I feel left out - I seem to be an unimportant factor

[shywife]

Hubby was interested in swinging... I SLOWLY came around, believing that if this was something we shared TOGETHER COMPETELY, then it was really about us having an erotic encounter TOGETHER that could not be achieved any other way, instead of being about the two of us screwing other people.

Hubby seems content cruising the sites and fantasizing without sharing this info with me. What I mean by that is that yes, I know he's on the board, but I do not know when, for how long, what he does while there, etc. He does not share any of this unless I SPECIFICALLY ask. When I do ask, he mostly says he "can't remember" any posts, etc. He did recently volunteer that he read a story on one of the sites that got him "hot," but he didn't elaborate or share anything more than that. I feel left out - I seem to be an unimportant factor in the equation.

[playinginmacon]

Before you became interested in swinging, he was probably still browsing sites and fantasizing. I do plenty of stuff online (like responding to this post) that I probably won't tell my hubby about. Not because I'm hiding something from him, but it's something I'm doing on my time that doesn't really affect him and really doesn't affect me. Kind of like checking my email, I just do it. Now if I were talking to a couple we could meet, I would tell him about that because it would affect both of us. It seems you are still new to the idea of swinging and he may not be sure what you are comfortable talking about, or he may simply be used to not talking about it and not know how to verbalize his fantasies. The more my hubby and I experience sexually, the easier it is becoming for us to talk about what we like, what we don't, and what we fantasize about. Before he wasn't even comfortable watching porn in the same room as me, now we sleep with other couples and talk about who did what well.

If you're uncomfortable with what your husband is doing, tell him so. He probably doesn't realize that you want to be included or that you feel that the relationship is between him and the computer, instead of the three of you.

[Fringeswinger]

I'm confused (not unusual). In another post you said you have swung with him in MFM several times. Did he just quit on you and now only wants to read and post to the board?

If it was early in the game and you were just starting to talk about it I would say he is still a little shy and embarrassed about his desires (like me). But if you have done several threesomes before, I can't understand why he would all of a sudden regress. I mean, after you go all the way like that, what is there left to hide??? With the little info I have, something doesn't sound right. please explain.

Bill

[socolais]

This is a very interesting observation. The original post could very closely describe the communication patterns between my wife and me. I enjoy the email flirting and cybersex. And while the pleasure for me is very real, it's also very short-term - there's no desire to remember anything other than the smiles. The next cyber-encounter will bring a fresh smile.

As a side note - for me, movies (DVD or at the theater) also get the short-term memory effect. I think it makes the movie more enjoyable enjoyable the next time I see it.

Make a date to sit in his lap and read the emails together - we've had some fun with that.

[beachzen]

shywife,
Talk to him. Let him know that the 'togetherness' aspect of play starts with the surfing, and tell him you're feeling a little left out. I expect he's getting some short-term pleasure from the computer foreplay, and might be a little embarrassed. Or he may not realize it counts as part of play, at least for you. The two of you need to have a conversation around how you're feeling, and his desires. Then perhaps you can get a point where you're sitting in his lap and you're reading the emails or watching porn together. I hope everything works out.

[Youngcalcpl]

I'd offer a suggestion that its best not to worry too much about it. If you look around the forum you'll notice a common thread that comes up pertains to Husbands trying to get their wives more involved. There are a lot of men that fantasize about taking part in the lifestyle. Some lurk, some take part in the conversations, some try to make friends, and its doubtful that they think too much about sharing everything with their spouses. Some most likely have been given the role of doing the "net scouting" by their spouse as well. Chances are his time on here was actually pretty innocuous and he meant no harm to you.

Surfing the net for info is a good way to start and talking to him to let him know you want to be involved is probably the best suggestion any of us can make.

Good luck!

[shywife]

Yes, I am still pretty new to all of this, but we have had a couple of MFM's and both enjoyed them. What made me comfortable with the concept of "swinging," be it threesomes with another man to full blown swapping with another couple, was the idea that this was about US and an erotic experience that we would share TOGETHER, as well as the honest and open communication we once had that included everything, even the seemingly insignificant.

My husband has been very open about his fantasies - we seem to be able to talk about all that just fine. However, when it comes to the websites, there is no communication unless I specifically ask, and again, I get the "I don't remember" statement. When I have been on the sites, I have always told him and shared things I read or whether I chatted, etc. I have asked - repeatedly - for him to do the same, but his response is that I should just assume he's on everyday. Again, that's not "sharing" the experience - that's him doing his thing without regard for me and my desire to be included. And yes, I have repeatedly told him I feel left out and unimportant.

I do not understand his desire to be on the boards fantasizing about all of this, but then have such a reluctance (and at this point, almost a defiant refusal) to communicate his activities. I am not asking for anything other than communication - but for some reason that seems to be an unreasonable request.

[beachzen]

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all; based on what you've said so far, it sounds like you've tried everything to open some communication on this. Unfortunately I don't have any great ideas for you, other than to let him know (yet again) that he's disrespecting you and your relationship by not sharing his activities.

My ex-girlfriend and I had a similar situation, where I would spend time online and not really share the experience with her. Not that I was withholding anything, just that I was unaware of her desire to be included. Once she told me she felt excluded, I did everything I could to make sure she was part of the experience. Because our timing for this wasn't always in sync, surfing together was usually not possible. So I relayed stories I liked, kept chat logs if I was talking to anyone, and kept a list of interesting profiles - she did the same for me.

If he's truly interested in your play being a 'together' experience, then these compromises shouldn't be a big sacrifice. If he's not, and is more focused on what he can get out of it, then I would question whether he's ready for play at all.

[MRnMSbhaven]

Originally Posted by shywife

I am not asking for anything other than communication - but for some reason that seems to be an unreasonable request.

