and mostly did...she went back he didnt force her to do anything. There are going to be mishaps from BOTH you if you remain in the lifestyle..

hey we are all human and make mistakes...if a tiny one like this has caused you so much pain maybe you should not be in the lifestyle.

It really isnt worth breaking up your marrage over or hurt feelings and resentment.

Really well said Biblonde!

Pacpl, I think you've got your swinging style under such incredible tension that it can't help but break.

Step back and re-examine what you're doing and why. If you can't let go of something like this I think that your resentment for any issue is just going to compound itself until your relationship with your husband explodes.

Is that something you want to risk?

[pumpkins1970]

Mr. Pumpkin here, okay Mr. DH tried to follow the rules, he broke them , accidently, I can understand how hard it would be to withdraw from her mouth being on the bottom and all, he apologized and begged forgiveness. You even admit you heard him give warning Surrender to the impending orgasm,...so why are you still dragging him over the coals? I agree with the majority of the board here and have to suggest that you may not be ready for the swinging scene, I mean , good Lord how would you ever forgive yourself if another man "accidently" came in your mouth ? Please, if you are going to continue swinging, just remember were here for fun, not drama and jealousy, there's enough of that out in the vanilla world. XOXO XXX

[LikeMinds321]

Originally Posted by pacpl4funn

What More do I want??? the answer no one here seems capable of giving,
How do you move on, how do you forgive when your trust has been violated?

Biblonde has already said it like it is. But I'm going to say more.

I think you are trying to camoflauge the real problem with tons of details and the ole blame game.

I don't feel you have the comfort level to swing. I think you're looking for an out and you've made your husband the excuse.

Rules are only meant as a guildelines, sometimes swingers find they've made poor choices in rules.

I've never understood why anyone would go so far as to share oral with others and stop themselves from the orgasm. That seems like cruel and unusual punishment. It's natural to want to expend that wonderful build up of energy when the time has come where your body screams "let go!"

I think others have already said this, but it can be damn hard for a man to stop the orgasm, and when his partner is eagerly participating in bringing him pleasure her tenacity can make it hard to time things out for an ideal outcome of withdrawal or stop-and-wait-for-your-wife-to-crawl-off-the-other-guy-and-jump-on-you thinking.

Before you can be honest with your husband you've got to be honest with yourself. I don't think you're being honest with yourself.

LM

[couplewanting50]

See we have this rule, no direct mouth cumming and no inside cumming, as he wanted to keep this for us and I did too.

The first question I have to ask is..... why? What is the point of that rule? Maybe you should add, no penetration, to your list of rules, that would greatly simplify your current rules.

As a woman, you have a longer ramp up to orgasm than a man. You can much more easily control whether you orgasm or even approach orgasm. You believe it is OK for him to fuck this other woman, but don't come in her vagina or in her mouth, or..... even near her? Bluntly, I question just how realistic your wish is for him to thrust in her and guarantee that he won't come. ....and as an aside, I rarely orgasm, because I enjoy the desire that remains, so it is not as if I think men can't do it, it is just that most men enjoy orgasm and move toward it rather readily.

You have to believe that the woman was trying to make him come. It might be different if the woman did not want it and he did it anyway. She had no objection.

The entire tone and repetitious nature of your critical remarks reveals that you have an attitude or an axe to grind, and you don't want so much to move past this as you want to beat him to death with it.

You seem to want the people here to support you in your indignation, to better implement some agenda that you have ready to unveil.

[DBL D]

I think what the newbies try to do with their rules, or anyone for that matter, is to try to control the other and see how much they can take under pressure. Well, it isn't that simple. We have generally been very forgiving when we each break rules; she has changed a lot of the ways she thought about things since we started. I have too. We now do what each of us is comfy with (with our partners) and for the most part things are going pretty well. People can't and shouldn't be held to having sex just one or two ways. Too clinical and it becomes like the golf swing after awhile...paralysis by analysis.

Not much fun.

I don't want to sound like I'm coming down on anyone but after 3 years things should be different.

Here's a different approach. How about no rules? Then discuss that afterwards and decide what you should rule out or in. Too scary? Maybe. Sounds like a control issue here but one that should be dealt with in a loving and thoughtful manner.

You'll either become more comfy with each others way of swinging or you'll quit with a bad taste in YOUR mouth. Hope that doesn't happen.

Male D

[HappyPeople]

Situations like this is why we have very few rules. We have rules about playing alone or no taking one for the team, but other than that, we have no hard drawn lines.

And also, I'm not meaning to offend, but those with lots of rules kinda put us off - we don't want to feel like a rhino in a china shop.