Not to make lite of your problem but... it appears that you have taken MY husband home by mistake. Perhaps it is simply a problem of 2 different communication styles.

It is well know through our family that my husband will tell me nothing unless I ask and then it's like pulling teeth to get information.
It is not uncommon for him to speak to his parents for hours. When I ask him what was said in the conversation his response is "nothing". To him this means that there wasn't anything of any real importance that he thinks I need to know about. To me it's a pain in the A**! When I show up at family functions and had no idea I was supposed to bring the buns because that was in the "nothing" conversation, I get a bit peeved.

My style is more that I tell him everything to the point of him asking "why do I need to know this"? Usually he doesn't but I like to share and have conversation.

Just so you know, you're not alone. I just don't think men & women communicate the same way.

MSbhaven

[Tia Vampire]

In our relationship, I ( the female) do most of the surfing and than speak to my fiance about things that I find interesting. I think that your husband is just trying to better educate himself in the life-style. Even though you guys have talked about swinging, it is hard to get over some things that being in the life-style requires. If he thinks that you know he has some jealousy issues, he may think that you may not want to continue on. He knows you and may also be looking for issue that may concern you both.

So let him surf and he'll speak to you on his own time. I'm sure he will come around when he is more comfortable with himself and the idea of you guys being in the life-style. I swear he sounds like myself,someone who wants to, but want to know all the do's, dont's, how to, and hear advice from other swinger who has been in the life-style for a long time and get some advise. I know that what made me become part of the board.

The best of luck and have patience with him.

[intuition897]

Welcome to the board!

It sounds like you two just need to find some middle ground. Your Mr. has a lackadaisical attitude that needs to tighten up a bit, and perhaps you could ease off on the reins a bit.

First of all, what is it that you're afraid you're missing? Try pinning down specific fears. Are you afraid of growing apart? Him finding someone else? Him becoming obsessed to the point of sickness? Are you afraid that he secretly wants someone else more than you? Are you afraid that his reluctance to talk about his online adventures will lead to him getting sneaky? I mean really really get specific. Get a piece of paper and a pen and make a list if you have to. Then look at your list, sum it up into a sentence or two (the main theme of your fears) and let your hubby know about it. "THIS is why I'm so focused on your online activities." Guys like it when we're specific. Vagueness and generalities fly right over their heads and through their ears, usually. They just want to know what our point is so that they can fix whatever the problem is. So give him a problem to fix. If his silence feels like secrecy or sneakiness, let him know. It may just be two different ways of interpreting a situation.

Maybe his meanderings are just a pleasant pastime and as such are, in his opinion, not worth mentioning because they're exactly the same each time. Describing them may seem redundant to him. I have no idea who your husband is. I'm assuming you know his handle on here, though. If that's the case, and he's not hiding this from you, chances are his activity here is on the up and up. If you don't have his handle/nickname and he won't give it to you, I'd question that.

[shywife]

No, I do not look at his online activities as "sneaky," I don't think he's necessarily trying to hide anything, etc. He seems comfortable with swinging - this was his idea in the first place. My attitude about the lifestyle is that it is about US doing things TOGETHER. Literally everything I have ever read on any of these boards all emphasize COMMUNICATON, COMMUNICATION, COMMUNICATION. That's all I have asked for, and quite frankly, if this is something that is truly about us, then I think it is reasonable to conclude that communcation would be forthcoming, not something I have to beg for.

[ANGEDKY(mr)]

What are the chances of his intrepeting your begging for communication, regarding websites, as nagging (without regard to right or wrong)?

My intent is not to be rude nor disrespectful, but rather to ask the blunt question.

I say this because if I was asked what I read on the errornet on a regular basis after the first few times I would probally give VERY similar answers that he has given you--and the more I am asked the more I would push back. Not becuase I was hiding anything but for the simple fact not only am I reading repetative topics, but I am also being asked to discuss those same topics on a frequent basis and if there is marginal interest in some of those, the conversation goes downhill that much faster. Sped anytime here (and elsewhere on the 'net) and you will soon see the topics rarely change, just the names and places. I can only read about creampies, dp, shaving. bbw/skinny, cock size, et al so many times before I roll my eyes and mutter same old crap. If he finds something of interest I would bet my paycheck you will be the first to know.

All that being said, I must say I do recognize a distinction between reading the boards/stories and 'net activities that are aligned with the intention of leading to the possible playtime. Entertainment/research v. pursuit if you will. Pursuit requires the utmost in communication, entertainment or research (in our house) not so much.

Intuituion is dead on when she talks about vagueness versus specifics. If you ask me a general vague question about a subject I am interested in you will get a specific detailed in depth answer, whereas if you ask the same question about something I am not interested in, more than likely you will get some half assed shot from the hip reply. Converesly (for me) specific questions get specific answers--it's the way I am wired

That's my two cents worth, although at times I think a couple squares of Charmin has more value...............

[socolais]

Lots of good perspectives here.

Shywife, have a google look at "Transaction Analysis Theory" - we all know it's more important "how" the question is delivered. Maybe try roll-playing some of his fantasies to open the lines of real communication.

[shywife]

Socolais and Angedky, no disrespect to either of you, but if I am willing to open myself and my marriage up to swinging, then I do believe my husband should at least respect me enough to honor my request for this comunication. Afterall, I have let him know that this is important to me, and I do believe my feelings/beliefs on the subject should count for something. I mean, swinging is apparently important to him, and I developed an interest on his behalf, so surely he cares enough about me to give me the communication I have requested.

Hmmm, asking for him to communicate with me could be construed as "nagging?" Well, if that's the case, all he had to do was communicate in the first place and I would't have to ask repeatedly, now would I?

Again, all I have asked for is communication - it is important to me... surely I matter enough in this equation for him to honor such a simple request.